If you believe the word of God is confined just to the word of God and does not manifest in the realities of Life, you are living the life of a powerless Salvation. That is what you're believing. You're just echoing what the writer writes. You believe in him more than what scripture says. The Bible is full of accounts of miracles.

Denying that it's only valid during Jesus days and the Apostles days is unwarranted. The Bible never conclude as such. Only Sceptic does. Sceptic Christians who don't believe like you.

The Bible is never about unbelieve but BELIEVING! disbelieving Heart towards God is a SIN, the same when you deny Him of his miracles.

And you question my miracle experiences and have the audacity to say it's not authentic? Who do you think you are? I have enough of your insults.
You can blaspheme me, that's alright, Blaspheme the HS for his work in my life? Consider your own ways whether it's pleasing In God's sight, you are encouraging unbelief, division and arguments.

Praying in tongues is between you and God. Who gives you the idea to take things out of context, calling in other believers the need for interpretation, it shows that you CLEARLY don't understand this portion.

1 Corinthians 14

6 Now, brothers and sisters, if I come to you and speak in tongues, what good will I be to you,.....

What does If I come to you means? Care to think about that for just 3 minutes? WHAT DOES THAT TELLS YOU?

Only IF He rejects Christ as the messiah on purpose, going back to the Law (Galatians 5:4 & Hebrews 10:26) problem is, does he even understand what that means?

It really boils down to how the Gospel is presented.

No Wrong.

This is the accurate definition according to scripture, the rest is the following of the base of this definition.

Romans 5:19 - For just as through the disobedience of the one man (Adam) the many were made sinners,

and in the same breath.

so also through the obedience of the one man (Christ) the many will be made righteous.

Adam made us sinners
Christ makes us righteous

This is what I've been standing on all these while.

Before you accept Christ, you are a sinner because of Adam's disobedience not because you sin so also when you accept Christ you are righteous because of Christ obedience not because you obey.

The things if God is very consistent. If you say Jesus is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow then this is also very true.

You were locked into sin by Adam's Sin, no matter how much good you do, you cannot be righteous and get out of the status of a sinner in the same manner when you're set free by Christ, no matter what you do, you cannot undo your status as Righteous as long as your Faith holds.

If Salvation is given to you as a Gift, something you have never earned anyway, what makes you think you can through the same concept of effort, lose your Salvation when you have never earned it in the first place? (Wages and Gift as in Romans 4:4)

Not unless you are suggesting you got your Salvation because you repented and you lose your Salvation because you disobeyed God.

That clearly makes your Salvation becomes your effort. You contradict the meaning of Grace vs Works! You are also in essence pushing away What Christ did for you at the cross. You have never understood what the work of Christ is. You think you know but when you echoed Believers can change back into a sinner, you are in error of scripture.

The Bible is very clear! If Grace it is not of works and if it's work, it is no longer grace.

YOU ARE TRYING TO MIX BOTH TOGETHER.

The Bible will have no such thing. Old Wine cannot be poured into New Wine Skin, it will burst.

This is scripture, you cannot deny.

One more thing. YOU CAN'T EVEN OPEN YOUR DAMN MOUTH and admit Jesus has cleansed the believers and made Him Righteous through his blood.
What's wrong with you? Devil got your tongue?

Satan wants people to remain in sin and keep on acknowledging he is a sinner all the time so that they remain bound to eternal condemnation.
God wants his people to be free from sin and keep on acknowledging the work of Christ is FINISHED and that he is righteous in Christ to eternal life.

I guess we all now know which camp you belong to seeing that you refuse to acknowledge what Christ did.

One more thing. YOU CAN'T EVEN OPEN YOUR DAMN MOUTH and admit Jesus has cleansed the believers and made Him Righteous through his blood.
What's wrong with you? Devil got your tongue?

Right on. 

Repentance is an act of faith, a response of a sinner before a Holy God.

If you think you have exclusive Truth, you are in trouble. i believe God uses teachers to help us aling the way of understanding of the Gospels.

Are you fluent in Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek? 

Where did i say that the word is confined to the pages of the scriptural script?
I am a manifestation of God's Truth, a sinner who has been saved by Grace through the death of Jesus Christ.

What you are on is, signs and wonders. Well, i am not moved by sight but by faith in God's words.
God's words brings faith, not signs and wonders. Ask the Israelites in the desert!
God's written words keep me straight headed.

