Hello.. For those who is wondering "What!! Him again? Asking questions about career prospects" yeah I'm sorry..


So, I'm here to ask...

Most my friends here, which, I believe, is taking Accountancy course pursuing its degree and professional qualification(s).

But I'm just curious to know,

1) Why there's so much people unemployed with Account certificate?
I've made some summaries,
maybe they are
not very fluent in English
does not possesses a professional qualification

but that's it. I can't think any others. Can you guys tell me some other?

2) How long does it take to complete its degree and professional qualification altogether?
5-6 years from now or more?

3) What I've found is that we need to seek for an internships program before we could be considered an experienced accountant, is this true? So if it's with the internship program, how long does it take for me to be officially employed?

Thanks, I will ask in this thread if I'm having further confusions..

Why there's so much people unemployed with Account certificate?
Not sure how did you come to this conclusion......Is it ACCA/CIMA level? Don't think you will be unemployed with those qualifications

1. Since when accounting graduates are unemployed?
The practitioners themselves keep harping on talent management of accountants in business forums/conferences.

2. Around 3 -4 years for a degree/professional qualification. But if u pursue a degree first continued by the professional qualification, you might be given exemptions for the professional papers. In total, it could around 5 years. But most would study the professional qualification on a part-time basis after graduating with their academic degrees.

3. You don't need to go through internship just to seek employment as a fresh grad.

TS can share some of your weed? =.=

TS is live in parallel world and have great personality and thinking.
He even made summaries and concluded so much unemployment in accountancy.
Everything are based on assumptions rather than speak with facts.

This post has been edited by quovadis123: Feb 4 2014, 01:18 PM

First time I hear accounting personnel of ANY level being unemployed.

Do you know how difficult to recruit even an accounts clerk?

If any, there must be some who can't differentiate between a profit and loss account and a balance sheet.

I eat kangkung lorh.. lol haha.. Oh well, thanks anyway..

even if only just degree in accounts, the hiring rate is high too. I rarely heard that those who studied account have high unemployment rates, can you least share with us about regarding this?

If you are taking a professional qualification, I don't think you really would need a degree with it. Professional qualification is, itself, very strong.

ACCA requires 3 years of experience whilst ICAEW requires 3.5 years of experience from authorized employers (can see the detail on their website)

I agree with you

Any professional qualification > degree

I myself oso dun have any degree qualifications

anyway ... the unemployment could be due to the following reasons:

1) no Vacancy

2) not suitable / does not fit into their requirement despite there is vacancy

3) did badly during the interview

4) other competitors did better than you in interview and etc



Degree and Professional qualification = not necessarily need to go hand-in-hand

you can go straightaway skip degree and complete ACCA (for example) within 2.5 years

(all pass in 1st attempt taking 3 or 4 papers each sitting)

however you can also study for ACCA while you're working if you can cope

wa, since when accountancy low employement? where u read?

Accountants all level sought out so much, every company also want

TS, just to let you know, your words are actually true, contrary to other forumers saying it's untrue. But, why are they unemployed? Before I go on, lemme stress that this is from the point of view in Penang. It does not apply to KL or other states.

The main reason is salary level and ego issue. First off, most accounting students graduate, aiming to go to big4 audit firms. Of course, big4 pays more. A fellow forumer said accounts clerk hard to find. Why? Because accounts clerk's pay is less than Rm1,500. With the current standard of living, everyone will shrug off the prospect of earning anything lesser than Rm1,500. Why so? Many, if not all, of the fresh graduates are those who are used to spending. Even if you're those who doesn't spend, 1.5k and below a month gets you nowhere. Expenses outweighs the revenue we earn. As such, we'll be trying to run around hoping anything more than 1.5k comes by. There are many accounting fresh grads that I know who couldn't get a job due to meagre salary. Most accounting students, when graduated, will have the same mindset "I have to go to audit firm for 3 years". This is what made job-searching more difficult since the middle and lower tier firms will not pay more than 2k a month.

Secondly, ego level. Everyone says accounting is a profession where jobs come by easily. So the question arises "why so low pay?". Being less-fluent in english doesn't reduce your chances. In fact, most clients nowadays are bilingual.

As for your question of how long to complete. A degree with ACCA/ICAEW/CIMA takes around 5yrs if you're fast and do full time studying. If part-time after degree, depends on determination.

