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> sub sale issue, wta

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oxm8
post Apr 20 2014, 02:12 PM

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yes follow my advice. TS has lawyer to prepare SPA... agent only get comission after SPA stamping
like i said - lawyer do checking.... bank also do checking...unless all of them con TS *pity*

yup really hard to provide title with bank... seller may not have a copy...
SUSsupersound
post Apr 20 2014, 02:19 PM

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QUOTE(oxm8 @ Apr 20 2014, 02:12 PM)
yes follow my advice. TS has lawyer to prepare SPA... agent only get comission after SPA stamping
like i said - lawyer do checking.... bank also do checking...unless all of them con TS *pity*

yup really hard to provide title with bank... seller may not have a copy...
*
Isn't it very obvious? Seller don't have the title.
But he can sell a property that not his doh.gif
oxm8
post Apr 20 2014, 02:26 PM

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like i said. original title with bank if he still have loan.

YES seller cannot sell. that is y u have lawyer to check first before ask buyer to sign...

*****
i dont have original nor copy title.. i still have loan.. so i cannot sell?
SUSsupersound
post Apr 20 2014, 03:03 PM

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Bank can provide the photocopy when being requested.
Again, only when someone wants to cheat will give all sort of excuses.
oe_kintaro
post Apr 20 2014, 05:04 PM

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QUOTE(supersound @ Apr 20 2014, 09:22 AM)
So you mean gang up with all parties to mark up the price, then "lower" the price down to cheat people that is was lower.
For me, any price that are > launch sale price are not market value.
Another benchmark market value will be the lelong price.
*
There's book value, market value, fair value, valuation and a few more other technical terms. They all mean slightly different things to different people. If the whole market/world thinks like you, then yes, market value = valuation = sale price = book value = lelong price = intrinsic value because everybody is only willing to pay one price.. Obviously it doesn't work that way or there would be no inflation or other economic activity such as trading and speculation. I'm not saying it's bad or good, just that that is not how a free market economy functions. Its because everyone has a different perception of value that trading and speculative activity occurs.
SUSsupersound
post Apr 20 2014, 08:26 PM

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QUOTE(oe_kintaro @ Apr 20 2014, 05:04 PM)
There's book value, market value, fair value, valuation and a few more other technical terms. They all mean slightly different  things to different people. If the whole market/world thinks like you, then yes, market value = valuation = sale price = book value = lelong price = intrinsic value because everybody is only willing to pay one price.. Obviously it doesn't work that way or there would be no inflation or other economic activity such as trading and speculation. I'm not saying it's bad or good, just that that is not how a free market economy functions. Its because everyone has a different perception of value that trading and speculative activity occurs.
*
Then don't say a sub-sale is cheaper than market value.

oe_kintaro
post Apr 20 2014, 09:13 PM

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QUOTE(supersound @ Apr 20 2014, 08:26 PM)
Then don't say a sub-sale is cheaper than market value.
*
That's what TS says, not me. It's not my position to dispute that, but I don't see why it is not possible, provided he did the due diligence.
Market Value aka Open Market Valuation is simply a price agreed upon by willing buyer and willing seller.

If I were him and in a position to buy sub-sale at BMV (Below Market Value), I'd check both the initial sale price, bank valuation as well as the last transacted to see if it *really* is BMV and not something only the agent says, taking into account of course all the other usual factors. (location, rental yield, etc).

There are many reasons why people are willing to sell at BMV, but you wouldn't know unless you have encountered them. Some of those I know are: asset disposition by companies, family/legal disputes (where several joint owners decide that is the best way to solve an ownership problem), seller desperate for cash (e.g. due to urgently leaving country, business or family emergency) etc.
The point I'm trying to make is that BMV does exist and it's merely a matter of doing homework, keeping in mind of course, Market Value can fluctuate according to laws of supply and demand as well as inflation over time.

I just want to point out here that BMV does NOT necessarily mean cheaper than initial launch sale price which is what you seem to be thinking. Otherwise, please sell us the house you are currently staying in at exactly the price you bought. Likely, you would not. Why? because you would have attached emotional value as well as made some minimal modifications/renovations that cost you money, not to mention legal fees, loan interest etc etc. If perchance you wanted to sell it, you would want to sell it at a price higher than what you bought, to compensate for what you already invested in it. There is nothing wrong in that, but that is obviously not going to be initial sale price. But supposing someone offered you a price 500% what you originally paid for, wouldn't you consider it seriously? Maybe you would think he is crazy, but that's a case of willing buyer, so why not? It's merely then a matter of whether you are willing to sell.



SUSsupersound
post Apr 20 2014, 09:25 PM

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QUOTE(oe_kintaro @ Apr 20 2014, 09:13 PM)
That's what TS says, not me. It's not my position to dispute that, but I don't see why it is not possible, provided he did the due diligence.
Market Value aka Open Market Valuation is simply a price agreed upon by willing buyer and willing seller.

