Just to update you all Malaysian. I'm from Thailand and we face the same crisis as you do. Nothing has been done from our authorities. Nothing. Your Malaysian Government at least has done somthing (but could have done more). Now BN fetch same price here for around RM1800-2000. I myself, as stubborn as Uncle Westwing, refuse to sell and now keeping almost 70kg stock. Lucky I have other small business to be able to manage. Now I'm so sick of this I will draw a letter to the Thai Ministry to help your Malaysian Authority in together discuss to the Chinese and really see what they are up to.

This is my first read back in 3 years I guess. Farewell and best of luck to all of us.

...

This post has been edited by chitchai: Feb 28 2012, 10:09 PM

I like to share something further now that i'm back here reading about the current birdnest crisis.

1. 1st of all you think there is a 'conspiracy' going on? Meaning China will no longer allow us to export legally but instead letting through all these smugglings? And Chank (or kohloh?) said it's power play now in China to determine who will become the BN king? Is that what happening? sigh...

2. About the boiling & disappearing nest, I think real birdnest will eventually 100% dissolve away in the water if you boil too long. Faked nest, on the other hand, will never dissolve, no? This I learn from my Sifu, and that's what I tell people that, if u keep boiling them too long, all will dissolve away. The nutrition is still there in the soup, but you just can't see and feel the nest.

3. Cambodia now is like Thailand 15 years ago. I don't think you need to joint venture with a general. Just jv with any landlord will do, cause he will take care of his own property, the way you construct him to.

Do not invest in Thailand. I myself stop building bh already and I do not recommend any friend to do it here. I think we got more houses than birds already; all new bh here having a real bad start; only few manage to secure some tenants. I might be wrong though, and it all depends on area.

4. Lastly I really admire all your fighting spirit. I kinda quit this business already. Topped with the BN current crisis, you guys still talk about new venture elsewhere. Clap.Clap. For me, getting out of this hell crisis is THE ONLY thing I want of the bird farming business now.

5. Birds like hot and humid, not cold and dry. I don't think 35 degree *c will do them harm. Just my 2cents


Wait.. last thing, in Thailand you CAN own properties by registering a company with you being 49% shareholder and scatter the rest 51% to some Thais (with them signed a blank transfer of the shares back to you in case something happens). Then you appoint yourself a managing director and then buy the building in the company name. That should do it. I think it's similar in Cambodia.

Keep up the spirit all friends.

We have shared our parts in helping. In the name of a BN Association here in Thailand, 2 weeks ago I wrote letters to Dept of Commerce, Dept of Export Promotion, and the China Embassy to Thailand. Later on manage to talk to a guy from Dept of Export Promotion and he said he had already talked to a Thai Authority in Beijing about this and the Chinese Authorities, when inquired, said they treat BN the same as other importing food, which subject to 30 ppm rules. The Export Promo dept. guy later on told me that this Nitrate thing can be categorized as some tactics called NTB (Non-Tariff Barrier) (since we have enter the Free Trade Agreement.) And it doesn't only happen to BN, it happens from time to time to fruit, vegetables and other export to China.

I will continue to call him every week to see what has been done in the Chinese part to resolve this.

Hang in there all friends. Cheers,

Try this. Very helpful about BN Nitrate written by some Dr. from Jaho Baru

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=ppm...WpyYCHA&cad=rja

Summary: Birdshit and urine develop Ammonia (NH3). After that NH3 develop in to NO2 (Nitrite) and After that oxidized into NO3(Nitrate).

Average Nitrate in cleaned raw birdnest from Jaho-Baru is 87.5 ppm. And 384.7 ppm for uncleaned raw birdnest! (sigh)

How comes YST birdnest claim their birdnests have only 11 ppm Nitrate?
http://ystnest.blogspot.com/

So, what's current prices? Last post you said price shooting up and now prices tumbling down even further. Can anybody show me market prices in your area? I might have to sell some now; i'm soooo dry up.

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Added on April 15, 2012, 5:36 pmThailand is indeed a place for retirement since cost of living is a bit lower than Malaysia and we are friendly and fair to foreigners. But I don't think BH consultant will be such a good business in the future, due to modest birdnest prices and more than a handful of Thai sifus now in the field.

By the way, busy or not, I don't think any Thai governments, the current and those to come, will be puting anykind of stringent regulations for tax purpose or any environment issues for BHs. One thing to remember, BH business is a domestic self-manufacturing and Export business. Nothing to buy from abroad, nothing to lose, and everything to gain, for the country econ.

Long time no see, P'Tweeter. U sure know more ppl in here than me. Still Passionate of building a perfect BH? (Or fish is yr bigger interest now?) I wanted to join yr guppy blog sometimes but with superuser granted, Hehe..

This post has been edited by chitchai: Apr 15 2012, 05:36 PM

Hi all,
I like to talk about something else a little. It's about the golden color nest. And this topic may later on prove valuable for some bird keepers, when negotiation time comes.