True. Any company needs an accountant. However, how much can they afford. Smaller PLCs dun mind hiring less-than-excellent employees, but salary is meagre. Larger PLCs only want to hire staff capable of handling a full set of accounts, together with knowledge in consolidation and other qualities. Thus, large PLCs only go for experienced employees from Big4 and middle-tier firms.

Thus, your question of every is very subjective. Anything below 1.5k is consider very very pitiful. Why? Some people, to go to work, needs to buy car (unless you're lucky that your dad can afford you a car), then need to spend for other expenses. All these go above 1.5k so anything less than that is very low.

I think nowadays, employee chooses the company, not company choose employee. LOL

i think is difficult to recruit a qualified one, qualified also problem because obviously they would want progression....

I have heard from several sources qualified accountant (eg CPA) in Australia hard to find permanent job, mostly contract basis

Those who can pay and provide good prospects will have better chances.

I love your explanation.. This is what I'm talking about..

5 years? Are you for real dude!
I am about to finish ACCA in this year and I started exactly in June 2012. 5 years can do PhD lol

Read properly what he wrote.

He said a DEGREE WITH ACCA afterwards.

3~4 years for a degree, 1 more year for final 5 P papers, sounds legit no?

My bad didn't read clearly haha
Then it sounds legit but still there are alternatives by which ACCA can be done after SPM or even no previous background in 3 years or so.

True enough.

But some ppl prefer to get a degree 1st before deciding what to do.

Good for them

hi boss

that depends on the financial condition of one la

if he / his family can afford it ... I agree to go out explore more before entering working life

This post has been edited by tzxsean: Feb 20 2014, 10:01 PM

Didn't you read? Seriously some people only see numbers without reading and you said you're about to finish ACCA. Gosh I wonder where you came from seriously. Must be ACCA examiners close their eyes when they mark yours. I said DEGREE with ACCA. Stupidity counts on all levels and you said you're finishing ACCA? OMG OMG if you're an auditor now, I must warn the company that this dude doesn't read. Blind for sure.

Some people is truly stupid and that guy is. Getting a degree before ACCA is the safest route out. Firstly, it ensures one has a degree first, giving them a stable job. A half way ACCA student is not recognised by the public. Only a fully-passded student is recognise whereas a degree ensures you can divert to another field if you want to since an accounting degree also adds a few sub-modules not required by an accountant. In a way, a degree provides a lifeline to those wanting to divert.

hahaha nothing to get angry about bro
I already apologized about this in my previous post. Have a look!

Even I doubt ACCA examiners are either blind or too stupid to pass me in all the rest of ACCA papers and fail me in the easiest F6 paper Agree with you

Anyway, sorry again and don't get angry for these small reasons dude

Yes but an ACCA certificate is ONLY recognised within the acocunting/auditing profession. Out of it, for example marketing, and it's useless. However, an accounting degree allows a student to venture out if he finds out he's no longer interested in accounting/auditing field. Once again, I guess you need me to explain why since you got no idea what's an accounting degree. In the degree, most unis require students to take elective modules, meaning modules like marketing for instance. This is important if a student wanna divert to another field after graduating. AT LEAST, it is recognised industry-wide.

Depends on student bro. I like taking shortcuts whilst some other people don't like taking risk
So I felt like doing ACCA as fast as I can then move to masters straightaway at the age of less than 20 Sound awesome isn't it

Haha everybody likes taking masters. Not only you, but ALL ACCA students. However, degree students will think otherwise. Pure CAT-ACCA students like you won't know the difficulty of doing research papers. Masters is not a full-time studying thingy like ACCA, where you mug and mug, then apply your knowledge in it.

Masters is more to research and research, combining 80 journals, each having 30-60 pages long, into one journal. Assignments, reading journals, and so on. It's totally different from ACCA.

In a research, there are NO shortcuts. You have to read the whole journal to find your wanted points. You cannot use word by word. You need to rephrase, rewrite, analyse and so on. Plagiarism is another case. Truly very few accountants/auditors take up masters. Only lecturers will take up coz all their time is dedicated to it.

This post has been edited by whitesabre: Feb 21 2014, 10:47 AM

Yup it is but still if there is a will, there is a way
If we are willing to struggle then surely we'll get the fruit.

Doing masters sounds like doing OBU stuff by the way

Doing the OBU RAP will give you a rough idea on the process of writing a business project.

Unfortunately, it's nothing close to writing a dissertation for a postgraduate degree. I would say doing the OBU RAP is more like doing a simple assignment rather than writing a dissertation.

I once approached the programme manager of OBU RAP from UK (when he was in Malaysia) and I told him that something must be done to increase the rigor of this RAP. But looks like nothing has been done.

