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 (True 4G) LTE 100-150Mbps 2013-2014 Malaysia V1, LTE is going to replace 3G in future

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Ahn3hn3h
post Jul 26 2012, 09:58 PM

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QUOTE(fat16 @ Jul 26 2012, 09:45 PM)
this one from india, LTE no better than 3G HSPA+
Airtel Rolls Out 4G In Bengaluru
Airtel’s 4G-LTE launch in Kolkata
When someone pointed out that the data caps would hamper content consumption and that watching a few high quality videos might gobble up tremendous amount of data, Kapoor came up with a rebuttal that world wide, wireless technologies are not used for heavy data consumption, and that if customers wanted to consume 100 GB of data, they should switch to fixed line.
- Airtel CEO, Sanjay Kapoor
*
As the CEO his perspective is leaned towards the corporate side which matters profits over anything else.

Technically speaking, when it comes to speed, we refer to data rate transfers and NOT data volume.

When you speak of water flow in a pipe do you refer to how broad the diameter of the pipe hose or how many clogged up untangled points the pipe has?

Imagine how can you blame the top 2% hogs most of the line when they themselves don't even have 2% of the total pipe capacity?
Meaning if the total gateway raw pipe is 1Tbps to USA, and this 2% have say have a 10gbps line at home downloading most of the time, you can say they hog up 2% of the whole overall capacity?

A 20-50mbps line hogging the line? Why don't he just admit he's not overselling his line enough to buy a new castle in England? laugh.gif
Ahn3hn3h
post Jul 26 2012, 10:08 PM

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Businessmen are actually over greedy.

Who doesn't know that with say a 100mbps LTE line, how can they still push silly out of date volume packages such as 1GB, 3GB or 5GB anymore?

It'll just burn out within hours or minutes.

Just like a Ferrari and you only give it a 1 litre gas tank?

Stupid greedy businessmen making themselves really look stupid.

If you speed up your service 10X then consider multiplying your old volume packages to 10 folds la.

Meaning 1GB = 10GB, 3GB = 30GB or 5GB becomes 50GB
Ahn3hn3h
post Jul 28 2012, 04:37 PM

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QUOTE(Skylinestar @ Jul 27 2012, 10:48 PM)
with malaysian trend...i guess this plan likely to be offered by our telco:
LTE speed with 1GB data...once cap, throttled to 64kbps.
*
If Malaysians are smart consumers don't buy them! It's very stupid of you to buy a 1GB plan for say RM50 only to be used up in less than 1 hour by a 50mbps LTE network.

Telcos will keep playing the dumb game until you put up your acts against them. If no one complains, they'll act as if people are fools to accept their sale of such ideas.

Start deleting/turning off your APNs and mobile data settings inside your phones. If possible avoid.

Start using WiFi Hotspots when possible or your own wireless access points you have at homes.
Ahn3hn3h
post Jul 28 2012, 06:29 PM

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QUOTE(kernel123 @ Jul 28 2012, 04:57 PM)
not malaysian telco only.worldwide telco also doing the same thing maa.

AT&T,one of US telco that recently launced their LTE network is offering 5GB data with price tag of rm150.what the hell is this ? really greedy company.same like maxis

doh.gif  doh.gif

http://www.att.com/shop/wireless/data-plan...bid=Qudm-6mGbo_
*
AT&T Wireless is one of the most unreliable cell in USA. Often limited coverage and highly priced. Verizon too but offers stronger coverage through CDMA 700MHz LTE.

Americans are switching to Wi-Fi networks for calls and unlimited internet.
Examples are like Republic Wireless
http://republicwireless.com/

$19 for unlimited domestic voice, data and text.
But you need to live with spotty coverage and urban areas where partner hotpsots are widely available.

In Malaysia you can keep your mobile phone only for calls and text. Want internet try to find public hotspots and wifi zones.

Turn off your mobile data or delete your settings inside your phone.

Ahn3hn3h
post Jul 28 2012, 07:30 PM

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QUOTE(digilife @ Jul 28 2012, 07:03 PM)
This is similar to the YES network call , ie YESLIFE........
*
If YES offers UNLIMITED local calls, texts and data with widely available public hotspots for RM50, I'll glad to subscribe it.
At home I can use my home wifi for calls too and texts.
Ahn3hn3h
post Jul 28 2012, 10:45 PM

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QUOTE(kentchow75 @ Jul 28 2012, 08:48 PM)
Now we concern about speed, but isn't that adequate already?