There was a free seminar in my area recently and this one host guy, sounded professional, pointed out that there are black nests (cheapest), white nest, red nest (more expensive), and golden nest(most expensive).

He went on to say that when we keep the nest longer, it will turn yellow. If we go on to keep them for even longer, it will eventually turn from yellow to golden. However most cannot keep it that long.

Anybody tried that before? Keep the nest until they become golden color?
and
Golden color nests really fetch higher price in your area?
and
What causes a golden color nest? Will yellow nest become golden if kept long enough?

If this info is real, from this very long drought, some of our nests will become golden for sure.

This post has been edited by chitchai: Apr 19 2012, 03:30 PM

Appreciate both info. Thanks a lot.
This week 1 Chinese guy call my bro in BKK to ask price and my bro quote 3kRM. Nothing happened.

This week another guy from China (relative to local southern Thai) approach me to see my nest (after being told my price was 3K Rm). After seeing my nests, he went home... (even though the bag I showed him weren't that bad..)

So like you said, there are some increasing activities on the buyer side in this last couple of weeks. But not many are really buying. Maybe my price is still too high...

This post has been edited by chitchai: Apr 20 2012, 03:14 PM

Yes lumsum or mix grade, about 20% corner nest the rest cup shape of mixed sizes.

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Added on April 21, 2012, 1:12 amIf you have not much nests, putting them in the freezer (-18*) works best. They won't change one bit as long as you still pay electric bills. However many kilos become a problem where your many freezers run out of space. And that's when turning yellow becomes inevitable, like mine Hope this helps.

This post has been edited by chitchai: Apr 21 2012, 01:12 AM

Not cleaned. Average nests just like what you harvest from your BH.

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Added on April 24, 2012, 4:58 pmBrother WW, I think it's normal they quote stupid prices like that. After all, they are BUYING centre, not selling centre. Whenever I go sell my nests, if they already know we are not buying but selling, they will immediately start telling prices has fallen and fallen and dirt cheap for the moment. Everytime. Why don't you ask the buying centre if they would be willing to sell to you that less-feather white nests for RM1700/KG? If they do you could buy 20kg grade A from them.
If someone is sincere in helping out in the crisis time, they should offer at least reasonable prices. This EBN Buying Centre does the opposite. Not only didn't they help, instead they try to take advantage of this crisis to make profit. So I agree with you that all swiftlet breeders should just disregard them.
Wish you successfully manage to sell at Rm2800. I will try to work on that number too.

This post has been edited by chitchai: Apr 24 2012, 04:58 PM

Current prices in Thailand.

Corner / dirty 1800rm
Cup 2200-2600rm
Super White Cup 3000rm

Getting a bit better. Don't get too depressed die here die there lah. Or hypertension could creep in.

Don't flatter us lah. All the Thais here always talk about how much more developed (than Thailand) Malaysian has become. We believe yr country is years ahead of us. Even your minimum day wage is like 40RM, isn't it? Our minimum wage is currently less than 30RM/day.

The prices I quoted are the averages from latest birdnest Auction. However next auction not sure because everybody just made their biggest harvests. So price could drop little due to large supply and rebound July-August. Aham sound like an expert?? Heehe...

Its depressingly quiet. Latest prices heard in Hadyai not too good,problem being there are more nests to sell than demanded. There is this one shop in Hadyai selling CLEANED bird nest at RM4000. Dunno his raw prices. However I will definitely post my selling prices here once I manage to sell.
Should be in 2-3 weeks time. Hang in there tight bros.

Brother Kohloh,
Are these the real expenses you have to pay to import nest to China? May I know more in detail?
Because I just queried a guy from the Foreign Trade Minister of Thailand and he gave me a spreadsheet full of rows specifying "import tax rate" to China. It say 0% which means no taxed imposed.

On what port in China did you go through? By vessel or airplane? I really don't know the procedure well but I will use your reply as info to press against the guy who talk to China authorities, to really find out what happens.

Could it be that, these are non-tax items we have to pay. If that's the case, China can't really say it's a free trade (as per the FTA).

Please reply as I really need your info. Doing this together may eventual help u, help the Thai exporter, and eventually helps us all. Thanks in advance.

To Other brothers: As for the current nest prices in Thailand, I will notify you after the first week of July. I hope they won't fall too bad, keeping my finger crossed.

Koloh,

Although I have a hard time trying to understand what you wrote because may be you use too much abbreviations and some Malayus. , I think I got the whole picture. I will translate what you wrote and give it to our Dept. Thanks a bunch and hope you do well and may the prosperity returns soon (as well as ours).

However I still have a question. Why should we insert the Raw nest section in the agreement? Aren't raw nests with too high nitrate to export anyway? How can one export raw nest to China legally? Please clarify. Thanks a bunch.