To jump from ACCA to MPhil is like jumping from a kiddy pool into the pacific ocean without a proper training on swimming.

Are you trying to scare me or....................

So you are saying that it is not a great idea to get into MPhil stuff after ACCA? Okay then, I follow your route then. What else should I do before starting MPhil in Finance?

If you like shortcuts, MPhil will hugely disappoint you.

Imagine while you are still halfway writing your MPhil dissertation into the second year of the programme, you will see your peers (peers who have failed several ACCA papers in the past) easily graduating with the MBAs within two years.

I don't want to scare you but I just want you to know what you are getting into.

I think one should at least dip himself in an Olympic pool before diving into the Pacific Ocean.

A mixed-mode Master's programme would be a better option for a CAT-ACCA graduate rather than the 100% research-based MPhil.

The ACCA syllabus is designed for practitioners while the MPhil is designed for those who have at least some research background. It's a totally different world for both.

This post has been edited by Blofeld: Feb 21 2014, 11:45 AM

So doing an MBA before MPhil would be a better choice is it?

I am sorry for asking such stupid questions

I just took the shortcut and it went fine for me so now I have a chance to be an ACCA Affiliate by the age of 19 so I am not in a hurry since I am planning to study until I turn 25.

MBA or any other mixed-mode Master's programme (Eg. MSc in Accounting from UUM).

Or you can search slowly for any mixed-mode postgraduate programmes in Accounting from other foreign universities.

If you plan to pursue the academic career, please avoid those 100% coursework Master's.

There are some MBAs or Masters in Accounting which are 100% coursework where you don't need to write any dissertation at all. So, you have to avoid this.

If you have the time and the money, MPhil would be still be suitable. If you are aiming for shortcuts, please don't do the MPhil.

Thanks a lot bro for your time and suggestion. You really gave me some valid points on which I need to think a lot
Really appreciate

TS, my reply to your question is like this, simply, there are too many accounting graduate or professional certificate holders who do not the reason they study accounting in the first place.

First thing first, finish your ACCA first.

Get to work and then decide later. Don't forget to complete your 3-year experience requirement as well.

Who knows if you prefer to work as an accountant/auditor rather than working as an academic.

Yeah surely will join an audit firm as soon as I become an Affiliate

Thanks again

Can an ACCA holder do marketing? Yes it is possible if it is sales. Marketing proper is not really possible for most business admin and other accounting graduate since one module is like doing the ACCA P3 Marketing chapter. In fact ACCA P3 = MBA coverage of subjects only without the assignments and group discussion about some case.

Please note that education is only a door opener, what you do with the qualification is your decision. You can cross over any time to a new job. Anyway the OBU degree provides adequate rigor for ACCA students to learn research skills required at graduate level.


Obviously doing the OBU which is 7,500 words + 2,000 words = 9,500 words is not the same as MPhil which is a pure research based qualification. The OBU RAP is the last element of the BSc award so you have to take into account the studying for F1 - F9 + OBU = MPhil level of work

Nothing really needs to be done for the OBU. If you go to MPhil from OBU, at least you have some idea of research. I remember the first time I had to do that jump - it was nearly impossible.

I seriously don't think it is a simple assignment - it is much more than a 3,000 word simple assignment. It must have all the elements that a MPhil has, only in summarised version.


Actually I agree to a bit that there are many accounting degree holders that are without a proper job - mainly due to the fact that they never understood their studies when they took them.

In this case, I have come across local uni grads that have no idea about basic debit/credit or even reconciliations. In fact I came across a lecturer from a certain local uni that has a Masters in Accounting that took 2 months to get basic bank recons completed.


I had come across many local uni grad from accounting working as clerks and low level admin officers happily.

So back to the original question - yes there are many out there that cannot get a job. ACCA/CIMA/ICEAW does improve your chances but does not guarantee anything.

At the end of the day - it will depend on how you present yourself.

This post has been edited by frodo baggin: Mar 8 2014, 12:49 AM

Sir,
Would like to check with you about qualification recognition in established or foreign organisations. Was informed that those organisation recognized one with a basic degree (in this case is Accounting degree) as opposed to someone with a Professional qualification without a bachelor's as ACCA/ICAEW/CIMA is more of needed in the audit firms. Therefore, it is not a must to have. How true is this ? Thanks for your help.

This assessment is correct. Sometimes a degree is a better bet compared to professional. That is why ACCA students should do their obu degree.