Hi and salam to all,

Newbie here, from Ampang I've read some pages from the the beginning, some from the end of this thread discussion, really exciting read.. but am in a rush before I miss my Subuh prayer, so a couple of quick questions, if I may ask..

i. [Local] Female aircraft engineers... are there a lot these days? (I mean, did many survived the training years etc?)
ii. Age keeps being a subject, I have another one...how about those interested to apply TAME with MAS, but without any clue except how airplanes look like and are now in their very, very late 20s? Do you think there would be 'expiry date' on age for applicants?

Thanks in advance all, will be back for more!

Cheers



p/s: ok I hid the truth... I did have some engineering background, but that was like... 5 yrs ago... and I'm in totally extreme opposite end of this industry ever since.


pp/s: and reading thru the above post, now I sounded a wee bit like a dumb chick and clueless... (how airplanes look like?? Sheesh..). Anyway, forget about that image. This post came from someone truly awed everytime she's near any kinds of airports, gets weirdly delighted whenever she saw an airplane minutes before their landing or during their take-offs, not to mention how giddy she was inside those magnificent big birds, ever since she's young (and unreliably ignorant too, at the time, of the actual scene behind every single thing that moves there, just too preoccupied being wide-eyed with the awesome coolness all around). Just that she isn't familiar at all with the p.c. jargons and terms, and now in a serious career change / makeover thoughts. Lets just say I just discovered my passion, few years later than the general masses. So no matter how hard-hitting or disappointing or the no-nonsense your experienced shared views on these will be, I would really appreciate your honest feedbacks. Thanks all

This post has been edited by iirnii: Dec 13 2007, 07:49 AM

I hope I don't have to kick some aSSes, but then if that's required to get into this field then I'll just go get my boots now, eh?

Anyway, I really do have strong feelings for this. Reading thru all 40+ pages did huge favor to rattle one's nerves, I know I did.. I mean, I was shaken up a bit reading thru some reality bites here and there about this line of work. I think I know what you mean when you say a girl might not be suited for this job. But as I've said, I've got strong feelings for this, and if I want to make this work, then I'll have to make it works. Right?

Besides, I don't mind starting from scratch part. Even at the age 28. And with a growing liking to airframe studies. (Yes, I know its Mecha side). After reading this thread's discussions, I am more challenged (and determined) to try my luck. Although the thousands of doubts are still there to haunt me, I still want to try.

Thanks Kabadi for your feedback, really appreciates them!


Gosh... reading your many, many valuable comments in this thread, sir, makes me want to turn from TAME with MAS to TAME with AK. Especially when there's some great similarities of the company's visions with the one I am working for now - our CEOs kept saying that the best asset the company has is the people [staff], and they invest a lot in making us the best place to work (which is why the decision to leave is so much painful, its like leaving a family). So reading your quote above does made me happy, I'm really glad to find those who values this sentiment in the field which I feel strongly about being part of it.

Shaken, not stirred, from my original plan of applying. If my application is open and read, and considered, then alhamdulillah. If things didn't go well, then I might try some more. But I am sure to keep an eye on this thread.

Keep up the good work, guys. I'm sure in many years to come, when some successful LAEs emerge, they would say that this thread, and its many sage 'sifus' commenting in here, guided them to be where they are. Salam, and cheers for now.

This post has been edited by iirnii: Dec 16 2007, 09:25 AM

Thank you Kabadi, underzoom, sifu jazzy, and trent (yes, I'm a ms. ), for the go-for-it cheers. Reading this thread gave me loads of insights but I remembered one member (I think its bonzaimy) did gave an advise to those who's interested to venture into this field to do more research (i.e. surf other forums, discussions, etc) on this profession, so aside from my normal daily schedule, that was what I've been doing in my free time since my last post in this thread. I even bought an idiot's guide to flying and gliding book, and almost bought myself a glossy picture-info book on warfare aircrafts haha . But now, to tell you the truth, I am currently more worried about the level of knowledge and instinct I would have for this career I would present in my application rather than being gender- nor age-conscious!

