Quad 11L ebony looks gorgeous and stands out fine but I still prefer the classic Bird's Eye Maple look, class of its own. However, if you like the Quad 11L, pls also audition the 12L, many have touted these to be better in almost every sense eg soundstage, bass weight, imaging, depth, attack. The only thing is a few enthusiasts found the 11Ls a little more nimble in the mids due to the smaller mid-bass driver as cone excursion is dampened a bit quicker and falls back to its neutral position faster for being a smaller cone (this is logic but does not always hold true in real-life audition).

For the B&W, either get the 602 S3 or 601 S3. If your room meets the required size, get the 602 S3, they offer much more sound per ringgit.

Come to think of it, Monitor Audio RS1 is also very good and suitable for those looking for an exciting and lively listen. They even make boring jazz light up a little so as not to put you to sleep.

Cheers

You should be able to even get the 602S3 for a bit more than 2k, of course the 601 S3 can be had for <2k (depending on your bargaining skills).

Cheers

Don't forget to audition the Epos M5...multitalented transducer, looks very good and solid too, though I must say the Quads look more classy. Only the Paradigm S2 signature can top them in aesthetics.

This post has been edited by Omegaminx: May 26 2006, 10:09 PM

U mean ES14? That is quite a retro classic but for beginners, it's advisable to try some new speakers 1st before embarking on the used market (there's quite a lotta bargains to be had here once you know what kinda sound u like and have certain targets in mind, but bear in mind there exist also tonnes of crap load in this market which can be frustrating and confusing for starters).

I would suggest going with what u had in mind earlier & newer designs (no doubt speakers per se hasn't made much of a light-year leap in terms of technology from granny days till now but there has been some significant improvement & trickle-down technology so to say ..ie Thiel showcases all-new metal drivers in their new CS3.7 & metal sound planet diamond speakers etc... hehe)

BTW mystical, u sold the CA 640A V2 already? What didn't u like about them?

Cheers

I c, hope u aren't talking about Cyberjaya's Euphonic AMP-80 that debut in Star some time back...

I supposed u r talking about the the iAMP500 & the like, quite massive watts here, which one did u get? These look more suited for studio use

**So as not to hijack the thread, here's some audioreview goodies for Renovatio who started this thread:
http://www.audioreview.com/cat/speakers/bo...92_4290crx.aspx

No, not at all, after all Malaysia boleh!!

We 'should' whenever possible but Malaysian products to support our own economy, ....but where hifi is concerned.........no comment

Ode to Charlize is good, there are always exceptions (hehehe), but doesn't come with a case, gotta DIY yourself, and then again to be fair, the thing that makes Charlize special is the Tripath chip which is from Santa Clara (don't think this is in M'sia at the moment) but credit be due to Yeo for designing it......Malaysia boleh lo

mystical, what speakers do u have in mind to replace the Epos? Floorstanders?
Also, is your ES14 biwire or the older single wire version? Comes in black ash or walnut finish?

Renovatio, back to thread on B&W601 vs 602 S3, get the smaller one if u listen relatively near-field in a small room, otherwise the bigger brother moves more air. I somehow never favoured their Sorento(grey baffle) style. Much prefer the black baffle with cheery finish. Anyway, try the Rotel amps/CDP with B&W 600series, they seem to gel quite nicely and many reviewers pair them up for reviews.

Cheers

hehe

Actually nothing is ever run-in where Simon is concerned, probably a pair of speakers need 700 yrs to run in if u ask the guy(especially his Ls3/5a) LoL
Just kidding there, he seems to have a longer burn-in threshold than any average joe around this block of town
Not that it's not justified but it can be quite impractical as we all have other priorities in life also apart from running in audio gear(instead of enjoying them). Even manufacturers quote a modest running in period, some even say just a few days of regular playing will do the trick(the change after that is minimal at most). You must remember that manufacturers test their gear with minimal running-in(they don't have the time to spend months to run in before they can market a product) and the quality they claim to a product is usually based on initial testing impressions with minimal run-in only. So what u hear from a 5 yr run-in period of say a pair of speakers is not what they expect you to hear as they didn't spend so long to run them in before they had to market those speakers. In that 5 yr period, they probably could make a few more versions of the same product ie..601 S4, 602 S5. Even companies that make speaker drivers work similarly, they make a new driver and test them stat(immediately), and if the measured response (technically and by ear) is not what they want or like, they ditch the drivers stat and make new ones that match their requirement, I don't think they sit there & run the new drivers in for months and then only retest. These guys actually have no time to listen to how their new speaker drivers will sound 5 yrs down the line

I am quite a practical person, who also believes in running in audio gear (at a moderate level at most...weeks to a few months at most) but never fanatical about it. It's often very convenient (especially for dealers) to say something does not sound nice bcoz it's not well run-in, give it a couple more weeks..maybe months...years...decades (and b4 u know it, u are no longer into this hobby d)
Sometimes, I just can't stand dealers who over-emphasize on run-in(like yrs) before a product can sound its best. If that's the case, nobody ever needs to change any equipment, despite poorly matched to personal taste as running-in 'will' eventually solve all the problems and change the initial sound(more likely your ear has grown accustomed to the new sound character and reference as the psychoacoustic adaptation has kicked in).

Back to 601 S3 thread, so Reno, have u pulled the trigger yet? Keep us informed ya! U can try out Hiway Laser for these little buggers.

