Recently I'd purchased a new property & discover water mark at downstair ceiling after performing water ponding test on my own at all 3 bathrooms in 1st floor. After filing the defect complaints, the developer gave excuse that I had put too much water during ponding test & offers to redo the water ponding test by the developer worker.

The worker complete flooding the bathroom at 5:30PM yesterday & I observe significance water level reduction at 6:30PM on the same day as part of the floor already dried up. I took the picture for record purpose. On the next day, developer representative conduct a joint inspection with me at 10:30AM. I find that the same bathroom water level has risen back to the original flooded level. The worker has denied several times that he refilled the water prior joint inspection, but confessed after being shown the photo. I also have proof that water meter reading was out by 200+ litres.

The defect rectification manager told me that it is normal for water level to reduce during ponding test & such reduction does not mean leakage. The water level reduced bout 1-2cm within 18 hours. Is what he said is true? Any one with experience in this, please give your valuable comment. Thanks

I do believe water will reduce/absorb when got:

1-air
2-hot
3-time

based on my own experience

i) any water mark at downstairs ceiling after wonder ponding test IS a positive test that there is a leakage.
dont believe otherwise.

ii) significant water level reduction means the water is leaking off somewhere into the walls etc..

my advice would be -

- ponding test should take at least 48 hours and note where the stains are. Take lots of photograph as evidence to be used to build your case against deveoper later if so needed.

in your case, the fact that the worker tried to mislead you by filling up the water level is an indication there could be leakage.

you must be persistent to get this resolved otherwise i tel you after you moved in, your will have a MAJOR NIGHTMARE!

in my case, while the cleaners were washing the bathroom, the water was pouring down the walls downstairs so there is no way they can say no leakage ma..so call in the main con, and they said ok, we found the leak and we have repaired and done ponding test for you and all OK..

ya right...i decided to do my own ponding test, and yup, leakage AGAIN..!

Second time, same thing, ya, repairs done, and ponding test done, all OK

ya, u guess rigght, did my own ponding , and yup Leakage AGAIN..

and same thing the THIRD TIME...!!!!

they were doing guess work all this time and patch here there everywhere hoping that the leakage will be stopped ..

so you can guess, by that time I was absolutely LIVID and bombasted the developer in writing of course so that i have a record. During the fourth repairs, i insisted the ENTIRE FLOOR must be hacked off and the water proofing redone..it was a quite a big job but no choice as i was not going to go through it the 5th time..!

So i am going to do another ponding test to make sure all is ok before the defect rectification period is over ..

So you see, why the developer will try to play kungfu with you so you must be on top of this matter to make sure they dont screw you over..

my developer suppposedly one of the top in the market some more....ie Sun&^%* ..swore never ever to buy their properties anymore..

Concrete is porous and can act like sponge, so there is logic that some water could have been absorbed resulting in slightly lower water levels.

Waterproofing is often only done till 6 inches above floor level for general floor area hence the developers comment that you may have used to much water for initial poring test.

The fact that their worker (most likely under orders from a superior) added extra water then lied about it shows the developer can't be trusted.

Redo the test a third time see the result then demand the developer fix any problem or you will sue and remind them they will lose badly once you present the evidence of their attempted deceitful cover up.

Cheers

Thanks for your sharing. I did managed to get the developer rep to agree on proceed with leakage repair without further testing, as I stressed that I no longer have confident on the integrity of the testing. They agreed to repair within one week & redo the ponding test after repair is done. I have the conversation recorded too, just in case...

Now just have to pray they did a better job on the repair...

I've done ponding test lately as well, roughly 20hours , 2 toilets the water completely dried. I tell the developer and the guy seems like not happy and ask me when I stay will I let my toilet flood for whole night? And say no people do test like that. But they say will go check since I already write in the form.

But then second day they tell me no leaking, but have 1 water pipe leak hence the plaster ceiling below one of the toilet wet. The other toilet no leak, and the plaster ceiling seems like no stain. Keep insist if there is leaking the plaster ceiling will have stain, I think I will do test again soon.

My developer rejects all water leakage complaint for owner who did their own water ponding test, say we did it the wrong way. They insist the test must be done by their worker. Now only I knew why, coz they cheat! Gosh~ have to further delay reno plan, this issue must be fixed properly

Hi, never heard of this before...can u explain in detail what do u mean by this water ponding test? Is it u let the upstairs toilet food fill with water but got drain Hole so how to test? M confused by this all...

