Debatable.

Both PhD and Exp has its pros and cons. Some asked me to go for PhD and some telling me experience always has an upper hand than PhD. I googled this but none of them give me a direct answer. I even speak to a few PhD holders as well as some seniors whom already out working, both has different opinion on how PhD job career landed. Hence below are the pros and cons which I can think of (mostly thru advises from seniors and lecturers).

PhD PRO & CON:
PROS
- more secured job
- 5k salary
- less competition in M'sia
- able to join education line (which I'm not interested)
- knowledge seeking
- Doc. title

CONS
- minimum 3 years of devotion
- not getting any salary for 3 years MIN; no car no house no wife
- lack of work experience; you're treated as fresh grad when you enter the job industry

I'm currently a first class engineering student who being offered to further my studies in one of the local university. There is grant provided so I won't have to get any sponsor for the materials, plus an allowance of RM 1.5k per months.
Also, there are few MNC company offering me a position in their company, of course I still haven't reply them.

I have no interest in being a lecturer or joining the education line whatsoever. The lecturers told me that getting a PhD in 3 years will secure you a job as an Senior Engineer when you join some MNC company with at least 5k salary. They added it's impossible to reach 5k salary in 3 years time even when you work double hard without a PhD. Frankly speaking, the salary is what attract me the most; aside from the title.

So my question is which one is more important: PhD vs Exp?

HELP PLEASE.

This post has been edited by ShrugsLova: May 26 2011, 03:45 AM

If you did PhD in IPTA and choosen IPTS, you may apply for Mybrain and the chances is very very high ... and it's RM 2300 per month .

Ya, thanks. I read about it and it's good, sadly I have to cancel the allowance before getting this MyPhd scholarship thing. Wouldn't it be great if I can take both the allowance and scholarship at the same time. *greed*

After reading some article about PhD. Most of them do it because of knowledge seeking rather than money. *Sigh* There is more to think.

This post has been edited by ShrugsLova: May 26 2011, 04:39 AM

If you're really not interested in educational/theoretical field, then go for experience and a professional certificate: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulation_an..._in_engineering or other well known certifications like MCSE or CCNA for example, other factors against going for postgraduate studies is probably uncertainty -you're not assured of actually finishing your theses in X years, there are tons of journals to be read and published, field works and studies, nutty supervisors, assisting your professors in classes and marking their papers etc. :\

This post has been edited by mgjg: May 26 2011, 10:31 AM

i'm just a master student waiting for results
but if you were to ask me
i would say go for your phd
since you don't have to worry about the tuition fees
why bother entering the job market now
you have decades to earn the experience needed
most of the time is really about how fast you learn
unless you really have no interest in continuing with the research, i would say no harm taking up phd

well, anyway just my opinion

You mean BEM and IEM? Those IR title?
Can I take those professional certificate together with phD (MIN 3 years research experience)? Or it require real work experience to get IR title?
As I recalled, it need 2 years experience but the question is do phD consider working experience as well?

Thanks for your advise, well the real question is: is phD valued in most of MNC company?
Most of the forum I followed, say phD is overqualified in M'sia

I'm writing as an outsider here, with a layman's view. Like I wrote in my original post, it's really up to you whether you can give at least 5 years (IMHO a more prudent ballpark) pursuing postgrad studies in Malaysia. The choice too depends on whether you can stomach working as a junior engineer for some years, get the necessary qualifications and get a better paying job.
Another thing, have you tried contacting IEM?: http://www.myiem.org.my/default.aspx?redirect=oldsite

Opportunity knocks. Go grab the phd now. Experience will always come later when you start working.

that's what i have in mind too

Oh thanks, i will take a look at it.

That's what I think too, but there is this 'over qualified' case which I'm worry at.

Anyhoo, thanks alot for your advise.

You'll more or less gain experiences while you pursue your phD?
If you're good enough, you won't be treated as fresh grads when you enter the job industry. Conversely, companies may even fight to hire you
Since you're a 1st class student, why not opt for better scholarships?
I'm studying phD as well, a Brightspark scholarship holder, income is RM4.7k per month (no intention of boasting, just want to share with you that there are good scholarships out there that'll make your phD studies more worthwhile)

This post has been edited by [PF] T.J.: May 27 2011, 10:44 AM

4.7k per months is a killer.
PF T.J may I know where you doing your PhD? Singapore? you skip master as well?