I need better signal and coverage over speed and data cap.
No point paying almost rm100 monthly subscription fees and unable to get online in needy situation due to low 3G data signal.
*
They will do it and eventually push the costs over to consumers. You want coverage and speed. Can. You willing to pay RM60 for only 1GB of data?

I rather settle for unlimited public wifi hotspots whenever I'm outside within urban setting and pay a flat monthly fee with unlimited access.

At home I'll opt for a high speed fixed line that provice me my own wifi access.
Ahn3hn3h
post Sep 2 2012, 12:11 AM

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Haha I went and subscribe Maxis 1 day pass for Wireless BB with 200mb.

Got HSPA+ signal but after watching 2 Youtube HD movies within 15mins quota finished.

What silly idea Malaysian telcos have.

100mbps LTE with ridiculous quota such as 3GB, 10GB, 20GB?
I think it wouldn't even last for 1 week of use.

With cloud services emerging and future online apps/games, this is a no brainer approach.

You know the Xbox720 and PS4 gaming consoles?
They say without a fast net connection your game console is just a dumb box sitting on top/beside of your TV. You can't play any games or proceed in your games because access and levels will be streamed with demand as you play.

How about movie rentals? OS and application updates?
Online storage and cloud disks?

10GB? laugh.gif
We're talking about games and apps that fit in DL-Blue Ray Discs and beyond.
Ahn3hn3h
post Oct 1 2012, 11:40 PM

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Softbank Japan To Launch Industry's Most Advanced MiFi Device

Softbank 102HW by Huawei

user posted image

Supports LTE 4G AXGP 110mbps
Fallback to 3G DC-HSPA+ at 42mbps

Japan is using AXGP ahead of the Advanced LTE standards.
Advanced XGP was co developed by both China and Japan based on the TD-LTE standard. Therefore both technology shares the similar standards and operatability.
Think of it as what FOMA2000 is to the ITU standardized WCDMA group.

So in future there'll be TD-LTE and FD-LTE. P1 Networks is pledging on TD-LTE while I'm not sure what Maxis and DiGi is going to use. Very high chances they'll follow the European counterparts of using FD-LTE instead.But the Advanced-LTE standard working group has came to a agreement that future devices will simultaneously support both technologies and they'll be interoperatable.
Ahn3hn3h
post Oct 3 2012, 10:20 PM

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QUOTE(coolstore @ Oct 2 2012, 09:13 PM)
can this relationship last seeing their current tension status and future prospect? will it end up japan itself only continue using/developing? Huawei/ZTE may pressured by cn gov not to supply any to japan in future.

modem which capable support both FD & TD-LTE start emerge already. but whatever latest product = rocket high price.
*
No it'll not. As you can see major Japanese telcos are now supplied by China sophisticated modern equipments that none of the European counterparts can supply and compete in terms of pricing. Patent ownership is also the strong point here. China and Japan co developed this technology to avoid paying the patent fee to European ITU. If they maintain control over their own home based patent, then people who wants to adopt their technology will have to pay them the licensing fees.

At this rate, TD-LTE (AXGP) is winning the Advance-LTE war. We have Japan as its first adopter with strong following by China, India, Thailand, Russia, Taiwan, Middle East.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_LTE_networks

In Malaysia, P1 Networks is leading the TD-LTE scene in their next 4G upgrade.With the gloomy economy European markets are experiencing, more of them are expected to buy Chinese equipment as well due to their fierce competitive pricing and improving quality.
Such enticing opportunity do you think the Chinese will ignore and let tensions get in the way?

The current tension in China is just politically incited and motivated. The violent protest I believe is being staged by the falling Communist Government and there have been cases where locals themselves have been beaten up until near death accused of siding the Japanese.
The normal Chinese citizen would not care about the islands because the oil rights has nothing to do with them.Same goes with the Japanese regular citizens.