He could completely apostasies, rejecting God with going back to Law.  You are too obsessed with the Law in contrast to grace.

Some of my friend have given up the faith along the way. Thats why Paul asked us to work out our salvation with fear and trembling.
Its That serious.

You are describing positional sinfulness and righteousness with Christ and Adam.

A sinner still needs to come in repentance. Unless you are a universalist and takes this verse literally as umbrella righteousness

2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the WHOLE WORLD.
without coming in repentance.
Are you swearing at me now?

I think we need to differentiate between active faith vs passive faith.

The analogy I can think of is below:

A guy fell in love with a lady. He express his love to her. He told her once a week, "I really love you with all my heart." but do nothing else. It is like going to church once a week, being so 'emotionally connected' but Monday-Saturday same old unchanged person - Passive faith.

A guy fell in love with a lady. He express his love to her. He told her everyday, "I really love you with all my heart.". He will date and spend time with her to know her. He is there when she needs him. After dated her for awhile, he decided that make a life-time commitment with her and propose to her and at the end they get married - Active faith.

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When we first get to know God and Jesus, we go to church, we read the bible - dating stage (exploration stage)

After we have understanding God and the bible more and decided to follow Him for the rest of life and surrender life to Him, make life-time commitment, putting God first, we will move the next stage, repent and get baptized. That baptism is like wedding day. But it is just the beginning stage as a Christian. This marriage vow can still be broken if the guy decided to leave his spouse. Just like a Christian journey, if we leave the faith (leaving church and God), we are leaving the body of Christ for long period of time. Imagine if you accidentally cut your finger, if you quickly go to the hospital, you can still attach back that finger. But if after few days, that finger can become rotten already. But that's just analogy. - marriage stage

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Ok now shoot me. Armor ready 

After we have understanding God and the bible more and decided to follow Him for the rest of life and surrender life to Him, make life-time commitment, putting God first, we will move the next stage, repent and get baptized. That baptism is like wedding day. But it is just the beginning stage as a Christian.

--------------

...
This marriage vow can still be broken if the guy decided to leave his spouse. Just like a Christian journey, if we leave the faith (leaving church and God), we are leaving the body of Christ for long period of time. Imagine if you accidentally cut your finger, if you quickly go to the hospital, you can still attach back that finger. But if after few days, that finger can become rotten already. But that's just analogy. - marriage stage
...

Ah I forgot to announce forgive me.

http://www.chc.org.my/

City Harvest KL sunway has Kong Hee preaching at 8PM today (22 oct) ... I should post this last week but i forgot....

You and Kong Hee are headed in 1 direction. I am pretty sure of that.

Thanks for the appreciatioon ... i just wanna people be maximal in Christ... anyway to answer ur question:

i think i can assume what is initial salvation. is that OSAS ? I am a believer of OSAS Version DE1929... not OSAS... OSAS version DE1919 is like below

For people that believe OSAS, and never bother about bible, truth, relationship, etc... their house in heaven is ugly. their reward is 0.
For people that believe OSAS and have a loving heart to Jesus... their house is heaven is  big, luxurious, and their reward is maximal.

what is loving heart to Jesus ? it's a long story. I assume  you already know what is loving heart to Jesus.

some people simplify 0 reward as lost of salvation. Actually no. Lost salvation meaning go to hell, 0 reward mean go to heaven. But now you know the depth of 0 reward right

--

i do not know progressive salvation + final salvation in your context. Perhaps you can help me what your thinking and i will try to help.. or at least UW always can help.

Obviously another person who talks alot of bull but no scripture to backup.

Yeah, you have already receive your rewards in full. Just like the pharaisees.

Oh uh Left Behind is airing in Malaysia.

My bro and I agree that it's not biblical. We don't encourage mom to take people to watch that show for witnessing.

But we can't agree if we need to suffer as Christ suffered when the time comes, or Jesus talked in other context.

Most Hollywood Christian movie isn't accurately biblical based.

I think it's only the Passion of Christ, Mel Gibson, that's the closest.

Witnessing is more in tuned with people.

Movie can only do so much depending on it's content.

I know but I have trouble trying to explain this to mom. Need to explain why the concept of Left Behind/ Rapture isn't biblical with details and stuff.
That's a common misconception taught to her generation.

I haven't seen the movie any examples why it's that bad?