Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

Outline · [ Standard ] · Linear+

 Basic Intake and Exhaust Modification Guide, for normal aspirated cars v1.0

views
     
edison_84
post Sep 28 2011, 09:58 PM

Redefine The Limit!!!
*****
Senior Member
942 posts

Joined: Sep 2005
From: kuching, sarawak
QUOTE(upontheriversky @ Sep 27 2011, 09:48 PM)
yes indeed bro, diameter tuning unlocks probly 40% of ur exhaust potential, its the length of ur header and downpipe to first bullet that makes the big difference

try this, if u r on 4-2-1, assuming extractor length is 15" like mine, then use 37" downpipe length and put ur bullet there. if header length is different, just makes sure header+downpipe length = 52". +- 1 inch is ok.

use 1.6" piping for downpipe, this will flow good up to 4500rpm on myvi engine. with myvi exhaust open BBDC at 30 degree, 52" of header+downpipe would give u boost at myvi peak torque 3200 rpm. for max boost effect, ur bullet internal pipe volume has to be minimum 2X engine cc i.e. 2.6L of bullet volume

if 4-1 then 52" starting from extractor flange to end of downpipe then put bullet there.

i tested this theory on kelisa, 34" downpipe to boost at 3500rpm, i felt boost at 3400rpm which made me happy coz it was really close to my approximation.

try this first and let me know the result, then i can propose something more to lengthen the boost duration biggrin.gif

oh yeah, avoid openpodding ur intake, it does not do good for touge tuning, keep ur airbox, modify it to let airflow in easily up to ur rpm habit and call it a day. once air can flow easily thru ur airbox, there is no need for aftermarket drop in. use oem filter that was highly R&D-ed, designed and tested purposely for myvi biggrin.gif
*
Can I apply this method on blm??
edison_84
post Sep 30 2011, 12:21 AM

Redefine The Limit!!!
*****
Senior Member
942 posts

Joined: Sep 2005
From: kuching, sarawak
QUOTE(upontheriversky @ Sep 29 2011, 09:54 PM)
yes, this technique applies to all conventional 4 stroke engine, the difference is the length of ur exhaust pipe depends on ur engine camshaft profile particularly the exhaust valve open BBDC. refer to ur manual for this data and i can help u approximate urs biggrin.gif

it works even if u got engine with variable cam timing (vvti etc) coz i think only the intake cam is variable but exhaust cam has same profile across rpm
where to get the data? I mean which section..
edison_84
post Sep 30 2011, 08:02 PM

Redefine The Limit!!!
*****
Senior Member
942 posts

Joined: Sep 2005
From: kuching, sarawak
QUOTE(upontheriversky @ Sep 30 2011, 12:46 PM)
in ur manual at engine mechanical section. usually there is a table showing engine cc, bore stroke, compression etc, there u will find intake/exhaust timing
*
Engine model: S4PE-2-FDM
Total displacement (mm): 1332
Bore (mm): 76.0
Stroke (mm): 73.4
Compression ratio: 10.0
Firing order: 1-3-4-2
Max output (DIN) kw/rpm: 70/6000
Max torque (DIN) nm/rpm: 120/4000
edison_84
post Sep 30 2011, 11:27 PM

Redefine The Limit!!!
*****
Senior Member
942 posts

Joined: Sep 2005
From: kuching, sarawak
QUOTE(upontheriversky @ Sep 30 2011, 10:40 PM)
bro, i need the exhaust open valve degree at BBDC to estimate, and would be good to let me know:
what setup u have on ur car now?
ur driving habit as in the rpm u usually drive in?
what kind of power u would expect?
do u prefer more straight line acceleration or faster speed recovery (torque-y)?
*
sweat.gif sweat.gif not stated in the manual...

My exhaust current setup: 4-2-1 header - midbox - straight muffler. Engine still original, only change spark plug.
Shift gear between 3k-4k rpm
faster speed recovery
edison_84
post Oct 1 2011, 09:20 PM

Redefine The Limit!!!
*****
Senior Member
942 posts

Joined: Sep 2005
From: kuching, sarawak
QUOTE(upontheriversky @ Oct 1 2011, 09:00 PM)

oh how so?..every car manual usually states the cam timing degree, its ok, whats ur engine? i try look for the exhaust open BBDC for u. without it i cant do anything much really
*
engine model - S4PE
edison_84
post Oct 17 2011, 03:42 PM

Redefine The Limit!!!
*****
Senior Member
942 posts

Joined: Sep 2005
From: kuching, sarawak
Change my muffler 3 weeks ago. Compare to previous setup (mod+original muffler), car feel like power lose, what is the problem? But FC still maintain, RM50 300km.. rclxub.gif

My ride : BLM
Mod: header 4-2-1, midbox, air filter, and spark plug.
edison_84
post Oct 17 2011, 04:01 PM

Redefine The Limit!!!
*****
Senior Member
942 posts

Joined: Sep 2005
From: kuching, sarawak
QUOTE(luqmanz @ Oct 17 2011, 03:48 PM)
300km with 26.31 liter RON 95  ?  11.40 Km/L ... ... is this Auto car ?
*
Driving manual. Why?