But since my University is not a major public Uni (universiti of perlis). I have to do a year of master in most university i.e USM.
I don't know about Singapore.

I'm actually planning to go Nottingham University Malaysia this weekend to ask them about this.

universities usually give exemption to first class graduate
so you should be able to skip master and do your phd straight right?

Not all, USM require me to do master first.

One more thing, it sound a bit naive to me but I'm curious: doing my phD in University of Nottingham, Malaysia Campus = University of Nottingham.
The word 'M'sia Campus' will affect alot? I mean the world ranking for University of Nottingham is 21st, do the same apply for M'sia Campus?

Naive hor?

This post has been edited by ShrugsLova: May 27 2011, 05:42 PM

@amy From what I've heard, it's not 'exemption', it's promoting your Masters thesis to PhD because your research is superior or reached a higher level than originally proposed. So, it's like the first few years of your Masters work becomes the preliminary work for your PhD, and you'll save a few years.


@TS It depends, if a company wants a graduate from a ranked uni. they'll offer him the job; if the company finds a candidate they like, is qualified and fits into the team they'll still hire him/her even if he/she comes from a lower ranked/less glamorous uni.
Another advantage of being a graduate of 'named' uni's is probably the old boys and their network :s

no, is not naive at all
is good to find out and be sure about it
i did my master in Notts UK
but i'm thinking if can, i might consider phd in Malaysia Campus
anyway, is not going to happen anytime soon
i'll find out later

so it's the same whether to do it in Notts UK or M'sia?
whoa! thank you.

Experince create PHD....

study PHD like learning ppl experince to shorten the time of self explore. Like Shortcut to point.

If u can afford, then go for it.

PHD = study
experince = Exploration.

Just my opinion.

Beware, some universities won't promote your Master thesis to a PhD one even though the external examiners suggested so.

Speaking from my point of view, i would prefer students to work for 1-2 years before taking up postgraduate studies. The experience from working world is priceless and it will help you think more maturely during studies. Also, the working world is a whole lot different playing field compared to the academic one; yes, companies may fight to hire you as a Senior Staff, but once the honeymoon's over, you'll be kicked around to deliver and culture shock sets in.

Since you are getting or will get scholarship, by all means go for PhD straight away.

Thanks, but there is this issue where most employers tend to hire experience employee than phd holders.

Do it in M'sia? I read your post back then in 'Reason to get a PhD'; you strongly recommend ppl to do it oversea not?

Honestly, please do it overseas if you can afford it. Our local standards are abysmal in comparison to other universities bar a few.

But most of the oversea university want us to do master first. I don't think first degree is exempted from doing master in oversea.

Not necessarily. If your Master research is excellent, you might get a 'promotion' to graduate as a PhD, which is quite common.

Let's put it this way; research is a lifelong task. The paper qualifications are just a short stopovers from your ultimate destination. It is more important to choose a good supervisor (with funds ) and an institution with great facilities/equipments and colleagues. Not much difference from choosing the right company to work in.

In term of good supervisor, and equipment as well as great colleague; my current university-to-be has it all. The only disadvantages would be the fame; it's local and not oversea.

Anyway, I appreciate your post. TY.

muda lagi go futher study la...3 years only...u get ur phd ur super big boss also will call u Dr

The title is not the main reason I want to do it.

I wish to join into this forum...if taking part time PhD..is it advisable ? as I am plan to do it at AeU...any idea about this U ?
TQ

If you're a first class degree holder and do not get 5k after 3 years, then sadly u r either not-performing in your work or you have just joined the wrong company. while PhD has its advantage during an interview, i'm sure you would have to join a company that needs the knowledge you gained from your research work. so, you'll have to be very determined to end up at a place you visualized 3 years earlier.

having said that, 5k can buy u small car, small house and a working wife. maybe you should think out of the "salary" reasoning. no offence. just my opinion.

AeU stand for? If you're able to multitasking between your work and night/weekend-time-research then why not? Most of my friend hesitate to do that is because they can't even manage their work. In my opinion, why not discuss with your company to send you for a phd with a contract.

