Rumor Gov introduce new policy


（吉隆坡24日訊）當局可能在本週推出更多打房措施，尤其是箝制產業公司與銀行間聯合展開促銷活動，這包括發展商承擔利息計劃（DIBS），豐隆研究認為此舉可能高樓公寓發展商有不同程度的衝擊，維持產業領域“中和”評級。
該行說，政府當局推出的限制措施，可能包含5/95融資計劃和DIBS計劃；所謂的DIBS計劃，是發展商與多家銀行合作，豁免購買者在房屋承建期間的利息。
豐隆研究估計在其所評估的發展商中，大約有20至40%涉DIBS融資高樓公寓計劃，這些發展商也同時融資有地產業，因而即使實施此措施，還在他們的管理範圍內。

This post has been edited by Nikmon: Jun 24 2013, 09:33 PM

Dey,try to translate or summary pls...zzzzz

Kuala Lumpur, 24 hearing) this week, authorities may introduce more measures to fight housing, especially clamped between industrial companies and banks jointly launched promotional activities, which bear interest including developers plan (DIBS), Hong Leong studies suggest that this might rise Apartment developers have different degrees of impact, sustain industries "neutral" rating.
The bank said that the government authorities introduced restrictive measures may include 5/95 financing plan and DIBS plans; called DIBS scheme is developer with a number of banks to exempt purchasers interest during the construction of the house.
Hong Leong study estimated that in its assessment of the developers, about 20-40% rise apartment involving DIBS financing plan, these developers also have real estate financing, and thus even if the implementation of this measure, is still within the scope of their management .

authorities could potentially impose additional property curbs later this week which may include banning joint-promotion activities between developers and banks.

even i'm cainis,reading this long 繁体 is pain in the ass...pls summary in english,zzz

So we are looking at potentially no more DIBS? And this will cause the rise in prices of apartment?

No dibs? I foresee pick up in subsales

that only rumour that the govt will curb DIBS. It affect the property counter mainly.

High rise property price maybe will also be effected

More discount. BBB

May I know why?

Many good n value buy launches already no dibs.

I dun support dibs. Is gov can scrap it and force a 30% down on 2nd loan regardless of resi or commi, then subsales ll start to move and clear some stocks. It ll b gd in the near future.

if 5/95 extended to subsales, then sure the property market will boom boom boom

Yup yup agreed. Subsales need some push and balance the price for newly launch. Once stocks fr subsales r cleared, props ll boom again.

Actually wat is the possible outcome on property price if curb dibs?
- no dibs> less ppl can buy> price drop due to supply demand rule??
- no dibs> developer need stronger financial> ? Increase cost> price up??

no dibs = less flipper

Why sub sale slow, it is a lot cheaper now when compare with new launch with or without dibs.

But y it will move if abolish dibs

This post has been edited by Nikmon: Jun 24 2013, 10:41 PM

No DIBS will lower down pricing or increase in product quality... Either way..

No dibs = no fake demand .

So no dibs wil benefit real buyer rite? Then it's gd also..

No DIBS - more genuine buyers, less chance for speculators

No DIBS - developer reduce supply especially those soho/sovo, but releases limited good quality supply at targeted market

No DIBS - everyone pls welcome the entry of a new giant player... PR1MA... govt agency will be more attractive against private developers for entry-level new properties... (without DIBS pr1ma can have bigger market share)

This post has been edited by accetera: Jun 24 2013, 11:34 PM

I thought PRIMA is for low income buyer and one of the restriction requirement is the property bought could not be sold within 10 years

Dibs creating unhealthy trend where everybody kip buying new luanching properties, and developers kip pushing up prices with every new launch...many cheaper gems can be found in subsel, why buy a new RM500k, 600sf studio when u can get a slightly older but cheaper maybe Rm450k 1000sf condo? Wat about those Rm600-700k studio units barely 600++ sf soho vofo sovo toto, who can afford and want to buy when completed??

For middle income or normal income... from income of rm2,500 to rm7,000... lower income is ppr or spnb.

good to see no more dibs

+2

Actually of u try to look around, there are still many few year old condo with nice designs...for me, i would rather sleep well eveynight rather than working like a slave to pay an expensively bought condo that may cost nearly twice as much..dont forget the total interest paid, if u buy at Rm500k u end up paying double if inc the interest

Maaf, apa ialah ppr or spnb?

its getting more challenging every year..

DIBS for first time buyer
No DIBS for property owners from 2nd property onwards.

That would be most ideal.

