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 Gold Investment Corner V7, all about gold

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SUSsylar111
post Sep 10 2013, 01:53 PM

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Just out of curiosity. How do you guys actually buy gold? Using CFD accounts or Bank certificates?
SUSsylar111
post Sep 10 2013, 05:38 PM

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QUOTE(davinz18 @ Sep 10 2013, 05:38 PM)
as I said before, always slow when reducing the price  doh.gif
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So you are buying from Maybank? If you sell back to them. how?

This post has been edited by sylar111: Sep 10 2013, 05:39 PM
SUSsylar111
post Sep 10 2013, 05:55 PM

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QUOTE(davinz18 @ Sep 10 2013, 05:47 PM)
I know. But do you find that it is worth it? I mean do you think there are other cheaper ways? Thanks for the info though. So you feel that Maybank is the best?

This post has been edited by sylar111: Sep 10 2013, 05:57 PM
SUSsylar111
post Sep 11 2013, 07:41 PM

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QUOTE(hey_there @ Sep 11 2013, 12:24 PM)
U'll risk the company go bust. Imagine if u have rm100k worth of paper gold with u and the next day u see, the company bankrupt. Ur rm100k is gone with the company. If u have the physical, u don't have to worry. Like u buy from poh kong and the next day poh kong bankrupt. U no need to worry coz u have ur gold with u.

Another reason ppl buy physical is to curb hyperinflation. Money is being print in every country and it cause inflation. Money might become just a piece of paper. By then, ppl will use gold/silver as money just like few hundred years ago. Google mike Maloney and see for urself.

I invested in GIA (paper gold) instead of a physical gold coz I can't afford the physical. And I'm not investing a lot of money in GIA. Plus, it's a bank... Chances of it going bust is slimmer. It depends on how u look at it.
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It would be impossible for people to use Gold as money. Gold is simply inefficient as a monetary tool. Paper money is still better but there has to be very strict process to ensure that people do not simply print. Think about this. If gold is being used, then gold mining countries will be very rich instantly which is pretty illogical.
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post Sep 11 2013, 07:43 PM

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QUOTE(cybermaster98 @ Sep 11 2013, 12:45 PM)
It would be wise to revisit the wisdom of Buffett and his thoughts on gold:

1. “Gold gets dug out of the ground in Africa, or someplace. Then we melt it down, dig another hole, bury it again and pay people to stand around guarding it. It has no utility. Anyone watching from Mars would be scratching their head.”

2. “The problem with commodities is that you are betting on what someone else would pay for them in six months. The commodity itself isn’t going to do anything for you….it is an entirely different game to buy a lump of something and hope that somebody else pays you more for that lump two years from now than it is to buy something that you expect to produce income for you over time.”

3. “Gold is a way of going long on fear, and it has been a pretty good way of going long on fear from time to time. But you really have to hope people become more afraid in a year or two years than they are now. And if they become more afraid you make money, if they become less afraid you lose money, but the gold itself doesn’t produce anything."

4. “I will say this about gold. If you took all the gold in the world, it would roughly make a cube 67 feet on a side…Now for that same cube of gold, it would be worth at today’s market prices about $7 trillion – that’s probably about a third of the value of all the stocks in the United States…For $7 trillion…you could have all the farmland in the United States, you could have about seven Exxon Mobils (XOM) and you could have a trillion dollars of walking-around money…And if you offered me the choice of looking at some 67 foot cube of gold and looking at it all day, and you know me touching it and fondling it occasionally…Call me crazy, but I’ll take the farmland and the Exxon Mobils.”

5. “The major asset in this category is gold, currently a huge favorite of investors who fear almost all other assets, especially paper money (of whose value, as noted, they are right to be fearful). Gold, however, has two significant shortcomings, being neither of much use nor procreative. True, gold has some industrial and decorative utility, but the demand for these purposes is both limited and incapable of soaking up new production. Meanwhile, if you own one ounce of gold for an eternity, you will still own one ounce at its end.”

