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> BERSIH 2.0 and their demands, Is it wrong for us to support it? (Local Politics)

Faidzal
post Jun 15 2011, 01:57 PM


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OK, here are the demands:

BERSIH 2.0 has been actively advocating electoral reform but our demands have fallen on deaf ears. The time has come for those mandated to administer the nation to “listen to the voices of the rakyat”. There is a clamour worldwide for greater democratisation of societies and we would invite those in power to heed those voices.

In this light, BERSIH 2.0 has decided to organise a rally: Perhimpunan BERSIH 2.0

The demands of the rally are:

-Clean the electoral roll

-Reform postal vote

-Use indelible ink

-Free & fair access to media

-Minimum 21 days campaign period

-Strengthen public institutions

-Stop corruption

-Stop dirty politics

for people who don't understand or refuse to understand English, I made a banner:

user posted image

feel free to copy the URL and redistribute this banner.

So, is it wrong for us to support these demands?


Added on June 15, 2011, 1:58 pmofficial page: http://bersih.org/

BTW, the words and design were lifted from the official T-Shrt, can be ordered here:

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=233...&type=1&theater

This video explains clearly why a clean and fair election is needed.

Also will answer the often quoted disinformation "If elections in Malaysia are not clean, how come Pakatan can win 5 states and 82 Parliament seats?"



This post has been edited by Faidzal: Jul 9 2011, 12:38 AM
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ray123
post Jun 15 2011, 02:01 PM


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Who the hell doesn't want the mud-slinging between political parties to stop? These are all very fair and reasonable demands.

Compare this to the apparent penis-envy from Perkasa ("mine is bigger"):

Let’s see who’s bigger, Perkasa dares Bersih
http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/malaysi...a-dares-bersih/
QUOTE
KUALA LUMPUR, June 15 — Claiming the support of 36 NGOs, Perkasa threw down the gauntlet last night to organisers of the Bersih gathering to see who could rally more support when the two groups face off in the federal capital on July 9.

The Malay rights group said that it had no choice but to take to the streets to counter election watchdogs Bersih because “if we don’t, then the world will think that they have the support of all Malaysians.”

“Wait for July 9, then we will see who has more,” Perkasa president Datuk Ibrahim Ali told reporters after chairing a roundtable meeting with representatives from various NGOs.

The Pasir Mas MP insisted the 37 NGOs including Perkasa was not trying to “create chaos” as alleged by critics but simply wanting to show that “we are rakyat as well.”

“The Bersih gathering has a hidden political agenda to cause chaos. There is no justification to gather hundreds of thousands simply to ask for free and fair elections when the Election Commission has already answered.

“Please don’t assume we are trying to create chaos. That makes no sense at all. Our stand is simple. They march, we march. They cancel, we cancel. We don’t want them to say they are doing this in the name of the rakyat. We are also the rakyat,” he said.

Pakatan Rakyat (PR) parties and activists are gearing up to march next month in the second such rally by Bersih, the first being in 2007 when up to 50,000 were reported to have gathered in the capital, with many being dispersed by water cannons and tear gas fired by the police.

PAS has promised to bring 300,000 protestors this year in hopes that it will galvanise support for the opposition in the general election expected within the year.

The 2007 rally was said to play a big role in bringing record gains for the opposition electoral pact in Election 2008, where it swept five state governments and won 82 parliamentary seats.

Umno-owned daily Utusan Malaysia has urged Malaysians to boycott the protest and quoted Home Minister Datuk Seri Hishammuddin Hussein’s warning that “it will be chaotic when those for and against the street demonstration clash”.

Ibrahim also echoed Utusan Malaysia’s claim that Bersih was being led by those who are anti-Islam.

Saying that Bersih chief and former Bar Council president Datuk Ambiga Sreevanasan has been pushing for an interfaith council and supported Lina Joy’s apostasy, Ibrahim called for PAS to withdraw its support for the rally.

Perkasa also announced that it will launch the Anti-Bersih Movement on June 19, when it expects more NGOs to join its ranks.

Also present at today’s roundtable were former PKR lawmakers Datuk Seri Zahrain Mohamed Hashim and Datuk Zulkifli Noordin who are now independent MPs.



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PACINO
post Jun 15 2011, 02:09 PM


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QUOTE(Faidzal @ Jun 15 2011, 01:57 PM)
OK, here are the demands:

BERSIH 2.0 has been actively advocating electoral reform but our demands have fallen on deaf ears. The time has come for those mandated to administer the nation to “listen to the voices of the rakyat”. There is a clamour worldwide for greater democratisation of societies and we would invite those in power to heed those voices.