This post has been edited by urb7: Jun 25 2013, 05:47 AM

Even w/o dibs for some new project, Dev has trick in huge discount. Which mean buyers get to enjoy lower d/p. in subsales, the valuers somehow failed in many cases to match the selling price. If gov force a 30% d/p with no dibs, if possible no discount, then buying new props ll b similar to buying subsales in the upfront payment. Anyway, it's my pov.

+100

I hope no DIBS, no free MOT, free loan legal fees, GRR as this will inflated the selling price and create bubble.

Should also avoid the rebates, discount and credit notes thingy, give a fair chance for subsales market at the same time government can collect fair RPGT.
For example now developer selling RM1000psf, give 20% rebate so actual selling price is RM800psf, when vp, flipper sell RM1000psf, on paper no capital gain so government collect zero RPGT, and at the same time flippers pocket in 20% profit with no tax.

Not all developers provide such flexibility.
And it is not applicable to subsales market

Ideal but difficult to implement.
It is not developer's responsibilities to check who is the 1st time buyer who is not, and how to prove u r a first time buyer?

DF is not mine.
A good project will still sells even without discount.

Developer has imputed DIBS cost into the price. So the current price is inflated.

If no DIBS, the developer has the option to reduce price. And my guess is new launches demand will be lesser without DIBS, so they have to price it lower

DDD camp, is this the start of the bubble burst ?

No dibs no rebates no free mot and all kinds of freebies are among the measures to reduce the artificial or the flippers demand and thus reduces the chances of bubble formation.
So this measurements will not cause the bubble to burst but the other way round.

tell that to the DDD camp and they will think otherwise

Is the rumour only on abolish DIBS, or abolish DIBS + 30% rebates + free mot + etc ? If only DIBS, many people still can afford the interest during construction period. Not much effect to flippers

But abolish 30% rebates + free MOT + etc will turn away the flippers, AND ALSO young first time buyers who still do not have enough savings for the 10% down payment. So it will not help the first home owner who really need a roof over their head

I think it will be better to reduce the 70% LTV to 50% on 3rd house to curb flippers. Then from 4th loan, 30% LTV, or 0% LTV

The posts seem to only emphasize on DIBS. Don't forget this alone is not adequate. The other parts are discount and rebates. But the question is whether can bank negara control discount and rebate? Maybe they just make sure loans are computed after discount or rebate. That will be the way to go about the problem.

If really no dibs ...legal fees...& other financial...

Developer will go around try others ways...

Maybe more none financial free ? Eg. cabinets...free...maintenance...free aircond...free

Boss beta to start ltv70 on 2nd prop. Ltv50 for 3rd n 4th. Then ltv0 on 5th or above. However, its on the loan and not on the number on props.

Nothing can do the gov right now to curb the price increasing...

Developer could give higher discount, 20%-30% upfront...

Now already has few developer giving 20% discount... Etc, UOA on southview residence @ Bangsar south...

That's why I say control DIBS alone is not enough.

They must got some ways to control the discount.

But discount cannot be controlled. As any business entities, they can give any amount of discount they so wishes.

But perhaps they can control the loan amount - make sure it is calculated after discounts/rebates.

This post has been edited by puchongite: Jun 25 2013, 09:23 AM

Just some concluding words on this.

If Bank Negara is just looking at DIBS to curb the growth, then I say it's just pura-pura only. The real intention to do something effective is not there.

Lips service.

Im sure government wil control it step by step. First LTV 70 then dibs then control the rebate amount n so on. But developer on the other hand sure hav other strategy as well

Singapore banned DIBS in 2009. I think it should have been dismissed in Malaysia earlier also. This is an unhealthy scheme that artificially inflates a property market and muddies the water unnecessarily. There is an oversupply of new units with no resolution of the units in the secondary market. First time buyers should be given subsidies and benefits in different ways. LTV should be adjusted towards a cumulative ratio over the individual's portfolio and not in terms of first, second and third.

Yes tis part is crucial and wise move. Some banks oledi practice tis. My recent loan application came in with few offers indicating tat they ll giv mof based on price after discount. So they ll liaise with dev rather than me for the confirmed purchase price. They afraid I ll lie to them.

Fast leg fast hand implement leh. I want to buy discount highrise for rental.

All the banks know how effective is this. And they currently pretend unaware of the discount/rebates given to the buyers. Pretend only.

And also Bank Negara has not demonstrated it's seriousness on this.

If Bank Negara wants to come down hard upon the banks, I am sure the banks cannot claim that they are unaware of the discounts given to the buyers. In this world, pretending unaware of the regulation or the laws does not give you a permit to do illegal things.

