Yea, I agree that a lot of times the KIX HD programmes PQ sucks due to stretching from 4:3 to 16:9 plus upscaled from SD source too !

Mmm... the answer to your question can be simple and easy or difficult depending on what you actually want for your second TV in another room which is about 30m away.

When you mentioned "Astro HD", you mean that you have the Byond box, already subscribed to HD Service (or Superpack) and already watching HD channels in 1080i HD quality on your 1st HDTV ??

Have you done the "connection" to your second TV in the other room ?

Here is what I understood from your short explanations...

1) First HDTV connected by HDMI directly to your Byond box.
2) Want the 2nd HDTV in another room to be connected to the SAME Byond box.
3) Want to use the Byond Remote to be able to change channels when watching from the 2nd HDTV.

* I believe that you already know, that connecting 2 TVs to the same Byond box will only allow watching the same channel on BOTH TVs.

* For remote control use on other room, an IR (infrared) transmitter and receiver is needed which many chinese people refer to as "Cat's Eyes". The receiver unit is attached to the front of the Byond box and the transmitter unit is located in the other room. The question is how to get the transmitter and receiver connected by cable or other methods.

The question is on the 2nd HDTV connection and what you need and actually want.

Its possible to use a 1-to-2 HDMI splitter on the Byond HDMI output BUT the question is about getting the 30m HDMI cable !! Signal strength will definitely drop a lot for very long HDMI cable of 30m AND more difficult to find such long HDMI lengths to buy. Therefore, using HDMI splitter in such a way is... well... not my recommendation.

So... it will depend on what sort of Picture & Audio quality you want for your 2nd HDTV.

I do know many people will just accept SD quality and poor quality 2 channel audio for the 2nd TV.

Before I continue further, any options I suggest here do include the IR capability for Remote use.

Option 1
For the 2nd HDTV, get the same HD quality as the 1st HDTV (connected by HDMI).

Wow... this is very expensive. A few choices available.

Get a wireless HDMI transmitter and repeater device such as the Sarowin HD10 5G Full HD AV Transmitter device or other brands which are cheaper. "Sarowin" is just a suggestion so you can also use other cheaper ones. Other people here have discussed about this in previous posts here.

Another is to use ethernet cables (same cables used for the modem and PC). The Byond HDMI output is connected to a 1-to-2 HDMI splitter, Output 1 directly to HDTV and Output 2 to a Ethernet Converter Box. This converter box converts the HDMI and IR signal to be carried through the ethernet cable to the 2nd location. At the 2nd location, another Box receives the signal and reconverts back to HDMI signal with HDMI Output to the 2nd HDTV. Preferably, CAT6 ethernet cables is better than CAT5 for very long distance to reduce signal loss.

There are also other methods but the two methods I mentioned should be enough for my explanation.

Option 2
This option means that you will only get low quality SD video and 2 channel audio for your 2nd HDTV !!

The Byond box do NOT have RF Out for connection using "white TV Aerial" cables. The Satellite cables are the same. Previously, other people used this type of connection for the old Astro DMT box because this box have RF Out.

So the only way is to use converters again.

For the 1st HDTV...
No change in connection... Byond HDMI Out directly to HDTV.

For the 2nd HDTV...
Use the Byond RCA (red, white, yellow) Out to connect to the RCA Input of the "RCA to RF" Converter Box. From the Converter Box RF Out, connect ... hehe... the usual "TV Aerial" cable (recommended to use RG6 type for less signal loss). Can also use the "Satellite Cable" which is the same. For your needs, a 30m length cable required. Extend this cable to the 2nd room and connect to the "RF to RCA" Converter Box. This reconverts the signals back to RCA. Use RCA cables to connect from the Box Output to the 2nd HDTV RCA Input. Connections DONE.

For this option, you have to sacrifice the audio quality for your 1st HDTV. Why ? The Byond box "Digital Audio Settings" for Digital Audio Output MUST be changed to "Stereo (Analogue and Digital)". Therefore 1st HDTV will get lower audio quality, no Dolby Digital anymore. This Byond RCA (red, white) will NOT have output for ALL HD Channels when "Dolby Digital 5.1 (Digital Only)" is used.

Your 2nd HDTV will then be able to receive all the SD and HD Channels in SD Resolution video and 2 channel PCM audio only. Well... can you accept the much lower quality for the HD channels for your 2nd HDTV ? Its up to you to decide.

This Option 2 is much much cheaper than Option 1 BUT have to sacrifice PQ/AQ quality, hehehe.

Mmm... where to get the "RF/RCA" Converters ? I believe many of your local TV sellers, installers, etc can help you. Hehe... other people here can also recommend many types available. Hehehe... "Made In China" ?

IMPORTANT ! Such Converters must also have IR capability for Remote use.

Oh, almost forgot... you may need to add a RF Signal Booster in the 2nd room because of signal drop.

There are people who can afford it to pay RM 50 per month for an additional Byond box because they don't want all the hassle on the connection matter and also they want to be able to watch different channels in different rooms. I know of one rich person in my location who got 6 Byond boxes for 6 rooms, LOL !

I hope I did not confuse you and have been clear in my explanations.

EDIT... Found out later... corrected a mistake... changed "did confuse" to "did NOT confuse".

NOTE : IF anyone find any mistakes made here, please correct me. No problem. I also welcome other suggestions which I may have left out here.



ADDITION : Mmm... "Pargon" asked earlier about the difference between 1080i and 1080p. The often asked "Interlace" and "Progressive Scan" difference, hehehe. Maybe, just maybe, I will try to answer if I have more time, hehe. Not sure if I can explain in non-technical way to make it easier to understand so I may choose not to answer it.

This post has been edited by jamesleetech: Jul 6 2012, 01:07 PM

You are welcome. Glad to help. Hehe... only hope I did not confuse you with my terribly looong feedback.

EDIT : I hope you can edit your reply to put the "quotes" in spoilers because of my looong feedback to reduce unnecessary clutter in this thread. Sorry for that and thanks.

This post has been edited by jamesleetech: Jul 5 2012, 10:13 PM

I appreciate your compliments.