I'm actually very new to phd and not even taken phd; just in the phase of planning now, so my answer could be helpless. Sorry.

haha..good point over there, 5k is just a starter. What I'm trying to say is you might earn 5k in 3 years without a phd too. But there is always competition; you have to compete among the Degree holders (let's say) for promotion, meaning you have to shine to the max to catch the attention of your employer. Aside from that, bear in mind there is always Msc holders, which is by large has more chances to get the promotion than you. Promotion in 3 years is possible but with a higher odds; some might be CEO in 3 years, but what I'm trying to say is by the majority, 3 years to get promotion to 5k without a phd is near impossible.

Phd on the other hand has a more secure route. You finish your phd (3-4 years), you get into the industry with zilch experience; but you get some Senior Executive Position (5k minimum). That's what most of the engineers out there told me: 3 years to boast up your salary to 5k; possible but not everyone can get.

My perspective of higher salary is not just getting 5k, but an easy and more secure route to getting 5k in 3 years.

That's just my opinion too.

first of all, from the perspective of somebody who've gone through the challenges of a PhD:

if u're planning to do a PhD and asking about how much u're gonna earn afterwards, u're setting up for a disappointment. get ur priorities straight. PhD does not mean u'll earn more.

if u wanna earn more, go get working experience. it's much easier and less stress on ur head.

AeU is stand for Asia E University. For more information, you may browse http://www.aeu.edu.my/.
FYI, I am from govt sector, I don't want to tie up with govt contract, furthermore, I wish to be a lecture and as far as I am concern, the bottom line to be a lecturer, a person must have a PhD. Now my main constraint would be the time factors....how the life being a Phd ? as I am planning to take part time.....any idea about it...tq

then what's the main reason you do your phd? Salary didn't ever come across your head?
I'm not aiming for high BIG bucks salary; i mean a phd will at least secure your salary; a better salary is a 'for sure' right?

I'm not very sure about part time, perhaps azarimy can help since he already started his phD.
But to be a lecturer, it's a must in most of the university (some action taken to raise the reputation of M'sia Uni)

IMO you need to take the research route, because the local uni's prefer candidates who are qualified researchers and have the relevant experience. Doing part time PhD (if there is such a thing) usually mean course works (classes/exams/presentations) which would not help you with writing journals and research papers (the current policy iirc, is for an academic staff to write and publish a journal/research paper every year) and supervising postgraduate students.

What Azarimy meant is you have the wrong mindset for wanting to do a PhD. Salary should not be an important criteria in deciding to uptake the course.

Yes, a PhD qualification may attract the big corporations which may shower you with good offers but you have the survive the trials and tribulations of PhD first! So, it's important you have a correct mindset and aim.

haha..i know what azarimy mean. I just wanna joke with him about salary.
PhD is not always about money, but it do attract more money (that is still a plus not?)
But the reason I really want to do it is I feel that there is still thing I haven't settle, you know that feeling of wanting to complete every stages in computer games? Or you can call that as my interest.

lolz.

And for part time phd, it's usually very hectic, you take longer time to complete around 6 years. During this years, you have to sacrifice your weekend/night time to do research. The main problem with part time phd is:

1. Can you bear sacrificing your leisure time for research? Some engineers I knew in my previous company, give up half way (after a years or so) because they lose their interest as the time for completing a part time phd is rather long.

2. You may have to take leave just to meet your supervisor, back to the university for the test, etc aka performance lower. You employers will sometimes irritated by this.

3. Hectic, can you manage multitasking?

Are you a lecturer now? Cause in my university, the lecturers are paid to have their phd. I mean they are still consider working even when they're out doing their phd. There are fund for that, I suppose.

Rather than you take part time phd, in my opinion, why not apply for Industry Phd (It's actually a full time phd but you can do it with your company, provided that your company and university agree on that).

The above is totally based on my limited understanding, I just share my opinion based on my slight understanding to phd. If there are mistake, please bear with me.

Nope, not a lecturer, just a part-time tutor.