6. “What motivates most gold purchasers is their belief that the ranks of the fearful will grow. During the past decade that belief has proved correct. Beyond that, the rising price has on its own generated additional buying enthusiasm, attracting purchasers who see the rise as validating an investment thesis. As 'bandwagon' investors join any party, they create their own truth — for a while."

7. “I have no views as to where it will be, but the one thing I can tell you is it won’t do anything between now and then except look at you. Whereas, you know, Coca-Cola (KO) will be making money, and I think Wells Fargo (WFC) will be making a lot of money and there will be a lot — and it’s a lot — it’s a lot better to have a goose that keeps laying eggs than a goose that just sits there and eats insurance and storage and a few things like that."
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He is right about the fear part and there is good reason to fear considering how money is being managed right now. That is the only reason why people are buying gold but it is a very, very valid reason.

This post has been edited by sylar111: Sep 11 2013, 07:43 PM
SUSsylar111
post Oct 8 2013, 02:05 PM

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What do you guys think about Gold ETF?
SUSsylar111
post Oct 8 2013, 03:08 PM

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QUOTE(kazama82 @ Oct 8 2013, 03:01 PM)
what about it?..
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Is it accurate and would it be a better investment?

SUSsylar111
post Oct 8 2013, 04:27 PM

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Another thing i find pretty weird. The spread of Gold in Malaysia seems to be much higher compared to Singapore.
SUSsylar111
post Oct 9 2013, 02:21 AM

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QUOTE(meistsh_musical @ Oct 8 2013, 06:15 PM)
You buy gold from them too?
SUSsylar111
post Jan 28 2014, 04:44 PM

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If I buy in Singapore where should I buy, Gold Silver Central, bullionstar, UOB, ????? The funny thing is UOB seems to be cheaper
SUSsylar111
post Feb 4 2014, 11:09 PM

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QUOTE(bfoot @ Jan 28 2014, 11:10 PM)
Not every "advises" you hear will meet your specific needs.  15-20% of my portfolio sitting in gold gaining nothing in between while the price continue sliding down ..... no thanks.  5% in gold or any other precious metal is the max I'm willing to go.  I don't have any precious metals in my portfolio. 

If I want insurance, I might as well stick the 15-20% of my cash under in a bank safety deposit.  That may be a better bet than venturing it in gold.  Having said that though, every one is different.
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Well, have you ever wondered why gold price is going down despite countries inflating their currencies every where. If you stick 15-20% of your cash under bank safety deposit, you still lose because of inflation.

Of course, if you expect Gold to generate income or dividends for you, then you are putting your money in the wrong place. Gold is not an income generating tool. It is a speculative tool based on macroeconomics or a hedge against inflation. You have to actually be prepared to pay money to keep your gold(invest in safe or pay a monthly fee for storage)

If the economy is good and we have responsible governments, no one would be buying gold right now. The reason why people are buying gold is because of irresponsible government, potential bad economy and the fact that gold price is relatively low right now.


SUSsylar111
post Feb 4 2014, 11:11 PM

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QUOTE(GoldChan @ Feb 4 2014, 05:21 PM)
well, for those who had invested just don;t over invest.
B4 the price hike in gold, they will take down something with them 1st.
maybe it's related to CHina. or interest rate or property bubble in asia etc. Thus cash may be the king during transition. Just gut feeling only.
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What do you mean by take down something? Actually, what you are saying is that if there is a crash, gold price may drop. I do not think so because the people who are vested in Gold by then would probably be prepared for the crash.

If you do not buy your gold or silver soon, maybe it will be difficult to obtain your metals in the future because I think purchasing rate right now is pretty high.

This post has been edited by sylar111: Feb 4 2014, 11:12 PM
SUSsylar111
post Feb 6 2014, 01:34 AM

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QUOTE(icemanfx @ Feb 5 2014, 09:57 AM)
How much is the current inflation rate? What is the expected inflation rate for next 2 to 3 years?
Gold and silver supply are running out? If purchasing rate right now is pretty high, why price is still lower than last year?
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Inflation Rate in America? Pretty high, if you ask the actual people living there.