Unless the oil resources is worth more than China's deeply invested telecoms market, my guess is that they'll brush the tensions aside when it comes to signing telecom equipment supplying contracts.

Ahn3hn3h
post Oct 5 2012, 10:37 PM

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QUOTE(coolstore @ Oct 4 2012, 12:52 PM)
the latest development is that China announced it may stop FTA talks with Japan. [FTA among China, Korea, Japan]. economic analyst commented it will affect supply chain throughout the east asia.

the general citizen is not protesting about oil or for economic reason, it is the historical matter between the two nations. sth far more important beyond money consideration.

huawei/zte wont' die if stop supplying equipment to japan, they already have strong global market. (huawei/zte always perceived having strong tide with cn gov). now is looking at how this incident be ending up, maybe will be alleviated after passing japan general election.
As we speak, my Mainland Chinese, Hong Kong, Taiwan and Chinese friends are still buying Toyotas and other Japanese brands and silently hiding their cars at home when going to work for those who live in China.

Historical matter over an island and 3 rocks? Obviously they're securing rights over the sea area for oil drilling. What else?

Japan is a very important member of the TD-LTE(AXGP) coalition. If they pull out, that's the end of Huawei/ZTE high end products market.
They are the ones who are willing to take the high risk buying their untested products with high value, less one customer China's push to maintain their AXGP patent will let FD-LTE eat into their marketshare.

Ahn3hn3h
post Oct 15 2012, 09:44 PM

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Japanese Mobile Operator Softbank Announces $20 Billion Deal To Acquire 70 Percent Of Sprint Nextel

TOKYO (AP) — Softbank Corp. has reached a deal to buy 70 percent of U.S. mobile carrier Sprint Nextel Corp. for $20.1 billion in the largest ever foreign acquisition by a Japanese company.

The agreement, announced Monday at a joint news conference in Tokyo by Softbank President Masayoshi Son and Sprint Chief Executive Dan Hesse, will bring together the third biggest mobile carriers of both Japan and the U.S., underlining the growth ambitions of Softbank, which has made a series of acquisitions over the last couple of decades.

It also shows how the strong yen, which is usually seen as a negative for export-reliant Japan Inc., has boosted the overseas purchasing power of Japanese corporations as a stagnant domestic market pushes them to look abroad for growth. The Sprint buy pushes Japan's overseas acquisitions so far this year, including debt of the acquired companies, to over $100 billion, nearly double the same period last year, according to deal tracking company Dealogic.

The deal was given a green light by the boards of both companies. It still needs approval from Sprint shareholders and U.S. regulators. Softbank said the transaction is expected to be completed by the middle of next year.

The combination of Softbank and Sprint will tie with AT&T for world's No. 3 mobile company by revenue after China Mobile and Verizon, according to Softbank.

Son said the investment made sense because the U.S. is the world's biggest market in smartphones, and it was still growing.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/10/15/s..._n_1966045.html

Softbank will very likely use TD-LTE for the US plans.
Ahn3hn3h
post Nov 3 2012, 05:21 PM

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QUOTE(blacktubi @ Oct 30 2012, 12:35 PM)
Looks like Celcom hate Penang so much that they include WM and don't want to include Penang

Or maybe no people using Celcom in Penang laugh.gif
*
Their decisions are more politically motivated than anything else. The consolation for Penang is it's still heavily wired with fibre so at least we have PenangFON upcoming open FTTH network to look forward to.

Look at this chart:

user posted image

http://myip.ms/browse/cities/1/countryID/MYS

Besides Klang Valley, JB is 2nd followed by Penang, Ipoh and Kuching in Top 10 list.




Ahn3hn3h
post Dec 23 2012, 04:03 PM

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QUOTE
You're saying that TDD LTE 1x20MHz is as good as FDD LTE 40MHz (2x20MHz)? Have you not come across the term 'spectral efficiency' or 'bits/Hz'? It's OK to express your bias view on TDD, but please don't give misleading technical facts.

Some info on worldwide LTE deployment and ecosystem as of 4th December 2012 (from GSAcom).

