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unknown warrior
post Nov 19 2012, 10:11 AM

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QUOTE(Alvin330000421 @ Nov 19 2012, 09:56 AM)
Of course I am spending time with God. I do my quiet time, I do my bible study with my friends.
Of course I seek god first.

But I don't deny my human nature which I do want to settle down. What emptiness? You don't know me. I kniow exactly what is works. Please don't tell me works is not important. Works is a manifest of our faith.

You don't tell me that when you convert to christian, you still go out to night club, party and drinking and fool around with girls at the pub while yuo are still being married, right? The conversion to christianity have to manifest in your actions too. You can't just say, I believe in what Christ did for me at the cross, I am saved. Hooray...and then you still live in sinful life. The love for christ has got to manifest in your actions....hence works carried out as a result of your faith. Please don't tell me that works = emptiness.

You don't tell me that you are not affected at all if something not very good happens to you? You never felt frustrated at all?

Yes I am a fallen human being. Yes I am still a sinful human being. But by the blood of christ I am cleansed. Until I die and have the eternal salvation, I will still do battle with sin. Yes I am frustrated...I admit that. But don't don't tell me that I am empty because I did not seek the kindgom of god first.
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A lot of Christians have faith that God is able to bring them out of their sin through the blood of Jesus but lack the Faith that God is able to bring them into the promised land life. One of fulfilment and contentment in Christ.

I can tell you there are some Christians who hide their pain in the works of ministry but cry behind the scene before God about the unfairness of their life. Because they don't trust God enough.

There are some people can perform work without really believing in God. Do you know that? They do it for the sake of doing. Now I'm not saying you are but just to give you an example it can be so.

Because works cannot make you holy nor righteous. The Bible is very clear, until your have a right believe, then only your life will be transform.

I know for a fact there are some people who can cry out at the alter " Oh Jesus change me" with tears and emotion but still remain the same after leaving Church.

I'm not trying to bring you down, but your level of trust in God has to go much deeper.


unknown warrior
post Nov 19 2012, 10:32 AM

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QUOTE(Alvin330000421 @ Nov 19 2012, 10:24 AM)
Fren,

The trust in God manifest in my actions. Meaning to say, I go out there and do something about it. Not sit there, pray pray and believe that it will come true...but do nothing about that.

Do you pray earnestly to find a wife. But don't bother to go out there to meet people? Always stay at home do nothing? You're not walking the talk.

Of course, I know there are lots of people hiding behind ministry, crying in pain. That is why I don't spend half my life doing ministries. I still have a job to do.

I only do those ministries that my talents can excel in. I won't simply walk into a ministry that I am not capable or not suitable. of course there's no harm trying to see if it fits me or not.

Aiyoh, of course works cannot make one righteous. But works is a manifestation of your process of sanctification ! The result of your transformation, makes you want to serve for his glory and have a heart of servanthood.

Works are the fruits of your labour. Get it?

Actually, I don't really believe in the power of altar call. Correct me if I am wrong, I have never read anywhere in the book of Acts, about alter call.
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Let me put it this way (I'm trying to help you, really)

Until you can come to a place before God and say,

Dear God, I submit to your will. Even If I don't see my potential wife, I will be contend with you alone to fill my emptiness.

Until you can come to that place, you'll probably not get what you want.

Until you can say I don't need a wife if it's not your will, you will pursue and not find.

I know it's hard to accept this. I know it's not easy.

But bro and you're wrong to say I don't understand.

you're so very wrong.

I was like you, seeking my life partner like my life depends on it.






unknown warrior
post Nov 19 2012, 10:36 AM

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QUOTE(OlgaC4 @ Nov 19 2012, 10:34 AM)
Jesus is your first love. Love him first.
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Amen. notworthy.gif
unknown warrior
post Nov 19 2012, 10:44 AM

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QUOTE(OlgaC4 @ Nov 19 2012, 10:33 AM)
I got a friend which he is very good cell leader but some how his faith is not really strong as i am. He is very good in the bible verse but his faith is not that strong when he is facing challenges.
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Erm don't be surprise, some pastors also.

But I notice that God uses people who depend on Him totally even though they seems to exhibit weakness.

God will come in and fill you up when you admit your weaknesses, not your strength.

It takes humility to admit before God, I'm not strong and I don't think I can do it without you God.

Just need simple Faith. That's all. A mustard seed Faith is powerful enough for God to work through you.






unknown warrior
post Nov 19 2012, 11:25 AM

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QUOTE(OlgaC4 @ Nov 19 2012, 11:18 AM)
Not in Malaysia but i have heard in Indonesia. A young pastor told me.
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http://jesuscallsmalaysia.org/MINISTRY-IN-...&doit=showclass


I've been there before, prayer tower in PJ, near amcorp mall.

One of the many testimonies.

1)
Torn ligaments and tissue heals instantly without going through the normal process of body recovery

2)
two hairline fractures to rib bones healed instantly.

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Nov 19 2012, 11:55 AM
unknown warrior
post Nov 19 2012, 03:20 PM

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QUOTE(Alvin330000421 @ Nov 19 2012, 10:24 AM)
Do you pray earnestly to find a wife. But don't bother to go out there to meet people? Always stay at home do nothing? You're not walking the talk.


Actually, I don't really believe in the power of altar call. Correct me if I am wrong, I have never read anywhere in the book of Acts, about alter call.
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It's alright to pray such prayer, nothing wrong. And it's alright to go out to meet people, that should be the way after prayer.

But my point is, if you still couldn't meet somebody, don't despair and focus so much on it until it affects your emotions to the point of pain.

That is like saying, you couldn't bring yourself to trust God. It's evident when you say you want to find a none Christian life partner because of no choice.

There's always joy in hope, brother.