Well, good question. Why is it that even though demand is high, gold prices is still going down. Very, very good question.

SUSsylar111
post Feb 6 2014, 04:23 PM

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QUOTE(GoldChan @ Feb 6 2014, 04:18 PM)
an experiment must be verifiable. Here are the task list
Task 1: Call UOB got stock or not. Got means = price too high or people are still doubting when to buy
Task 2: C goldsmith shop everybody queueing to buy? yes or not
task 3: call Maybank C got kijang emas or not.
Task 4: call Publicgold said U 1 immediate delivery pay cash.! got stock or not!
Task 5: select 3 main bullion dealer website :- see gold and silver price.! still available for sales???

If all YEs, then availability is not an issue now or maybe few months down the road, unless something big happen. E.g. Suddenly China revalue Yuan.

give it a try ok.

If that the case, then every week you just cost averaging buy a bit and a bit then U won;t susah hati buy too expensive.
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Well, of course there is gold available. Once gold starts 'not' to be available is really the time when the price starts to shoot up. Come on. Gold price is still arr pretty low and has not skyrocket it. Seriously. You have a blog on silver and yet you do not understand the fundamentals.
SUSsylar111
post Feb 6 2014, 04:42 PM

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QUOTE(GoldChan @ Feb 6 2014, 04:10 PM)
What I mean is those who already have a big saving in gold and silver? During the last gold bull ride, a lot of investor has over-geared and have more than 30 - 50% of their asset in PM. Some government staff even took personal loan to play PM, some saw people $making $$ and become a physical trader. Wow! too be a successful trader you must have big capital! where to get the capital? squeeze everywhere lah! Now price drop so much! what happen to these trader? If own $ oklah, if borrow money personal loan? every month makan roti.  rclxms.gif

Just my gut feeling only. I think over the next few months 6 month to 1 year, the interest rate will goes up. This may lead to liquidity crisis in banking system. They have try it b4 last year asking Uncle Ben to announce possible tapering , interest rate shot up. That was an experiment.

If interest rate goes up for few months, lot of derivatives , margin will die due to high interest.
liquidity crisis means most of the thing will drop. For PM maybe it maintains at current prices.

Once the liquidity crisis is over, probably people got $ but the gold price has gone up. That will be a more likely scenario. For now, keep some cash.
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This time around, I believe those who actually own gold are the ones who will be well prepared. So yes, maybe if crash comes, prices of gold will go down. But, people who are well prepared will buy on the drop so the drop will not be so significant this time around.

Secondly, maybe gold will start to go up to a certain level before the crash.

Well. There is a risk in everything. But what is important here is risk management. The thing is yes, there is a possibility that gold will go down. But by how much? Do you seriously think that it will go down less then 900 or 850 this time around?

You see friend. You need to see things from a longer term perspective. The drop in prices act to drive out people who are buying gold to make a quick profit. The people who buys into gold for long term investment are probably even prepared to pay Storage Cost for the next few years. On the other hand, short term thinkers are always thinking in the short term. The moment price drops, they become scared. And using loan to buy gold is not a good idea because gold is not something that can produce income. By borrowing, you are now incurring storage cost + interest. That is not good financial planning. A person who is good in financial planning has to always be prepared for interest rate hikes etc. You have to always be prepared for negative consequences.