- 113 commercial LTE networks: 102 are FDD LTE, 11 TD-LTE
- 1120 LTE devices: 930 are FDD LTE, 190 TD-LTE
FDD-LTE networks have an earlier headstart compared to TD-LTE. It's wider acceptance is due to more political, gifts/bribe showering and interests than technical advantages. The success of a technology or product not only depends on its design advantage but also its promotion for wide spread adoption as well as political red tapes.

Due to the earlier launch of FDD-LTE networks in US and Japan, it's expected that there'll be more devices for it at present. However TD-LTE will see its true advantage when some of the worlds largest telecom companies turn on their networks: China Mobile(having the worlds largest mobile subscribers), Softbank Japan, Bharti Airtel, Clearwire, WIND Italy and Australia's NBN.

Speaking of "spectrum efficiency", TD-LTE can accomplish the same with FDD-LTE in real world commercial conditions with just 1/2 of the spectrum block. The efficiency advantage behind TD-LTE is that it allows time slots to be dynamically adjusted according to download/upload traffic whereas FDD-LTE separate fixed channels for both ways. FDD-LTE results is only proven to be at advantage in restricted lab conditions where you have a fixed small amount of terminals downloading/uploading continuously without contention.

In the case of MCMC spectrum award, the FDD-LTE operators were favourably awarded 2X the amount of spectrum blocks compared to TD-LTE operators.That alone already gave the FDD operators level themselves along the TD operators discounting out their weaknesses. To put it fair, if both parties (FDD-LTE and TD-LTE) operators were given equal share, TD-LTE would have been the winner if your argued about spectrum efficiency.

user posted image

You might want to know what is the primary benefit if an operator gets to make use of twice the efficiency of spectrum blocks as demonstrated by TD-LTE. I have provided a chart just to explain things more clearly. Having to use the whole spectrum and dynamically assign time slots allows for:

1) Higher subscriber capacity
2) Allowing more spectrum to be assigned for more base stations
3) Higher revenues and profits
4) Cheaper services
5) More efficient use of spectrum resources.

(*Note the 5MHz spectrum divided into 6 lanes? It represents 6 simultaneous users on a connection/call.)

FDD-LTE has fixed timing for its time slots, so unused idle portions of the transmission is wasted.
Think of the idea as call second blocks when making a call, the longer the duration the more waste you're going to make if you have the tendency to make short conversations.

This post has been edited by Ahn3hn3h: Dec 23 2012, 04:06 PM
Ahn3hn3h
post Dec 23 2012, 04:17 PM

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QUOTE(shincy @ Dec 17 2012, 09:40 AM)
Noted that 1800Mhz only available to M and C
*
If telcos in Malaysia can utilize the 850MHz/700MHz bands with TD-LTE, it'll become undisputed win-win strategy for consumers both in coverage and efficiency.

Australia's NBN is using 700MHz to deliver 100mbps lines to rural homes in small towns where fibre cannot reach them. Only those in the middle of the desert will use satellite.

MCMC however always make weird decisions, they decided to use the spectrums for digital TV instead and many predicted it'll cause disruptions to other neighbouring country telecom services.

They should have kept the 100-200 MHz band for digital terrestrial TV like Japan did instead.

450MHz and 700MHz was always meant for fixed wireless broadband services.
Ahn3hn3h
post Dec 28 2012, 11:29 PM

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QUOTE(alf233 @ Dec 24 2012, 09:38 PM)
How do you know there were bribes & political reasons. Dont tell me you used you work with FBI.

At the end of the day, users wont care if its TD-LTE or FDD-LTE. As long as we can user the phone that we want. And i bet most LTE phones will be FDD.

You better read back the SKMM news.. All operators, except Puncak Semangat are allocated same amount of spectrum. The TDD get 1x20MHz and FDD get 2x10MHz. How is that FDD operators get 2x amount of spectrum like you said. Isnt maths is a prerequisite subject to become an engineer?

Looking at the diagram that you showed, even the diagram clearly shows that FDD and TD have same spectral efficiency. Yet you're saying TDD has more spectral efficiency.

Looks like you forgot that in LTE, OFDM is used. So resources are based on time and frequency.. Not just frequency. You are right TDD requires half of spectrum than FDD. But FDD only requires half of the time. So at the end the spectral efficiency is the same.. Why is it so difficult for you to understand this and keep giving wrong technical info to the public..

