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 Personal Financial Management V3, It's all about managing your $$$

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engtat
post May 3 2016, 07:30 PM

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This is my friend case, and I am proposing him to take EPF money to settle personal loan via his current semi-flexi house loan.

Personal Loan amount: RM15,000
Personal Loan Interest rate: 11.0%
House Loan Interest rate: 4.4%
EPF Interest rate%: 6.4%

Suggesting him to withdraw money from EPF Account 2, and take the money from his semi-flexi house loan account to settle personal loan.

Is it possible? Once EPF made the payment to my friend's house loan account, there is no difference than own money deposited to house loan account right?

This post has been edited by engtat: May 3 2016, 07:31 PM
engtat
post May 4 2016, 01:00 AM

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QUOTE(wkphang @ May 4 2016, 12:32 AM)
How about refinance the house? use the extra cash from the refinancing to clear the personal loan, as the rate is 11%. How many years your friend has been paying the hse loan so far? and what is the market value of the house?

While hse loan is at 4.4% (is much more lower than the personal loan)...
btw, how old is your friend? if he still young, can consider refinance.

the number of years you can borrow is up to 35 years or if your friend reach 70 yr old, whichever reach first. (correct me if i'm wrong).

personally, i will not go for the epf withdrawal as it still gives about 6% (assuming that your friend still working, and contributing to epf... the total will gradually grow).
i think in this case, refinance the house is a better option.

while, can use the epf for investment, that will be your retirement (Unless your friend has a better achievement in terms of ROI that is more than the epf 6% annually, else you can consider that.

While your friend get to clear the personal loan, he also can use the epf to invest. however, please be caution, that investment comes with risk. so it depends on your friend risk appetite, and the discipline for it.
if you go for high risk investment via epf, you may get high return, but you also may risk high losses. basically just do your due diligence.
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My friend is not good in investment, so based on his personality, I will not suggest something complicated.

15K of amount seems like not worth to refinance when there are other charges, and his repayment just started less than 3 years ago, I did not see any room to refinance.

EPF Acc 1 to UT involves sales charge, I hope my suggestion can minimize his impact in retirement with EPF, try not to touch other acc.

Yes, it would be first time application for withdrawal, I read the EPF website that there is chance for cheque payment if direct debit with financial institue has failed, but not sure whether can opt in for cheque in the beginning.

If withdrawal from house loan acc after direct debit is possible, guess this is another option. Just wondering anyone done this before.

Friend age @ 38.

This post has been edited by engtat: May 4 2016, 01:06 AM
engtat
post May 5 2016, 12:29 AM

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QUOTE(wkphang @ May 4 2016, 11:10 PM)
but TS mentioned his friend personal loan has a 11% interest rate. If he do a balance transfer /cash on call via credit card, it will be about 4-9% and also got processing/admin fee if not mistaken.

9% and 11% not much difference.

i agreed that 15k is not a big limit. However, depends also on his friend's salary/income. If his friend able to save 2k to 3k per mth, he just need about 5-7.5 mths to clear.

If he can borrow from his relatives/friends/parents, by offering 3-5% for them, and at the same time nego to pay back in installment... this way not just can help his friend reduce/clear in few mths time, but also able to keep his epf intact. This is because his friend do not know about investment, and finds it complicated. Therefore, in this case, is better to keep the money in epf.

15k to some ppl is no big deal, but to some ppl it maybe a big deal... so it depends on various factors that TS's friend only knows.
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Just digged more info.

His personal loan repayment tenure is 60 months, just serviced 18 months so far.

The first time I talked to him, I already suggested him to apply credit card, apparently he has no credit card. Reason is that, credit card can be served as emergency due to his wife is delivering soon.

Borrow from people around is not an option, personal complication.

His DSR over net income now is at 73%, and not possible to save 1K per month, so you get the idea of his salary range.