Cheers

This post has been edited by Omegaminx: Jun 1 2006, 01:29 AM

Reno: I think u can buy the 601 at the fair but auditioning is tough with all the noise & everyone looking at you leh, your attention will shift a bit.

Mystical: Since u a r using Epos ELS3, I believe one yr is more than enough lo fren, Epos themselves quote that even their ELS sub(using 10" driver) would loosen up mostly by a week(a few days actually on their website), thereafter even if u need any further fine tuning, it would only be a tiny bit. So since the sub is labelled that way, u can extrapolate that speakers definately don't need a year (unless u play them only once a year ). My M12.2 also run in quite nicely d after <6-8 weeks of regular (6 hrs average on most days)....been > 1 yr and still no change in sound that I could discern.
BTW, Octave is quite expensive, when it comes to tubes, I usually purchase online for new NOS tubes. Only certain models I get from them after factoring in shipping cost etc. Somehow, I didn't like their Ls35a demo with an exteriorized crossover on the floor, seems quite lifeless to me, too flat(I would probably throw eggs at the singer in real-life if she sings this way, get what I mean).

Davis: you gonna bring ppl to the perfect hifi booth for audition? Must be Sonus Faber and Melody SP3, no?

This post has been edited by Omegaminx: Jun 1 2006, 10:04 PM

Mystical buddy, just go on to Acoustic Arts in City Square and ask the boss there. Lawrence is quite kind to demo for you, also don't forget to try the M5, a very nice standmount with very similar performance as the 12.2 but better price. To be honest, sometimes, I wonder if I should've bought the smaller M5 but alas, 12.2 are simply very articulate and dimensional(nice soundstage). The best thing about Epos speakers is the minimalistic crossover (almost none)...this has its pros but also cons but Epos manage to achieve an exacting balance here. Howver, Epos might be releasing a new line soon, a higher end one, so hold your horses if u can wait a bit...but no harm auditioning mah
maybe during AV Fest, the new line may debut but then again, perhaps next year as no concrete updates so far from Luke(of Epos).
The Epos ES14 is a great one if it's fully functional, reason why my interest got piqued when I read that one was going for cheap (this is a different design by Marshall and not the current Creek team)
What standmount u have in mind now? Get the ProAc Studio 110, it's that good and quite a bargain for the RM6xxx spent (at least better value than the Tablette ref 8 sig mini mon IMO). AVI Neutron IV also very detailed but lack some lower registers. I am waiting to hear the new Monitor Audio GS-10-signature (might get this if the price is right but waiting for reviews from >2 hifi mags at least and personal audition later)

Simon is a nice chap, hardly ever pressing for sales, come to think of it, Grado SR80 and some hifi mags are the only audio gear I have bought from the guy so far but he does know quite lot about hifi to begin with. Apart from his obsession for burn-in, I suppose u can trust him on other advice.

Davis: whatcha waiting for, lets invite the new guy into the forum and start dancing and singing man
Maybe he has more audio gear to share with us.

This post has been edited by Omegaminx: Jun 2 2006, 06:57 PM

I am also using bullet plugs (Eichmann plugs actually, cost RM50 per plug, so 4 will be around ~RM200 not counting cables yet and workmanship unless DIY) for my interconnects' RCA head, but not silver cable as they would sound too bright for the Epos. Supra (tin coated) is better suited for those speakers with a tinge of prominence in the highs. I prefer silver coated cables for ATCs which are by nature a bit more neutral and some would even say dark (or warmer to convey an idea across but they aren't really...at least to me).

Davis u meant silver coated cables I hope, no? Or pure 99.999% silver throughout, which is bad news for a few reasons, ie. everything will start sounding fast and bright with a metallic sheen lingering on the sound/music with a thin bass note(sounds quite unnatural especially rock/metalica which is already quite bright for most recordings) & very expensive (might as well buy new speakers and frontend to get more sound difference) & too costly to produce in real life by manufacturers (most say pure silver but actually mean pure silver 'coating' only or maybe a few strands of pure silver amongst the crowd of copper) hehehe
The type of dielectric might make more difference in most cases.

Mystical: Monitor Audio is distributed in M'sia and Singapore by Ban Leong brothers but the price over here seems always higher than usual
Their office is in Kepong but you can audition their products at the dealers as they have no showroom
If possible, try not to audition at Rave (in City Square), the old man there is simply too proud of his products(Jadis, Wilson Benesch, dCS, MA, Ho's, Spark)...and gives you that look...if u r relatively young (with no pot belly, graying hair, Rolex watch and receding hairline to show your wealth). He also sells MA but I would rather pay a bit more and get it from other dealers anytime. Apparently he believes he is a super-audio guru who knows it all, and tries to impinge his opinions on you (you know the type if you disagree, u r in for a treat...hehe). This kind of dealer is the type whose knowledge is mainly from experience alone (streetwise and from years of selling) with no scientific backup(theory) as he has stopped reading audio articles for many years & don't know what's going on in the internet(bulk sales are crap and the wrong way to go according to him).....dangerous seller....and irritating too. Others are no problemo so far


Take care

I do agree about the extra bit of brightness that follows the detail of the 12.2. I also find it very airy. However, the ATCs (if driven properly) are more musical and neutral to my taste. There are always many who would prefer the hyper-detail and lively sound of the M12.2.

Similarly, Quad 12L is not so bright but musical & quite a 'leng lui'