I'm not a fan of FDD and never hate TD, its just that they have THE SAME SPECTRAL EFFICIENCY OR BITS PER HERTZ
You did not read the latest Wall Street Journal on applying tenders in Malaysia and how many felt that without bribes, they could never secure contracts? Never heard fo the Alcatel-Lucent case with TM before? How many are confident enough of securing tenders in Malaysia fairly without going undertable?

That diagram shows that with FDD-LTE using duplex channelling for separate channels on dn/ul, there can only be 6 simultaneous users, while TD-LTE can handle 12 users which is twice the amount of users effectively with the same frequency block width.

Now do you understand clearly what spectrum efficiency is all about?

I haven't come close to explaining the more advanced promising features of TD-LTE that FD-LTE can do.
TD-LTE can do MIMO Beamforming with channel reciprocity(single channel for both traffics) which FDD-LTE is still years behind in research due to its complexity of duplex channels.MIMO beamforming can easily give operators a boost in speed with TD-LTE in the near future that FDD-LTE will see trouble getting into.

and NO.They DO NOT have the same spectral effiency if competed against each other on the same spectrum blocks of equal width.
One gets to use the whole road for itself for both traffics of different direction while the other has to split it into 1/2 for different traffics.
Ahn3hn3h
post Dec 30 2012, 09:27 PM

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QUOTE(alf233 @ Dec 29 2012, 10:01 PM)
This is by far the stupidest statement I ever read/heard from a person who claimed to be an RF engineer... Are you sure you're an RF engineer?

Like I said before, yes you are correct saying that TD can dedicate the whole spectrum for either download or upload.. But they will need to divide the time, e.g. Half of the time is allocated for DL and another half for UL.. (this is just an example, if course there are many TDD modes which provide different DL-UL ratios in a time interval.

Whereas in FDD.. Only half spectrum is used for DL and the other half for UL.. But they are dedicated 100% of the time..

Since i now doubt that you're an RF engineer.. I will explain in easier-to-understand form.. Imagine you have a 2-lanes highway in both direction, say Melaka to Johor PLUS highway.. So in total you have 4 lanes, which 2 going south and 2 going north..

1. If you divide the traffic by time, all 4 lanes are going south in 1 hour and the you change the direction all traffics are going north in the next 1 hour... This is how TDD works.

2. On the other hand, FDD is just like the normal traffic where 2 lanes always going north and 2 lanes always going south all the time..

So assuming the traffic is constant for the 2 hours... And if you do the basic maths, you will get the same number of cars reaching south and north for both scenarios.. And this is similar like spectral efficiency...
You are still not getting the point there.

If a spectrum block width is to be imagined as that of a highway with 4 lanes wide, then time will be the determinant of its efficiency for its usage.
Traffic was never meant to be symmetrical in both directions where in real world usage, people do downloading more than uploading most of the time.

Take for instance you have a PLUS Highway with one going southbound and the other northbound,

In the case of FDD-LTE, the since the establishment of 2 lanes each way, the north bound traffic may be idle at times but the southbound traffic might get congested during certain hours. Don't you think it's a waste of resources when the northbound lanes are empty at most times of the day while nothing can be done about it?

As for TD-LTE, where each direction is allowed each time, all 4 lanes can be used either way and if northbound traffic is low, longer time slots can be dynamically be granted for southbound traffic to ease the congestion. Most importantly, the main argument POINT here is that the "lanes(spectrum use)" are not put to waste during in idle/low traffic utilization.Thus, spectrum efficiency is brought up.

QUOTE(alf233 @ Dec 29 2012, 10:01 PM)
Can u understand now why I'm saying in term of resources, FDD and TD are very similar..

I agree with you there maybe bribes in our telco.. But you were saying in your previous posts that there were bribes on why FDD is more commonly adopted than TD worldwide... And this of course has something to do with ITU at international level, thats why I thought you worked with FBI
Technology superiority was never an issue in the silent trade war among nations even during the 2G Cellular war when GSM and CDMA competed years back. The CDMA technology was more efficient compared to GSM yet the latter prevailed because of the higher adoption rates and eventually used in most parts of the world. How good the technology itself is not enough to determine the success of a particular product.

