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 Has Soundbars Improved to Usable Levels?

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SUSskyforcerld
post Apr 15 2019, 02:29 PM

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QUOTE(Andrewtst @ Apr 15 2019, 02:13 PM)
I not sure for others, but LG SK9 won't activate Dolby Atmos if your source is not direct connect to the soundbar but TV itself.
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I think most, if not all won't. Current ARC only supports DD passthrough. Any other additional formats like DD plus or DD Atmos, is a hit and miss (most likely miss) when using current ARC, depending your TV supports it or not, and your soundbar/AVR supports it or not, and even if both do, are they compatible with each other.

We will need HDMI 2.1 and e-ARC for return of higher quality audio DD Atmos.

So best bet today on connections, is to have a box(playing NETFLIX/YOUTUBE/Whatever) => soundbar/AVR => TV.
Andrewtst
post Apr 15 2019, 07:34 PM

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QUOTE(skyforcerld @ Apr 15 2019, 02:29 PM)
I think most, if not all won't. Current ARC only supports DD passthrough. Any other additional formats like DD plus or DD Atmos, is a hit and miss (most likely miss) when using current ARC, depending your TV supports it or not, and your soundbar/AVR supports it or not, and even if both do, are they compatible with each other.

We will need HDMI 2.1 and e-ARC for return of higher quality audio DD Atmos.

So best bet today on connections, is to have a box(playing NETFLIX/YOUTUBE/Whatever) => soundbar/AVR => TV.
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Ya. Agree. I also check out it is also due to current HDMI issue.

The problem is beside TV Box, I also have 4K UHD player but seldom use already. Haha!
GHOSTVIC
post Apr 15 2019, 08:20 PM

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QUOTE(skyforcerld @ Apr 15 2019, 09:18 AM)
Wow! There's some serious legwork there! thumbup.gif

I think it would be better to test dolby atmos sound using NETFLIX or some downloaded files which you know the sound track has a good/complete DD Atmos, rather than Youtube as we can't be sure the quality of the source. Unless you intend to buy a lot of Blurays or download huge uncompressed files with DDTHD or DTS-MA, i don't think there is a reason to have DD True HD or DTS-MA. So it depends on what you intend to watch.

Even then, DD Atmos is the future, i believe. The Yamaha models has been around for some time and haven't been updated yet, hence no DD Atmos. Although i am big fan of Yamaha ( i have Yammy AVR, subwoofer, digital piano, electric guitar etc....), i can't honestly recommend to spend the same amount of money to get something that is already obsolete right out of the door, when we can see the next big thing standard already here and available, when you can spend about the same to get the latest elsewhere.

As for the 1 HDMI in, 1 HDMI out, it can be resolved with a HDMI switch. You will have to find a HDMI switch which supports 4k60p and HDR (for connecting PS4, Bluray etc to play 4K with HDR). Problem with soundbar is there is always not enough HDMI ports, even the highest end soundbar maybe gives you 3 ports at most. When looking for HDMI switch, if possible, also get one which does not need external power and can be power by the HDMI cables alone. This will save some hassle and one less cable (i hate cables...).
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Thanks for the information brother. Appreciate it..
So which sound bar you suggesting based on your expertise brother?
SUSskyforcerld
post Apr 15 2019, 08:43 PM

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QUOTE(GHOSTVIC @ Apr 15 2019, 08:20 PM)
Thanks for the information brother.  Appreciate it..
So which sound bar you suggesting based on your expertise brother?
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I am not expert bro.. sweat.gif..i only give some opinion based on what i would look for...

I think you have done roundup of a good selections already, now it's matter of fitting your budget and needs. Another model you can look into is the SONY HT-Z9F. This one RRP at RM2,999 but should be able to get cheaper at shops and online.

I don't know what do you watch most, so what do you intend to watch most? For me, my main source is Netflix and Youtube and ahem sources for Asian Dramas which will not have any sort of quality surround sound anyway.

