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 V10 - Property Prices (Up, Down or .....), and the debate goes on and on and on ...

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Halamdar
post Mar 26 2013, 07:55 PM

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QUOTE(tat3179 @ Mar 26 2013, 06:16 PM)
Everybody's in debtlah...whether you are in the the developing or in the developed.

Everyone's in debt in order to attain their wanted lifestyles...

The only country where the people has no debt worries is probably North Korea or some certain African countries.
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I dont have debts lah.....and I am close to the life style I want tongue.gif and I think there are lots of ppl like me.

Once my kids finish uni.. I should be finincially independent biggrin.gif

P/s: some ppl just dont like to use debt leverage.
Halamdar
post Mar 27 2013, 03:23 PM

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QUOTE(agentdiary @ Mar 27 2013, 02:48 PM)
Irony, as a responsible and mindful adult, we should have debts that we are capable. Without debts, your wealth will surely and definitely been 'transfer' out to those closer to the monetary expansion circle, both public and private.
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Let just say I beg to differ.

"as a responsible and mindful adult"

For me is make sure I have food on the table to feed my family and a roof over their head biggrin.gif


"Without debts, your wealth will surely and definitely been 'transfer' out to those closer to the monetary expansion circle, both public and private"

Dont have debts =/= dont invest.


Before you come screaming : O, u must be rich or from rich family ....... I come from the typical middle income group family. Just that I CHOOSE to Save and invest and NOT to Borrow to invest.

I have seen "millionaires" bankrupt during 1997 when interest rate shoot through the roof, hitting 20% or more. My question is how many could withstand the cash flow problem when interest rate go up another 1 to 2 percent for your loan ? rclxub.gif

As someone my senior used to tell me , over-leverage, you end up as a "slave" to the bank....

Just my 2 cp biggrin.gif
Halamdar
post Mar 27 2013, 04:35 PM

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QUOTE(agentdiary @ Mar 27 2013, 04:12 PM)
I am more bearish.

from what I know, the overly high debts has prone BNM to make speedy counter measures in order to pull back the number within the BASEL standard.

Current spike in foreigner owning local bonds is a double edge sword. Coupled with expected accelerate inflation, pressure to interests rate is clearly seen.

I think once this stagnant market go for another year (I don't know how long), the whole situation will start to go south. The newer and higher up (stratified property) the property, the greater the impact will be. If it ever happen, I don't think govt can do much about it like taking up problematic assets (aka TARP) or pushing down rate (aka Fed). It is beyond them. But if it really do so, well, then be very very very worry about our ringgit.

It will take some time before the market can recover.
   
To Halamdar: I owe you an explanation. The debts I mean, is fixed not free float one that tied with OPR or BLR. All my remaining mortgage loans already converted to fix because I bet on the inflation.
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Hehe, as I mentioned, EVEN with FIXED rate =/= fool proved.

What if I lost my job, can I still service the loan repayment....if so many property loan > I will die die die and fast fast too. ( BBB fast fast >>>> DDD fast fast)

Dont tell me O, my job is secured... only thing I will ask is are you 100 percent sure ? and how can u be 100 percent sure ?

During economy crises, No One will be spared. What will make a BIG difference > are you prepared for it ?

Just my 3 cp biggrin.gif


Halamdar
post Mar 27 2013, 05:03 PM

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QUOTE(agentdiary @ Mar 27 2013, 04:51 PM)
don't conclude so fast.

Open mind and just think about it:

Superman have 2 prop, one for own stay (RM650k) and one for rental (RM350k).

For own stay, he paid 2k installation and 1.5k respectively. But he receive 1.2k rental.

Thing is, Superman is very conservative and have 1 million in FD for rainy day despite continue saving 2k a month for rainy too.
He also got EPF, insurance and equity too. Bcoz he is so conservative, all derivatives instruments is out from his mind.

This leverage help him!

The problem nowadays is alot of people, most of them I think, leveraging like no tomorrow. Many are on the cliff.

Fire kills, doesn't mean we have to be so scare from using it for our benefits. That's why I am saying 'responsible and mindful adult"
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Very true biggrin.gif

As for myself, the house I am staying > fully paid up. No debt on the house.

400 K cash > my kids education fund ( IMO, MY best performing investment fund !)

Have some equities (divident play).

But as i said, depend on your risk appetite. And dont be envious of the ppl next to you " that make a few million on speculating property". If they make it, congratulated them.

For me, its most important that I can sleep well at night biggrin.gif

Just my 4 cp !
Halamdar
post Mar 27 2013, 05:40 PM

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QUOTE(Rooney1985 @ Mar 27 2013, 05:31 PM)
Wow... I hope you didn't up your 2 cents to 4 cents because I said the earlier two were very valuable... haha... kidding...

But again.. another valuable 4 cents...
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Inflation lah ... 2cp > 4 cp !!! due to latest CPI from the government !!!

Hahaha laugh.gif

Halamdar
post Mar 29 2013, 05:05 PM

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I am just curious, what is your opinion :

(1) How much net assets to be considered to be Rich, Middle class, or Poor ?

(2) How much income before tax to be considered to be High, Middle and Low income group ?

(3) From what I can see, it seems the ppl who have the holding power > 1 million USD net assets at least.

And usually I would assume these ppl predominately at 45 > 50 age group ?

Last question : what is the percentage of the ppl or NUMBER of ppl you think in Malaysia have these holding power ? Considering the amount of the properties that are on loan...

Thank you biggrin.gif

This post has been edited by Halamdar: Mar 29 2013, 05:06 PM
Halamdar
post Mar 29 2013, 07:00 PM

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QUOTE(AppreciativeMan @ Mar 29 2013, 05:57 PM)
Different ppl different definition... I see a gal as pretty doesn't mean u see the same....  tongue.gif
The basic definition in poor, middle, rich for me is:
Poor - struggle to earn a living for those most basic needs such as a shelter, food, clothing..... Need to calculate every single penny on expenses... Hardly hav any savings...... In short, survive day to day basis...
Middle - Range will be wider.... On a job (can be self employed, businessman, or professionals), earning enough, basic need is not their most worrying but their future income, and expenses.... In short having the ability to plan for tomorrow but not to the extend of no worries.
Rich - Basically no worries about money.... Future have been taken care of too already....
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Haha biggrin.gif

So from your definition, law of gravity still apply to the vast majority of ppl who has 3 + properties on loan, IF there is a 25 %+ market correction .

Just same random thought, could the properties go up and up and up , and ALL the ppl become overnight millionaires' due to properties appreciation tongue.gif ? I know, I know, that depends on the general household income growth to support the property price.

Thank you biggrin.gif
Halamdar
post Mar 29 2013, 10:39 PM

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QUOTE(EddyLB @ Mar 29 2013, 10:17 PM)
Holy sh*t ! Soon, UK will be bankrupt !
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UK IS bankrupt ! look at their tax system and VAT... rclxub.gif


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