Today, the FDD-LTE and TD-LTE war is also a result behind the clash of the East and the West. One will not try to support the other because of the patent royalties incurred and trade inbalances as a resultant. The Europeans do not want to buy the TD-LTE products because they fear ending up to pay the Asian while the Asians do not want to give the same royalty fees to the Europeans which inturn affect their telecom equipment sales revenues.


Added on December 30, 2012, 9:42 pm
QUOTE(ErgoProxi @ Dec 26 2012, 04:40 PM)
When ? 2020?
Which ISP got the Balls?
*
Actually if TD-LTE and lower frequencies were adopted, the chances of ISPs offering flat rate unlimited quotas would have been higher due to much lower initial costs for investments.

TM and Jaring managed to do it last time with their Wireless Streamyx and Jaring Wireless last time with 450MHz proprietary CDMA tech from SOMA Networks. Very good coverage too with fewer base stations needed.

Australia NBN(on 700MHz) is using this strategy as well as Sweden by Net1 using CDMA EV-DO RevB on 450MHz to serve subscribers in the jungle/rural markets. Those areas will never be served with fibre since they are too remote for implementations.
Their governments felt that even rural fols should not be deprived of high speed internet even if they'll never be served by fibre so they plan to use LTE 700MHz to give them 100mbps internet.

This post has been edited by Ahn3hn3h: Dec 30 2012, 09:43 PM
Ahn3hn3h
post Jan 3 2013, 10:50 PM

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QUOTE(alf233 @ Dec 31 2012, 05:57 PM)

2 things you forgot (or probably you dont know):

1. DL & UL have different spectral efficiency.. DL can do MIMO spatial multiplexing and 64QAM, whereas UL can only do 1 stream and 16QAM. And because of this difference, the capacity of DL & UL in FDD will never be symmetrical (as what you claim). What I meant by spectral efficiency is "DL Spectral efficiency in LTE" and "UL Spectral efficiency in LTE". So if you compare DL spectral efficiency of TD-LTE & FDD, they are of course the same. Try answer this (any Telco RF engineer can sure work this out very easily): How many bits can be transmitted in a subcarrier in (i) TD-LTE (ii) FDD LTE for DL? The answer is the same for both. And same goes for the UL. Do you understand what is spectral efficiency now? Number of bits per Hertz. I guess you get confused with spectral efficiency and capacity.
Answer:
Did you intentionally left out the total number of subcarriers in regards of spectrum width, mind you without that you can't calculate the maximum throughput? You forgot the fact that the total number of subcarriers are different in 2X10MHz versus 1X20MHz setups? When you do the calculation of radio resources to bits conversion, of course they are similar but it has of no interests to network operators. The spectral efficiency which you argued on has nothing more than the technical meaning of bits conversion related to RF than efficient use spectrum for service deployments.

The spectrum argument has been dead since voice became purely packet switched. Pure data players such as YES, P1, Clearwire, Vivid Wireless and others who provide mobile broadband players hardly see any advantages from using FDD.It is also natural for WIMAx operators to take this route for their next upgrade since WIMAx is also based on TDD. There is no urgent need for them prioritized QoS for voice services. HD Voice is packet based which can be handled with upper layers. If they need, there is the 3G networks to fall back on for pay per minute calls.

QUOTE(alf233 @ Dec 31 2012, 05:57 PM)
2. True that TD is flexible, but you can't really have a different TD configuration (ratio) in an area, that will cause massive interference. So you'll have to stick to only 1 configuration, and if you want to change it, you will need to change in the whole network. You can have different TD configurations but you will need border in between the network area, e.g. TDD mode 1 in west Malaysia and TDD mode 2 in east Malaysia. You probably haven't come across this?
Of course you can't use the same strategy as FDD with TDD. But I see you lack the experience and knowledge in deploying your products in real commercial situations. TDD excels in urbanized setups and indoor coverages where you have isolated hotspots that hardly overlaps with other microcells footprints.Take Softbank's Wireless City Planning Project for Metropolitan Tokyo. The number of microcells they'll deploy is about 150 units per sq km all of them with just about the size of a shoebox.Dark fibre is plentiful in metropolitan Tokyo for backhaul. Each "shoebox" will be pumped with 10GE access to a centralised local exchange office which synchronizes time for all of them.So what's your problem with inteferences? Moreover (if you don't know) the sales of LTE microcells is expected to dominate and surpass macro base stations by 2014. It'll expect to make up 90% of all base stations by 2016. DC-HSPA+ will continue to serve greater areas outside the cities, while wifi hotspots will offload data in public areas.