As for quality of the sound of the soundbar, you will have to listen to it and make your own judgement. I haven't hear any of them so i won't comment. I can only comment on the specs. tongue.gif


GHOSTVIC
post Apr 15 2019, 09:26 PM

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QUOTE(Andrewtst @ Apr 15 2019, 02:13 PM)
I not sure for others, but LG SK9 won't activate Dolby Atmos if your source is not direct connect to the soundbar but TV itself.
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I see, what about the sound delays i am hearing about... how it happens
OPTION A : astro / android box --> TV (hdmi in) --> soundbar (hdmi arc out / optical)
OPTION B : astro / android box --> soundbar (hmdi in) --> TV (hdmi arc out / optical)


both option giving different sound ha... LG spec desciption not detail enough as SONY saying about the ports and what sound can be delivered. Atleast user can have idea.

Example for SONY HTX9000F Audio Formats

HDMI input - Dolby® Digital, Dolby Digital Plus™, Dolby® TrueHD, Dolby Atmos®,Dolby® Dual mono,DTS®,DTS-HD High Resolution Audio™,DTS-HD Master Audio™,DTS-ES,DTS 96/24,DTS:X™,LPCM(2ch / 5.1ch / 7.1ch), DSD(2ch / 5.1ch)

Optical Input - Dolby® Digital,Dolby® Dual mono,DTS®, LPCM 2ch

USB - DSD(.dsf / .diff), Wav, Flac, Alac(.m4a only), AIFF, HE AAC, AAC, mp3, Monkey Audio, WMA, Ogg Vorbis

Bluetooth(Receiver) - SBC, AAC



Attached Image Attached Image

This post has been edited by GHOSTVIC: Apr 15 2019, 09:28 PM
GHOSTVIC
post Apr 15 2019, 09:44 PM

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QUOTE(skyforcerld @ Apr 15 2019, 08:43 PM)
I am not expert bro.. sweat.gif..i only give some opinion based on what  i would look for...

I think you have done roundup of a good selections already, now it's matter of fitting your budget and needs. Another model you can look into is the SONY  HT-Z9F. This one RRP at RM2,999 but should be able to get cheaper at shops and online.

I don't know what do you watch most, so what do you intend to watch most? For me, my main source is Netflix and Youtube and ahem sources for Asian Dramas which will not have any sort of quality surround sound anyway.

As for quality of the sound of the soundbar, you will have to listen to it and make your own judgement. I haven't hear any of them so i won't comment. I can only comment on the specs. tongue.gif
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Ya HD movie with dolby sound, i hate my current SAMSUNG 4K TV NU8000 sound quality. That is why i would like to go for soundbar. Wanted to enjoy dolby audio. I see in this TV has dolby option but cannot enable it since no dolby support device attached.
Whats the point having 4K TV but no soundbar no android box. hahaha...
I have doubt SONY / LG soundbars will be compatible to SAMSUNG 4K TV ? Is the will be any BUGS firmware or software issues, sound delays or any glitch ?
Worry spending high, if anything does not sync or goes wrong total effort and money wasted.

Andrewtst
post Apr 15 2019, 09:54 PM

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QUOTE(GHOSTVIC @ Apr 15 2019, 09:26 PM)
I see, what about the sound delays i am hearing about... how it happens
OPTION A : astro / android box --> TV (hdmi in) --> soundbar (hdmi arc out / optical)
OPTION B : astro / android box --> soundbar (hmdi in) --> TV (hdmi arc out / optical)
both option giving different sound ha... LG spec desciption not detail enough as SONY saying about the ports and what sound can be delivered. Atleast user can have idea.

Example for SONY HTX9000F Audio Formats

HDMI input - Dolby® Digital, Dolby Digital Plus™, Dolby® TrueHD, Dolby Atmos®,Dolby® Dual mono,DTS®,DTS-HD High Resolution Audio™,DTS-HD Master Audio™,DTS-ES,DTS 96/24,DTS:X™,LPCM(2ch / 5.1ch / 7.1ch), DSD(2ch / 5.1ch)

Optical Input - Dolby® Digital,Dolby® Dual mono,DTS®, LPCM 2ch

USB - DSD(.dsf / .diff), Wav, Flac, Alac(.m4a only), AIFF, HE AAC, AAC, mp3, Monkey Audio, WMA, Ogg Vorbis

Bluetooth(Receiver) - SBC, AAC
Attached Image Attached Image
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In the manual it only mentioned what setting can out Dolby Atmos. The rest didn't mentioned. Haha. You can get the manual here https://www.lg.com/us/support-product/lg-SK9Y

I think optical had limit to 2 channel even they is Dolby support. I not so sure. But pretty sure Dolby Atmos required direct connect device to soundbar HDMI in only.