Second, about letting ppl here knowing current prices in Thailand. I merely try to feed in info from outside to the forum and I wish everybody do the same. Only this way could all friends benefit from this forum. And your earlier info are deeply appreciated.

And I'm sure as heck I've nothing to do with manipulating the Malaysian BN prices in anyway. Please don't get me wrong. (I won't be able to if I want, to begin with).

Years back, I can recall Malaysia BN prices always a bit higher than the Thai prices. And I like it that way, knowing that there will still be another place to sell outside my country. I hope, like ChanK said, the Chinese will come back to eat bn someday and the whole market will recover, eventually.

Brother WW,
Prices in Thailand fell just as bad despite the fact that CNY is coming. Birdnest Auction yields vary from 1.4 - 1.9k Rm/kg. Sell to final consumers (if you manage to get one) give better price 2-2.4k Rm/kg.
Cleaned nests fetch approx 3.x-4.x KRm/kg.

I understand you all are pissed by your Goman/Authority of not helping enough on the matter. Couldn't agree more but we all have to keep in mind that this is not up to your Goman only. It's clear that China is putting up some kind of barriers on the luxury import items, no matter what the Chinese spokesmen said. Nitrate is 1 thing and there are many more factor & procedures to go through that will dishearten any legit BN exporters. That only leaves submarine(word choice for safety sake) the only alternative. Now the Chinese have this submarine checked, while legit export is still very troubling to get done, all harvested birdnests have nowhere to go.

Now in Thailand, where its Gomen not yet able to produce any legit BN exporters, whoever involved in the submarine to HK are controling the market. They make quick bucks like you said, with no need to build BHs.
Sad but we have to admit now is definitely their times. Only hope is that our and your gomen are strong enough to negotiate, or trade some kind of trade privileges for exporting BN. Then we might see light at the end of the tunnel.

Until then, I don't know what to say really...

For me, I sell some here and there, keeping the rest, hoping the current prices are already at the bottom of all time.

wanna ask something and found the answer already. Sorry

This post has been edited by chitchai: Dec 9 2012, 10:56 PM

Hi all,
Long time no log-in to this forum as I was occupied with other crazy things in my live.

First of all, sorry for uncle ww for the flood. Hope things get better and u stay with this forum as our shifu for a very long time to come (alongside genius Tuckfook).

Secondly, sorry to all BH owner in Selangor if the laws were to enforced.

I can't think of a better way to counter this, except to go protest on the streets. Show them they are wrong. Birds will not move along when you move your BH. Shifting outside the city will result in a tons of dead baby and young birds; thus hurting the BN industry in Malaysia. That will harm the country GDP and economics. Less BN means you literally hand money to your neighbor country. No gov in the world would do that to their own econ. You must protest to show them this fact.

When Malaysian chineses earns their income, they will spend within the state. They will eat, shop, and distribute their income to anybody, bumi or non bumi. Hurting them will result in shrinking of total spending, and national econ as a whole.

Hopefully with your protest, their gods will light up their heads.

If this were to happen in our country, surely some bloods will shed. As a swiftlet farmer, I strongly denounce this bill and hope the state of Selangor realize their mistake.

Best wish to you all, swiftlet farmer friends.

Uncle WW,
Please be warned about the auction that, things will get uglier as time goes on. The auction, which allows lot of satisfactory buying prices at the beginning, will tumble and became, what I would call, PIG slaughtering house, at the end. (WE are the PIGS, unfortunately).

U know how they do that, all buyers will join force in no time. They will start to know each other, and form up a team. Their team will consist of several buyers, to make the (conspired) auction realistic. When they succeed, they all will bid low and each one of them will win proportionate amount. Later when the auction is over, all sellers gone home, they will sell and buy from each other at added prices. This way they get cheaper nests.

Another way to do it is to bring in fake bidder. A real bidder will ask his friend to come over and participating in this game. His friend will win some bid, but eventually when we all go home, the real bidder will pay him.
To achieve all these. They will need to 1) keep out new bidder 2)Approach new bidder and make deal before the auction take place

We all of course have the right to NOT SELL, however how many people would raise their hand objecting his/her sell, now that they have come a long way to this auction. Some would swallow their loss and just let the bird nests go. Same things happening in the Thailand auction.

How do you prevent these?
1.) Do everything you can to keep them from seeing each other. Even at lunch time or whatever.
2.) Make sure after the buyer/bidder pays, we transport the nests into their car right away. This way, before we all seller go home, no nest will be left on the bidding table, for them to buy and sell among them.
Doing this may help. Because once the nests got to their car/pick-up, whoever want to buy from them has to do it beside the car. That makes it difficult for them to easily plot / buy and share the nests.
3.) Always set hidden minimum selling price of each bag. NO FEE is to be paid to the auction manager, IF NO PURCHASE has been made. This is to ensure many seller won't lose anything, if the prices are to low.

I will add more if I can think of later.