Sorry if I am a bit confused about what you mean by "source play". If you are referring to the "source programmes" used by each different channels, then its difficult for me to answer.

The "source programmes" are those movies, TV shows, TV documentaries, TVB dramas, etc. For example... HBO HD Channel 433 always broadcast in 16:9 format but can choose to broadcast the movie "Transformers: Dark Side Of The Moon" in actual 22:10 cinema ratio which will show as letterbox with some black bars on top/bottom... However, HBO HD have chosen to reformat that movie into 16:9 by cutting off a liitle bit of the left and right side of the movie so the movie is shown as full 16:9 without letterbox.

Sometimes letterbox cannot be avoided depending on what source each channel operator have chosen to broadcast. If the channel operator chose to "cut-off" left and right parts of a 22:10 movie, then will get full 16:9. Some channels... example... KIX HD chose to use original source programs in 4:3, reconvert it by expanding left and right to fit 16:9 so everything in the screen will appear fatter and will be slightly more blur picture so it sucks.

It does NOT matter what "source materials" each channel chose to broadcast. You will not be able to avoid poor PQ due to upscaling from SD source, letterbox, screen image appearing "fatter", etc. This happens for ALL satellite broadcasters, not only for Astro.

Ok, to make it simpler, I think this is what you want to know ...

The actual ratio used by Astro for broadcast
1) For all SD channels... in 4:3 format.
2) For all HD channels... in 16:9 format which is the standard adopted by all High Definition TV broadcasters.

You cannot have the best of everything when you choose which Byond setting to use.

Since all the HD channels are broadcast in 16:9, people with Widescreen HDTV will have NO problems viewing HD channels when the source movie/TV show is originally in 16:9... so setting to "Pillar Box" or "Fit to screen" makes NO difference. Aah... there will be letterbox when the source movie is in 22:1 Cinema format.

BUT since all the SD channels are broadcast in 4:3, setting to "Pillar Box" or "Fit to screen" will definitely have difference.

Ask yourself these questions...

a) Do you want to watch all the SD and HD channels in the correct ratio (no fat image) and can accept letterbox with black bars ?
b) Do you hate to see the letterboxed black bars and don't like a smaller picture screen due to black bars and wants the entire TV screen area to be used ?

If you have a Widescreen 16:9 HDTV
Answer to (a)... "Pillar Box" is the suitable choice. This will cause ALL SD channels (4:3) to be shown with letterbox, left and right black bars.

Answer to (b)... "Fit to screen" is the suitable choice. This will cause ALL SD channels (4:3) to be shown "fatter".

If you have an old CRT TV (SD screen 4:3)
Answer to (a)... "Pillar Box" is the suitable choice. This will cause ALL HD channels (16:9) to be shown with letterbox, top and bottom black bars.

Answer to (b)... "Fit to screen" is the suitable choice. This will cause ALL HD channels (16:9) to be shown "thinner". Hehe... not sure about this as I have not tested it on an old CRT TV.

In my opinion, I don't recommend "LB Expand" for Widescreen HDTV because too much area is cut-off from the top and bottom for ALL SD channels. Even the channel logo at the top may go missing ! Well... some people may disagree with me on this and love "LB Expand"... so everyone have the right to choose whatever one feels and believe is the best. After all, its each person's viewing experience that is important, my opinion is not necessarily right for everyone.

Oh... I really don't know how to answer you on how to check the ratio format for any "programme source" when it is playing in any channel. I think you will "sense" that something is wrong, for example... when you see people's face appearing fatter BUT its not accurate because you will get used to it after watching for a long time.

Many people got used to watching SD 4:3 channels when "Fit to screen" is used for Widescreen HDTVs and did NOT notice that everything in the programme appear fatter and happily watch people with fat faces without any complaints. But when changed to "Pillar Box", THEN they complained about the smaller screen area with BIG black side bars on their Widescreen HDTVs !!! LOL !!!

Speaking for myself only, I prefer "Pillar Box" for my Widescreen 16:9 HDTV because I like the original shape and don't mind the smaller screen area for the SD channels.

Kakakaka...hehehehehe... the Screen Ratio Choice ! Nobody wins and nobody is right.

This post has been edited by jamesleetech: Jul 6 2012, 12:28 AM

Bingo ! All yes.

The only change is when any channel operator reconvert any source programmes original screen ratio into a different one. For example ... KIX HD sometimes reconvert some programmes from the original 4:3 by expanding the black side bars to become 16:9... eventhough you set to "Pillar Box" for your HDTV, you will still get "fat faces".

That means if the channel operator did not reconvert or meddle with the original source program ratio, then you will get exactly the same result as you mentioned above.

It is the same situation for the Byond subtitle settings. Eventhough I set the Byond subtitle setting to "Disable" which shut off all subtitles, the Bahasa or English or Chinese or whatever subtitle will still appear for some programmes. Many times the channel operator can "hard-code" the subtitle into a programme. Whatever I do to the Byond subtitle setting... if they "hard-coded" Bahasa Malaysia subtitle, then I will ALWAYS see the Bahasa Malaysia subtitle.

Subtitles that can be changed or follow according to the Byond settings are called "Soft-coded" subtitles. Of course there will be no subtitle when the programme did not come with any, hehe.

ADDITION
By the way, I think most people chose to use "Fit to screen" and don't care about watching "fat people, fat everything" for SD channels. Just go to any open air kedai kopi, mamak shops, food courts, etc... which shows Astro channels... most will never subscribe to HD service... you will see the SD channels shown as "fat" 16:9. I may be wrong ...mmm... I believe almost everyone already got used to "fat" 16:9 !!! You and I are among the only few people left in Malaysia who don't like to see beautiful slim sexy girls changing into fat ones in SD channels !

This post has been edited by jamesleetech: Jul 6 2012, 12:37 PM

Hehehehe... oh please me... I am so thin and want to become overweight like everyone else. Mmm... eating a lot will not me so I must change to "Fit to screen".

From your previous few posts and questions, this is what I already understood on what you want...