They is sound delay when connecting device to TV HDMI in and later ARC to Soundbar. I Google seems this is common issue especially if your content is 4K which make it very obvious. That probably the reason why they is delay setting for you to adjust.

They is no sound delay issue when direct connect device to Soundbar HDMI in.

This post has been edited by Andrewtst: Apr 15 2019, 10:07 PM
SUSskyforcerld
post Apr 16 2019, 08:34 AM

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QUOTE(Andrewtst @ Apr 15 2019, 09:54 PM)
In the manual it only mentioned what setting can out Dolby Atmos. The rest didn't mentioned. Haha. You can get the manual here https://www.lg.com/us/support-product/lg-SK9Y

I think optical had limit to 2 channel even they is Dolby support. I not so sure. But pretty sure Dolby Atmos required direct connect device to soundbar HDMI in only.

They is sound delay when connecting device to TV HDMI in and later ARC to Soundbar. I Google seems this is common issue especially if your content is 4K which make it very obvious. That probably the reason why they is delay setting for you to adjust.

They is no sound delay issue when direct connect device to Soundbar HDMI in.
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I found there is delay even when using optical in from TV to AVR. Playing Netflix on my Android TV, output optical out to AVR. When both TV speaker and AVR speaker on, can clearly hear delay.

Problem is in AVR only can set delay the sound...which is already delayed...there is no way to move the sound a bit faster than what was received, unless there is some way to delay the video on the TV.

It is not that bad (compared to ARC which is giving me serious delay), but still noticeable a bit.

I think in the end, an external TV Box player is still the best to avoid so many problems!

This post has been edited by skyforcerld: Apr 16 2019, 08:35 AM
Andrewtst
post Apr 16 2019, 08:43 AM

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QUOTE(skyforcerld @ Apr 16 2019, 08:34 AM)
I found there is delay even when using optical in from TV to AVR. Playing Netflix on my Android TV, output optical out to AVR. When both TV speaker and AVR speaker on, can clearly hear delay.

Problem is in AVR only can set delay the sound...which is already delayed...there is no way to move the sound a bit faster than what was received, unless there is some way to delay the video on the TV.

It is not that bad (compared to ARC which is giving me serious delay), but still noticeable a bit.

I think in the end, an external TV Box player is still the best to avoid so many problems!
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I didn't try optical. No idea. Probably only HDMI in at soundbar no delay.

Ya TV box is a must for full enjoyment in movies now.

This post has been edited by Andrewtst: Apr 16 2019, 08:44 AM
SUSskyforcerld
post Apr 17 2019, 11:20 AM

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QUOTE(GHOSTVIC @ Apr 15 2019, 03:57 AM)
I went to harveynorman IPC IKEA to test.. need to check other places if can get cheaper ir not.. i tested sound from youtube so i couldnt hear difference between dolby atmos vs dolby true hd..
Very hard to pick.. i feel YAMAHA produce good bass and sony good clarity.

YSP 1600 - RM2106 (5.1ch, dolby audio,dts,dtsx)
YAS 306 - RM1508 (7.1ch  built in subwoofee)
YAS 207 - RM1499 (2.1 ch, 200w, 4k)

HTX9000F - RM1999 (2.1ch, dolby atmos)
HTCT800 - RM1239 (3.1ch, 350w, dolby audio)

LG SK9 - RM2097 (5.1.2 ch,dolby atmos, 500w)
LG SK8 - RM1398 (2.1ch , dolby atmos,360w)
LG SK6 - RM1096 (2.1 ch)
For dolby atmos LG SK9 seems better over SONY HTX900F.. Both just 1 hdmi in, 1 hdmi out. If u have more devices than got to use tv..
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I see you survey survey, now ayam also poisoned....dang i can't get rid of my AVR...putting them in store room, also already full...waifu will rage....sweat.gif

Anyway, i have been thinking my setup also.

After much survey, i realized there is very little option to play Netflix 4K HDR and Dolby Atmos. Most of the solution is imperfect, expensive or lacking in some ways.