Googling here and there, I have stumbled upon some aviation forums (mostly for aspiring pilots though) by our fellow Malaysians. There was a full transcript of a [cadet pilot] interview too, which was both entertaining and nerve-wrecking to read at the same time! (Nerve-wrecking because of how the interviewers bombarded questions to make one sweats!) And there are online journals from a couple of AK's engineer trainees who are kind enough to share their experiences before and after their succssful applications, which are really informative and very beneficial to those who are curious about life as an LAE trainee (like me ). And I have to say, although reading them really gave me such an eye-opener, I am both impressed and intimidated; the level of knowledge and passion these people have are more than what I was expecting one should have to become successful in their selections. Heck, I thought my passion was enough to barely scrape by the selection (yes... I am a hopeless dreamer, I was already thinking about my life as a would-be LAE, when in fact there is no guarantee that I am going to get pass the first level of qualification!) but one who depends on sponsored training needs to really go the distance to secure a place, be it with MAS Airlines or AirAsia. Gosh... I really need to dig out my engineering books and stuff to rev up my technical brain back from its many years of dormancy.

Also thank you to atrocitines for updating us on the possibility for the no intake on MAS TAME program this coming 2008. It did startled my focus a bit but at least I am now ready from accidentally slipping into a sorry state of dejection. I still want to send in my application to MAS, nevertheless...

From what I've understand, roughly around 4000+ sent in their applications to AK early this year, only hundreds get interviewed, and later on, only 30 were selected per batch (please pardon my stats if its wrong). That gives the success rate to roughly only 0.75% per application -- that's less than 1%!! (Before this I thought I've had around 20% chance, then later after reading this thread.... around 2% chance... and now.... "meep" )

Of course, it certainly does give me the butterflies to last me thru many months to come, but I guess this is how a first time parachuter would feel when getting ready to take their first leap off that airborne plane. The more chickened I feel about my prospect, the more excited I feel to barge in and be part of this trade. Hehe.. kicking and screaming included too.


So... another few queries here:

1. I am wondering if any of you would be kind enough to advise me of the mailing address for AirAsia Academy, where I can send my application in, and to whom should I put the FAO for. I have Googled it but it just gives me list of news articles et al. regarding AirAsia (and this Googling for the Academy's info was how I stumbled upon those online journals / blogs etc).
   
2. One mentioned that they were successful and was slotted for AK's February 2008 batch, but from what I've read they've already undergone some program modules. I'm curious (and my question here might be odd too...) why was the modules done earlier than the batch intake slot?
   
3. Does the general knowledge (i.e. the history of the company, how many aircrafts do they have, etc) questions really matters once it comes down to determine one successful candidate to another?
   
4. I've read quite a bit on commercial jetliner trade for an LAE, but due to my lack of research, nothing yet about any kind of internship or LAE training programme from Malaysian Royal Air Force (RMAF) or any other than our local commercial airlines. Is there any out there (aside from colleges, training centres, private licenses which one needs to pay from their pocket without sponsorship or job contract)? Well... just wondering, since there was news on the purchase of the VVIP aircraft last July, an RM200 million Airbus Corporate Jet (ACJ) 319, purchased by Penerbangan Malaysia Berhad, for use by our PM (and if I am not mistaken an engineer who used to work for AirAsia was one of the engineers surveying / overseeing the aircraft), maybe with other options I think I can broaden my possibilities from that 0.75% to more than 1% success rate, hehe. For someone who do not have "inside cables", yeah... I'm kind of desperate to up my game.

My post is way, waa-ay too long now so I should take my leave for the time being. I thank you in advance for any kinds of feedbacks!

It might be late but Selamat Hari Raya Aidil Adha to my fellow Muslims who read this, and Merry Christmas, Happy Boxing Day, Happy Hannukah and Kwanzaa too those who celebrate any of those days

And.. have a happy countdown to 2008!

Salam and cheers!

This post has been edited by iirnii: Dec 26 2007, 05:50 AM

1. Thank you sir! Very very much appreciated
   
   
2. I might have confused myself with this question too But you've cleared that up, because I was not aware that induction programmes for AirAsia's new staff might not start on the first day of employment (I'm used to new staff being inducted when they started their first day, so I apologize for my unclear question).
   
   
3. Yes, of course, now come to think about it.. the answer is just plain simple I think when I wrote that query I might be influenced with worries that I might not cut for it. Silly, I know... (and now I am embarrassed asking this in the first place..)
   
   
4. That's a relief to hear, because I don't have such so-called 'cables' anywhere in the industry (which was the initial reason why I feel desperate to find any more means to join this field). What I was wondering on this question was whether there is such training programme for would-be LAEs offered by non-commercial companies such as RMAF et al.