1) You have the Sony BDV-E490 (HTIB) home theatre system which you want to use for Byond
2) You want to get 5.1 surround sound from Byond to your Sony BDV-E490

This means you want to try and get the best possible sound from your Byond box for the HD channels, and for Byond, that is Dolby Digital 5.1.

When your HDTV have an Optical Out, of course you can use it to connect to your Sony BDV-E490 BUT there may be problems AND does it satisfy what you want ? Mmm... now you are wondering why I answered in this way.

Okay, let me show you a picture I took using my phone camera for my Samsung HDTV (inside spoilers)...

Here is a portion of my Samsung HDTV Manual...
When the receiver (home theatre) is set to on, you can hear sound output from the TV’s optical jack.
When the TV is receiving a DTV signal, the TV will send 5.1 CH sound to the home theatre receiver.

When the source is a digital component such as a DVD / Blu-ray player / cable box / STB (Set-Top-Box) satellite receiver
and is connected to the TV via HDMI, only 2 CH audio will be heard from the home theatre receiver.
If you want to hear 5.1 CH audio, connect the digital audio out jack from your DVD / Blu-ray player / cable box / STB satellite
receiver directly to an amplifier or home theatre.

My Samsung TV clearly state that it supports Dolby Digital Plus and Dolby Pulse. Dolby Digital+ is slightly different from Dolby Digital so will my TV decode the Byond Dolby Digital 5.1 ? I think can BUT I have not tried it yet, hehe. My Samsung HDTV will only output from its Optical Out as * DTS 2.0 for DTS signals, not DTS 5.1 ! No problem for me since most amplifiers support DTS audio.

* EDITED : Corrected some mistakes above, for the DTS 2.0 info (in blue text)

THEN I realised that I have a problem here if I want to get the Byond Dolby Digital 5.1 for HD channels !

If I used HDMI to connect directly from Byond to my Samsung HDTV... my Samsung manual VERY CLEARLY state that ONLY 2 CH will be output from the TV Optical Output !! The manual also says "If you want to hear 5.1 CH audio", I must connect my DVD/Blu-ray player/STB Satellite Receiver Optical Out directly to the Amplfier. BUT in your situation... the Byond (STB Satellite Receiver) DO NOT have Optical Out !!

Your friend's recommendation on "HDTV -----HTiB via optical for 5.1" may not be 100% right because it depends on your HDTV actual specifications for its Optical Out.

You have to find out from your HDTV specifications to answer these questions...

a) Does it have built-in decoder that fully support Dolby Digital 5.1 or does it support only Dolby Digital 2.0 or Dolby Digital+ ?
b) Does it receive the audio from HDMI, decode to 5.1 and pass the audio to Optical Out ? If it decode to 2.0 to the Optical Out, then no 5.1 !
c) Does it support digital audio "pass-through" which means what comes in to the TV goes out to its optical out without any decoding ? Mmm... I have NEVER known of any HDTV that have this so forget about this question.

Of course you can try connecting your HDTV optical out to your Sony BDV-E490 BUT is it really 5.1 sound or only 2.0. Its okay to get Dolby 2.0 this way if you can accept it because the audio is at least better than the analog RCA (red, white) connection. But you will NOT get the "best available" audio from your Byond, hehe.

Answers...

1) Byond HDMI to HDTV... then HDTV Optical Out to your Sony BDV-E490 home theatre > Yes, BUT depend on your HDTV specifications. Advantage : FREE, only pay for cables.

2) Beyond Co-Axial Out... to Coaxial-Optical Converter... then to your Sony BDV-E490 home theatre > Yes, BUT make sure the converter support Dolby 5.1 Optical Out. Disadvantage : Spend $$ lah.

You decide... do it for free, pay $$ for converter or accept stereo 2 channel audio.

You have earlier asked... actually what is the Gefen Translator from the picture I posted earlier. Mmm... a picture is worth a thousand words so here is a graphic I have drawn for you (inside spoilers)...




NEW ADDITION
I took some time to google search for the Manual for your Panasonic P50ST50k 50" Plasma 3DTV but unfortunately cannot find it. It seems difficult to find your Asia model. Maybe I did not search correctly, hehe.

What I did find out is that your TV specifications says that it have internal built-in decoders for "Dolby Digital Plus / Dolby Pulse / DTS 2.0+Digital Out" which means similar decoders specs as my Samsung HDTV.

If I guess correctly, then your TV will also receive the audio from HDMI and then output to its "Optical Out" as Dolby 2.0 only, so no Dolby 5.1. I can NOT be 100% sure without your TV actual Manual.

This post has been edited by jamesleetech: Jul 6 2012, 09:20 PM

It seems new Software Version 7.0 for Byond (Non PVR) and Version 7.0s for Byond PVR have test Interactive Features which uses our broadband internet connection. I think not available for the old Asto DMT decoder boxes.

Can be any channel (SD or HD).

Use the Remote Control buttons.

1) Press the OK button.

2) Press the Apps button.

NO Broadband Internet Connection

You will see this (inside spoilers) ...

With Broadband Internet Connection (Streamyx)

Now use a network cable to connect the Byond/Byond PVR network port to the broadband Modem Router. Make sure the broadband is online.

Do the same thing with the Remote Control buttons, OK and Apps.

No more "Website cannot be found" and is replaced with the following screenshots below. Actually the size is a bit small so I have to put my phone camera near to my TV top-left screen to take snapshots.

Screenshot 1
This is the first "Interactive Screen" that appeared which shows "Service Not Available Currently". Do NOT exit yet and continue reading.

Screenshot 2
Press the 1 button and the weird message "no key pressed yet" appears.

Now, press the Back button once to return to previous screen. Continue reading...


Screenshot 3
Now press the 2 button and the "Twitter" screen appears. Cannot make any tweets yet.

Now, press the Back button once to return to previous screen. Continue reading...

Screenshot 4
Now press the 3 button BUT nothing happens !

Next, press the 4 button and the "League Selection" screen is displayed.


Screenshot 5
You can use the remote arrows to move between the 4 footbal leagues. I selected "Barclays PL" and pressed OK button and the "Standings" screen appeared. This shows the latest points obtained by different teams.