Like that will become sama sama like Singapore liao.

The rich will get richer, many here will be happy to be the landlord. Haha.

this will not curb the issue.

the buyers are just filthy rich. dont know where they get the monies from.

almost all ppties are sold out during launching.

Agreed. Good projects will definitely have their buyers. Genuine buyers

This post has been edited by RedDevils88: Jun 25 2013, 10:12 AM

We have to go down the fundamentals, what's the reason to curb property market growth ?

As far as the economy is concerned, if everyone is just so filthy rich, there is no reason to stop people from buying properties !!! If people are cash rich, we should ENCOURAGE them to buy.

Then from social welfare point of view, the government can implement other measures for the less rich people to own a place to stay.

it's fine for those buyers who can afford it. problem is when speculators flood the market with easy entry and unreasonable borrowings.

Developers could just re-phrase DIBS in the form of rebates. Hike up the price and offer higher rebates, i.e. >15% rebate is very attractive as it gives an impression that the first 10% downpayment is waived plus another 5% discount. Then, the developer could promote their "rebate period" meaning to say, faster buy buy during the sales preview period otherwise apa pun tak dapat.

This post has been edited by accetera: Jun 25 2013, 11:23 AM

same as singapore, property will continue to cheong even without DIBS.

Singapore has banned DIBS in 2009, has the bubble burst? nope. continue to cheong.

no rumor as it already in talk for some time. what hinder the move, I think is lack of nerve.

but it's too late.

curb speculation? here's best solution: abolish the minus BLR offer. Effective from the minutes it's ON.

The more curbs, the property cheong faster. until the additional stamp duty kicks in. cheong ah!!!

Then market will crash if + BLR.

In fact the young and fist home purchaser under PRIMA, they are entitle up to 100% loan. So whatever measure kick in this lucky group is still protected.

True. Many rich will continue to collect & play rental...

now more like quality buy la, where got hulu hulu place/ beside waste water/ dump site one also people go and cheong meh...
back to basic of property valuation la, location x 3 and finish quality.

now with the stamina of holding power will be in a stroll of good shopping, imagine 800k-1mil loan one with hike interest going to drain those
unsustainable fryer. Music stop who doesn't have the chair leh?

I think it will be a good move if it happens as it should deter short term players.

I really doubt the gomen will revise policies to help the real home buyers like LTV 70%/50%/30% and RPGT at least back to old days. Look at those big property developers in malaysia they are all own by who ? Gamuda, Sime, SP, IJM, etc etc. There will be a lot of resistance

PR1MA sounds jatuh standard for the young yuppies lah. They prefer properties by "branded" developer

good..limited supply...but end up boost the existing property price up..

http://www.starproperty.my/index.php/prope...bearing-scheme/

I agree

Sime Darby is very aggressively building PRIMA project. Launched project including Bukit Raja, next would be in Elmina.
Sime Darby not branded enough meh?

So, if the ban of DIBS is going to be officially effective by 1st Jul. Let say now you are being offered by developer with a DIBS scheme to buy a 1K square feet apartment with selling price of RM700K+, is it better to buy it now with DIBS or should wait after the removal of DIBS see whether there'll be any further discount/price slashing by developer?

I thought this is just a rumour at the mmt?
If they implement so fast a lot of developers gg to freak?!?

whatever, luckily i managed to get a house with dibs, free both legal fees,free mot last week....
thanks godssssssss

for me personally, i would prefer dibs as you don't have to pay anything during the construction period. You are not burden and you can have those money saved for the future. after 2 years, when the property price increase, you can just sell it to get your profit after deducted the rpgt, legal fee....
furthermore, there is no guarantee that developers will reduce the price if without dibs or free legal fees...

Base on the article from The Star, it seems like very soon it's going to be implemented (if the ban is firm by gov) :

http://www.starproperty.my/index.php/prope...bearing-scheme/

Anyhow, I don't think developer will pull out the DIBS scheme until the official ban announce since they sure want to do more sales until last minute of announcement rather than announce pull out now and let the sales drop immediately (assume DIBS will sure be pull out later). So, if really under this situation, should a buyer wait or should grab the last chance when DIBS still available? What will be the pros & cons?

if the offer wun wait n u need this kind of deal, go for it now.

if u feel it's marginal, no need to rush.

dibs++ is not free, all costed, good for cash flow but u pay for it in the end.


but like some mentioned, bolehgomen not ready to get real, can expect devs to keep beating it, drawing on easy credit ways, n balloon debt, unlike china now squeezing on credit.