QUOTE(alf233 @ Dec 31 2012, 05:57 PM)
Let me guess, your resource and reference on LTE is only google, thats why your knowledge is so limited? I'm sharing with you what I've compiled from 3GPP specs the peak speed (MAC layer) of FDD and all configurations of TDD below. All are using total of 20MHz. Hope this is enough to open your mind a bit. I can also tell you which TDD mode is widely used, what makes their peak speed difference if you are interested to know. I can even share with you how to find 3GPP specs, if you dont know how to find them.
I've not told you this until now but FYI, I've been a registered member with ETSI since the REL99 days, company forced me to do it upon joining. I'll wouldn't suggest engineers to concentrate reading up those specs without proper exposure and touching knowledge materials supplied by their companies research depts. Without proper guidance and hands-on from seniors or trainers, the contents are gibberish even to most engineers out there. They make good references for facts finding but not cookbooks.

QUOTE(alf233 @ Dec 31 2012, 05:57 PM)
If you compare FDD 2x10MHz with TDD 1x20MHz Mode 1 (which divides the resource equally for DL & UL just like FDD), can you see that FDD gives more capacity? Do you know why? I can help to explain if you're interested to know more about resource allocation in LTE

FDD 2x10MHz              DL 75.4Mbps    UL 25.1Mbps
TDD 1x20MHz Mode 0    DL 38.3Mbps    UL 29.5Mbps
TDD 1x20MHz Mode 1    DL 69.4Mbps    UL 19.9Mbps
TDD 1x20MHz Mode 2    DL 95.6Mbps    UL 9.9Mbps
TDD 1x20MHz Mode 3    DL 95.6Mbps    UL 14.9Mbps
TDD 1x20MHz Mode 4    DL 112.3Mbps  UL 9.9Mbps
TDD 1x20MHz Mode 5    DL 125.5Mbps  UL 5.4Mbps
TDD 1x20MHz Mode 1    DL 53.8Mbps    UL 24.7Mbps
Answer:
You hid the fact that 75mbps can only be achieved by TDD-LTE if there's only a single user occupying the whole subcarrier for himself. In a multi user environment that contends, TDD mode's wider lanes will be at advantage. The challenge for throughput is to send as much data over the link with the fixed amount of time. It's true that in a single user environment where one gets to download continuously over a subcarrier for a longer period of time FDD achieves greater transfer speeds but if assuming you have a competition where who gets to paint a larger overall portion of the road, TDD can have just as much covered with higher capacity making up for it.Try benchmarking TDD with more users contending with downloads at the same time, real world condition speeds will drop considerably. One proof I will show you is from a presentation given by a Korean working with NSN, unless he's trying to pull off a lie with the crowd, the results are contrasting compared to the theoretical maximum thoughput which you took from your 3GPP specs boldly. Not that it did indicate any caveat emptor when quoting them. Did they specifically mentioned the conditions when they conducted the tests? Do you now know why I only refer to specs for referencing?They don't tell best practices.

user posted image

In fact if they have extra spectrum to spare, just like in the case of Clearwire acquisition, Softbank intends to use full 40MHz and give speeds of upto 4-5 times that of what those FDD networks Verizon and ATT are doing.On top of that they can even provide unlimited quotas with the added capacity which none of the 2 FDD players can ever dare commit.
Ahn3hn3h
post Jan 3 2013, 11:01 PM

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QUOTE(alf233 @ Jan 3 2013, 10:45 PM)
WiMAX is 4G, as defined by ITU (international telecommunications union). Literally 4G can be using either WiMAX or LTE technology
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Most WIMAX chipset manufacturers are moving into the TD-LTE camp since both technologies are similarly related.

Inefficient and corrupted governments love playing spectrum auctioning games.They are auctioning little blocks of them everywhere telling people they are scarce and pricing them at exceptional high costs.