Now that the price is lower then 2 years ago, you tell people not to buy. So if the price suddenly goes up. I am sure you will be asking people to buy. That is what I call "herd" mentality.
SUSsylar111
post Feb 6 2014, 05:22 PM

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QUOTE(spring onion @ Feb 6 2014, 04:58 PM)
increase of gold price = inflation rate + sentimental value

now the sentimental value is gone. time to buy buy buy

of cause 1250 level is not a good time to buy, if you scared that gold will crash below 1000, you can buy shares while playing with gold

if gold sits between 1100-1200, then i would advice to buy. but now is winter... let's see what happens when summer approaches
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Hahaha. suggesting people to buy shares at this time. Have you even observe the share market recently? It's not pretty.
SUSsylar111
post Feb 7 2014, 02:26 AM

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QUOTE(spring onion @ Feb 6 2014, 07:22 PM)
there is a saying. never put all your eggs in a basket. with fed tapering ahead, assuming it is successful, stocks will have bright future for at least 5-8 years. if not, share will be all time high and wait for crisis to happens again... then gold will really shine
last time USA-japan the only countries dominating the world market. everybody respect USD. now we have china, SEA, korea, india,... everything has changed. it will be a challenging time for gold  rclxms.gif
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Fed QE is exactly the reason why stocks market are so high and now you are saying that tapering will actually make the stock market go higher. Seriously, arrrr do you even know what you are talking about?

Now that USD is "less" respected, shouldn't gold move up against the USD.
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post Feb 7 2014, 03:49 PM

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QUOTE(felixwang @ Feb 7 2014, 11:02 AM)
FED is maintaining liquidity in the US market by introducing QE 1, 2 and 3 as to aid US economy after US sub-primed mortgage crisis in 2008. However, by pumping e-money into the market via bond purchasing over the years, has weaken the US dollar against foreign currency, thus causing US government to pay more to its foreign creditors in the long run, increasing the risk of defaulting, in return causing US Treasury bond to loose its AAA credit rating from Standard & Poor (S&P) in 2011.

With the weakening of US dollar against foreign currency, commodities that are traded world wide in USD also experiencing artificial increment in price and thus seeing gold price appreciated drastically after the introduction of QE in late 2008.

With the tapering of QE, the US dollar is anticipated to gain strength and majority institutional investors will take advantage of this moment to make good gain from currency exchange alone thus leaving the Asia equity market for now, returning to the US market.

In the long run, when the US economy is back on their feet, they will continue to be one of the world's largest consumers, continuing to import goods frm other parts of the world especially China, thus spurring global economy growth.
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First of all, there is no possibility that US can default on it's debt to it's foreign creditors. After all, the debt is in USD. All US needs to do is to print USD and return them to it's foreign creditors. And exchange rates do not affect the debts because the debt is in USD.

Secondly, the whole world is supporting the USD by also having their own kind of QE. China and Japan espacially.

Thirdly, you have wrongly used the word artificial. When you inflate your currency, naturally commodities should become more expensive. Secondly, the boom in the commodities sector is due to the fact that there is a great demand from China. The fall in commodities also coincide with the slow down in economy in China. You really shouldn't associate gold price with any other commodities. Gold is unique. It has very little industrial usage. The main reason why people buy gold is because of fear and also as a hedge against future inflation. Of course someone argued that gold is not actually a hedge against inflation but my argument against that is that gold has and will always be a very, very valued commodity. No matter what happens, gold will never lose it's perception as precious and costly. That by itself is already a hedge against inflation because people's perception will never change and perception is the actual factor that determines prices. After the correction of 2008, people became more fearful and thus they begin to buy gold to protect themselves. Thus driving the price up.

What happens with QE is that the companies and banks that benefitted from this QE put their money into emerging market. But with the tapering, they will not have so much money to pour into emerging market and thus they will slowly pull out their money from the emerging markets. Stock prices are driven up because of excess liquidity. So what happens when the liquidity decreases. I guess you know the answer. That is why people are so concern about QE tapering because QE tapering could lead to a rise in interest rates and that could potentially crash markets.

Countries all over are already starting to move away from the USD. There are credit swaps deal made all over the world and that means USD will eventually play less and less role towards the coming years. China has already starting to move from exporting their products to actually focusing on their actual internal economy.