Yup, I second that our government is always few pace slower to implement something really beneficial to the people

However, if let say it really implement soon, what most likely developer next action? Lower the price of current or next new launch? If yes, do you think buying an over inflated DIBS pricing property now will have risk of not able to sell it easy later?

project recently lauched by sime darby was not pr1ma. its just their own affordable housing initiative. this has been confirmed by pr1ma itself

bnm been studying forever, they know the risk, just that they must kowtow to politicians need to grow GDP, keep building la... remove constr, palm oil price crap, factories not making much, how not to raise civil wages bonus, br1m, wat u get? riots maybe.

developers r smarter than all, dun forget that.

if dibs ban, price will come down a bit to test, see how many still wanna play. if nobody play, they will b forced to lower prices or stop launching.

Without dibs and US cutting QE, China facing credit crunch, I think the potential upside is limited. Rather downside is more likely.

One cannot use Singapore government's dibs halt in 2009 as a scenario because at that time the US started printing money. So hot money was rushing in causing all markets be it property, equity and commodities to shoot. Now better err on side caution. Even in Singapore, property market has slowed down tremendously. I have investor friend owning S$50m property portfolio largely in commercial property. He has stopped buying since 3 months ago. Instead he is selling.

All have their opinion. No one can predict the future. Just don't over stretch oneself coz if downturn hit, don't be caught with your pants down.

This post has been edited by Mlchoo: Jun 25 2013, 06:42 PM

B4 the implementing of LTV 70% for 3rd mortgage loan. there were strong buying sentiment in the market.

With the 70% take place, ppl predict property market will be badly hit, but I would say this didn't stop investors to buy as ppl has started to accept 70% as a norm.

Another measurement effected last year end, increase of RPGT by 5% to 15%/10%, I didn't do much on cooling down the BBB

I would say if BNM remove DIBS, it wont make much different, except it may filter out those investors/flippers with tight cash flow.

i think it will make significant diff but in a good way.

the capable sturdy ones will continue to invest and keep the industry going while the boyos will wean and leave.

that is the correct way. this prop game can't be, shudn't be and musn't be for any tom d*** and azli to play and then annouce all over lyn how i got rich at 25.

It ll b a healthier way to push props up than using dibs or no down purchase, which is a bad practice.

Imho the faster the beta. Scrap the idea of ltv70 on 3rd loan and implement ltv 70 on 2nd loan. Tat sound beta. At the same time stop bridging loans to all dev who giv rebates in wateva form. V need healthy market.

sorry correction, what I mean is the impression on anything to do with 1Malaysia 1 this 1 that, it sounds like ah jib kor is helping the poor. So, if gf hear she is staying in 1Malaysia apartment in the future, she will feel jatuh standard. You know lah nowadays the girls

Not looking down on PR1MA projects, but I think given the choice, they would rather choose private projects

+1

this is the problem with the generation Y+Z nowadays, they keep on complaining house price too expensive, come cope with it. At the same time feel embarasing and "loose face" living in the PR1MA home.

U shd change your potential gf if she judge u based on where u live. Nowadays, newly married couple double incomes purchase the house together and support the mortgage loan together. If she look down on you, she look down on herself.

In Malaysia, we have good policy but we always have problems on the implementation.
The key issues is Ministry of Housing should control the DIBS thingy on the developers, as BNM can't regulate developers but only banks.

Agreed to what u have suggested. Besides recalling bridging loan, the government can recall and frozen the A&P permit, so that developer can't sell the property for a period of time, if not following the rules of the game.

Warning can be given to those developers whom try to give DIBS and challenge the MOH authority, MOH can blacklist developers' names and publish their names in the major medias, or hold the Board of directors responsible for this misconduct.

I do hope I have a gf at this stage of my life

Understood on tat. But the biggest concern now is the difficulty for 1st time buyers. So hav to solve 1 prob at a time. Hav to stop all flippers and allow genuine young buyers to get their house b4 loosen the regulation later. Maybe bnm can oso allow banks to giv 95% mof to 1st timers. Then it ll balance out the effect.

This post has been edited by ManutdGiggs: Jun 25 2013, 10:39 PM

No doubt DIBS is fuelling e unusual psf in Iskandar n creating a potential condo bubble. Good to stop DIBS before anyone gets hurt.

DIBS is the excuse for developer to up property price at 10-30%. U may check out new launches w/o DIBS selling at current market price where new launches wif DIBS all in future price.

You mean PetalZ?

Petalz not in my radar... if its more than 600 per sf then it's future price.