As an end result, the move is actually to deter competition from smaller players from entering the next generation game. In the case of USA, the ones who can only afford most of the blocks auctioned are the 2 monopoly giants which are Verizon and AT&T. Don't you see they are continuing their monopoly practices because only the big guns are the only ones who can afford the purchases?

Similarly in Malaysia, the joint team ups are only benefiting the big players such as TM and Maxis. Eventually the smaller players such as P1 will have to end up being absorbed and merged itself into the giants or be eliminated. They are singulating out companies which they only have interests in and make them payback for the continuation of their monopoly tactics.Cronies get themselves with money acquired from licensing and at the same time maintain their monopoly.

Some way or another you will be able to find that people who sits in the FCC or communication commisions have their interests in the giant monopolistic telcos.
Ahn3hn3h
post Jan 3 2013, 11:13 PM

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Here some good news. Just yesterday SKMM had just announced that they'll be refarming the 800MHz trunk radio bands.

A total of some 30MHz blocks will be released.

On sidenote, there's an emerging 700MHz block(Band 44) that the Asia Pacific Telecommunity is planning for future TD-LTE use. Although Malaysia is leaving this out for their digital terrestrial Tv services, neighbouring countries such as Australia, Japan, Korea, Papua New Guinea, New Zealand, Mexico, Taiwan, India, Indonesia, Singapore, Thailand, Vietnam have shown support and interest leaving Malaysia out.

Link source:
www.apt.int/sites/default/files/Upload-files/SATRC/SAPIV-WGS01-INP-08_700_MHz_Band_Plan.pdf


Added on January 3, 2013, 11:18 pmHere some good news. Just yesterday SKMM had just announced that they'll be refarming the 800MHz trunk radio bands.

A total of some 30MHz blocks will be released.

On sidenote, there's an emerging 700MHz block(Band 44) that the Asia Pacific Telecommunity is planning for future TD-LTE use. Although Malaysia is leaving this out for their digital terrestrial Tv services, neighbouring countries such as Australia, Japan, Korea, Papua New Guinea, New Zealand, Mexico, Taiwan, India, Indonesia, Singapore, Thailand, Vietnam have shown support and interest leaving Malaysia out.

Link source:
www.apt.int/sites/default/files/Upload-files/SATRC/SAPIV-WGS01-INP-08_700_MHz_Band_Plan.pdf

This post has been edited by Ahn3hn3h: Jan 3 2013, 11:18 PM
Ahn3hn3h
post Jan 3 2013, 11:39 PM

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QUOTE(alf233 @ Jan 3 2013, 11:11 PM)
Let me guess.. You are an old WiMAX engineer working with NSN?  hmm.gif  whose mind really closed on TDD because of the extensive experience you had with WiMAX..

Hang on, isn't this an LTE thread, why there is a WiMAX stuff here? I guess maybe you should start a new thred on WiMAX vs LTE then i won't bother to argue with your closed mind..

To be honest i didn't even bother reading everything that you wrote, your mind is really sealed with one technology. No point for further discussion/argument. Like I told you before, I'm open to any technology and nuetral whether its FDD or TD LTE...

Lets just wait and see which one (FDD LTE or TD LTE) will be the choice of Malaysia users. Well at least we know already FDD LTE is more commonly deployed worldwide..

No WiMAX please or open new thread

I forgot one thing, you were saying FDD vs TD are because of political issues west vs east... Looks like your exposure on LTE is not really enough.. Dont you know that all LTE vendors.. I repeat all, from west (NSN, ALU, Ericsson) and from east (Huawei, ZTE, Samsung, NEC) have both FDD LTE and TD LTE solutions? Ok you didnt know this, well at least you should thank me for telling you this good piece of information
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You do too much of guessing la bro and you're always welcome to join us since we've a much brighter and prospectful future path.
No doubt it's still new but you know, WIMAX2 might absorb many of the good elements of its TD-LTE cousin and evolve into something far better.

Mobile networks are fast evolving into pure data packet switching.

Back when TD-LTE was still in its infant stage, labs that wanted to compare FDD-LTE equipments used WIMAX for spectrum efficiency benchmarks. It was the next closest cousin to TD-LTE.

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