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 Is water heater safe to use?

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weikee
post Sep 10 2013, 11:50 PM

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QUOTE(Patagoniaranger @ Sep 10 2013, 04:02 PM)
according to the radio station this morning american consist of about 30 cases of electrocution per year.
actually this is very often also just that the news were not spread out like this japanese couple . i heard of this case many times already.
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Electrocution can be many things, not only instant water heating.


weikee
post Sep 10 2013, 11:51 PM

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QUOTE(ozak @ Sep 10 2013, 11:42 PM)
Final Destination meh.  tongue.gif

During gas heater era, not much news I heard about gas explosion. Normally the leaking is very small. Rather a fire than explosion.

Gas heater have a safety valve. Which will shutdown when high pressure release. Even if a gas hose broken, the most is fire shut out. Because the gas valve limit the pressure. I saw this kind of situation before during makan steambot. Scary.

The most famous news using gas heater is suicide. Specially in HK. Even HK actress use gas heater for suicide.
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The was I remember was the Empire shopping mall.


weikee
post Sep 11 2013, 09:27 AM

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QUOTE(ozak @ Sep 11 2013, 08:47 AM)
In this country, the gas era is over. It is just like trend here. And most of them don't no got gas heater too.

Mostly using elctrical heater. As it is cheaper and easy to install.
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Because people here in this forum mostly marketing electrical, and solar only. And they don't sell.

Gas is still best bang for buck. And go for RINNAI.
weikee
post Sep 11 2013, 12:49 PM

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All storage heater piping will be earth. Make sure house earth cable are working. I earth all my ss piping.

Even solar can be dangerous if electric leak. Imagine a live wires touches the steel / copper pipe. These can happen when rats bit the cables and it touches the pipes.
weikee
post Sep 11 2013, 01:05 PM

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QUOTE(ozak @ Sep 11 2013, 12:21 PM)
I m not sure about this. Weikee is using storage tank. Maybe he can answer you. Additional elcb for safety perhaps?
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Storage tank have earth wires.

The key is to have your house earth wire working. Without Earth is without protection.
weikee
post Sep 11 2013, 01:11 PM

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QUOTE(ycs @ Sep 11 2013, 12:36 PM)
even if heater element leaks electricity, the water can't conduct electricity as it breaks up into drops as it comes out of the showerhead and won't create a circuit

and if all external parts are plastic/non-conductive then should be ok
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Haha... like that also can. rclxms.gif I got no comment already.
weikee
post Sep 11 2013, 01:13 PM

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QUOTE(ycs @ Sep 11 2013, 12:36 PM)
even if heater element leaks electricity, the water can't conduct electricity as it breaks up into drops as it comes out of the showerhead and won't create a circuit

and if all external parts are plastic/non-conductive then should be ok
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Haha... like that also can. rclxms.gif I got no comment already.
weikee
post Sep 11 2013, 04:27 PM

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QUOTE(eksk @ Sep 11 2013, 02:15 PM)
dont use hot water heater lar.. we are in malaysia lar so cold meh our weather? bath cold water gooding.. can increase body metabolism .. burn fat... budak budak nowadays so pampered, in my grandpapa time bath early morning from teligi siok woh.. or so they tell me..
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No need to pampered, no astro, no internet, no smart phone, no need electicity.. Last time without all these also can survived...

All there are Standard of living..don't have won't die ma... So go without it lo
weikee
post Sep 13 2013, 11:29 AM

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If the resistance level if earth are higher than the water path electron will flow via less resistance.

The other possibility is the instance water heater are leaking, and the leak flow from live to water and to the human body while earth could be high resistance.

High rise building earth have one issue, high resistance if not maintain.

This post has been edited by weikee: Sep 13 2013, 11:30 AM
weikee
post Sep 13 2013, 11:37 AM

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I gave back most of my E&E knowledge to the collegue. Here some good slide for reference.

http://fyi.uwex.edu/mrec/files/2011/04/W4....ng-MREC2010.pdf

http://www.suparule.com/docs/earth_ground_...g_technique.pdf
weikee
post Sep 13 2013, 01:26 PM

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QUOTE(Patagoniaranger @ Sep 13 2013, 12:42 PM)
Okay, from the scientific theory of it, this invention is failed to me. All water heaters are not safe no matter what Protection is used.As long s current is live and you are holding the hose that conduct electricity is dangerous especially when water n electricity is in the bathroom. I would assume the water tank unit and solar power unit is safer than the one in the bathroom with you.
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Car build with 7 airbags will have death cases. Everythings are not 100% safe.