And yes, 9 and 11% has not much difference, one could just borrow money from future self via EPF.
engtat
post May 5 2016, 12:51 PM

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QUOTE(j.passing.by @ May 5 2016, 03:12 AM)
Almost every sentence you wrote raises a red flag.

If you thiink 11% is high, I would imagine him paying from 12% to 18% with a credit card.

And how to get money out of EPF... except maybe using fradulent documents... if there was any easy loophole, it would have been abused by many people ages ago, and already closed. So let's not waste time on non-solutions...

It might be high time to face reality that he could be living beyond his salary and financial status... for example, if can't afford to have medical care in a private facilty, then the option is public hospital.

With the high DSR, talking of making some interest savings by changing from one loan to another can be extraneous. Banks would assess the credit risk of the individual and charges the interest accordingly. So we can't simply say that if we were offered an interest rate of x% from Bank A, your friend could save some money by having a lower interest loan by switching to Bank A.

Anyway, the best time to think about making any interest savings was before and during the application of the loan. After making the decision to take any loan, it is already clear how much we have pay in installments every month, and more important, whether we can cover the installments and other bills and expenses from our salary.

What would throw a spanner into the monthly budget is extraodinary or unexpected expenses in some months, thereby missing some payments and incurring late payment penalties and maybe, due to these late payments, the bank increases the interest rate.

If this is what your friend is facing, not able to make ends meet in some months, then maybe the better option is to approach AKPK for assistance... https://www.akpk.org.my/

(See also the AKPK thread in this forum for further info and queries...)
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I would not suggest him to loan from credit card, and as I mentioned, it is for emergency and indeed, he already chose public hospital since the first day. Bank might or might not approve his CC application but I told him to apply from two banks, just in case.

EPF, if you refer early posts, the discussion was started, as can he apply EPF account 2, so that the money can be deposited into his semi-flexi HL account, and further withdraw out to settle his personal loan. His personal loan tenure is freaking long when the first time I heard it. If it is workable, use the money that supposed to pay personal loan for investment or deposit back into EPF, to less jeopardize his retirement fund. Nothing fradulent here, the question is always, will bank lock the money from EPF, and do not treat that as semi-flexi fund.

He told me he did pay all on time, thus, maybe credit rating is not that bad.

AKPK is the last resort, he is not at the point, into a forever blackhole yet, just not worth to pay so much interest.
engtat
post May 5 2016, 03:11 PM

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QUOTE(j.passing.by @ May 5 2016, 02:42 PM)
================

"... the question is always, will bank lock the money from EPF, and do not treat that as semi-flexi fund."
The EPF website has further info on monthly withdrawals to supplement the monthly housing installments... how to apply, etc... the question of whether the bank lock the money is irrelevant; you pay a lesser amount on the installment, and EPF helps pay the remaining portion.

By the way the question was phrased, any newbie to flexi-loan could mistakenly assumed that whatever amount of money we put into the flexi or semi-flexi could be withdrawn. It is actually the extra money that is above the required monthly installment that can be withdrawn.

The main problem is, I think, that there is confusion on how the bank will treats the extra money - a) as advance payment into future installments, or b) a standby sum to contra outstanding balance and interest charged which can be withdrawn.

As said, the EPF monthly withdrawals are to supplement the monthly installments...
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The consideration here is EPF "Reduce/Redeem Housing Loan Balance" (can only be done once a year), not ""Housing Loan Monthly Instalment Withdrawal".

In my planned advice, I understand that it is about extra money (that offset principal) on top of minimum monthly repayment, in semi or full flexi loan. On the bank side issue, we can always call up bank to confirm, but the EPF side is a bit tricky.

He is not the person that in financial stress, but lack of backup fund. Discipline on putting the money back to EPF is always a concern. If executed properly, getting rid of 11% personal loan is still better than 6% EPF?

I am taking really cautious step before giving out of advices, thus just share my thoughts here.

This post has been edited by engtat: May 5 2016, 03:18 PM

 

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