Hi guys,
I am going to hack off tiles and re-allocate the water piping, I am thinking to isolate the "instant water heater" at the top left of the shower area and concealed the pipe inside the wall.

The water piping will be just like the storage water heater. i.e. Shower/bath set (rainshower head will be smaller size) directly plug into the wall.

Is this feasible for instant water heater, anyone done that before?

How you want to adjust the temperature?

The setup should same like this:

http://www.beebest.com.my/product_multipoi...ter_heater.html

I guess instant water heater doesn't need a mixer. So, just need direct the instant water heater output all the way to the shower head. (concealed)

Alternately, use the external shower set . i.e. the cabana brand from
http://forum.lowyat.net/topic/1607783

which setup is better?

This post has been edited by upman: Aug 23 2011, 04:26 PM

Up to you...both way also can. u just need to conceal the copper pipe not the normal pvc pipe.

i plan use external shower set b4, end up i separate the rain shower and water heater....

It need the following power

Power Rating : 4.5, 6.0, 7.0, 8.0, 9.0Kw

You know how many Amps for 4.5KWA? That is putting normal socket wire to threshold.

I have done this arrangement for my previous house's down stair bath. This arrangement requires some hacking of the existing wall tiles and additional piping work. Basically what I did was to hack and connect out the section between the stop cock & the shower outlet.
The water after the stop cock will go into the instant heater's inlet (cold) and then the instant heater's outlet (hot) will connect back to the existing pipe and water will come out from the shower head above.
You can control the water using either the stop cock (ex) or the stop cock on the heater.

For my current ground floor bath, I decided not to do any hacking. Thus I am using the adjustable shower directly from the water heater. Water is still control from the ex stop cock.

getting an exposed unit like the cabana set would reduce ur headache and better for the long run as anything goes wrong, u can have an option to use back hand shower or change the unit. Conceal is definitely nicer but will incur addition $$. If u r planning to do conceal, i would strongly advise u to get a storage heater and a mixer

depends on the nearest location you can locate the storage water heater. If the available location is far away and too much of hacking work involved.... will cost lots of $$$

cost me 1.5k for 2 bath room on first floor. Will cost me extra 2k if want to connect the ground floor copper / stainless steel pipe. So minimal need to pay around 4k+ include plaster

if you are doing major reno work in the house (plus not moved in yet) the OK. Else with all the hacking plus dust, nightmare

In Singapore, i see some HDB owner install copper pipe without conceal, could be by law (not sure), but if the workmanship is good, it don't look too bad lah.

cos in HDB apartments, the walls are structural walls. Thus hacking is not allowed

yea, even the wiring also use pvc trunking not allow to conceal compare to malaysia condo.

I think before the cast the block, each owner are ask any extra points and type of point.

Exactly what I'm planing to do with two of my bathrooms.

How much did that cost U?

Which method are you referring to?
Anyway, both methods cost very minimal for me. Most of the connection works DIY.

Inlet and outlet of the instant water heater connected between the outlet of stop cock and inlet of shower head respectively therefore U can use hot shower from the existing shower head and control the temperature of water from the instant water heater.

Hacking on the wall needs to be done, U DIY?

Hacking and reinstate wall tiles get tiler to do la...
Install water heater and the piping reconnection can DIY what.... not rocket science...

My common bathroom is using this setup too. There's 1 challenge in this design as the heating cut off is triggered differently between storage tank type & instant water heater type.

For storage tank, the heating is cut off by the temperature of the water in the storage. For instant water heater, it is by both the water temperature & the water pressure.

For instant water heater type, I've seen that some are triggered by only water temperature & switch, whereby the switch controls both the on/off for heating as well as the water flow mechanically. If your instant water heater is this type, I'm afraid you won't be able to implement the mixer design.
For the other instant water heater design, the heating only begins when it detect flow & stops when the flow stops or the temperature reaches more than the 'set' temperature.

Means get tiler to hack the wall, do the DIY piping works, and then get the tiler to reinstall the tiles?

Do you have spare tiles?

No sir. Thts y I have put into account the dificulty to get the similar tile, which is another hassle.

Does this job needs to be done by two contractors? I mean plumber and tiler?

I'm really keen of getting this job done, but currently having difficulty to find contractor with good workmanship.

What I did was to hack the tiles and make the modification to the piping. Then get the tiler to reinstate the wall tiles.
BTW, I am not using the cold & hot mixer for this bathroom.

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Added on November 2, 2011, 8:30 amIt is to be expected to have the tiles with some slight colour variation. It will depends on how particular on this.
If you can get the right plumber, he may be able to reinstate the few pieces of wall tiles for you. You have to source for the tiles yourself.


This post has been edited by kelvyn: Nov 2 2011, 08:30 AM

R U refering the cold & hot mixer to shower with two outlet of hot water and cold water? Those typically seen in hotels.

I'll be using only individual instant hot shower system for each of my bathroom, as said it will be joint between the outlet of the stop cock and the inlet of the shower head scured to the concrete wall. Water temperature will be controlled by the thermostat of the water heater.

But how can I find out how is the orientation/layout of those concealed pipings since they cannot bee seen externally? What tools do I need if I choose to DIY?

Grinder + diamond cutter blade, + rotary hammer. If you want to do it fast. And some cement skill, maybe tiling skill if you want to try.

If you don't have the tool, a metal chisel and mid size hammer with lots of patient. I did that to hide my current room a/c wires.