For the Instant Water heater design point of view, earth / ground have to work. If grounding have higher resistance compare to the the water, live current will go to the water and not earth.
weikee
post Sep 13 2013, 05:32 PM

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Manufacture will produce product with minimal basic security, any add on will required more $$$ and transfer the cost to consumer. Even with state of the art technology, no one can prevent accident.

I do agree the manufacture need to look into another design. But if I recall, my mom house water heater can't be switch on if the earth are faulty and this are basic things. I remember this when I wire the water heater and forgot to wire the earth.

Since I am going to change the heater soon (after 5 years), i shall do another test again.

BTW, I change instant water heater every 5 - 6 years. That another preventive maintenance I do.
weikee
post Sep 17 2013, 03:15 PM

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QUOTE(hackwire @ Sep 17 2013, 03:09 PM)
you only lived once.  wink.gif And since you have known of this danger, the ball is in your hand.
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Is not that bad. As long get proper brand, and good installer.

BTW another fault point many did not look at. The water pump also risk electric leakage. And that will cause electrocution too. So no water pump? Solar users also use pump.
weikee
post Sep 18 2013, 09:47 AM

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QUOTE(ozak @ Sep 18 2013, 12:23 AM)
Malaysian.

For running cost, gas is cheaper. But installation cost is higher. You need gas copper pipe, piping and backyard space for a heater. Than copper pipe for hot water to run up to the bathroom. And Wiring to the heater. All the house at here don't have such facility. That can cost thousand for the installation.

While all the house is come with the instant heater wiring and piping ready. It just take about 1hr to finish the installation. That is why it popular here.
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Gas heater is price in between storage and solar. Is more expensive than storage but cheaper than solar. All three still need copper piping.
weikee
post Sep 18 2013, 03:01 PM

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QUOTE(stevie8 @ Sep 18 2013, 10:53 AM)
Storage tank can explode!!!
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Storage tank got pressure valve.
weikee
post Sep 18 2013, 05:55 PM

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QUOTE(ozak @ Sep 18 2013, 05:00 PM)
I would not said it is not good to huh hah for a while. Or create some fear about this matter.

It at least raise the safety awareness and some understanding about protection and safety.
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We know speeding is dangerous people still drive like f1 driver. Everyone know tires need to change when reach certain level but some drive until tyres botak.

I read many people asking where can I buy cheapest instant heater, who can give cheapest installation price. You think they care about safety? The priority for them is saving money.

Any type of water heater be it solar, gas, insrant we install will sure have some sorts of danger. Get proper installer and don't skim on quality of work.
weikee
post Sep 19 2013, 10:09 AM

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QUOTE(stevie8 @ Sep 18 2013, 11:31 PM)
Still how it gets jammed?
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Just like car radiator cap, you don't read anywhere it jammed and cause hose burst. you read more of the cap leak
weikee
post Sep 19 2013, 12:03 PM

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Jammed can be few reason,
some use cheap valved made of cheap spring that rust, no proper protection making small object like insect go in, damaged by other object, like knocked by objects.
I do see some rubber-less valve that are very reliable and leak proof.

Like I mention in previous page, nothing is 100% safe, we can reduce the risk by doing proper things, and invest more in good product and installer. But difference people have difference preference in saving vs safety.

Do you want to pay RM 1,000 to get 85% safety, or pay RM 10,000 to get 90% safety, or pay RM 50,000 to get 95% safety?

QUOTE(weikee @ Sep 18 2013, 05:55 PM)
We know speeding is dangerous people still drive like f1 driver. Everyone know tires need to change when  reach certain level but some drive until tyres botak.

I read many people asking where can I buy cheapest instant heater, who can give cheapest installation price. You think they care about safety? The priority for them is saving money.

Any type of water heater be it solar, gas, insrant we install will sure have some sorts of danger. Get proper installer and don't skim on quality of work.
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This post has been edited by weikee: Sep 19 2013, 12:04 PM
weikee
post Sep 19 2013, 12:05 PM

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QUOTE(cherroy @ Sep 19 2013, 10:58 AM)
Hose do burst...  tongue.gif without need cap leak or cap jammed.  biggrin.gif

Joking only, I understand what try to say in the statement.  smile.gif
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Because the hose are due for replacement.
weikee
post Sep 19 2013, 03:39 PM

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QUOTE(stevie8 @ Sep 19 2013, 12:44 PM)
Radiator cap problem struck closed mainly due to the expanded rubber seal and get stuck on the radiator cap neck. This add to the extra pressure needed to push the spring up by xxx psi till your hose give way and burst. If you want to save money RM10 to RM25 for the cap you can trim the protruding rubber, it works.
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Radiator cap won't jammed. Unless is the cheapo cap the spring will rust and not made to spec. I drove car > 10 years all still with original cap. Usually it will leak can causes lower coolant boiling point

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