Normally you don't need to flood the toilet. The test just need 1 cm or maybe 1/2" of water will do. Because you won't be running a pool in the toilet.

How they gonna cheat you?

Water ponding test is done by seal off the drain hole & flood the bathroom floor. In my case, the developer flood bout 5mm at the highest floor level & bout 4cm at the lowest floor level. 5mm water gone within 1 hour, so I take picture as proof. The next day morning, they secretly come & refill water before joint inspection, this is to make the flood test pass as they claim no water was leak out.

flood basically means u fill until the whole floor is covered entirely with water..yes true no need to be one feet high ..just around 1" or so will do..easiest is to mark the water line on the side of the wall once its filled so if water do run off you can easily see it.

leakage in any property i can assure you is one of the worse things that can happen as it is usually costly if you end up having to fix it yourself..

Yes, bathroom leakage is the top priority defect that must be repair properly by developer. It is unbelievable for a big developer (listed company) to cheat on such simple thing.

The proper way to check water leakage after ponding test is by looking for sign of leakage not the water level reduce or not.
If you can spot sign of leakage, then your developer shall repair it , no need to argue on the water level.

Water mark already exist after I done my own ponding test, but developer refused to accept my defect complaints. They insist the ponding test must be done by their worker, so I let them do it. But they lied about refilling water prior joint inspection. If there is nothing wrong with the test, why they have to lie about it?

Bravo Bravo, YIPEEE ! ! ! 1 Victory for the common guy against the Big Evil Corporations.

5MM gone in 1 hour (its huge amount of water) then there's no sign of leakage, how we can be assure it will not effecting concreate in a long run?

Hi all..thanks for the explanation, first time I heard of such a thing. Must do for upstairs n downstairs toilet? The water must not receed after how many hours only consider as pass? Sum thing new I learn..will try it out when i get my house keys...

Oh ya, how do u seal off the drain Hole to ensure that no water passes thro the drain hole when want to do this test?

Drain hole can be sealed by using plasticine, the stuff kids play in art class. The ponding should last for 24 hours. Normally ppl don't do test on ground floor, not much affects even it have leakage.

If water mark exist, even without ponding test the developer should repair it.
Anyhow, it is good to know that your developer have agreed to repair it for you.

If really 5mm gone in 1 hour and no sign of leakage, probably the reason will be the floor trap is not properly sealed.
FYI, if after ponding test there is no sign of leakage then your bathroom not likely will have waterproofing problem as when you use your bathroom, you will not pond it.
And i don't think water can affect a proper cured concrete much.

Developer was trying to avoid repair, to be specific, the sub-con that was doing defect rectification tries to avoid as much repair works they can.

This photos was submitted for defect claims, but was rejected by defect team...

Water mark at ceiling of downstair room:


Water mark also can be seen at side wall of bathroom:


This post has been edited by my_nickleo: Jan 21 2014, 09:44 AM

This is a clear water seepage that developer must repair.

Can kindly pm me or post the developer name here , this is a very IRRESPONSIBLE developer we all need to be wary.

T****N IND*H from northern region

is there any ways to check leakage for condo units? i think not all owners, especially those investors would do leakage checking..

anyone who is living in condo, could you share your experience when you got your unit? many thanks

Just do a visual checking, look for water mark. Especially during heavy rain day.

For water seepage at bathroom side wall, what type of repair can be done, beside hack off tiles & redo water proofing?

As i know that shoild be the way.
Either from internal side or out side the wall.

Developer repaint & redo ponding test, now my bathroom side wall looks like this:



Very sad......

Ask them to repair the wall surface and repaint it.
Then further monitor for water seepage.
And FYI, waterproofing contractor is giving out 10 warranty to the developer.

my_nickleo, u can submit the developer an inspection report with photo showing the defect clearly and then give them 2 week notice if no rectification done within another 2 week, u will bring the issue to Tribunal for Homebuyer under national housing board of development and concurrently u will engage ur own contractor to submit the quotation to developer for the rectification work. If the development no action taken then give them a notice that u will start the rectification work after and back charge to the Vendor's solicitor (which bank pay to the lawyer to hold the retention money for the warranty purpose).

I use this way to force my developer to rectify all my complaints. Any non compliance still can claim to the Vendor solicitor BUT make sure is not exceeded 8 months they hand over the key to u. Do read thru the S&P agreement then u will know where u stand on ur own right.

I strongly suggest u force the developer to hack the entire bathroom floor then redo waterproofing and retile the floor again. As this is the proper rectification method and it can last longer and avoid for future leak.