I believe, no one can justify your stand to take a PhD. Only you yourself will walk the talk, not the critics nor your supporters. At the end of the day, it's your decision that matters

If you have the interest (and funds!), by all means go for it.

the reason for my PhD?

refer to this article:

http://matt.might.net/articles/phd-school-in-pictures/

i just wanna add another dent in the world knowledge. PhD is the only place in the modern world where a mere mortal can leave his mark forever. i mean, we cant build pyramids anymore, can we? lol.

for me, taking Phd just not only about monetary term of the title....but to further explore something we wanted to know...just like we are diving in the deep sea level to look for a needle...

A dent long enough to see another dent proves it wrong

Edit: Ops it's the same

This post has been edited by matt85: Jun 3 2011, 05:41 PM

Let's make more dent.

By the way, where you did your phd azarimy? Mind to share a little about the environment and why you choose your university and what title. It will help me to choose what university I want too. Thank you.

But to make the contributions forever .. not everyone can make it even with the current professor level ... too many journal that I found already out of date and irrelevant especially in technology

But for your area, a lot of physical things can be built for a longer time ...

university of sheffield.

my phd title is long and doesnt often make sense to those unfamiliar with it. so suffice if i mention that my PhD is in the area of architecture education and the virtual environment. the reason i chose sheffield was that they have a leading expert in architecture education, prof. bryan lawson, which i had the privilege to become his student. at the same time, sheffield is also the top 3 university in architecture in the UK, top 10 in europe. so that puts me right in one of the best university in the world in regards of my field.

well, it doesnt matter if somebody proves it is wrong or obsolete. the point is, at the moment u submit ur work, it fulfills the knowledge gap not known at that particular time. until somebody fulfills that gap, the future researchers cant build new knowledge. so it's either u or somebody else, either way, u will make ur mark in the world. ur work will be reviewed and referred to in order to the future guy to make urs obsolete.

just like designing a PC processor. pentium 4 was replaced with a new model in less than 2 years. but it gave birth to other chips, and eventually the multi-core designs. but it all depends on the predecessors. so it's either u or the other guy. i'd rather it be mine.

dude, just continue to study when you got the chance. a lot of people want to study but no chance.

also, managers/hr people mostly judge on the day of your interview, how you perform instead of looking at your job experience or education. if you perform well during your interview, you will surely get the job even if you are under-qualified for the job.

I am also an engineer currently. In my field, master and pHd has different branch or so called specialist. So to find out which field you like most, your need to work first then go for the master and pHd in that field. I do not read the front post so i also don't know TS is from which branch of engineering so if your branch do not have specialist then you may go study first as when you doing your pHd you may ask your guidance prof to give you some part time work and you will gain some exp from there. To get PE, you need either working exp 2 year design + 1 year contractual exp or if i not mistaken is 10 years in research. Hope this clear your doubt.

This post has been edited by picfantasia: Jun 4 2011, 11:43 AM

Sorry I did not reply earlier. Yes, by all means if you have the chance, do it overseas in the best universities. In UK, look for 'Russell Group' universities. They are the top uni's in the UK who received the bulk of grants for research. So you are likely to get the best researchers and academics there. Furthermore, living overseas is an experience in itself. It will open up your mind and world view.

I'm from the academia so I don't know how well does this apply to engineering companies, but:

Why do you think that PhD is not an experience in itself? Why do you think PhD holders can't compete with degree holders?

PhD is not just about research but an important training that develops your capacity to solve problems (ie. to think like a scientist/researcher and to come up with ideas/solutions to your problems). From what I have seen, postdocs are generally more capable of completing tasks and solving problems than your average degree holders, there's a clear difference between the way these two perform their tasks. They may not have the work experience when they first came in, but they pick up stuff faster than anyone else, and I believe this has to do with the training they have been through.

Seriously, I have yet to see postdocs that worry about picking up new skills, but rather they concern themselves with how best to approach a problem.

This post has been edited by tester: Jun 4 2011, 10:31 PM

I already e-mailed IEM and BEM for further clarification. Ir title is important? I thought Ir only useful for Civil Engineering.
By the way, I'm from materials engineering (basically Mechanical engineering major in Material Science) and we do have those branch. Thank you.

The University of Nottingham is in a Russell Group, there has a campus in M'sia as well; so is that a good choice to do it in M'sia?

Whoa! +1.. I'm more confident to do my phd now.

touche

what is that?

