A friend of mine told me that Body building is like cosmetics, mean just like girls do for beauty but no power.

Strenght building is for power.

fitness building is to be healthy and strong.

Toughness building is like going for commando traning.

In your opinion which is better.

brother....body building = cosmetics?? just try to lift 20 kgs of barbells each and you see what is body building..don't always listen to friend lah...try goggling yourself...everything also "friend say, friend say". No opinion, kah?

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/index.html

aiyo... dun become so mad, he just asking.. . but wat loki said is true... not easy to build our body, need a lot of effort

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrmSoPKgYEs

Oh shit. Then i better stop my powerlifting/bodybuilding since i'm lifting very light weights. I got no strength or power.

This post has been edited by darklight79: Jun 22 2006, 11:30 PM

Girls don't really like bulky and muscular men they prefer the lean and tall type...

I disagree. You don't know how wrong you are mate.

Hmm.....your sig seems to say otherwise....

Granted yes. The point is, i do bodybuilding for myself, and not to impress other women. But it doesn't mean i don't have many female friends. How are you with women? Just curious. If you don't have the means to back up your statement about women not prefering muscular guys, i don't think you should assume anything in the first place.

This post has been edited by darklight79: Jun 23 2006, 12:16 AM

umm cosmetics? sry but... your friend is dumb. have someone like say... darklight(sry cant think of anyone else atm ) slap him hard in the face and see if he still thinks its cosmetics.

your equations are kinda well wierd, all athletes are fit doesnt matter if they are weight lifters or marathon runners.

if we follow your logic that there are three types of training then they should read: speed, endurance, power.

speed being sprinters

endurance being long distance runners

and power being heavy weight lifters


toughness doesnt fit in here, while toughness can to an extent come from body building and such, alot of it is about training your mind and body to react to pain differently. someone who's 6ft and weighs 240lbs of pure muscle from body building might have a lower pain threshold than a 6ft 150lbs guy who is actively involved in martial arts where hard full contact sparring is the norm.

one is conditioned to withstand pain while the other is not.

my opinions are based on personal experience and should not be taken as anything other than that, personal opinion. to be taken with grain of salt, stir well.

Lol at the example. I get what you're saying. Thanks.
Let me tell you guys out there who just think bodybuilding is for cosmetics.
--------------> Bodybuilding is a LIFESTYLE, not just something done on the side. The discipline is there 24/7. You're in the gym, you're bodybuilding, when you're out of the gym, you're STILL bodybuilding. It's 70% diet, 30% the rest.
Watching what you eat outside the gym is also bodybuilding, constantly making sure you consume enough calories and watching your macronutrients is bodybuilding. So are making use of recovery methods and applying science and theories such as periodization, concepts of muscular, fibrillar and sarcoplasmic hypertrophy is part of bodybuilding.
What? Those people who think bodybuilding is so easy assume we just go to the gym, pump iron and get out? Sheesh.... But then, i guess the majority would never understand us because the people who appreciate bodybuilding contests are also those who bust their damn asses in the gym. They know how hard it is attaining those physiques on the stage. Please don't assume bodybuilders lift LIGHT weights.
Take football, some of you love watching it, but it doesn't mean you have to play football to enjoy watching the game right?
'Nuff said.

Btw, there are many women who like muscular guys. You just haven't met them, that's why a few individuals in this thread make assumptions.

This post has been edited by darklight79: Jun 23 2006, 12:39 AM

This friend of mine is from military. They say body builders are not that strong. he told me he seen his member(which is small, and not muscular with spare tyre) could carry weight more than bodybuilders. Running 20km with weights of 10kg(the intercom, water bottle, etc acceesories, boots), bla bla.. comando stories.

With his commando stories(you guys must know right? long story), they are doing the painful, tough activities that I think most human cannot do.

It is said that our military is more tough than UK's army. ST, herst.

LMAO!!! Prepare to get owned!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WS0GGC_LD2U...0lifting%20lift

^^^^^^^^
These guys in the video are powerlifters AND bodybuilders and they can carry more weights than your friend EVER will. And there are skinny guys in there who still can own your "army friend"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uSNvEpH2L1o...onnie%20coleman

Ronnie Coleman, leg pressing 2300lbs, again, more than your friend will ever lift.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wIX5v4_V4o...onnie%20coleman

Again, same as line above.