Wou, seems like many DIY gurus here.

U bought those tools only for this job? I feel like DIY too, but lack of power tools. I only have a electric powered drill.

Just brought the rotary hammer, got a china grinder. Going to buy a variable speed grinder to polish my concrete top.

Generally the conceal water piping will be in a straight line between the stop cock and the outlet for the shower.
As for the tools, weikee has already elaborate.

There is another alternative which does not require the hack the existing wall tiles.
However, you will need to accept the fact of having an exposed piping. This way, all you need is to install the install water heater and make the connections. Can be easily done DIY or get the shop selling you the water heater to install for you.

Or runyour piping from the back of your wall, only if that wall is not belong to your neighbour. Just a suggestion.

Assuming that the wall in question is one of your internal walls.
You will still need to hack to access the existing water piping. Doing that already involve damaging the existing bathroom wall tiles. Since you are already at that, it would be easier and lesser disruptive to localise the work within the bathroom only.

Unfortunately, aesthetic is my concern too.

In that case, just get a plumber to reroute the necessary piping. He will hack the necessary wall tiles.
Then get the tiler to replace the wall tiles.

If you place is quite new, should be able to get the wall tiles.

So, if I already have a storage heater with concealed piping and mixer, can I replace it with this unit? My electricity bill is rather high and I have been looking at ways to reduce the bill from heating elements.

p/s : Why is everybody spelling this wrong? It is STOP CORK not STOP COCK

This post has been edited by matthewctj: Nov 4 2011, 12:25 PM

Off it when you not using, should be ok. On it few mins before take bath.

Sorry dude...

The correct spelling should be STOP COCK, which is is a valve used to restrict or isolate the flow of a liquid or gas through a pipe (refer to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stopcock )

While a stop cork is this

Darn it ... and I always thought everyone was being a pervert lol ... *places paper bag over head*

Storage heater problem is, it boil unneccessary extra hot water if you only have 1-2 person using. That waste power.

Unless you can adjust how many liter you want to boil.

This post has been edited by ozak: Nov 4 2011, 05:22 PM

It's a new property actually. I have actually found exactly the same wall tile. Juz need to find out how much do I need tp pay for this type of work (plumbing and concealing work with installation of tiles, not including the tiles). Any idea?

The work is not much. Plumbing work is just a few hours. Maybe plumber will charge for one day's work.
Tiler's work also not much. Maybe charge also one day's work.
The problem is to get them to do these work. It is now towards the end of year. Most of them will be hard press to finish their work on hand. So, may be reluctant to take on minor jobs.
If you managed to get any, they may change extra....
Anyway, where is your place located? Klang valley?

The new hse is actually a condo in Sentul.

anybody who done this setup whr instant heater with conceal piping for the rain shower head, do u face any drop in water pressure?

isit sufficient pressure for the rain shower head without any external water pump?

have anyone done this together with an additional hand shower?

It very much depend on your incoming water pressure. You can try install the instant heater and conceal pipe first. If pressure not enough, than put in the pump.

wats the min water pressure leve/ratingl should i see and check with my plumber before proceeding

Check your rain shower head spec. Not your instant heater.

Rain shower Head specs??

If I will to buy a square 10" rain shower, I need to ask the seller whether its compatible with instant heater or how shud I check?

Quite confuse in this

10", i don't think the instant water heater pump can give good water pressure, unless the incoming pressure is already good. Than again, if it flow too fast the water may not be warm enough.

Here is a video of I70P with 10" rain shower

Since you know what is water pressure, just ask what is the recommended or minimum water pressure for the 10" rain shower head to work. 10" require higher pressure than 8" or 6" to work. Simply because of number of nozzle.

Either they will tell you need 40-60psi or flow rate of 9l/m. (example) if they tell you anything will do or don't no, better walk out from that shop.

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Added on November 20, 2011, 8:48 amThe pump water heater can't handle the 10" shower head or even 6". Even a small but high flow rate shower head have problem too.

What he require is external pump to instant heater to 10" shower head. But as you said, flow to fast water not warm enough. He got to find a better water heater.

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Added on November 20, 2011, 8:54 amNot bad already that 10" rain shower head. Still can work. Did the instant heater with the pump?

This post has been edited by ozak: Nov 20 2011, 08:54 AM

that is Joven I70P with built in Silent pump + inverter

so the "on" "off" that fella said is actually turning on and off for the I70P rite?

What this means is, the larger the size of the rain shower head, the higher the water pressure required. This is because, the water must be able to fill the rain shower head quickly in order to get a nice steady stream of water. You don't want to experience only the middle part of the rain shower head coming out water.

I will be using a 10" rain shower head as well and I installed a water pump to ensure that the water pressure is nice and steady. Want it to rain and not just drizzle mar.

this is what im planning to do.. to conceal inlet & outlet piping of the water heater.. got few questions:

1) does the outlet portion need to be replaced with copper piping?

2) usually the water heater pump will stop if to water flowing right? coz i will use main stop cock only.

3) do i need to place the water heater unit higher than shower head?

Exactly what I'm going to do to my two bathrooms. Actually the hardest part is not the piping, but the concrete and tiling works since job involves hacking, buying matching tiles, and tile installation which would cause U more than the plumbing work.

I thot no many ppl would want this type of layout, but seems like I'm not alone

Currently having difficulty finding a good tiler.