Screenshot 6
Then I pressed OK button and the latest match results appeared.

Nothing happens for the rest of the other numbered buttons (0,2,5,6,7,8,9). For now, only buttons 2 and 4 have test application screens.

I don't know what "Apps" will actually be launched in future. Will any "chosen Apps" be useful or useless for subscribers ? Will Astro only continue to test and test and then disappear later with "Apps" totally cancelled ??

Is it really useful to "tweet" using Byond ? Will the Byond USB Port be changed to allow us to connect USB keyboard and mouse... and if NOT, then using the Byond Remote to type and for movement (without mouse) will be terrible !

This post has been edited by jamesleetech: Jul 7 2012, 03:44 AM

According to what I read from your comments here, it is PARTLY correct to say that the Byond PQ become so bad without using the Yamaha AV Amplifier for the 2nd Byond decoder in another room/main room/hall.

This is what I understood from your comments here so please correct me if I am wrong...

a) Have 2 Byond boxes. 1st Byond in your room and 2nd Byond in another room/main room/hall.
b) Tested with your 46in LCD TV on 1st Byond with connection through Yamaha AVR.
c) Took the same 46in LCD TV to 2nd Byond and connect so no Yamaha AVR.

Since you used HDMI connections for BOTH your Byonds, why take the trouble to temporarily move your TV to the 2nd Byond to test ? Just test using the 1st Byond. First test with Byond >> to Yamaha >> then to HDTV. Then second test with Byond >> direct to HDTV. You can test this same way without "moving" your 46in LCD TV to the 2nd Byond box in another location.

Mmm... unless you tell me that the 2nd decoder is the Old Astro DMT box, not Byond, so of course the PQ from the old Astro DMT box is terrible ! If true, its not correct to make comparisons between the Byond box and the old Astro DMT box.

If you used only HDMI connections to test compare, its only PARTLY correct to say that your Yamaha AVR improved the PQ a lot by "upscaling" the SD channels.

Video Scaling
Refers to resolution used such as 576p (852 x 576 px 4:3), 720p (1280 x 720 16:9) and 1080i (1920 x 1080 16:9) for Byond. Actually 576p is generally not regarded as HD and the 852 pixels may be slightly different for different video standards.

Video "Upscaling" means changing from lower to higher resolution which may include changing from 50Hz to 60Hz. Example... Upscale 720p original video ratio to 1080i resolution. I think (not sure) that upscaling can also occur from the source player (such as the Blu-Ray player, Byond, etc) when the source player setting is changed.

Video Processing
Refers to the video processing by different video processor chips. The processing includes controlling the Brightness, Contrast, Colour, Sharpness, White Balance, Colour Space, Gamma, Black Tone Levels, and others. The better the quality of such processors the better the PQ and the higher end ones also allow users much more control to adjust the settings. Because of the wrong factory adjustments and lower quality video processor chip used in many budget HDTVs, this is where the Professional Calibration person come in, who used specialised devices to fine-tune the HDTV to achieve the best optimum PQ. One among many video calibrator devices used is the Spyder4Pro which I really don't know whether it is the best or not. Hehe... to "Anfieldude"... did I make any mistakes here ?

Here is the interesting thing about the Yamaha AV Receiver Amplifiers which have HDMI... I am quite sure that almost ALL such Yamahas do NOT upscale any video connected to its HDMI Input. My present 2 Yamaha AVRs are the 3rd and 4th ones after replacing the previous ones. My Yamaha AVR Manual definitely states this clearly.

You can test whether your Yamaha AVR actually "upscale" the video or not... just by looking at your HDTV display Info.

I am absolutely sure for my Yamaha AVRs, RXV-1900 and RXV-3900. Here was what I did. Byond HDMI out to Yamaha... then from Yamaha HDMI out to my Samsung HDTV.

On my Samsung HDTV Remote, there is an "INFO" button which when pressed, will display on the TV screen the Video Resolution received from its own inputs.

With my Yamaha HDMI Output still connected to my Samsung HDTV, I then changed my Byond HD Settings to test...

1) Byond 576p setting... my TV info shows 720 X 576 @ 50 Hz.
2) Byond 720p setting... my TV info shows 1280 x 720 @ 50 Hz.
3) Byond 1080i setting... my TV info shows 1920 x 1080i @ 50 Hz.

* 50 Hz because our Malaysian TV system is PAL.

As you can see, there is absolutely NO UPSCALING from the Yamaha AVR when HDMI is used (from Byond HDMI to Yamaha). IF there is any upscaling, all three Byond settings will show on my Samsung HDTV as only 1920 x 1080i @ 50 Hz BUT its not.

So, part of your comment "was on assto thru Yamahaa avr which upscaled the feed and PQ on LCD seemed okay" should be corrected to "was on Byond which feed HDMI to Yamaha with better internal Video Processor improved the PQ which seemed okay".

I do understand what you mean about the Yamaha which improved the PQ. My Yamaha have the Anchor Bay video processor chip and Burr-Brown audio processor chip. It seems the Marvel QDeo Video Chip used for my Oppo BDP-93 is much better than Anchor Bay. Denon AVR usually used Audyssey Video Chip.

I admit that I am a bit picky on the "upscale" word that you used to describe PQ improvement. PQ Improvement is NOT because of "upscaling" from HDMI. Actually the Yamaha video processor chip do improve the PQ slightly because of better noise reduction, colour interpolation, etc.

My apologies if I have offended you.

I can suggest that you can test with Component Video (Red, Green Blue) connection to see if your Yamaha improve the PQ for upscaling from Byond 576p to 1080p. Test using only the Byond "HD Setting" at 576p. First test, connect Byond Comp Vid directly to HDTV. Second test, connect Byond Comp Vid to your Yamaha AVR, then from Yamaha HDMI out to HDTV... your Yamaha will now definitely upscale the Comp Video Input to HDMI Output as 1080p. Must make sure your Yamaha internal settings set to (1) Video Converter... ON (2) Component I/P... ON (3) HDMI Resolution... 1080p so correct it if necessary. Now, at least you can make a more fair comparison of upscaling improvememt to PQ.