You have no facts to back up your statements. Show me videos, show me articles, show me proof, then come back and argue.
Quit talking smack till you come up with a video or a picture.

This post has been edited by darklight79: Jun 23 2006, 01:36 AM

haha....so..this one is from army eh...
got one fren from ATMA also
so syiok listen to his stori......expecially comando one....
u have to live in a jungle nekid in a month duration~~ with onli a knife, rope and 3 matches....(commando survival training)

p/s: they r super human~ ~
Chow.

This post has been edited by bata: Jun 23 2006, 01:33 AM

Yah, i bet living in a jungle naked for a month carrying a knife, rope and 3 matches make them really strong. Haha.

It really depends on own interest...

I'll go for fitness ... well define muscles but not too bulky ..
Too bulky will slow you down in sports ...

Not really. An article from a US friend of mine.

What is up with people and their constant need to perpetuate the "muscle/speed" myth?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So I have a friend who blogged about weight training in his blog thing. He is primarily a practitioner of Aikido but he is wondering whether he should continue weight training, and this nerd pops in and says "You know, weight trainin's gonna slow you down for Aikido!" And you know the guy hasn't even read an article in men's fitness, he's just parroting some crap he heard elsewhere. I know impliciltly that this is a stupid myth but I am at a loss for the direct science required to disprove it, beyond the physics of F=MA. Especially the biological/neurological aspects. Anyone know that stuff?

I mean even if greater mass IS harder to accelerate, the two are multiplicative, so wouldn't it stand to reason that a practitioner of a non-scored martial art would be interested in greater FORCE production per strike, and therefore the greatest multiplicative value of mass and acceleration? So if mass can be increased (good mass) without too significant of a drop in acceleration, force will go UP and the person will become more powerful and more dangerous. So long as the mass does not drop their acceleration below that of the norm, as far as defense goes, they are good to go.

I know that at some point even muscle slows acceleration, for instance, a very strong, lean horse can't beat a world class sprinter in a 3 meter race. But the assumptions people make about this concept are annoying and ignorant. And up to a certain point, I am quite sure that weight training INCREASES acceleration and allows you to hit faster, especially endurance/circuit training because it allows you to hit quickly with less fatigue.

Have you seen the physiques of sprinters compared to long distance marathon runners? I can tell you that the sprinters are very muscular indeed and they are in no way slow when it comes to doing the 100 metre race.

The main problem with carrying a lot of muscle, when it comes to endurance, is not the greater amount of mass that slows you down, its the inherent difference of the muscle fibers size. The extra bulk is secondary to the real reason why skinny guys can run marathons better than big BBers. But they can't run as fast.

However, obviously there IS a cut off point where mass starts becoming a negative rather than a positive, but the two can work together until a certain degree of mass. It's about prioritising what you want most. Explosive weight lifting movements are great for strength and speed, combining the best of both worlds. I fail to see why anyone would think weightlifting 'slows you down'. Having huge slabs of lets call it 'bodybuilding muscle' would, but if you're training for speed and gaining mass it isn't going to be a problem, only a problem if you're training specifically for mass while trying to get quicker.


This post has been edited by darklight79: Jun 23 2006, 01:53 AM

ermm... personally feel that body building make the respond slow down.. wonder is it using the wrong method? i got this feel after gym.. then i don't wan to continue d..

i prefer fitness and the military training mm is better for day use..

Yes, you're using the wrong method. There are programs which enhance performance in sports. You're probably overtraining.

Bodybuilders, not strong? Wakakakaz! Your friend needs to get his definition of "STRONG" checked. Your friend, 20KM, 10KG, isn't much of strength.

It's endurance. It's something you build up, with constant training.

Strength, is more like holding on to something blooming heavy, and being able to control your muscles to the desired motion. Not letting the weight control you

Power, is the ability to explode all your strength and release it in a single movement or repeated with follow ups.

Tat's what my previous tkd master taught me. In martial arts, you want all three.