This post has been edited by edison_84: Oct 17 2011, 04:08 PM
edison_84
post Oct 17 2011, 07:03 PM

Redefine The Limit!!!
*****
Senior Member
942 posts

Joined: Sep 2005
From: kuching, sarawak
QUOTE(upontheriversky @ Oct 17 2011, 06:48 PM)
u will be surprised with how different the car goes with 0.1" pipe change. increasing pressure in exhaust increases gas velocity in squares i.e. 2 pressure increase = 4 velocity increase, 3 pressure = 9 velocity. so u can imagine how 0.1" change can make lots of difference

if backpressure happens, the velocity will be reduced in same fashion too

i only know straight flow setup bro. have to ask others who have experience with sflow in their setup


Added on October 17, 2011, 6:54 pm

may i ask what is the muffler spec? and any mod on stock piping?
*
piping original. straight muffler.
edison_84
post Oct 17 2011, 11:03 PM

Redefine The Limit!!!
*****
Senior Member
942 posts

Joined: Sep 2005
From: kuching, sarawak
QUOTE(upontheriversky @ Oct 17 2011, 10:57 PM)

what is the diameter of that muffler?
*
piping diameter about 0.2mm bigger than original piping
edison_84
post Oct 17 2011, 11:22 PM

Redefine The Limit!!!
*****
Senior Member
942 posts

Joined: Sep 2005
From: kuching, sarawak
QUOTE(upontheriversky @ Oct 17 2011, 11:08 PM)
ok this is tough..mind sharing ur driving experience before and after u mod?
*
Before change muffler:
Can feel the boost when rpm almost reach 3,000rpm. Normally change gear at 3,000 rpm

After change muffler:
Have to rev higher, 3,000 rpm and above, 3,200 rpm can feel the boost, change gear around 3,200 - 3,500rpm, if below 3,000 rpm, have to press more gas to get the speed. Overall, car feel slow at day time, can feel the power at nite time.
edison_84
post Oct 18 2011, 05:23 PM

Redefine The Limit!!!
*****
Senior Member
942 posts

Joined: Sep 2005
From: kuching, sarawak
QUOTE(upontheriversky @ Oct 18 2011, 01:58 AM)
ok i can probably say that the muffler actually raised ur powerband from 2.8k to somewhere near 3.2k, reason can be the straight muffler opened up a bigger path so the gas velocity now takes higher rpm to match ur usual driving habit.

but just want to see other factors, what do u have in between the new muffler and the 4-2-1?

did u find more power at higher rpm than before?

apart from colder air at night giving more power, pressure wave tuning will change at night too because of exhaust wave speed is slower at lower temperature so meaning if during day boost is felt at 3500 rpm, at night time the boost might be felt at 3,000 rpm

in general, i believe an engine performs differently between day and night especially when we have 2 extremes of shiny hot days to breezing rainy night coz engine performance overall is largely affected by temperature..exhaust speed, intake air temperature, thermal efficiency etc...

who knows in rainy days where air is dense with moisture, we got free water injection upgrade for a while haha biggrin.gif
*
Change to aftermarket midbox between new muffler and 4-2-1, pipe diameter also around 0.2mm bigger than original exhaust pipe.
Yup, more power at higher rpm and easier to rev up to 5k-6k rpm.
Can I add bullet after midbox? My friend complain exhaust sound too loud, she don't like it.

edison_84
post Oct 19 2011, 12:15 AM

Redefine The Limit!!!
*****
Senior Member
942 posts

Joined: Sep 2005
From: kuching, sarawak
QUOTE(upontheriversky @ Oct 18 2011, 10:25 PM)
do u like the power u have now in higher rpm? or u like the setup but wish the starting boost stays about the same rpm as before? or anything else that u want to improve?
*
Compare to current setup (4-2-1 header, aftermarket midbox and new muffler), I prefer old setup (4-2-1 header, aftermarket midbox and default muffler), cause 90% i drive at city area. Seldom I rev 5k rpm and above

For bold part, how to do it?

This coming Thursday when go to exhaust shop, will ask them measure downpipe length and try this method
QUOTE
general rule for collector length:

18" - 24" for higher rev range (6k-7k peak), longer 30" - 40" for lower rev range (3k-4k peak) and if u wish to tune it further down slight higher than stock exhaust, use as long as 50"



QUOTE(upontheriversky @ Oct 18 2011, 10:25 PM)
u will feel higher boost with bigger pipe diameter midbox but since noise is an issue, if got space why not install another midbox right after the first one? the bigger the pipe diameter the better but if scared too noisy then keep to same diameter on what u have now but the potential would be limited. it muffles better than bullet and if the 2 midboxes are close enough to each other it would form a bigger termination box than what u have now and thats good for power overall, but some exhaust shop would refuse to do this, i think it would work.
*
2 midboxes setup, which one give better performance
4-2-1->defaut pipe->midbox->midbox->default pipe->muffler
or
4-2-1->defaut pipe->midbox->default pipe->midbox->default pipe->muffler
or
4-2-1->defaut pipe->midbox->bullet->default pipe->muffler
or
4-2-1->defaut pipe->midbox->default pipe->bullet->default pipe->muffler

Noob question, why exhaust shop refuse to do this?


 

Change to:
| Lo-Fi Version
0.0420sec    0.94    7 queries    GZIP Disabled
Time is now: 11th December 2025 - 08:05 PM