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 Credit Card v16, Ask general questions here, Please read the 1st post before posting!

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FastCoder
post Sep 26 2011, 12:02 AM

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QUOTE(cute_boboi @ Sep 22 2011, 10:17 AM)
On average, 41 are declared bankrupt every day, mostly due to credit card debts
That's not true.

Credit cards are not the top contributor to bankruptcy. Car loans are the biggest culprit at 24%, followed by personal loans at 12% and business loans and 11%. I read somewhere credit cards defaulters comprise of around 5% of all bankrupts.

Click the link below:
Car loan takers top bankruptcy list

Many people take car loans without realizing that the affordable monthly repayments are probably just around 33% of the total cost of owning a car.


FastCoder
post Sep 26 2011, 12:31 PM

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QUOTE(Gen-X @ Sep 26 2011, 09:35 AM)
Thanks for the above info. I was just about to post my latest article when I read your post. So added few comments to my article.
Click here to read my latest article titled Credit Cards - App iPhone & Android, Easy Cash and Bankruptcy.

In the above  article I commented on ppfoong's App called Credit Card Calculator on my android tablet and RHB Easy Cash where you can get cash deposited into your RHB CASA. While writing the article, it made me realized that one may even pay less interest with cash advances with credit cards instead of going with Personal Loans  rclxub.gif And as usual, got me telling story from my sick imagination.
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From today's Star, the AKPK commented on yesterday's article:

Married folk and males the main debtors, reveals agency

From the article, AKPK confirmed that those who seek their help based on credit card debts only is low, compared to those with mortgage, hire purchase plus credit card debts.

It's easy to blame credit cards for all our debt woes but statistics proved otherwise.

I think the start of all our problems is probably the car loan because it is highly unlikely that we got our first property mortgage before a car loan.

Nowadays, so many young people won't hesitate to take a 9-year car loan even though they can ill-afford it. A RM600 per month instalment may seem to be manageable for a person with RM2500 monthly salary, but the total cost of ownership may come to be around RM1800 per month when you count petrol, maintenance and repaairs, insurance, parking and toll. The credit card used in paying for all those expenses is just a financing tool, because the actual culprit is the car itself, even though the credit card interests may be quite heavy.

Does it make sense to pay RM1800 per month for the privilege of travelling alone in your own air-conditioned comfort, compared to RM40 to RM150 per month on a bus or train pass?


FastCoder
post Sep 26 2011, 03:33 PM

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QUOTE(hye @ Sep 26 2011, 02:06 PM)
@FastCoder

Since this subject is fast becoming a discussion then look again. The articles mentioned those who approached AKPK help and credit card owners is only 8.8% only. Those being declared bankrupt is a from another list altogether and the actual number's / statistics are not mentioned in detail - so to use that as your basis of proof would be inconclusive because you are not working with comparable values in the first place.

The real issue here is unmanageable household debt which many people living in the big cities are unable to cope with. Many make decisions to buy something not understanding the long term impact. While car loans owners can be a factor but credit card owners I believe are the larger culprit as well as it covers a wider ranger of the population. (Using Google - it will give you 3.2 million card holders based on 2010 statistics) The seniors here have been following this thread for years (myself included) and we have seen many chasing after this easy unsecured credit facility like hell.

To me it has nothing to do with bank's easy application, huge CL, etc - it boils down to the card holder itself who does not understand financial control and treating credit limit like real cash. And like the issue you raise (thank you ... at least you have some appreciation just by virtue of raising the subject), the problem lies in the population refusing to think long term and understanding good financial management.
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Car loan takers top bankruptcy list
Married folk and males the main debtors, reveals agency

Well, what can we get from the 2 artitles? Those were official statements, not an opinion, unlike the yesterday's Star article.

1. Top bankruptcy cause - car loans NOT CREDIT CARD DEBT
2. Top reason to seek help from AKPK - mortgage and car loans NOT CREDIT CARD DEBT

So, isn't that proof enough that the biggest cause of bankruptcy is NOT CREDIT CARD DEBT?

I used to believed that credit cards were the biggest culprits, but now I don't because my finances are in much better shape now that I don't drive that often and no more car loans. I can afford to go on holidays and buy the latest consumer gadgets and don't have any credit card debt. Compare to the days when I have a new car, my credit card debts were terribly high and I couldn't afford to go on holidays or buy the latest consumer gadgets. Even though I have settled my car loans many, many years ago, I have decided not to buy a new car as well as not to use the car that often and chose to travel by bus and lrt instead.

From my own calculations, I think I can afford to go on a Bali, Bangkok or Singapore holiday or buy a smart phone or laptop every month with cash, if I don't buy a new car. rclxm9.gif


FastCoder
post Sep 26 2011, 05:58 PM

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QUOTE(hye @ Sep 26 2011, 04:43 PM)
@fastcoder

Perhaps you misunderstood me ... I mentioned the main problem is the population itself / people. I believe the root cause is actually poor financial planning.
What you highlighted is a cause but addressing it will not solve the larger (and real) problem itself. You have to look at the root cause of the problem.

Let's end the debate ya (once and for all) ... this is a thread focusing on credit card after all.
I think the root cause is poor financial literacy, not poor financial planning, although they both sounds similar. Low financial literacy leads to poor or no financial planning.

Many people think that their 3% to 4% hire-purchase interest rate is low. That's financial illiteracy because the real effective interest rate is very high. That wrong perception is why so many people fell for the personal loan traps too.

Many people think that buying a nice big house that is located far away from the city center at a very attractive price to be a very good investment. To me that's penny-wise, pound-foolish because just a few years' cost of commuting is more than enough to offset the "cheaper" price of the house, on top wasting valuable years of one's life commuting long distances. Unfortunately, many still make this kind of mistake which doomed many to long-term debt servitude.

Choosing the place to stay is as important as choosing the place to work. For example, a fresh graduate may be able to save 1 to 2 thousand ringgit per month by renting a room in an apartment near a LRT station and commute to work with the LRT to a work place near another LRT station. Choosing to work with lousy public transportation service for extra RM300 to RM500 per month is not a good idea because you need to spend up to RM2000 on your own car transportation. Again, this kind of bad decision is surprisingly widespread.

The original aim of my posting was to dispel the myth that credit cards are the biggest culprits. I think I have said enough, and yes, we should end this debate.
FastCoder
post Oct 22 2011, 02:09 PM

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QUOTE(jeff_ckf @ Oct 22 2011, 11:13 AM)
Hi guys, recently I got a letter from Citibank to update my income record with them due to the new regulations by BNM on card holders with 3k income or less. With that in mind, I was wondering what will happen to card holders who are retirees like my dad? Any idea what will happen to his cards and credit limit? Technically he has zero income now tongue.gif
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Can you tell us what kind of information did they requested?

Did they request any kind of document to be submitted?


FastCoder
post Oct 22 2011, 05:30 PM

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QUOTE(jeff_ckf @ Oct 22 2011, 04:24 PM)
They listed a few such as latest tax returns and some other stuff for business owners. For myself a salaried worker, just one month of the latest payslip would suffice  smile.gif
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Latest payslip should be easily satisfied. Payslips could be easily forged. I wonder why they ask for something like that only.

I'm a Citi card holder too, but I'm wondering why I have not received such a letter.

As for retirees, logically speaking, should not be granted any credit anymore because they don't have any business or employment income. If they need a loan means their retirement income is insufficient and therefore must continue working. Debit cards or supplementary credit cards are more for suitable for them.




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