Anyway, from my personal experience, when I hit 70KG's from my previous 63KG's, I can feel myself kicking harder and faster. Yes, faster. My techniques improved and my stability, better. So yes mister, weightlifting does help.

Frankly, get your friend to arm wrestle a weightlifter, or spar with a weightlifter/martial artist. Or do trialathon against a weightlifter. They're strong aight, trust me there.

Well said pizzaboy. There's a difference between strength and endurance. Compare 2 martial arts exponents. One who does strength training and the other who doesn't. I'll bet you any damn day that the one who weight trains will KICK the ass of the one who doesn't, provided they are both on the same skill level.
It just irks me to hell when people come in and talk smack about bodybuilding and strength training when they obviously don't know anything about it.
Probably because they've been doing nothing but chest and biceps every day and whining about no growth when they're obviously overtraining.

um, 10kg? malaysia's military must be severely lacking in supplies. a normal soldier(US army/marines, GI basicly) carries around 50-70lbs, what the hell happened to your friend's rifle and plate carrier, coms, ammo? the first 2 alone would have put him over 10kg.

my friend is learning self defense from an ex-commando, he says the commandos learn to eat insects and can see behind them using chi.

our military isnt tougher than uk's army if all we're carrying is 10kg of gear.

yup

those of us with martial arts experience know balance of the 3 is important.

This post has been edited by malaysianPotato: Jun 23 2006, 12:16 PM

OT:
commandos can see behind using chi?

commandos doesn't only learn to eat insects... they will have to learn to eat anything that can help them to survive... including worms, maggots or even dead carcass

thats what they say... apparently its supposed to be part of the 6th sense thing, you know how you get that feeling when someone watches you long enough? same thing, multiplied.

i've eaten maggots before... dont taste all that bad fried. hate grasshopers though, all crunchy with their legs and wings and ugh...**shivers**

Hey..... insects are high in protein.

Oh, that's in RMC, kids 13/14 years old did that.

The plain simple fact is, if you don't have videos or articles to back up your statements...... don't even bother.
The fact is, you came in and deliberately insinuated that bodybuilders/powerlifters are weak and cosmetic, hence the deliberate insult to our lifestyle.
I don't get it, you friend says this, your friend says that. Ask him to take a video of his strength feats.
Videos (actual proof) > E-stats.

Everyone can brag about how much they lift, how tough they are, but at the end of the day, those claims are nothing without videos.

This post has been edited by darklight79: Jun 23 2006, 05:54 PM

WCW Scott Steiner, big arm but damn weak (Ada gaya, tak ada mutu.)

WWE Kurt Angle, small size but strong, can carry Big Show (500 Pounds).

thats for entertainment onli lor....got rumors say they prefer ex-WCW to look weaker~~


Chow.

genki sudou, not all that big but would probably beat them both in a real fight

anyone watch the genki sudo vs butterbean fight, damn that was some funny shit.

eta: here we go, this is why boxers should stick to fighting against boxers.
http://youtube.com/watch?search=genki+sudo...n&v=lthhFU0pXuc

This post has been edited by malaysianPotato: Jun 23 2006, 10:58 PM

You're sure u've eaten maggots before? Or did u confuse with bamboo worms?

it was maggots, a guy on the internet was saying that he runs a shop selling cooked insects and such with chocolate or ice cream and that maggots were pretty good fried in sesame oil and how i should try it. i decided to try it since a friend bet i wouldnt be able to eat the maggots. my friend supplied the maggots, i supplied the oil and he did the frying. i ate 1 and decided to stop because he asked "wanna know where i got the maggots from?", i really should have thought about that before eating the maggot but i got $500 out of it so i dont really care.

eta: edit to clarify incident to avoid misunderstandings.

This post has been edited by malaysianPotato: Jun 23 2006, 11:50 PM

I prefer fitness.
does not really into this muscle building

even pay me RM1 million I won't be a bodybuilder.

Just be fit and healthy is enough for me.

I'm not criticising bodybuilders.

Just not really into it.

if want to improve your speed, first you need to have strong motor (your muscle) so that you can do the acceleration.

Velocity (v) and acceleration (a) is totally different thing. To have more explosive move, you need to have more explosive muscle to do the explosion. just apply the physic into it;

a=v/t, (t=time)
F=ma, (m=mass, F=force)

That's why sprinter will always have bigger muscle than marathon runner. So that they can run faster.