In this light, BERSIH 2.0 has decided to organise a rally: Perhimpunan BERSIH 2.0

The demands of the rally are:

-Clean the electoral roll

-Reform postal vote

-Use indelible ink

-Free & fair access to media

-Minimum 21 days campaign period

-Strengthen public institutions

-Stop corruption

-Stop dirty politics

for people who don't understand or refuse to understand English, I made a banner:

user posted image

feel free to copy the URL and redistribute this banner.

So, is it wrong for us to support these demands?


Added on June 15, 2011, 1:58 pmofficial page: http://bersih.org/

BTW, the words and design were lifted from the official T-Shrt, can be ordered here:

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=233...&type=1&theater
*
honestly , not to kill your hopes...most urban folks find it real hard to support rallies...most of them find it a waste of time , etc...
though i feel somehow that way , i do share your sentiments for the call to change...i believe in the word of mouth as the power to make then change. Change can only come , if Malaysian do their part in speaking to the folks in the rural counterpart. Our idealogy needs to be spread to them...not to show which party is better , but more like to support the parties that would select accountable candidates , ammend certain rulings today that allow corruption , cronycism , and reward politicians openly for good policies and projects in place. The stick must also come to those politicians which allows things to nosedive under their jurisdictions. ( the same way KPI is implemented)

We need the rights to select the right candidate , ( and the rights to choose our PM - not party base )
This is where we need the government to change the system. Let us select our PM from a pool of people.
Lots of inputs , but sadly not enough time to type.
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Odinn
post Jun 15 2011, 03:07 PM


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QUOTE(ray123 @ Jun 15 2011, 02:01 PM)
Who the hell doesn't want the mud-slinging between political parties to stop? These are all very fair and reasonable demands.

Compare this to the apparent penis-envy from Perkasa ("mine is bigger"):

Let’s see who’s bigger, Perkasa dares Bersih
http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/malaysi...a-dares-bersih/
*
So what cause exactly is Perkasa going for here? If they are given permits for their riot rally, this won't be a surprise. Their motive in marching is clearly to go against Bersih, and in doing this, instigate riots/fights and cause damage.

I don't know about this marching/rallies and needing permits, but did the last march from the National Mosque to the US Embassy early this year (iinm) get any approval? When I saw it, they even had police escorts.
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takali
post Jun 15 2011, 04:27 PM


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there we go again.perkasa seems to be busybody every time blush.gif

if the march were really to happen,hope things will not get messy..as some idiots will take advantage to create chaos..and then blame opposition. sad.gif
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narf03
post Jun 15 2011, 04:49 PM


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QUOTE(takali @ Jun 15 2011, 04:27 PM)
there we go again.perkasa seems to be busybody every time  blush.gif

if the march were really to happen,hope things will not get messy..as some idiots will take advantage to create chaos..and then blame opposition.  sad.gif
*
wanted to join, but perkasa is bunch of bullies, looking for fights, dont really dare to stand in their way

This post has been edited by narf03: Jun 15 2011, 04:50 PM
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acbc
post Jun 15 2011, 04:51 PM


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Finding faults is really anti-Islam. Since Perkasa is doing it, they are actually anti-Islam not Bersih 2.0 organizers.
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takali
post Jun 15 2011, 04:56 PM


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QUOTE(narf03 @ Jun 15 2011, 04:49 PM)
wanted to join, but perkasa is bunch of bullies, looking for fights, dont really dare to stand in their way
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Ya better .
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Exiled_Gundam
post Jun 15 2011, 05:25 PM


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Both BERSIH and Perkasa should just cancel their intention for rallies. They will just make the life of rakyat around that area more difficult only
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alhs76
post Jun 15 2011, 06:32 PM


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I support fair elections!

If Perkasa wants to join the party, come along, that is if they are mature enough not to pick a fight. However, judging from press reports, I can hardly see that they are matured enough since they equate having fair elections with religion and they are looking more to challenging, like a tit for tat.


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ben83
post Jun 15 2011, 07:35 PM


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I hate to say this, but in order to change for the better, some sacrifice is indeed required.
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dkk
post Jun 15 2011, 07:46 PM


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You need to open up Photoshop again.

Reform postal vote != PEMANSUHAN UNDI POS


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Faidzal
post Jun 15 2011, 08:15 PM


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QUOTE(Exiled_Gundam @ Jun 15 2011, 05:25 PM)
Both BERSIH and Perkasa should just cancel their intention for rallies. They will just make the life of rakyat around that area more difficult only
*
you my friend deserve the govt. you voted in.


Added on June 15, 2011, 8:16 pm
QUOTE(dkk @ Jun 15 2011, 07:46 PM)
You need to open up Photoshop again.

Reform postal vote != PEMANSUHAN UNDI POS
*
the words were from the official bersih t-shirt.

but i believe they want to abolish postal votes in the end, because let's face it, in this day and age, there is no place in malaysia that is not reachable anymore....