Actually I don't know what cable connections you used for your PQ tests so I assumed you tested with HDMI connections only.



EDIT : Corrected some parts to remove repeated explanations and to make it more clear, hehe.

This post has been edited by jamesleetech: Jul 8 2012, 10:33 PM

I stand corrected because different AVRs either have or do not have video upscaling on its HDMI input. I am aware of that. So this depends on... different AVR brands and models... budget or high-end AVRs... and older or latest models. For example, it is probably true for the higher-end Yamaha Aventage A3010. I cannot check each and every different models and brands, old or latest models included.

Because Smileguy only mentioned that he used a Yamaha AVR without stating the model, I think readers here need better clarification that not all AVRs do upscaling from HDMI connection so this was why I posted my previous explanations here... and this was why I requested Smileguy to retest and check his HDTV display Info as I had described and outlined earlier. I did not deny that better upscaling capability will give some measure of picture quality improvement... and by how much will depend on each different AVRs. I have always accepted that Smileguy have the right to give his opinions on whether his AVR improved the PQ due to video upscaling. Since I don't know which Yamaha model he used, my earliear explanation was merely to make sure that his AVR have or don't have HDMI upscaling from HDMI Input. This was why I mentioned the tests from my Yamaha RXV-1900 and RXV-3900.

I do not dispute and will not disagree with Smileguy's opinion that his Yamaha AVR "upscaling" improve the PQ of Byond a lot BUT this is not correct IF his AVR do NOT upscale from HDMI input, and HDMI connections were used. My earler suggestion was to make sure "HDMI to HDMI upscaling" is available for his Yamaha AVR in order to be more accurate before giving his respected opinions on PQ.

By the way, better video upscaling for better PQ will depend on the quality of the AVR Video Scalar chip used, so, as I have mentioned before, will improve the PQ of Byond (for HDMI connection) but how much improvement will ultimately depend on which Video Scalar chip in the AVR. Hehe... which Video Scalar chip is better... for my opinion only... I have to see with my own eyes to compare.

Ultimately, its the AVR Video Scalar Chip that determines the improvement of PQ from Byond because that scalar chip handles the upscaling, resolution interpolation, etc. Therefore, its not correct to only mention that "upscaling" improved the PQ, it should be corrected to mention that its the combination of the AVR Video Scalar and Video Processor Chips which improved the PQ and which I, of course, do agree.

Appreciated your feedback and correction.

EDIT : Made a mistake again... I did a quick google check. There are Video Scalar Chips such as the Silicon Image Products - ABT1015 Video Scaling Chip which handles upscaling. So better AVR Video Scalar Chip do affect the PQ too. I corrected parts of my above reply to mention the Scalar chip. One thing I am not sure is whether its possible for the Video Processor Chip to handle the upscaling if no Video Scalar Chip is used.

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LATER ADDITION 09-07-2012
I am continuing my comments on AVR video processing because its related to improving the Byond PQ. My apologies if I may seem to be out-of-topic here.

Phew ! Its seems I have forgotten about my Yamaha RX-V3900 AVR specifications because I have been using it for so long. This is always connected to a blu-ray player which don't need any HDMI upscaling, hehe.

Getting too long so the rest of my explanations inside spoilers...

I repeat... if Smileguy Yamaha AVR video processor chip cannot handle upscaling from HDMI Input, then he cannot use HDMI to HDMI to test upscaling.

Hehe... sometimes when I try to help others with what I know, I also learn from my mistakes by doing more digging for info and "research".

This post has been edited by jamesleetech: Jul 9 2012, 05:21 AM

If you are refering to my two Yamaha AVRs.. then yes, video upscaling is available for both AVRs. Difference is... the RX-V1900 cannot upscale from HDMI to HDMI, can for RCA/Component Video to HDMI... and the RX-V3900 can upscale for all connections. Please refer to my "Later Addition 09-07-2012" above your post.

If Smileguy's Yamaha AVR video processor chip cannot handle HDMI to HDMI video upscaling, then such tests is not possible.

This post has been edited by jamesleetech: Jul 9 2012, 05:14 AM

Here is what you need to do...

1) Check whether the satellite cable connecting to your Byond is loose or not. If very loose, try to tighten it.

2) Check signal strength to your Byond. Use Remote, press HOME button. Select "Settings" and press OK. Go down to "Installation Settings" (below IP Diagnostics) and press OK. Enter 0 button four times for the PIN and press OK. "Satellite Settings" already selected, just press OK. Already at "Universal", just press OK. Already at Entry Point, for mine is "18 MEASAT 3A(VH)" but yours may be different so do NOT change anything, just press OK. The Signal Strength is shown. For my Byond is about 215 but I think for Byond PVR is lower, about 180, I think. If the signal strength is very very low at about 80 or if completely zero, then I suspect that your LNB device at the dish may have changed position causing mis-alignment so cannot receive satellite signal or receive poor signal. I do know and have heard that MANY idiot installers did NOT tighten the LNB holder... so after heavy rain (especially strong winds), the LNB may have moved direction so re-alignment is needed. If this is the issue, then call Astro Customer Support.

I don't know whether you are using Byond PVR or not but according to my friend (also an Astro installer), quite a lot of Byond PVRs got problems or spoilt after some time, because of internal harddisk, overheat, chipset problem, etc. Don't worry... the Byond and Byond PVR is under warranty until the Astro subscription is cancelled so it will be replaced FOC if got problem.

In many of my previous replies here, I did advise people here that the best person who can help you is to phone to Astro Customer Support which only cost a local call from land-lines (toll-Free but not for mobile phone call).

Do the simple checks I mentioned above first and if cannot fix your problem, hehe... call the Ghostbusters at Astro lah.

Sorry if I cannot offer more help.

ADDITION
If LNB mis-alignment, absolutely make sure the person who comes to your place REALLY TIGHTEN the LNB clamp holder to the pole after re-alignment !! Hehe... one of my friend told me that his satellite cable drop off from the LNB after strong winds during a heavy thunderstorm, LOL !!