To be honest with you, if you want to be fit and healthy, you must at first to join the bodybuilding. Because fit and healthy is part of the bodybuilding, you need to have the knowledge of bodybuiling to know what fit and healthy is. It is like you say you want to know how to jump without knowing the rest, but you dont even know how to run at the first place, then how you want to jump?

Bodybuilding is a very wide range of body knowledge. It is almost same as human anatomy study. It is not only about carry heavy weight, and eat anything that in front of you. You need to know how to do it correctly, what to eat correctly. And it is not easy to grow lean and big without proper knowledge, and you dont hope you can grow big or fit or healthy just by eating pure protein everyday. World dont go around that easily without any other factors and variables.

It is ok to set your goal as you want to be fit and healthy. But also dont because of that goal and you neglect other knowledge and it might limit yourself to your goal. Who knows you might end up changing your mindset and your goal.

I prefer endurance. However, i think gym is good for strengthening purpose.
I also dun wan to build mass muscle (those very huge muscles) but a lean (is lean and tone the same?) type would be nice.
of coz different people have diff interests/preferences.

I wonder does those marathoners and also triathletes go to gym regularly or they just devote their time to running and cross-training only?

yeah yeah. pfft.

High level athletes engage only in very specific functional training. Going to the gym would be a waste of time and even detrimental to their training. Marathon runners do not go to the gym. If they do, it would be a waste of time. They engage specifically in improving their endurance and lactic acid tolerance. Going to the gym to build muscle would be harmful to their performance as it would increase the bulk they would have to carry and besides, if they ever got big in the first place, they will lose it soon enough right after their first endurance training session.

This applies to triathletes too, as it's also an endurance sport but triathletes who frequents the gym to improve their upper body strength is not unheard of.

Anyway, it doesn't matter whether it's Bruce Lee's physique or Brad Pitt's or Arnold Susahnakeja's physique, it would be the same identical path you have to go through. There's no such thing as I want lean muscle so I go lift weights my mother can rep for 50 reps. It's still the same lift heavy weights get out of your comfort zone process. You grow very little each time you go to the gym. It's the constant process of living out of the comfort zone and progressively growing week by week that gives Bruce Lee/Brad Pitt/Arnold their physique.

not true, to be healthy one does not require body building. they simply need to exercise and maintain a healthy diet and lifestyle. he does not want to gain weight not bulk up, he simply wants to get into decent shape and get rid of the extra fat. he does not need to start body building to achieve this.


a gym =/= a place to bulk up, a gym is simply a place for you to exercise wether your purpose is to bulk up or run marathons or whatnot does not matter at an amature level. the gym simply supplies the facilities for you to use.

all professional level athletes have personal or team gym's for upper body training. sprinters have weight training to increase the capacity(right word for this? ) of their leg and upper body muscles, i'm sure all runners have some sort of training which incorperates weights and such.
theres alot more than just running when it comes to competition level running, even highschool field and track teams have weight training.

This post has been edited by malaysianPotato: Jun 24 2006, 12:54 PM

My meaning of bodybuilding is not totally on weightlifting, it also consist of the understanding of bodybuilding like what is the body metabolism, protein that needed for the body and a lot more. If want healthy and do exercise only, i dont think that's enough for these days especially the outside food or the ingredient that you get from it. A lot of people think they are living healthily like their day-all-meal eat or drink fruit juice, some i even heard of they say they are healthy because they have plain roti canai for their meal. From which i think they dont really understand how exactly the body support to work. For me, the bodybuilder is the world most concern about their body's person, they can really fully understood their body and how it suppose to work. But of course not all bodybuilders are the same. Some just simply do powertraining, bulking or a lot more.

This is just my 2 cent.

notice i did say "exercise and healthy diet", a healthy diet isnt exactly hard to come by, 1 day of research on the internet will give you enough info for the rest of your life's dietery needs. people's misguided idea of healthy food =/= healthy food. so my saying proper exercise and healthy diet is sufficient for his needs is accurate, if he were to begin exercising and changing his diet to one which was healthy and maintaining it then he would eventually achieve his goal of being in shape and healthy.

you do not need to be a body builder to know whats good and whats not for your body, you simply need to take the time to do some research. knowing your body and what it needs =/= bodybuilding.

theres no real point going back and forth on this, he doesnt need to body build he just needs to exercise properly, eat right and maintain it.