The latest offer I got is from USM; nevertheless I'll gone through a year of Msc, if my performance is good, then hopefully within that year, it'll convert to PhD as well.

You getting any funding from USM?

just a grant provided by my supervisor, not much though.

Is it going to be enough for at least 2 years?

I'm asking this because i have friends doing Master in USM too, and funding problems are prevalent. Just letting you know beforehand

For Msc, i think there is a variation of 1 year (mixed mode), 1.5 years and 2 years depend on your supervisor. Grant is optional, again, depend on your supervisor. Ya, funding issue are prevalent; that's why it most advisable to find for scholarship.

No, im telling you to be exact USM have this funding issue; if you stretch your research beyond 2nd year, you're in for a tough ride.

Tried looking elsewhere?

Just applied MyMaster, you already deduct RM 10K for school fees, and additional 1500 for thesis. And applied other scholarship during that time too.

with MyBrain aka MyMaster, you're not eligible to apply for other scholarship. That's how bad ass this thing is.

---

Added on June 14, 2011, 12:48 amYa it's true, cause now every Msc research in USM (if possible) is limited within 1 year (max 1.5 years). With additional 0.5 year for thesis/dissertation writing. Normally those taking 2 years is for part-time Msc; for part-time, normally its for working peoples, hence there shouldn't be any financial problem for those working engineer.

This post has been edited by ShrugsLova: Jun 14 2011, 12:48 AM

hi there, glad to know you're considering to further ur studies. I was really confused too when I was about to finish my degree, but I've always known that the minimum i want to achieve has got to be Masters. Then, the real headache came when I am eligible to go straight to PhD and skip masters. I'm studying in UKM btw. And my lecturer asked me to go for it, skip masters.I was afraid to do PhD, basically because I've heard experiences from people basically, like how it's really tough and all. And considering how I'm just a fresh undergrad, straight to PhD level, I was skeptical of my own abilities.

My parents and family supported me. They were like "since you have the chance to further till PhD, why not? There are lots of people who want to but due to circumstances, they can't." But of course, they told me in the end, it's really up to me. Whatever choice I made, btw Master and PhD, they'll still support me. In the end, I kinda leave it to fate lol...I just tried to apply for it and if I get the offer, then I'll go for it. That's not a really good idea though. I think for people to study PhD, they really have to think whether or not they like that certain field. Because imagine spending 4-5 yrs on that particular field, it's going to take up a lot of effort. I was advised about that fact too. Anyways, I'm now a first sem PhD student working in Microbiology field (leaning towards Molecular Biology though). Sometimes I did kinda wonder why I take the hard way especially when I have troubles with my research. But I'm trying to keep my mind positive and never give up. Hope it pays off when I finally graduate.

Oh btw, I wasn't ready to enter the work force after degree so it was definitely furthering my studies in my case. I'm also getting MyPhD scholarship atm. My father was a bit reluctant coz there's 5 years bond to it. I was too coz I don't wanna be tied to the gov after this, however...since my lecturers are calling us to apply for scholarships, we have to xD (coz if not, they have to pay you allowances from the grant, and the grant is precious). Just got my money few weeks ago, it was pretty delayed though, about 3 weeks after my coursemate got it and to think we're from the same uni, studying the same course. But I gotta pay back my allowances to my lecturer for the past 6 months. Anyone knows how to check the statement for MyPhd? Coz they never give us a statement to clarify which month are they paying. For example now, I don't know the money they gave covers how many months.


Hope everything turns out well for you!

This post has been edited by avanpiper: Jun 14 2011, 05:21 PM

If you have no interest in PhD then don't bother enrolling. It will be a 3-4 years or probably longer journey of mental torture.

And if you are really serious about pursuing a career in research after PhD, I would not bother enrolling in local unis for obvious reason. Try NUS/NTU or overseas universities.

I am not familiar with UK universities but Australia universities are offering research scholarship for international students (IPRS , UIPA). IPRS is government sponsored scholarship but managed by the respective universitiy. As far as I know, UNSW and Melb uni has it but my bet is the G8 uni are all offering it.

Good luck.

I'm planning to do it locally, ya, there might be 'saying' that oversea is better (I can't deny it is) but I do believe when it come to the end, performance is what matter. That's what I been telling myself; comfort/lies?...i not so sure now.

