i havent meet this case yet that i "cheated" by buyers...i make an assumption only...
just want to know whether the traders have the right to complain buyers which they are not serious on business...

because my bulk order not required to collect deposit before i collect stocks from office, not deposit will make the transaction easier... so worry that after i collected the goods but buyers didnt come to collect it and waisted my time to wait (if phone not reachable or absent without reasons) or i collected good but he never transfer the money (even not do any cancellation)...

so it is possible we have the right to "listed" them into black list?
at least other traders can try to avoid these buyers if possible...

This post has been edited by gkl83: May 17 2006, 11:09 AM

I personally think that you have the right to do so. I faced with problem many times also. Just open a thread and i will support you on this.

my idea is to setup a forfeit deposit system
a sum of money is paid up front prior to COD to ensure COD is success
if by any chance the buyer fails to turn up at the stipulated time + grace time, the deposit is forfeited no questions asked. this will bring down FFK cases but hopefully sellers would not take advantage of this and setup unrealistic times or places to meet up

yup, i only see complaining the traders only around here, not dare to complain buyer offcially... worry will boom by other ppls...

forfeit deposit system for LowYat Forum ?

it actually up to the seller to put the term..... n seller have respect the demand and mutual agrement wif the buyer.....

don need deposit system unless the goods it is an order from ur principal(supplier)

bro, i work in trading company. i know bussiness law.

but if you start doing like this, wouldn't there be even more con cases? People will start bulk taking orders and ask for deposit even for COD. Then the seller just run away. Nowadays, they even want to con RM10.

yup... have the business law...
but sometimes business law not working in LowYat forum, otherwise i think wont have so many buyers complaining certain traders... so tat means the traders can use the weakness of the laws to cheat ppl by using forum... but this will LowYat forum's reputation just only few bunchs of "Cheater" around forum, and effect other forumer's business because they dont 1 get cheat by traders, even we are the GOOD traders...

buyer get cheat RM10 is still ok, thought do the donate to the "disable" traders
but if trader not collect deposit and collected goods cost RM100++, and my office is not refundable if my goods cant sell, so the goods force to store for certain time by urself and sell to other ppl...

means like cant cash & carry with buyers immediately and tat things not usable for me... need time to store it properly and care well, and dont know when can sell tat things to other ppl...

This post has been edited by gkl83: May 17 2006, 11:00 AM

the blacklist here are usually sellers. and have committed an offence.

perhaps you could PM geminist if any potential buyer FFK and vanish in thin air.

ok... we wait the news which good for good traders...

i'm not expecting to create a official buyer's blacklist... just expect can share some of the infomation between traders and traders, we(traders) dun mind to do business with bad buyers that listed in blacklist (if created), but we will need the bad buyers to pay deposit 1st before we collect goods... so traders can avoid to get "con" by buyers also like kb2005 facing the problems before...

This post has been edited by gkl83: May 17 2006, 11:34 AM

There is the minor offender's list actually. It works both way for buyer and seller so if there is solid evidence that points to a person ffking your sales after a proven agreement, you can always file for a complain here.

However, the best outcome we hope for every sales is that, everyone keeps to their end of the bargain

satisfied with ur answer... i thought the "minor offender's list" is only for traders...
at least the childish buyers wont have much chances to playing fool with other traders as victims...

Expecting that LowYat Forum can be the safest online trading in the future

IMO if you don't want that to happen in the list, you might as well limit your list. There are perhaps those who should be put in the reserve list. Let say buyer around 20, perhaps another 5 in the reserve? If got more demand then can bulk it again. People like me who don't do bank in definitely won't buy unless cod. Just my RM0.02

for people that are under 18 and yet already do many trading, how you expect them to deposit, some people might consider the hassle, then they won't want to trade here, think of it this way, if you are a new to this forum, and you are required to deposit to some total stranger before COD, isn't it risky?

perhaps u both need some feedback from customer that dealed with certain bulk order...
like my bulk order's information listed very well, and got the feedback from customer who satisfied about transfering money thru online and received their stock within 1day

This post has been edited by gkl83: May 21 2006, 01:12 PM

i oso got problems with the sort of buyer that confirm the order and then cancelling it after the items arrive (as i dun wan to make hassle for deposit for something around RM100++)

the point is that once u've confirm buying the things in the 1st place, please commit the promise professionally...

i've encoutered plenty of these un-ethical buyers for the past 1 year...but lately 1 of these sort of buyers really 'pi$$' me off the way he deal and cancel his orders..