This post has been edited by jamesleetech: Jul 10 2012, 09:31 AM

Mmm ??? I am not sure but I think 85-90 is not high. Mine is 210 now. Higher number means better signal strength.

CORRECTION
If you say you got 85-90 % is from looking at the yellow bar indicator, then the signal is strong. For me, I look for the signal strength from the "Signal Level" number.

Don't do the LNB alignment yourself. Its risky to climb to the roof yourself. Call Astro Customer Support and explain your problem. The support person may ask you some questions and request you to check "this and that" and he/she will know if your signal is strong or not. Whether its the LNB alignment or not, they will file in your report that you cannot receive any channels and send a technician (usually an installer) to your place to check and fix your problem. Mmm... maybe the support person will also try to "re-activate or remote reboot" your Byond box.

Oh... almost forgot... did you try to completely switch off power to your Byond, not standby, wait a few minutes and then switch on again... don't touch anything and wait for it to reboot until the time display appears... then check if you can receive the channels.



Note... signal strength shown by the yellow/white bar indicator (00 20 40 60 80 100) is for percentage... also look for the words "Signal Level" which also shows the signal strength.

EDIT : Made some corrections.

This post has been edited by jamesleetech: Jul 10 2012, 10:07 AM

Mmm... why charge RM 40 ??

If I am not mistaken, your Byond was only installed recently... correct ? If yes, I think its not right to charge you IF your problem was caused by their lousy installer bad installation such as "did not tighten the LNB clamp holder". My opinion is that you should not let Ass..teruk bully you and complain to Ass..tuk that they should not charge you for their bad installation. There is also a possibility that its not the installation or LNB alignment because it can also be the Byond is spoilt which is under warranty, and service is FOC !! How could Ass.tuk know your actual problem before your problem is fixed... so... that Ass.tuk support person should also inform you that there will be NO charge if your Byond is spoilt !!

I don't know everything and I am not sure BUT is this a new Ass..teruk policy to rob subscribers $$ ?? Maybe I am still sleeping but I have not heard of this before. Previously, 2 of my friends was not charged a single cent when their defective decoder boxes were replaced. Am I wrong here ? I really don't know what's going on !

I could be wrong but I just want you to make sure that they don't "simply" charge you, hehe.

Yes... moving the dish to a lower and easier to access location is a good decision. I have often advised many of my friends to install the dish to such lower easily accessed locations and in fact any place which don't have anything blocking the above facing direction. In fact, moving away from the roof area will possibly reduce the chances of it getting hit by lightning strike !! I know it sounds a bit ridiculous... can even install the dish on the ground but nobody will do that !!

This post has been edited by jamesleetech: Jul 10 2012, 01:52 PM

When they later fixed your problem and IF found out that its not your fault and caused by the installer previous installation job or Byond found to be faulty... then you should not pay a single cent ! Even any normal new product purchase got 1 year warranty with free repairs and service... and Ass.teruk also tied you to 1 year contract so its NOT fair to charge you IF it is not caused by your fault !!

I can only give you my opinion so only you can decide what to do for your issue... therefore I am not able to help you further, hehe.

Yes ! This is exactly what I meant when I mentioned "...Byond found to be faulty... then you should not pay a single cent !" because the Byond box will always be under warranty with free replacement or repairs until the day we cancelled subscription. This is because Ass.teruk terms and conditions is to provide subscribers with the decoder box to receive Astro satellite channels, the Byond/Byond PVR box is NOT sold to subscribers, something like "rental". I think that only the previous very old Astro DMT before year 2000 was bought and subscribers own it but I am not sure about others. When Astro was launched in 1996, I bought my (now ancient) Philips DMT box for about RM 1400 and it has been replaced with a later model for free.

Who knows ?... I am just guessing... maybe later they will give excuse by using "on-site service charge" for sending technician to come to our location, LOL, and maybe say that the free Byond box replacement, spare-parts replacement, repairs plus servicing of the Byond box is different. Hehe... notice the word "servicing" which is only just playing with words and assumed all subscribers as being stupid ! Maybe for them, the FREE "servicing" word means "the service work" for opening the Byond box casing, clean out dust and dirt, remove oxidation of internal contact connections and then "menggosok semua bahagian didalam Byond sampai berkilat-kilat dan berkilau-kilauan seperti gigi kami selepas digosok dengan C*lgate ubat gigi" !

This post has been edited by jamesleetech: Jul 10 2012, 04:45 PM

Hi !

Either you have some difficulty in explaining to us here or confused, probably caused by too many people giving too many different advice to you. No problem. Maybe I am the only one who did not understand you properly, hehe.

Anyway, eventhough I did explain here before, I have some points or opinions which I wish to let you know.

Astro recording services CAN record from both SD and HD channels. Even without subscribing to Astro "HD Service", we can still record from just SD channels by using either one of the two Byond boxes... Byond box or the Byond PVR box.

A bit of confusion from the acronym "PVR" which can mean either "Personal Video Recorder" which refers to the decoder box OR "Personal Video Recording" which refers to the recording function/ability.

When you say "wanna to install astro beyond PVR", are you referring to the recording service or the actual Byond PVR box ?

Ok... please correct me if I am wrong so this is what I "think" you have explained...

a) Presently you are using the old Astro DMT decoder box which can only receive SD channels and totally cannot do recording.

b) You planned to upgrade to the Byond PVR box (already with built-in harddisk) but found out that it needs TWO satellite cables to connect to LNB at dish. Because you only have 1 cable that is already laid "in-wall", you don't want to use 2nd cable because of problems hiding it on the walls ! So... you decide NOT to upgrade to Byond PVR box.

c) You have now decided to upgrade to Byond box and you knew that Byond PVR EASi is needed but worry that it may be out-of-stock. Just in case no stock, you want to know what other independent external USB hardddisk brand and model that is compatible.

I do not know whether you have upgraded your box or not. So I am guessing that you have NOT upgraded yet and planning to do it later. Therefore, I would like you to be clear about a few things first which may affect your decision.