P/S: My financial status doesn't allow me to go oversea; even with scholarship.

The scholarships I mentioned covers both tuition fee and living expenses (allowances) fyi.

Yes performance does matter but it depends on your supervisor and your university in providing the facility/research grant/support.

On side note, I am involved in research and papers I got out from local unis for reference is pure bullshit (mind you I mean it when I use this term). I am extremely disappointed with the quality of work produced by the PhD students. However, having said that, I do believe there are still bright students in local uni.

Some of my own opinions:
1. PhD is nothing but just a title for someone else to call you "Dr".

2. If you have no genuine interest in research/academia, don't bother doing PhD unless you are happy to stay in local colleges/uni where publication is not important but rather the contact. However, getting employed by local uni itself is a challenge.

3. Considering you are skipping masters, you are required a minimum 3 years of research in PhD but usually it extends to 4 years. Within this 4 years, the amount of experience you gained in your workplace versus the 0 industrial experience you gain upon completing PhD. One may argue that PhD itself brings a certain prestige and provides leverage but all PhD demonstrates is just your ability to perform research in a larger scale as compared to your undergraduate thesis. My friends who are PhD holders end up being paid $3000 extra per annum (that is $250 per month) as compared to fresh graduate in engineering field and mind you they are 4 years behind as compared to their peers.

4. However, you do benefit from PhD. Research work is extremely fruitful and my friend working in Singapore is earning SGD5000+ per month doing research with certain company. But that is if you are comfortable and happy with research work, eg you are working in your area of research as defined by your PhD dissertation. And mind you, you need to demonstrate that you are competent in your field (by amount and quality of publications) and so on.

4. Salary of 5k for PhD holder as senior engineer (I doubt so). Unless you are involved in the R&D department then probably you stand a chance, but that again if you are interested in research. Again, fyi offshore O&G earns as much as 5k for fresh undergraduate. Ok, let's put O&G aside, having 3-4 years experience in hand, engineers can easily hit 6k or more.

Bottom line: I would say is your interest in research that will determine whether PhD is really for you. If you want to have a picture of what you will be doing in your PhD, go search for publication papers in relation to your potential area of research but choose the papers carefully, eg avoid China and Malaysia conference paper because most of them are considered low quality paper. Try journals if possible.

Given all that I said, this is your decision because is your future and not mine. Oh btw, lecturers LOVE to encourage students to apply PhD under them because you guys are churning out papers/publications for them. And right now I am in overseas Aus uni so what I said may not directly reflect on local uni in Malaysia so i'll let you do the judgement.

Are the currency you mentioned in MYR?

$ = AUD,

SGD - SG,

those figures without - MYR

any body kind enough to explain to me the differences between those 3??

1. Doctor of Engineering (D.Eng. or Eng.D. or Dr.Eng. or Dr.-Ing.)
2. Doctor of Philosophy (DPhil or D.Phil.)
3. Doctor of Business Administration (DBA)

i already have MEng...so currently intended to further my study part time basis...is there any major difference between them??

This post has been edited by MANKiND: Jun 28 2011, 05:24 PM

If you're an engineering student, I'm pretty sure you heard about BEM & IEM, from these two bodies, you could gain P.Eng which is Professional Engineer.

1. D.Eng or so, I guess is the other name for PhD in engineering. If I'm not mistaken, different country has different naming for it. Yet in M'sia, no matter what course you are, be it an engineering, biochemistry, etc. all under one PhD.

2. In M'sia, we use PhD. There is MPhil which is inferior to PhD; given to those who can't meet the requirement of completing a PhD.

3. That's PhD for business.

Hope it helps.

some uni in malaysian got engineering doctorate like utm and utem...utm utem so it just the sake of accreditation by BEM and IEM and nothing physically different between engineering doctorate and doctor of philosophy??

izzit possible for me to takes doctor of business administration where i don't have the master in business administration (MBA)?? i already working nearly 5 year in O&G consultation...so still not decided whether to continue on technical or change path into managerial...

This post has been edited by MANKiND: Jun 29 2011, 06:15 AM

I think you misunderstand my meaning. P.Eng is a title for professional engineer accredited by BEM and IEM. Different case form D.Eng, etc.