I realized there is one option to play it perfectly and i already have it.....using a PC...Windows 10 app Netflix is capable of all these (with the right hardware). My PCs are already capable of Netflix DD Atmos (it's shown in the app...on my Android TV, the Dolby Atmos won't appear). So all i need to do is connect my PC to a Soundbar and it should pass in as PCM or LPCM, meaning the PC will decode the DD Atmos from Windows 10 Netflix App. So voila! I don't care if the soundbar is not capabale of DD Atmos! I will pass decoded LPCM channels to it. Then i will have more options to choose from (as currently i am looking at soundbar with specifically DD Atmos).

Anyone care to comment? Is this workable?

This post has been edited by skyforcerld: Apr 17 2019, 11:22 AM
Andrewtst
post Apr 17 2019, 11:35 AM

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QUOTE(skyforcerld @ Apr 17 2019, 11:20 AM)
I see you survey survey, now ayam also poisoned....dang i can't get rid of my AVR...putting them in store room, also already full...waifu will rage....sweat.gif

Anyway, i have been thinking my setup also.

After much survey, i realized there is very little option to play Netflix 4K HDR and Dolby Atmos. Most of the solution is imperfect, expensive or lacking in some ways.

I realized there is one option to play it perfectly and i already have it.....using a PC...Windows 10 app Netflix is capable of all these (with the right hardware). My PCs are already capable of Netflix DD Atmos (it's shown in the app...on my Android TV, the Dolby Atmos won't appear). So all i need to do is connect my PC to a Soundbar and it should pass in as PCM or LPCM, meaning the PC will decode the DD Atmos from Windows 10 Netflix App. So voila! I don't care if the soundbar is not capabale of DD Atmos! I will pass decoded LPCM channels to it. Then i will have more options to choose from (as currently i am looking at soundbar with specifically DD Atmos).

Anyone care to comment? Is this workable?
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For LG, they is special setting for Atmos and it do sound different. It is more immersive compare with content not in Atmos mode. The Atmos mode is hidden and cannot activate manually.
sou12b810
post Apr 17 2019, 11:37 AM

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using my panasonic past 5 years..

happy with it ..
but no bluetooth

SUSskyforcerld
post Apr 17 2019, 11:41 AM

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QUOTE(Andrewtst @ Apr 17 2019, 11:35 AM)
For LG, they is special setting for Atmos and it do sound different. It is more immersive compare with content not in Atmos mode. The Atmos mode is hidden and cannot activate manually.
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What do you mean it's hidden and cannot activate manually?

btw, does your soundbar have wireless or wired subwoofer?

I saw lots of SK8 for quite cheap used also, but it's 2.1 compared to 5.1 (or 5.2?) of the SK9, but rest of the features seems similar.
Andrewtst
post Apr 17 2019, 11:46 AM

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QUOTE(skyforcerld @ Apr 17 2019, 11:41 AM)
What do you mean it's hidden and cannot activate manually?

btw, does your soundbar have wireless or wired subwoofer?

I saw lots of SK8 for quite cheap used also, but it's 2.1 compared to 5.1 (or 5.2?) of the SK9, but rest of the features seems similar.
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It auto change to Atmos sound effect when detect source as Atmos. This Atmos profile is never a selection if no Atmos detect. Also others sound effect is gone when in Atmos.

Subwoofer is wireless.

SK9Y is 5.1.2 and big differences in sound quality compare with SK8Y.

This post has been edited by Andrewtst: Apr 17 2019, 11:46 AM
SUSskyforcerld
post Apr 17 2019, 11:53 AM

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QUOTE(Andrewtst @ Apr 17 2019, 11:46 AM)
It auto change to Atmos sound effect when detect source as Atmos. This Atmos profile is never a selection if no Atmos detect. Also others sound effect is gone when in Atmos.

Subwoofer is wireless.

SK9Y is 5.1.2 and big differences in sound quality compare with SK8Y.
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I see. That means your source passing the DD Atmos to the soundbar to decode, this is normal behaviour for AVR/Soundbar.