400++ only?? I could have sworn that I read someone's post about that 4k figure. Plus with all the news articles I've read recently about how our country is in need for more LAEs (one of it as quoted below), it gives me the impression that this profession is what everyone else is talking about these days.

p/s: Sorry if I seemed to misled this thread readers about my earlier post! I wanted to 'UP' my game, add more value to it. I didn't mean 'giving up' at all, honest! Sorry...


pp/s: As what vader83 has said in the above post.. here's one article for your reading pleasure... cheers!

The article below is from The Star Online.
URL: http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...5504&sec=nation

Friday November 30, 2007
MYT 11:59:19 AM

Shortage of aircraft maintenance engineers

By EE-LYN TAN

CYBERJAYA: There is a need to overcome the worldwide shortage of aircraft maintenance engineers (AME).

Department of Civil Aviation director-general Datuk Azharuddin Abdul Rahman said the number of aircrafts has quadrupled in the past 20 years.

"In order to maintain these modern aircrafts, there is a need for people with special skills and attributes," he said at the launch of Nilai International University College's (NUC) diploma in aircraft maintenance engineering yesterday.

Air Service Training (Engineering) chief executive Peter Farrow who flew in from Scotland on Tuesday said that there is currently a large gap between existing AMEs and the younger generation of AMEs.

"There is a genuine shortage because of several factors that affected the aviation industry such as changing economies, the Sept 11 tragedy and SARS that resulted in no training being carried out for several years," he said.

Farrow added that China alone needed 210,000 AMEs in the next five years.

NUC president Professor Emeritus Tengku Datuk Shamsul Bahrin said the aviation industry was rapidly expanding and as a result, the demand for AMEs will continue to grow.

"Poor maintenance is no longer an excuse for flight delays so we are assisting in the development of the industry to fulfil the needs and wants of the industry," said Shamsul.

He added that NUC was looking at the international market with the intention of attracting international students in line with making Malaysia an education hub.

Azharuddin, a former AME himself, said that AME was a very marketable profession as there was a worldwide demand for them.

"You will be working with very modern and sophisticated machinery while dealing with new problems and challenges everyday," he said.

The diploma will incorporate the European Aviation Safety Agency (EASA) Part 66 Category B1-1 syllabus, which will earn them an EASA Part 66 Category B1-1 aircraft maintenance licence that will allow graduates to seek immediate employment internationally.

This is the worldwide standard that is adopted by many countries around the world.

This post has been edited by iirnii: Dec 26 2007, 10:55 PM

It was yours?? Wow.. haha.. I should have known it must been one of the posters here

Ah, so that's how it was for you, hmm... no wonder I was a bit boggle-minded hehe..

I don't know whether to smile or feel darn stupid about my obviously wrong stats, haha.. that means I should have done more homework beforehand! I was seriously panicky (only of a bit) with the sheer number of applicants, but now it seems the sky is much more clearer for me, yay!

Gimmick or not, it still sheds a positive light, in a different view.. more marketing means more exposure to the public, reaching out to more potential and capable people who will be interested in this field. Growth is not so bad, be it with one competing college or another, so long as its for the better future of this industry, eh?

Ooo wow.. you're one of the top 1% selected!! Luck or not, that's pretty impressive in my book!

Currently I'm in the middle of applying, so not in any group / batch yet. I've emailed Mr Salleh Mohamed (AirAsia) to ask when there will be a next intake, and I hope there will be one soon. I'm also looking for options with MAS too, and I'm going to send applications to both. Wish me luck ya



Great news! ewin, do you happen to know when usually the intake period would be for METC? For AirAsia Academy it looks like Jan08 intake (Batch 5, which is full already), so I really would appreciate any info here.



Thanks for the confidence guys I sincerely hope I do get my chance soon.



ADP (American Degree Program) is recognized, eh? I did pre-Uni for engineering under ADP back then.. before zaman gawat in 1998 and our govt couldn't afford to send us to the States...

..anyways, all the best for you comes this Sept in Glamorgan!


Interesting to know... before this I didn't see Malaysia in terms of either a consumer or manufacturer in airlines industry. All I know is Malaysia's aviation industry is growing steadily since the first 'atap nipah' airport

France (Airbus) and the US of A (Boeing) should be where the aircraft designers would flock to, eh? Hmm... comes to think of it, I wonder about why the height requirement are the norm for pilots, was the reason for the height was so that their legs can reach the brakes and the rudder pedals? If that's so, then aircraft designers should at least consider designing longer pedals for vertically challenged pilots, right? Hehe... just my lame musings here.