Below are more info for you which you may have missed...

The Byond PVR box
Have internal 500 GB harddisk so no need to spend extra $$ to buy any external harddisk. Many more hours of recording when compared to the other Byond box. It can record 2 channels at the same time because it have 2 tuners so this is why it need 2 satellite cable connections ! Also have immediate rewind function such as rewind immediately to watch a footbal goal during a Live Telecast of a football match. BUT, don't let me scare you, I have heard from so many cases here, actually happened to many of my friends and from an Astro installer that the Byond PVR don't last long... some got problems after only 1 month !

I may be wrong... I think most of the problems are... (1) the internal harddisk that cannot "tahan" the constant torture of continually recording non-stop for many many hours everyday because of the "fast, immediate rewind" function (Our PC harddisk together with smart "sleep" function have much much less torture because we don't save and read files on the harddisk non-stop continuously for many hours)... (2) its hotter so overheat, the internal fan is not enough and I have actually seen a few of my friends who put the Byond PVR inside beautiful cabinet below the HDTV and with glass door closed ! Not recommended because more ventilation needed (best if outside, open air)... (3) Byond PVR internal board and chip problem.

The Byond box
Well... you already knew that it have no internal harddisk and need Byond PVR EASi or Western Digital My Passport AV external harddisk BUT both are only 320 GB capacity. Aah... recording hours is therefore much less when compared to Byond PVR. It can record from ONLY 1 channel and no immediate rewind function.

Yes, I understood that you want recording BUT you can also record for SD channels eventhough did not subscribe to HD service. Is watching HD channels with great audio/video quality important for you ? If yes, then pay extra RM 20 per month for HD Service for people who did not subscribe to SuperPack.

So... if you think you want recording mostly for SD channels only and don't need to watch HD channels, then do NOT get HD service. You only cannot record from HD channels without HD Service.

Finally, if you have already upgraded and installed the Byond box, then a lot I have mentioned here do not have any useful purpose anymore. What is needed is just to buy the Byond PVR EASi box from Astro (should be RM 80, I think). One guy posted here previously that he searched everywhere, including from PC shops in Low Yat Plaza, and could not find the WD Passport AV for sale which I believe is no longer manufactured. Most nowadays are minimum 500GB ones. I believe you cannot use other capacities such as... 320GB from other brands or... 500GB/1TB capacities although I did not test it because I did not subscribe to Recording Service.

Don't worry about not able to get the Byond PVR EASi box, just tell the Astro Customer Support person and pretend to sound very unhappy that you already cannot find the WD Passport AV after searching everywhere, also complain its unfair to pay extra for Recording Service because its not your fault that the compatible harddisk is NOT available now... ahh... force them to find one PVR EASi for you... maybe only problem is waiting for a much longer time to get it, hehe, maybe 2 weeks or months ! Of course no need to wait if got stocks. I have 2 WD My Passport AV 320GB but its for my PC use and not for sale, hehehe.





This post has been edited by jamesleetech: Jul 11 2012, 09:23 PM

Please correct me if I am wrong because my answers depend on whether I understood you exactly.

You said that your wall have 3 different sockets. Do you mean that you have always used the TV socket to connect directly to your TV to watch the traditional analog Free-To-Air TV channels such as RTM and TV3... so now you cannot, probably because of broken commercial TV Aerial at rooftop or your TV socket with a broken cable connection. Therefore, the management will NOT repair any TV socket connections any more because they said that most people don't use the TV socket and many of them have already changed to the Satellite socket for Astro reception.

So, what you are asking is...

Will you be able to use the Satellite socket by directly connecting it to your TV ? The answer is a definite NO. You need a satellite receiver box connected to this socket but not any box... continue reading... will explain.

My common sense tells me that your condo already have installed the larger size commercial Astro Satellite Dish + LNB with additional equipment that is relayed to the connection at your wall Satellite socket.

There are thousands of satellites above our skies which include Satellite TV transmission. The MEASAT satellites for Astro TV reception are only part of them. Therefore, these satellites are in different locations. The few MEASAT satellites are position in "parallel" to each other so that we only need to position the dish and LNB to only one direction to receive Astro.

If the Satellite socket is already connected to Astro installation, then you can just subscribe to Astro, get their satellite receiver (Byond/Byond PVR box), plug it your TV, make changes to the receiver settings and that's it... nothing to do... sit and watch the Astro channels. Oh, I am not advertising for Astro lah.

The question is... what if you don't want to pay for Astro ? Hehe... everyone wants free, illegally if possible. Sssshhh.

So you are thinking IF you can use other "Satellite Receivers" for the Satellite socket ? Mmmm.... yes and no answer.

Thaicomm satellite and many other satellites are NOT in the same location in the skies and different location from the "Astro" MEASAT satellite. Firstly, you need to point the LNB + Dish at the correct direction to the satellte location in order to receive the proper signal for that particular satellite whose position is given as Longitude and Latitude.

Well, we can purchase Dreambox or Openbox receiver box to use with the Satellite socket to receive other Free-To-Air Satellite channels from other satellites. Yes you can but this will depend on whether any particular satellite you want to receive is or is not in the same location or near to MEASAT satellites. For example, if Thaicomm satellite is near to the MEASAT location, then using other receiver box will allow you to receive Thai satellite channels. Generally, the further away the satellite location from the MEASAT ones will possibly get you no signal, poor signal or good signal.

When your condo satellite dish + LNB is already pointing to the correct optimum direction to the MEASAT satellites, I know its impossible to ask your condo management to change the dish direction for other satellites just for you only OR they will never install a few more LNBs pointing at direction for the other satellites.

Generally speaking, satellite TV transmission broadcast on 2 different wavebands, KU Band and C Band. The Astro broadcast in KU Band so their receiver box have tuner that receive from this band only. Other satellites can choose to use the C Band so although most other receiver boxes can receive from both Bands, you need to be sure before purchasing other receiver box.