I agree, to be healthy doesnt necessary require body building.

For athletes, gym might be an optional thing. To become a better runner, u need to run more. To become a better basketball player, u need to practise more on shoots, passes and etcs.

You guys all have a point. Bodybuilding is not an ABSOLUTE prerequisite for being healthy BUT it does promote a healthy lifestyle. But there are athletes who lift weights to enhance their performance in sports.
Granted, you can't mimic a sports skill in the gym (eg. swinging a loaded barbell like a golf club thinking you'll get stronger cos that's stupid) but doing particular exercises there can improve performance significantly. (eg. squats help sprinting, military pressing and bench pressing, etc help track and field athletes tremendously)

At the end of the day, whatever you guys prefer, "bodybuilding or just fitness" is up to personal preference. There's no problem with that.

What i DO have a problem with are individuals who come in just to diss the bodybuilding lifestyle and make derogatory comments about it. I think that's what heated up a few regulars here like Flesh Wound, pizzaboy, iDk, me and a fw others.

*I'd like to think that the LYN Health and Fitness members are much better at resolving disputes compared to the people who frequent the other sections of LYN (*cough* Cupid's *cough*).
After all, no matter how varying our opinions, we're still in pursuit of the same goal ----------------> Maintaining a healthy lifestyle. 'Nuff said.

Peace.

This post has been edited by darklight79: Jun 24 2006, 07:47 PM

Darklight bro I shall call you Professor X from now on.

Not until he breaks his legs from challenging the limit with squats.

This post has been edited by bambambam: Jun 24 2006, 08:12 PM

A "bodybuilder"


Brad Pitt

Who looks healthier to you?
Tell me you prefer the second body.

I say "Ai"

Well, we should respect each other.
I have no problems with bodybuilders.

But I strongly prefer fitness
Hard to achieve lorr...that's why.

Maybe try weight training after this.
Been jogging for a long time...just stay fit but NO Brad Pitt's six packs.

Well. It's a matter of preference. I know a lot of guys would go with the flow of which type of physique women prefer. My sig says i bodybuild for myself, not to please women. Let's not compare 2 crazy extremes. I'm no Syed Fazli or Ronnie Coleman, I'm a natural bodybuilder and steroid free, but people would still call me pretty big. My pics say another story:-

http://www.friendster.com/6323938

So, there are women who like bodybuilder physiques and women who like fitness physiques. 'Nuff said.

Peace.

This post has been edited by darklight79: Jun 25 2006, 01:43 AM

nice pics darkie...wakakak
from bambambam pics.....i prefer A type.......for nowadays actor.....i think i prefer Mark Wahlberg physique..


Chow.

Agree.
Maybe women finds bodybuilders sexy etc.

So does Brad Pitt. Women do think he's sexy.
Differ people, differ taste.

dark,
I saw your video in frenster.

What do you call that rod thing?

Let say you lying on a bench.
Then push that rod from your chest and push it to the air.
What do you call that move?

My question is:

Is it the same to push ups?
Easier and better result by doing that compare to push ups is it?

It's purpose is to have a 'keras' chest right?
Mine is flabby

I saw you pictures.
Nice biceps.
bodybuilders...not easy tau to achieve body like that.

Needs determination and hard work.

Hey bro. Thanks for the compliments in the second post from this. I'm glad we could find common ground.

Anyway, as for your questions, the rod is called a barbell. And that movement you're describing is called the barbell bench press.
And no, it's harder than push ups but a lot more effective because it has added resistance.
You see, in push ups, the resistance is your bodyweight. Your chest will grow for a while, but after that it'll be more of an endurance exercise since your body would have adapted to the same resistance. Adaptation.
The bench press allows you to add resistance, hence the logic heavier weights = bigger muscles.
I'll find a link to the barbell bench press for you tomorrow. Pretty damn tired now. Lol. Need sleep.