I've attended a Six Sigma* Green Belt training last August, and early in beginning of the course the Master Black Belt [MBB] person who conducted the training told us that average "sigma" for most company in my current field of employment (definitely not aviation-lah) is 2 Sigma, which is below the classic / old view of quality of 3.8 Sigma (or in other words, 99% Good. Examples: 2 short or long landings at most major airports each day; or 20,000 lost articles of mail per hour; or no electricity for almost 7 hours each month). The Six Sigma, or 6 Sigma view of quality is 99.99966% Good (this time, the Examples compared: 1 short or long landing every FIVE years; or 7 articles lost per hour; or 1 hour without electricity every 34 years, etc... that's roughly one defect per million opportunities... that's the difference in sigma quality sample). So the higher the Sigma capability is, of course the better quality given, right? It is very hard for a company / process to obtain and maintain 3.8 Sigma, and getting 5 Sigma is considered a success for many.

Our MBB person then proceed in asking us if we know what is the Sigma capability for the Boeing Company. Of course-lah our first thought is 5 to 6 sigma. He just chuckled and told us that Boeing is actually a 12 Sigma, lemme state that again, 12 Sigma. That's like 1 defect per BILLLIon opportunities! So yeah... major new respect for those working for Boeing, designing or building those planes for the LAEs to maintain... (Okay, I've Googled the credibility of this fact but couldn't find much.. so I just take my MBB word for it.. he's really a sifu in this subject).

Anyway, sorry for my ramblings.. maybe will benefit for ccm123, Ady Yeo, or anyone who is more into the conceptual / designing / theory side of aircraft engineering. At least I did felt that way, my passion for aviation sure felt fired up whenever I came across the word Boeing after that (haha... no offense for the non-supporter of Boeing). Just that I am more passionate about getting my hands dirty, fixing aircrafts instead of manufacturing it.




*The term "Six Sigma" refers to the ability of highly capable processes to produce output within specification. In particular, processes that operate with six sigma quality produce at defect levels below 3.4 defects per (one) million opportunities (DPMO)[3]. Six Sigma's implicit goal is to improve all processes to that level of quality or better. (taken from Wikipedia)

This post has been edited by iirnii: Jan 2 2008, 07:52 AM

Heh.. quite frankly, now that you've mentioned it, and I've read it again, I'm totally lost when I read my comment too. Gah.. sorry for making you blanked out ccm123.

Anyway... I was in PPP-ITM in Shah Alam, under the ADP (American Degree Program), was then transferred to Uniten in Bangi just few months shy before I was scheduled to continue my studies in the States. I was under JPA study loan, so yeah... had to follow what the government arranged at the time for us.

At least my fate was a bit better than some of my ex- ADP seniors then... they were already at the airport just awaiting their tickets when the officers came and told them that the government couldn't afford to send them off to study.


The song "I Believe I Can Fly" by R Kelly was actually a bane to us stranded students back then, lol...




Hmm.. that means the advert is going to be expected around March '08. I think I can wait.. by the way... I wish all the best for En. Salleh and his fellow batch mates

This post has been edited by iirnii: Jan 6 2008, 04:42 AM

Salam

Maybe I've missed this or overlooked it before, so I want to apologize first if these queries have been discussed before in this thread.

To quote Lestat in his post #22 in this thread, if a candidate is fresh from SPM, or diploma, or degree in whichever courses other than aviation-specific courses, they are as good as zero. This has also been reiterated a few times by other members and experienced persons in this thread as well.

So, my query is, other that passion and dedication towards the job scopes, on what level of expectations does a prospective employer such as MAS or AirAsia have towards the prospective aircraft engineering trainee in this instance? For example, do they expect a candidate to have at least some marginal aptitude or knowledge in, lets say, fixing a car or a bike? Do the candidate needs to be familiar with types of aircrafts, for example, being able to differentiate between a B747 and B737, or be able to give general opinions on the pros and cons of maintaining a Boeing aircraft and an Airbus aircraft?

Or do they expect that at least a candidate is familiar with Flight Sim (although more in the line for pilots, but many aviation enthusiasts are into it)? Is Flight Simulator practise for engineers a good way to get valuable insights on the trick of this trade?

Great, thanks for clearing that up Kabadi