It's impossible to have a proper discourse with someone who doesn't have memory of such incidences. I call it, selective amnesia. Like I said earlier, Suarez should have shook hands to out a end to it all. However, I do think it's plausible that he didn't feel Evra was going to shake his hand after he dropped it. Improbably but yet, plausible. We've heard from the mancs, let's see what the club has to say about the incident.

It's obvious Suarez skipped Evra. It's also obvious Evra dropped his hand. Does this mean Evra had no intention if shaking Suarez's hand? No it doesn't but it doesn't also mean that Suarez didn't interpret his dropped hand as a sign of being unwilling to shake. Too many words?

You call Suarez a racist without noting the fact that Evra called Suarez a "dirty a South American", is retaliation. This was in the report you didn't read by the way.

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Added on February 12, 2012, 10:10 amNo, you're a simpleton.

This post has been edited by Duke Red: Feb 12 2012, 10:10 AM

Let me help with your signature. It should read "YOUR fart is the weapon most feared by YOUR enemies". Can't even get that right?

Uncalled for. Suggest you remove this.

Oh you mean the cup you're fighting for now?

Apparently it's unthinkable that we have our own opinions in our own thread. I've no issues against criticism being directed at the club, especially if we've been provide to be guilty of misdoings. All I ask is for accusers to realize that they are certainly no angels either. You can't frown on us and at the same time ignore past misforgivings.

Here we have Fergie labeling Suarez a disgrace. From where he's standing, Suarez refused to shake hands and looking at it objectively, I can see where he's coming from. Racial slurs are socially and morally wrong. Do not for a moment forget however that so is rape, adultery and violence. I never saw Keane apologizing to Haaland or Giggs issue a public apology for having an affair. Both are public icons who young children look up to as well. So, while Suarez may be guilty, don't sweep aside these facts we bring up just because it happened in the past because apparently, the past doesnt matter to a good number of mancs.

Seems to me that the only good reason to have shook hands was to 'appease' the media. I mean if I don't like a guy who has turned my life upside down, wouldn't it make me a hypocrite to pretend I do? It's a PR nightmare, no doubt and Suarez has to realize that whether or not the players or the club agree it's a matter of principle not to have shook hands, the club cannot follow him down this route. I reckon the club did advise him to shake hands which is why King Kenny said he would prior to the game, which he didn't of course. I think it was Suarez acting on his own.

If I were the club, I would have played it safe and requested for the whole handshake ceremony to be canceled just as it was when Chelsea faced QPR.

As far as criticizing Suarez for being racist goes, I can't help but wonder if the thousands of mancs who are up in arms and suddenly advocates for anti-racism efforts, are vocal because they feel very strongly about racism, or because it's Luis Suarez, a player of LFC? I'd like to think its the former but then let me ask you this, how are you contributing? Do you donate to anti racism groups or alliances? Talk is cheap. If you truly believe in ending racism, put your money where your mouth is. Do you even donate a dollar? No? Then maybe it's only because this incident involves LFC.

Everyone is ready to condemn Suarez for snubbing Evra but for the wrong reasons. Far as they're concerned, it doesn't matter that Suarez has been labeled as being racist. Their objectives are self serving. In all their statements you'll note that they say the same thing, that Suarez had the opportunity to put and end to this. True but at what cost? His reputation has already been tarnished beyond repair and he's supposed to suck it up and move on? I don't blame Evra for this, I blame the FA. I think they are a bunch of twats who only look into their own interests and by not shaking hands, Suarez has prolonged coverage of this racial incident, which is a slap in the face of the FA who have long been fighting racism. They pinned their hopes on Suarez to shake hands as an admission of guilt which would effectively concluded this saga.

Football was the loser last night. Says a lot that people are talking about this incident and not about the match. I personally don't see why do much attention was given to this whole handshake ceremony prior to the game. The media's focus was on whether or not they'd shake hands? Big deal if it didn't happen. It certainly isn't the first time.

Why didn't he shake hands? Takes a little bit of empathy to get it. Suarez has felt victimized all this while as he's been effectively branded a racist because of this whole debacle. I'd be a little bit bitter but that's just me. Shaking hands may have put the issue to rest but it could have also been seen as an admission of guilt. Like I said earlier thought, what's the big deal? Other players and managers have refused to shake hands before.

Give it some thought first.