I believe that purchasing the Dreambox or Openbox receiver box is not illegal (unless smuggled in without paying any duties) BUT the ACT of using any other receiver to receive Astro subscription based satellite channels (without paying to Astro) by "bypassing" the encrpyted protection though various methods such as CCCam and internet unlock is NOT LEGAL. By the way, presently all the Astro HD channels still canot be received yet from such <blank> methods. Hehe... not proper for me to discuss this further so thats all I dare to mention.

In my opinion, I think it is ok and legal to use other receiver box to get Free-To-Air satellite channels from other satellites BUT the question is... is this possible for your condo ? Well... I have already answered you.

Finally, I believe you need to use a Satellite Receiver Box to connect to your Satellite socket... cannot direct connection to TV... and its up to you to choose whether you want to subscribe to Astro. If you decide yes, please be 100% sure from your condo management that the Astro satellite system is installed and connected to your Satellite socket.

Hope my explanation correctly answered your question.

Other people can correct any mistakes I make here or to add in more info. No problem.

ADDITION
By the way, I think you may also ask why you cannot connect the Satellite socket directly to your TV and then use its built-in Tuner (only have VHF and UHF) to search for the satellite channels. Nope ! Most TV only have built-in Analog Tuner. A few may have built-in Digital Tuner. I am quite sure that your TV tuner can only receive Analog Signals so you cannot receive any Digital Signal from the Satellite socket. So, you still need to have at least a Digital Tuner box with HDMI out, Component Video Out or whatever to use for the Satellite socket BUT you still cannot receive Astro TV channels in this way because the Astro signals are locked with encrypted protection. Why Astro used protection and smartcard... hehe... you already know why... Satellite Pay TV means pay $$ lah. The Satellite Receiver boxes already come with digital tuner but it must support KU/C Band which have very high frequencies. Example... FM Radio waveband between 88 MHz to 108 MHz... Astro satellite KU Band frequency is 9750 MHz (or 9.75 GHz) and 10600 MHz. Others can correct me if I stated the wrong frequencies or if not correct.

The day will come in the future (don't actually believe that it will be near) that the Malaysian analog terrestrial TV transmission will be closed and replaced with digital transmission. When that time comes, new TVs will have built-in digital Tuners... but for older ones with built-in Analog Tuners, a Digital Tuner box must be used between the Outdoor Aerial and your TV ! By that time, the freed Analog Waveband may be replaced with 4G use for mobile phones or wireless internet connectivity.

Now I got to find some more time to reply to pm received from 2 forumers here who asked me a few questions. No problem sharing what little I know and to try helping people who do send me pm questions...mmm...maybe a little bit late to reply some pm due to limited time I have.



This post has been edited by jamesleetech: Jul 13 2012, 01:44 AM

Well... you are right.

The 18 free TV channels should be enough, with 16 Astro In-House Channels and 2 from RTM (TV1 and TV2).

BUT... NO these 3 channels... TV3, NTV7 and TV9.

Mmm... I did think of suggesting NJOI to answer Atisha's question but I decided to "keep quiet" about it because I don't know whether Atisha will accept or will not accept the 3 "missing" TV channels.

On second thought... maybe I should have mentioned NJOI because got additional 16 channels + 2 (RTM) eventhough lost 3 (TV3, NTV7, TV9).

Well... just to let Atisha know about the 3 "missing" Free-To-Air TV Channels.

For everything about NJOI, refer here... "http://www.astro.com.my/njoi/"

Portion of NJOI FAQ here...
How much does the Njoi set-up cost?
The set-up, which comprises of a set-top box, Out-Door Unit (ODU) satellite dish, smartcard and remote control unit is available at a one-time payment of RM 288 at all Astro authorised retailers, with a standard installation fee of RM 100 from an Astro authorised installer.

Mmm... I am lazy to check... is it total one-time payment of RM 288 or RM 388 ?



ADDITION
Thanks for your suggestion to Atisha, which I did not mention before.

For other people here... sometimes I found that they have only basic questions about Astro so I would suggest that they refer to astro.com.my for more info because the answers are already there... only need to spend some time searching that Astro website, hehe.

This post has been edited by jamesleetech: Jul 13 2012, 04:42 PM

I am not sure but I believe that there are "Astro Authorised Retailers".

The first thing you need to do is check whether that shop have a signboard with the Astro logo and the words "Astro Authorised Retailer". If no such signboard, then ask the seller in that shop to show you the genuine "Astro Authorised Retailer" Certificate for proof. All such authorised retailers have such documents. If such certificate is not available or many excuses given, then politely walk away and forget it.

I do believe that all such authorised dealers/retailers are issued wth genuine certificate of proof which most shops will surely frame it and hung it on their wall, hehe. However, I cannot guarantee that such certificates is genuine or false, so be very careful about this.

So, in my personal opinion, the second thing you need to do to find out...

1) Write down the shop name and full address if possible.

2) Phone directly to Astro (1 300 82 3838 - 8am to 12 midnight), ask whether that shop is an Astro Authorised Retailer and also ask whether there is such "prepaid cards" available for sale.

I may be wrong because I personally have NOT heard of such "prepaid cards" BUT there is something very fishy here or something is not right.

In my opinion, I do NOT advice anyone to just simply purchase anything without first checking properly for the actual correct info.

You are smart in your decision to check first and have chosen to ask this question here which allowed me the opportunity to give my reply.

I did NOT say anything here that the shop you mentioned is selling false Astro prepaid cards. I honestly don't know if its true or not BUT I think that its best to check for info from the Astro website AND if not found there, then phone to Astro so that you will definitely get the actual 100% correct details about the "prepaid cards".

IF, I say IF, that shop is selling false illegal prepaid cards, phoning to Astro with the shop's details and reporting this matter will help to prevent other people from being cheated or conned when Astro take action.

By the way, as sky3742 have asked, have anyone here ever heard of such "Astro Prepaid Cards" that allows selected Astro TV Channels to be watched for 15 days ? Mmm... certainly I have not heard of it so I am totally blur on this.

I repeat... the best way to get the exact correct answer is to phone to Astro for clarification.



This post has been edited by jamesleetech: Jul 13 2012, 10:17 PM