Economies everywhere are in deep trouble. China is slowing down and also is having shadow banking. Japan abenomics. Europe unstable. US as well. They just release their Non Farm payroll. It is horrible.

You do not have a clue as to what you are talking about

Seriously, I wouldn't touch any unit trust products that you offer based on your "expertise"


SUSsylar111
post Feb 8 2014, 11:10 PM

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QUOTE(GoldChan @ Feb 8 2014, 10:27 PM)
got one friend he said he already brought 200K of gold back in 2011.
another 100K of silver i think.
so do U think he should buy somemore.
he oso have stock property etc. + loan.
for him if net worth around 1 million, i think it's enough already.

he already finished his bullet.. Just don;t underestimate the 2011 bull ride, lot of investors already lost their bullet.... some even future bullet. some susah2 hold until today, they have missed out on real estates, some stocks and numismatic. or some $cash for travelling. 2 years ago travel should be cheaper than now.

so, how to ask them to buy somemore.? their face oledi red black oledi.  vmad.gif
that why I said if U already reach your gold/silver target then keep some cash! that what I meant. hope I clarify everybody.
now, cash out on spare property then buy gold/silver may be a good strategy.
however i 'm not a real estate expert do your own due dilligent.
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If he bought 200k of gold in 2011, 100k of silver. I think he should buy more right now. You see, when he buy at those prices, 2 years ago, that means he believe that PMs are indeed worth those prices. He should in fact buy more now since the prices now is so much cheaper compared to 2 years ago.

But the thing is, he wouldn't buy right now because he is just buying to speculate. He does not understand what is the meaning of value investing. He probably keep on thinking that gold price will 100% go up and so put a lot of money into it. On the other hand, I could be wrong. Maybe he still believe that gold and silver will go up. I do hope he did not sell though. Because by selling, he is admitting that he is making a mistake.

I cannot force anyone to buy. They have their own investment strategy. The thing is, I just tell people that right now, buying gold and silver is a good opportunity. If you have cash, it is good to put your money inside right now.

For me, based on fundamentals and overall sentiments, gold and silver is a very good buy.

Of course, you should always prepare for the fact that gold and silver will go down.

Why keep cash? I think it is pathetic to ask someone to keep cash especially RM which is depreciating more and more. Of course you should keep cash for a rainy day but if you do not mind your networth decreasing as time goes by. Go ahead and keep your RM cash.

And by the way, improve your English. It really sux big time.

PS: I would not have bought gold or silver 2 years ago. Sorry, I do not speculate. I only buy on the lows. I do not buy anything that is already trending upwards for a long time. If you want to buy things that are already trending upwards and at historic high, then dun blame others if the price suddenly go down.

This post has been edited by sylar111: Feb 8 2014, 11:13 PM
SUSsylar111
post Feb 9 2014, 02:09 AM

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QUOTE(GoldChan @ Feb 8 2014, 10:15 PM)
well don;t get me wrong!
if you still low in gold and silver then buy now. but do cost averaging... maybe 1 oz per week etc..

If you already have achieve your gold oz and silver oz target then you may 1 2 hold as you never know how long the pricing like this going to last. At the mean time you may lose out on some other opportunities that come along.

E.g in mid 2011  should have sold all  PM for a piece of land or property. now price is land + property high, price of PM goes down.  cry.gif
or at least if I sold a bit portion of PM in exchange for some numis stuff I still win.... like coin card , any old bank notes etc..
the loan stuff is for investor turn trader.
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Why buy numis? If you buy numis, then you are speculating that your numis will go up in price due to historical value. Most of the time, numis has high premium and prices do not go up so much. Would people take your numis if say there is a crash tomorrow? When I buy gold and silver, it is because I believe that the spot price will go up. Why should I waste my money on numis?

Cost Averaging. What if I follow your advise, and gold price shoots up in the next 3 months. Are you gong to be responsible for this?

This post has been edited by sylar111: Feb 9 2014, 02:11 AM

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