Suarez apologised for not shaking hands. He's obviously been coaxed into issuing an apology by PR representatives of the club. If he had felt any different he would have made a desperate attempt to shake Evra's hand even if the latter hid it up his arse. It doesn't mean he's forgiven Evra and everyone else involved in having him labeled a racist. From a PR standpoint, the best thing to do would have been to shake hands and let the headlines read wheat ever they want. The sooner this incident blows over, the better. As a matter of principle however, I can empathize with him feeling a sense of injustice and not feeling particularly happy about wanting to shake hands. Anyone who can tell me they'd feel any different if they were in his shoes is either a liar or a very forgiving person.

Nice piece.

The problem is this though. Many people either have selective memory or choose to ignore opposing views. Time and time against we've posted incidences where Man Utd players and Fergie himself have refused to shake hands but these are all ignored. You can't argue or debate with someone when they ignore your posts, and are too self absorbed with their own. Not often do you see good counter arguments.

I'm not fan of Gary Neville but at the very least he wasn't being a hypocrite. He himself refused to shake Schmeichel's hand in the tunni. It's sickening to see people call Suarez racist and cry out against racism but have contributed nothing themselves against racism. It's appalling also to see people lambast Suarez for not wanting to shake hands when their own team has been guilty of it on more than one occasion in the past.

Don't kid yourself. This isn't about racism or respect. It's about both clubs hating one another.

The fact that you're asking this question shows that the verdict was based on everything but fact.

Huh? You didn't offer an opinion, you asked a question. You asked what his intention was when he uttered that word to Evra.

Yeah but that's like saying Man Utd won't stay loyal when the club stops winning because it hasnt happened yet, and therefore, there aren't grounds to justify claims otherwise.

If you made an error, please don't fault me for interpreting it as it was written.

No one said you can't express your opinion. What I pointed out earlier was that the verdict from the FA was based on just that, their opinion and interpretation of what happened, and not fact. Whilst we can offer arguments based on opinions since we are neither judge nor jury, they cannot do the same.

You're missing the point. I'm not saying that you won't remain loyal. I'm suggesting that some things are just that obvious. In this case, if the situation were reversed, you lot would be behind Evra. Since we're in the topic though, 3 years without winning the title is hardly the end of the world, and doesn't exactly constitute a tough period.

This isn't a new crime either. Some years back an English footballer (can't remember his name now) used a racist word against a fellow player. He was hit with an 8 match ban. Suarez was given the same punishment despite citing cultural differences, a lack of evidence, a lack in consistently from the accuser (first he was used the word 10 times, then 7, and so on). He was hit with the maximum ban ever imposed suggesting he's racist even though his beat mate in Holland was black as is his grandad. Again, no one is disagreeing that he deserves some form of punishment for using a contentious word, it's the magnitude of the punishment which has affected his reputation and his family,

You've done nothing to deserve getting a ban so don't worry.

Then the media coverage of the event is misleading because a lot was made of this incident. Just comes to show that whatever comes out of the media's mouth can be misleading. Your explanation certainly sounds likely. In the same vein then, I'd ask people not to judge any player from any club based on what the media says. Not Suarez, not anyone. Won't bring up the other incidents like the Mourinho and Viera snub because I feel I've made my point. A lot of people have been guilty of not shaking hands, or apologizing. All I ask is for those who criticize Suarez to be impartial since your own players have done the same before. In the incident you're referring to, Neville probably had a reason as did Suarez but no one bothered to know the reason assuming the worst. If I don't like someone why should I pretend to? Just so the media can go to bed with a smile on their face?

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Added on February 13, 2012, 9:25 amThat's the thing. I get it that the whole racial thing gets minority groups stirred up. I personally don't like getting racially abused but I'm but an individual. The thing is if you don't like people stereotyping you and calling you derogatory names, why the hell would you act all ghetto, reinforcing the stereotype and use those words yourself. Black people should stop calling other black people the "N" word.

On another note, when are you in the UK until? Planning to visit Anfield again with my mate at the end of the year. Need to wait for next season's schedule first of course to pick a game. Reckon you can help with tickets?

This post has been edited by Duke Red: Feb 13 2012, 09:25 AM

I think that so long as you win the ball first without going through your opponent, it will be interpreted as a clean tackle. If Phil Dowd had opted to penalize Ferdinand, he would have had to send him off as Suarez was clean through on goal and Ferdinand was the last man. He would have to had been sure beyond all doubt that Ferdinand took Suarez out unfairly, which he didn't. Correct call in my opinion.