If I were him and in a position to buy sub-sale at BMV (Below Market Value), I'd check both the initial sale price, bank valuation as well as the last transacted to see if it *really* is BMV and not something only the agent says, taking into account of course all the other usual factors. (location, rental yield, etc).

There are many reasons why people are willing to sell at BMV, but you wouldn't know unless you have encountered them. Some of those I know are: asset disposition by companies, family/legal disputes (where several joint owners decide that is the best way to solve an ownership problem), seller desperate for cash (e.g. due to urgently leaving country, business or family emergency) etc.
The point I'm trying to make is that BMV does exist and it's merely a matter of doing homework, keeping in mind of course, Market Value can fluctuate according to laws of supply and demand as well as inflation over time.

I just want to point out here that BMV does NOT necessarily mean cheaper than initial launch sale price which is what you seem to be thinking. Otherwise, please sell us the house you are currently staying in at exactly the price you bought. Likely, you would not. Why? because you would have attached emotional value as well as made some minimal modifications/renovations that cost you money, not to mention legal fees, loan interest etc etc. If perchance you wanted to sell it, you would want to sell it at a price higher than what you bought, to compensate for what you already invested in it. There is nothing wrong in that, but that is obviously not going to be initial sale price. But supposing someone offered you a price 500% what you originally paid for, wouldn't you consider it seriously? Maybe you would think he is crazy, but that's a case of willing buyer, so why not? It's merely then a matter of whether you are willing to sell.
*
BMV will only happen when there's no market for it. Which won't really happen now as people never do proper research on this.
As GS Reality's boss said before, they doing group do able to get 10-20% cheaper, but he never says that they will sell it out at 50-100% more expensive than developer's original price. , they just need to mark up 100%, then offer buyers at 5-10% cheaper and says it is cheaper than market price.
For TS's case, why they can't provide the land title are more on that property in actual no owner has buy it which mean TS are "buying" from developer but being songlap by the agent.
And developer won't care on this, as if the agent can speculate the price, their next phase can sell more expensive.

This post has been edited by supersound: Apr 20 2014, 09:27 PM
oe_kintaro
post Apr 20 2014, 09:38 PM

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QUOTE(supersound @ Apr 20 2014, 09:25 PM)
BMV will only happen when there's no market for it. Which won't really happen now as people never do proper research on this.
As GS Reality's boss said before, they doing group do able to get 10-20% cheaper, but he never says that they will sell it out at 50-100% more expensive than developer's original price. , they just need to mark up 100%, then offer buyers at 5-10% cheaper and says it is cheaper than market price.
For TS's case, why they can't provide the land title are more on that property in actual no owner has buy it which mean TS are "buying" from developer but being songlap by the agent.
And developer won't care on this, as if the agent can speculate the price, their next phase can sell more expensive.
*
It's all about due diligence. Nothing that contradicts whatever I've said. On the other hand making a blanket statement that BMV = less than launch price only applies for freshly launched projects with similar situation like you mentioned, but it does not apply for other types of transactions. I personally know people who bought condominiums in prime locations at dirt cheap prices because the sellers were business entities that already depreciated the place in their own books. Heck, even my first condo was BMV because I knew the seller well and got a good deal as a favor. I sold it 5 years later at 100+% profit.
TSpopice2u
post Apr 22 2014, 07:55 AM

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yesterday the agent say will get the land title & owner loan statement. mean time i am submitting for loan application.
i reminded the agent not to get the owner to sign the purchase of order form until i give the green light.
TSpopice2u
post Apr 24 2014, 05:41 PM

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update.....

i decided to cancel the purchase after the owner cannot produce the individual title & loan statement until today. even though the agent committed to get for me since day one but he keep on delaying.
in fact the owner's lawyer said might take another 1-2 weeks to get the title.

i dont know what is going on but for peace of mind, i just cancel it.
SUSsupersound
post Apr 24 2014, 09:40 PM

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QUOTE(popice2u @ Apr 24 2014, 05:41 PM)
update.....

i decided to cancel the purchase after the owner cannot produce the individual title & loan statement until today. even though the agent committed to get for me since day one but he keep on delaying.
in fact the owner's lawyer said might take another 1-2 weeks to get the title.

i dont know what is going on but for peace of mind, i just cancel it.
*
Good, you make a right move thumbup.gif
Now is matter the owner's holding power only. Got price and no market already started, last year's bank housing loan approval rate dropped ~23% and this will continue further whistling.gif
oxm8
post Apr 24 2014, 09:59 PM

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mine to share the property details?
maybe if really BMV.... then i can sapu biggrin.gif
TSpopice2u
post Apr 25 2014, 12:55 PM

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go to mudah and select denai alam.......

 

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