This post has been edited by moderno: May 22 2006, 02:50 AM

but at least he said SORRY this words and canceled the order before collect stock... not means to offend u lah... but they ways to communicate with ppl is terrible

but for me it is fine if they cancelled the order before i collect stock or COD... wont waist the money for unpotential customers and spend time to wait him and phone him...

This post has been edited by gkl83: May 21 2006, 11:59 PM

i know he meant sorry...but it's after i've colleced the stock and ready for COD tomorrow....hurm..

For me I won't confirm if I don't have the money. The worst kind of buyer are those who say want to buy, and on the cod itself they say on the way but they didn't come anyway. And they switch off their phone when tried to contact them



Well, tell you already some ppl just doesn't do bank-in, plus it's really troublesome for me to go to bank. Maybe you can say online bank-in, sorry I'm not so familiar with those stuff, maybe you can argue with all those stuff, but still I don't feel quite safe. Perhaps in future when I am more experience with all these. Even losing RM50 is still money. Can support you makan for 5 days






This post has been edited by naruto_kun: May 22 2006, 07:20 AM

The problems both you, gkl83 & moderno, face with FFKers is nothing unusual. It happens in all forms of trading, whether online or not, because most of the time, the seller is dependent on the buyers' support. If you make your terms and conditions too tough, you lose customers. If you are too easy, many ppl (does the term `window shopper' sound familiar?) will take advantage and pull out at the last minute. Not to mention all the conmen you will attract.

Running any business is an art where you have to learn to balance risks against profits. If you can't take the attitude of some ppl, then it is up to you to tighten your rules, not the Forum. But it may cost you more if you annoy the good customers instead. Remember the saying -`the CUSTOMER is ALWAYS Right!'

I think you will have to learn to take the good and the bad at the same time. Even Bill Gates has to deal with ppl who use his products without paying!

Personally, I have had issues with 2 sellers with `Safe Trader' status and no problems with sellers who later ended up blacklisted! It just goes to show you can't win them all.

u can request IC copy from the traders... i think not wont tat the traders "loot" tat RM50 and loss the whole business within forum, plus u can make report to police with tat IC copy...

i know it is nothing unusual, but perhaps the trader can try to FKK by some foolish buyers by setting some rules & regulation... jz worry tat the buyers will take opportunity to FKK with traders bcos dun have any term&conditions before purchase and we try make the buyers' life easier such as dun hv collect deposit at all... but if collect deposit 1st like a lot of procedures and make my life sucX also and perhaps loss a lot of customers... well, we as a trader and treated the buyers so well without any rules, sure trader hope tat the buyers wont "ka ka cau cau"...

*off topic.. want to ask.. what's the real term for the abbrev. FFK?? i know it's meaning is some sort like 'ordered but didn't pay nor showing up to claim item'.. just want to know the real term only..

Hehe, I first came across this term here in LY.net and I wonder if this is a true LY.Net original. I don't think I've ever seen it used in other Forums.

One explanation I got was FFK means Fong Fei Kei which is cantonese for `put on airplane' or `gone away on airplane'. It simply means one party failed to turn up at the appointment or honour an agreement and never provided a reason for the misdeed.

I hope this explanation is the correct one and I stand ready to be corrected.

correct...
actually i also knew tat FKK stand for "put aeroplane" since last week...

i see.. now i get it.. it must be true LYN.net original.. i tried to do a google search last time but no result.. Thanks for the answer..