For D.Eng (that I'm not so sure about it, but I would give it a guess it's either different naming for PhD in Engineering or a Post-Doctorate title) [ask lord google for better confirmation]

I believe to go for DBA, you need MBA. Eventhough I have seen many that go for MBA with Engineering Deg. [ask lord google again]

Erm...personal opinion: the salary of an engineer will be saturated at some level; that is when most of the engineers some sort of convert to management. The advantage of being a manager with technical background would be you really understand the whole process of your product flow, rather than just manage the manpower.

Normally, they will promote you to manager after certain level, no more other position that they can promote you to.

Actually most universities refer to 'business' PhD as 'DBA', Doctorate in Business Administration. There are key differences to traditional PhD and DBA though, mainly in the research methodology. PhD is more rigorous and if you are thinking of academia then PhD is still the ideal route to take. If you want to continue in business and industry then DBA is a good choice.

Finally, I made my decision, I will go for fast track PhD in one of our local University. 3-4 years of devotion.

I shall start with proposal writing. Thank you guys for your comments, and point of view.

This post has been edited by ShrugsLova: Jul 19 2011, 12:32 AM

Grats grats~
Where where?

Do anyone know about the conversion program?
Msc/PhD conversion program. Many of the local unis are offering this. If you do know about this, enlighten me more.

Hi and good day all,

I'm studying Biotechnology degree in one of the public University currently, just completed my 1st year, going to enter my 2nd year this september. I plan to further studies after completing my degree. What I have in mind is something to do related with what I am studying now. My problem is that I don't know much about the options I have. I can't seem to find any sites or forums that cater specifically to my needs to search for such informations.

Anyone of you has any sites to share here? Preferably that gives information about renowned institutions that offer such courses.

Lastly, any biotechnology graduates that have been undergoing postgraduate studies now or Biotechnology related PhD holders are welcomed to share your views on your experiences. If you have already entered the job market, do share about the career prospects for Biotechnology graduates or postgraduates as well, locally or oversea.

Many thanks in advance.

Hihi, welcome welcome
Which Biotechnological field are you interested in?

Hi, I'm gonna start my PhD in UM soon, as I know BrightSpark offer up to 3.5K allowance per month, may I know how to reach 4.7K? Is it we allow to take part time as tutor or other job?

Wow, welcome welcome haha, which field are you in?
You'll need to have very good (closet to 4.0 results) to get RM4.7k allowance. You're required to help out in tutoring classes as part of the KPI . Cannot take part time jobs.
Err... unless if you're very good and confident, I think its not very advisable to get Brightspark; I'm abit regretting to be honest. Its only worth it if you're 100% sure you could hit the KPI lol.... if not, you'll lose everything... so why not just go for those normal scholarships without that high a requirements? Even if you don't hit those requirements, you can still keep the money

wafak rm4.6k??!! thats crazy

What u mean by lose everything? They dun give u your monthly allowance and cancel your scholarship? THen how u doing now?

My result is 3.8, that's why they allow me to skip master and straight for PhD, but I didn't know it can give more than 4K

I'm in IT field but also related to education, my supervisor help me apply for the 3.5k allowance but didn't state that I have to be tutor, he said I cannot take part time job OFFICIALLY, mean unofficially can la But I think I wont have time for that anyway.

The KPI still reasonable la, finish within 3 years is my target anyway, and the publication KPI is crazy but its a motivation if you able to produce more than 10 Q1 and Q2 papers your reputation would be good, may take time la. What I concern is the BrightSpark unit might force me to join some weird/unnecessary course, have you been to any program under 'command' by BrightSpark so far?

I think the amount of other scholarship is quite low as I have to pay for car loan, send money bek home, plus live in KL isn't cheap. I could use some extra money and motivation to push me

Anyway if I fail my KPI they will cancel my scholarship but won't ask me pay bek rite? By the time only go find other sponsor lo

This post has been edited by bashlyner: Aug 25 2011, 01:50 PM

Lose everything as in you need to pay back all the money they gave you should you fail
So its not exactly worth it... its more like a do or die path

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Added on August 26, 2011, 4:21 pmSince the KPI is the same regardless of whether you get RM3k or RM4.7k... so unless you can get the latter amount of allowance, its not exactly worth it at all
Yeah, need to join some courses like scientific writing, journal ranking researching etc. (I'm Bio student, not sure whether they'll have different courses for students from other fields )

Need to pay back all the money if fail, that's why I say its not worth it


This post has been edited by [PF] T.J.: Aug 26 2011, 04:21 PM

Sir, may I know what field in Biology are you pursuing now?