This post has been edited by N73: Jan 25 2014, 01:27 AM

How to do the water ponding test?
Use tape to seal up the floor water trap?
what kind of tape ?

hi guys, sorry for reviving old topic. I am having issue for my condo water ponding test. I seal the drainage with masking tape and put on 3kg heavy object. Flood the area and i was there observe around 1 hour before i left.

Today i went to the unit again, the flood gone and i notice there are some water in the drainage. Does this mean there is water leaking or i didn't done the sealing well.

Was trying to contact my neighbour downstair to check the ceiling but they are not available

masking tape is a very poor choice.

first time doing, dont know what should i use

any recommendation?

Use same diameter pipe and silicone the edges?

Is there a guideline for architect to follow when carry out ponding test before sign as acceptance? The ponding test is to do only at wet area (showering area), or both with the dry area (basin & wc area)?

A ponding test is done by sealing up all drainage exits in the area and flooding the entire area with 1-3 inches of water. The test may be carried out for a period of 24-72 hours depending on the situation.
Observations on the water level should be steady without any wetness on the outside wall and bottom floor (one floor below if more than one storey)

Should be both basin & wc area as long within the bathroom floor being wet area thus would be exposed to standing/ponding water by the user.

A ponding test is done by sealing up all drainage exits in the area and flooding the entire area with 1-3 inches of water. The test may be carried out for a period of 24-72 hours depending on the situation.
Observations on the water level should be steady without any wetness on the outside wall and bottom floor (one floor below if more than one storey)

Should be both basin & wc area as long within the bathroom floor being wet area thus would be exposed to standing/ponding water by the user.
Installed bathroom tiles and grouting compound must be waterproof.

You can also add in a layer of waterproofing membrane if required to the manufacturer's installation guidelines

This post has been edited by Richard: Jul 29 2019, 09:30 AM

Richard, thanks for your feedback.

Developer said they have done the ponding test before laying the tiles on the water proofing layer. Once the test is success, they will not do the ponding test at entire bathroom, but only do test at shower area (wet area). Hence they will not accept the leaking complaint from house owner after VP who did the ponding test at entire bathroom, is this reason acceptable?

Yes..

Already passed the ponding test.. A second test might fail due to outside reasons beyond the responsibility of the development..
Maybe a new extension that damaged the water proofing ..
That is the reason

Thanks for the info

SIMILAR CASE HERE. I BOUGHT ECO HOUSE, FIRST TEST I DID THE PONDING BY MYSELF, I LET THE WATER TO REMAIN AT LEAST ONE WEEK. THEN WATERMARK DID APPEAR ON MY CEILING GROUND FLOOR. ECO REJECTED MY DEFECTS CLAIM THAT I DID WRONG. SO SECOND TIME ECO DID BUT THE CONTRACTOR SAY ONLY VALID FOR 24 HOURS. I DID CHECKED NO WATERMARK.

I QUESTION THE DEVELOPER BECAUSE IT WILL AFFECT MY PLASTER CEILING IN THE FUTURE, IF THERE IS LEAKING ON THE CEILING. ECO SAY STANDARD PRACTICE ONLY FOR 24HOURS AND NOW IM FIGHTING WITH THEM, BECAUSE THEY REFUSE TO RECTIFY THE ERROR.

ANY ONE WHO BEING CHEATED BY DEVELOPER PLEASE REPLY AND RESPONSE, WE CANT ACCEPT THIS EXCUSE ANYMORE.COMMON SENSE IF THERE IS WATERMARK MEANS THERE IS LEAKING. SAVE YOUR RMMM IF IN FUTURE YOU NEED TO FIX THE LEAKING.

Do you have an update for this? Do you go to court if any? I think one week is too long. Cement allows water to go through it through seepage (i think). Thus ponding for an extended period of time would definitely results in leakages.

My developer also mentioned the same and advised all buyers to hire a professional / certified (by CIDB) house inspection team if we decided to go with water ponding test. If the one we hire is not certified, then my developer said the testing might be invalid and warranty might be void because we didnt follow the procedure. The leakages might be our own fault.

However, what curious me is the duration of the water ponding. I requested for a quotation from different companies. One company said they will do two hours only for the test while another one said they will do it for 48 hours. Mr Google said 24 to 72 hours. So im quite confused which is the correct and standard one.

This post has been edited by aerandir: Jun 8 2020, 10:21 AM