Back to my previous idea, if i can pass decoded LPCM to the soundbar, it will open my options. I don't neccessary need the best and loudest sound. Waifu don't allow anyway. My main concern is getting rid of my AVR to have a clean look with a soundbar which is capable of supporting everything that Netflix has to offer. smile.gif

One of my options is also to have a soundbar which can connect to an external subwoofer and make use of my existing Yammy subwoofer. So i have one less headache of getting rid an equipment, and no need to introduce another one...but soundbar which doesnt comes with subwoofer options are very rare and even harder when you have some other requirements.

I think later i go Harvey Norman look see look see during lunch...hehe.

This post has been edited by skyforcerld: Apr 17 2019, 12:04 PM
rx330
post Apr 17 2019, 01:36 PM

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QUOTE(skyforcerld @ Apr 17 2019, 11:53 AM)
I see. That means your source passing the DD Atmos to the soundbar to decode, this is normal behaviour for AVR/Soundbar.

Back to my previous idea, if i can pass decoded LPCM to the soundbar, it will open my options. I don't neccessary need the best and loudest sound. Waifu don't allow anyway. My main concern is getting rid of my AVR to have a clean look with a soundbar which is capable of supporting everything that Netflix has to offer. smile.gif

One of my options is also to have a soundbar which can connect to an external subwoofer and make use of my existing Yammy subwoofer. So i have one less headache of getting rid an equipment, and no need to introduce another one...but soundbar which doesnt comes with subwoofer options are very rare and even harder when you have some other requirements.

I think later i go Harvey Norman look see look see during lunch...hehe.
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then the easiest for you would be Yamaha soundbar

most of their soundbar comes without sub woofer, and has the plug for optional external sub
since ur sub is from Yamaha as well, I think shud work like a charm
SUSskyforcerld
post Apr 17 2019, 04:37 PM

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QUOTE(rx330 @ Apr 17 2019, 01:36 PM)
then the easiest for you would be Yamaha soundbar

most of their soundbar comes without sub woofer, and has the plug for optional external sub
since ur sub is from Yamaha as well, I think shud work like a charm
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Yeah, i think only Yamaha has such options, but then only a few specific models.

Btw, i read up on DTS:X on the YAS-207.

https://www.techhive.com/article/3244136/ya...207-review.html

This DTS:X really that good? Like these i can ignore Dolby Atmos already.

Most importantly in the review:

QUOTE
The YAS-207 will also serve as a good compromise for spouses who want audio equipment in the house to be heard and not seen.
rclxms.gif
rx330
post Apr 18 2019, 10:53 AM

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QUOTE(skyforcerld @ Apr 17 2019, 04:37 PM)
Yeah, i think only Yamaha has such options, but then only a few specific models.

Btw, i read up on DTS:X on the YAS-207.

https://www.techhive.com/article/3244136/ya...207-review.html

This DTS:X really that good? Like these i can ignore Dolby Atmos already.

Most importantly in the review:
rclxms.gif
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technically this 207 is good n cheap, only drawback should be the short of hdmi inputs I think
if you do not have lots of sources, then go with this

don't bother too much on the DTS x
SUSskyforcerld
post Apr 18 2019, 02:15 PM

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QUOTE(rx330 @ Apr 18 2019, 10:53 AM)
technically this 207 is good n cheap, only drawback should be the short of hdmi inputs I think
if you do not have lots of sources, then go with this

don't bother too much on the DTS x
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This got a subwoofer. I am thinking YAS-108, cheap good and non intrusive. Can tell waifu, it is replacement for Centre Speaker (which i have to remove currently coz it's too big blocking the TV). Review of YAS-108 seems good, all it needs is to connect to my external subwoofer. HDMI inputs, i plan to get a 4K60pHDR HDMI Switch.

Maybe go to Yamaha showroom this weekend to borak.
Andrewtst
post Apr 18 2019, 02:58 PM

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QUOTE(skyforcerld @ Apr 17 2019, 04:37 PM)
Yeah, i think only Yamaha has such options, but then only a few specific models.

Btw, i read up on DTS:X on the YAS-207.

https://www.techhive.com/article/3244136/ya...207-review.html

This DTS:X really that good? Like these i can ignore Dolby Atmos already.

Most importantly in the review:
rclxms.gif
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Not many title in DTS:X, mostly is Dolby Atmos or DTS-HD only.

Actually not that important as long the output is awesome.

This post has been edited by Andrewtst: Apr 18 2019, 03:05 PM

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