I'm in Bio field... maybe I'm too obvious doing my freelance job? I even write it in my resume, had quite a number of job interview as well. Most of those solo / independent business owner knew about me... I'm not sure whether my boss knew about it but they shouldn't blame me because I'm not under scholarship, paid by honorarium, paid below scholarship holder, get my paid only after few months delay...

Finish within 3 years is quite good but this will never happen in my department... ironically, those who can publish more always takes more time to graduate than those who published less... I'm talking about ISI journals here.

For me I think this sorts of things depends on your family background. If let say I am a first class student being offered a good job with high salary. I would take it since I got to take of my parents and younger siblings. However if I came from quite stable family, high possibility I would complete studies up to Phd.

I still think education is num 1 most important criteria.
It can help you climb the ladder faster.

For me certification come first before working experience, nowadays all the listed company look into certificate before they look into your experience. it is true, they select employee for promotion based on certificate but not working experience

Not entirely true, I created my jobs in companies that never had my position before from my experience alone and I don't have any certification, why? Doing business is all about money.

depends what kind of certification. It boils down to the direction of your desired area and focus on studies.

For example if your doing a phd in pharmacology vs work experience. If you want to end up in a foreign leading pharmaceutical company you would need the phd.

Doing your phd doesnt stop you from getting work experience. But you have to remember it is difficult to go the other way from work experience to getting your phd.

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Added on November 4, 2011, 5:54 pmEndorsed doctorates i.e Doctor of Engineering and the prestigious Doctor of Science are classed slightly different. Essentially by having a declared area of study I assume for D.Eng are not exclusively awarded unlike the D.Sc. But similarities are you require substantial work experience to be entitled the opportunity to study.

DPhil the same as PhDs. Most former British colonies call them phds

DBa... throw a stone you will get someone with a DBa. Those are doctorates of business.

It does vary from country to country.

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Added on November 4, 2011, 6:02 pmI did my Masters of Applied Science in Auckland now I am a post doctorate.
Malaysian universities have a lot more resources, it is really your area of research and which university your going to. Pick a local university which is the best in your field of interest and study. Also you got to get to know your supervisor and you have to be compatible with the way he guides you towards your research goal, if not you will really struggle with your postgraduate study.

Malaysia has a ridiculous funding scheme for research provided your at the right university. So dont rule out local institutions immediately. I also recommend going to a university which has A grade english journal publications as a requirement for your phd.

This post has been edited by snackmonster: Nov 4 2011, 06:02 PM

Well said, that's what I keep telling myself despite most of my friends telling me that experience is more important and so on..

You can always earn your experience later. If you have the determination to continue post-grad studies, especially research base, which is known for its boring routine and years of mental torture, I don't see why you will have problem working in the industry and gaining the experience later on...

in malaysia la,

which company u can work for when u get your phd other than teach in public institution?

can give example of company instead of naming the industry?

its easy to give general answers like say pharmaceutical industry or research industry but when u really tink about it..

Example : degree in pharmacy

Either you study until PhD in pharmacology or you open drug store selling medicine.

One is academic, one is money...

That one I agree. But it's hard to prove our self when employers won't give us a chance due to lack of working experience.

I can't think of any...Never seen any company that list down phd as requirement, master also very rare.

too many senior managers, and top gov officials (> N48, 52) who currently doing Master told me to find a job first before continue PhD ... I've been attacked almost everyday ...

They jelly

A few examples:

The director (with a Dr. title) from First Solar came to my campus to give a talk on solar technologies weeks ago. He was a lecturer before he was appointed as the director of the company..

Intel sponsor their graduate trainee to further their studies in USM, which is what my senior doing now.

Motorola provides grant for students to apply for post-grad research in MMU.

So they got in with a bachelor degree right?

Seriously, it's really hurt inside when any opinion or cases study (despite it's relevant) rejected or looked down just because lack of experiences ... lucky only one month left ...