This post has been edited by Faidzal: Jun 15 2011, 08:16 PM
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teongpeng
post Jun 15 2011, 10:32 PM


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QUOTE(Exiled_Gundam @ Jun 15 2011, 05:25 PM)
Both BERSIH and Perkasa should just cancel their intention for rallies. They will just make the life of rakyat around that area more difficult only
*
you are a selfish kid who would rather whine on the internet than take measures, arent you?
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atombom123
post Jun 15 2011, 10:51 PM


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QUOTE(Faidzal @ Jun 15 2011, 01:57 PM)
OK, here are the demands:

BERSIH 2.0 has been actively advocating electoral reform but our demands have fallen on deaf ears. The time has come for those mandated to administer the nation to “listen to the voices of the rakyat”. There is a clamour worldwide for greater democratisation of societies and we would invite those in power to heed those voices.

In this light, BERSIH 2.0 has decided to organise a rally: Perhimpunan BERSIH 2.0

The demands of the rally are:

-Clean the electoral roll

-Reform postal vote

-Use indelible ink

-Free & fair access to media

-Minimum 21 days campaign period

-Strengthen public institutions

-Stop corruption

-Stop dirty politics

for people who don't understand or refuse to understand English, I made a banner:

user posted image

feel free to copy the URL and redistribute this banner.

So, is it wrong for us to support these demands?


Added on June 15, 2011, 1:58 pmofficial page: http://bersih.org/

BTW, the words and design were lifted from the official T-Shrt, can be ordered here:

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=233...&type=1&theater
*




This post has been edited by atombom123: Jun 15 2011, 10:55 PM
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takali
post Jun 15 2011, 11:23 PM


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QUOTE(alhs76 @ Jun 15 2011, 06:32 PM)
I support fair elections!

If Perkasa wants to join the party, come along, that is if they are mature enough not to pick a fight. However, judging from press reports, I can hardly see that they are matured enough since they equate having fair elections with religion and they are looking more to challenging, like a tit for tat.
*
"If Perkasa wants to join the party, come along, that is if they are mature enough not to pick a fight." :Bro,I believe Am-no is playing smart here,they counter bersih march by perkasa. I may be wrong,but i trust my intuition most of the time. flex.gif


Added on June 15, 2011, 11:24 pm
QUOTE(alhs76 @ Jun 15 2011, 06:32 PM)
I support fair elections!

If Perkasa wants to join the party, come along, that is if they are mature enough not to pick a fight. However, judging from press reports, I can hardly see that they are matured enough since they equate having fair elections with religion and they are looking more to challenging, like a tit for tat.
*
=
"If Perkasa wants to join the party, come along, that is if they are mature enough not to pick a fight." :Bro,I believe Am-no is playing smart here,they counter bersih march by perkasa. I may be wrong,but i trust my intuition most of the time. flex.gif


This post has been edited by takali: Jun 15 2011, 11:24 PM
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papayandonut
post Jun 16 2011, 01:26 AM


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i still dont get it why PERKASA want stop this Bersih, unless they dont want a fair for next election
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alhs76
post Jun 16 2011, 01:34 AM


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[quote=takali,Jun 15 2011, 11:23 PM]
"If Perkasa wants to join the party, come along, that is if they are mature enough not to pick a fight." :Bro,I believe Am-no is playing smart here,they counter bersih march by perkasa. I may be wrong,but i trust my intuition most of the time. flex.gif

i'm sure your intuition may be right, however, being a malaysian, i hope for the best. i hope that ibrahim ali is not another pauline hanson looking for cheap publicity to gain political mileage. all i desire is for the people to be enpowered, not politicians from either divide. i desire for politicians to be chosen if they are capable and to be removed if they are not. politicians should be not idolized or treated as demi-gods where they are untouchable, and they should be subjected to the law and not the law being subjected to them. People should be treated fairly and equally and not according to their (politicians) whims and fancies. When we are treated to their whims and fancies, we are sometimes malaysians, but at times we are malay, chinese and indians, we are sometimes united as one, but at times divided when one wishes us to be. We should speak out loud but out loud as a nation, and not merely as a loudspeaker making loud noises.


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ray123
post Jun 16 2011, 01:38 AM


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QUOTE(papayandonut @ Jun 16 2011, 01:26 AM)
i still dont get it why PERKASA want stop this Bersih, unless they dont want a fair for next election
*
They claim BERSIH is a tool of the Opposition and will be used to cause riots. Not really surprising when you keep in mind of Perkasa's links to UMNO. People often tend to forget that many active UMNO MPs are also members of Perkasa.
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kurtkantoi
post Jun 16 2011, 08:30 AM


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I could see PERKASA people will sneak into BERSIH rally and make chaos out of nothing. Then media record this act and show to public in 8 o'clock news. Hopefully the organizer will prepare for this one.
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