I encourage you to come to a point of trusting God for a partner that even if you failed to meet, you're still intact and would prefer God bringing the right one to you.

One more thing. I leave this to you. Do not for one moment think by finding a life partner, it solves all your loneliness problem. It may add more problems. lol. laugh.gif you know why?

Having a life partner is really a journey to adapt to each other's whims n fancy. It may not be easy because some people refuse to change. Might be easy to say I'm willing to change for her until you get older and realize you yourself change in as your progress in age.

And to adapt with the same partner for life is really no easy task. I will say this and I believe it is right to say this.

There's no such thing as a perfect life partner. But When God gives you, it will be the right one where there's room to grow and adapt in both of your life through hurts and disappointment by his grace.


About Altar call, it really depends on the prompting of God's spirit in you.

If you get convicted for an altar call, go for it.





unknown warrior
post Nov 19 2012, 10:20 PM

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QUOTE(Jedi @ Nov 19 2012, 03:02 PM)
while I agree on this part, the protestants only have 2 Sacraments out of RCC and orthodox 7, mainly Sacrament of Eucharist which still needs priest - the role of Persona Christi. However we will not talk about this because its entirely different issue of our difference in opinion of actual presence of Christ in Eucharist.
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The Catholics are still preserving traditions and rituals as in the days of old Testament. That's why you practise sacraments and rituals. But you'll hardly hear this passage of the scripture below, preach in the RCC.

Hebrews 8:6-7
But the ministry Jesus has received is as superior to theirs as the covenant of which he is mediator is superior to the old one, and it is founded on better promises. For if there had been nothing wrong with that first covenant, no place would have been sought for another.

Here the Holy Spirit on purpose mention the Covenant of the OT is faulty and has something wrong . You can see the verse above and below.

Hebrews 8:8
But God found fault with the people and said: "The time is coming, declares the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah.

Hebrews 8:13
By calling this covenant "new," he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and ageing will soon disappear

It is link to the verse below where it talks about priest of old representing the people to God. God has made that covenant obsolete.

Hebrews 10:11 says.
Day after day every priest stands and performs his religious duties; again and again he offers the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins.

The reason priest need to stand is because they can never rest, for their work is not perfect is will never appease God perfectly. Jesus on the hand as our High Priest sat down at the right hand of God because his sacrifice is perfect and acceptable to God. He does not need to offer to God over and over again just like the priests of old. He sat down indicating his work is a complete finished atonement.

Therefore based on this scripture, Jesus is our High Priest today interceding on our behalf to the Father. Not human priest. Not saints, neither Mary.

Read here

Hebrews 7:26-28

26 For it was fitting for us to have such a high priest, holy, innocent, undefiled, separated from sinners and exalted above the heavens; 27 who does not need daily, like those high priests, to offer up sacrifices, first for His own sins and then for the sins of the people, because this He did once for all when He offered up Himself. 28 For the law appoints as high priests men who are weak; but the oath, which came after the law, appointed the Son, who has been made perfect forever.

The passage here gives the idea that it is fitting that only Jesus becomes our High Priest. The Holy Spirit purposely mention under the Law of the Old Covenant, the 10 commandments and law of Leviticus, Man who becomes Priest to represent us to God, they are called weak. The word weak means not as divine as Jesus.

So to say The saints are full of grace, divine or highly favoured and hence you still need them to practice the traditions of old, you're in essence not putting yourself under the New Covenant but of the Old which is obsolete.

QUOTE(Jedi @ Nov 19 2012, 03:02 PM)
It does seem so when you look at it from the out, if you see the situation I presented at the last part, Saints and Mary present our prayer to God, and petition God to grant our wish - in a role, accelerate the process by granting our prayers faster in cases of unanswered prayers. It is not the primary prayer that we use, only with Christ like a christian does.
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Not supported in scripture, brother. This is man's reasoning. The Catholics mainly rely on this logic, If my prayer are not answered, I need to pray to the saint as backup or to speed it up. Bro I can fully understand the need for answer to prayer but it must be based on scriptures. This idea of praying to the saints actually denotes that Jesus is NOT the only mediator which is already contradiction. It's very hard to justify 1 Timothy 2:5. You can give 100 solid reasons but it still contradicts the meaning of one mediator. One mediator is one mediator.

Besides, it can sideline to a dangerous heresy. In the sense you put your Faith more on the saint rather on God or Jesus.
The Bible says very clearly

Jeremiah 17:5
This is what the LORD says: "Cursed is the one who trusts in man, who depends on flesh for his strength and whose heart turns away from the LORD.

You cannot deny there's this tendency to revered Apostles and Mary on the same level as Jesus by practising this. Now I didn't use the word worship but you can see how it's very possible to end up as such. That could lead to idolatry.

QUOTE(Jedi @ Nov 19 2012, 03:02 PM)
Did I? if so, it is my mistake. only God have the power to authenticate any prayers or wishes.
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Well you said this.

"But asking for intercession (1 Timothy 2:1) from live, holy people is very biblical, due to the power they have (James 5:16, 2 Peter 1:4)."

QUOTE(Jedi @ Nov 19 2012, 03:02 PM)
Yes you are right, we are Saints on Earth (Psalm 16:3) I did state too, Saints in Heaven pray together with us, like our family and friends here on earth and in addition like you said: [t]he prayer of a righteous man has great power in its effects" (Jas. 5:16).
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Yes we are all Forgiven in Christ, justified and righteous by Faith. Not of your works. I can point this on tons of scripture verses that is in line with this.

Therefore your prayer can be akin to prayer of Man righteous as in James 5:16 when you based your righteousness by Faith in the finish work of Christ.

You are THAT righteous man and in turn your prayer is powerful and effective.

The only problem is that, do you have Faith to believe that?

If you cannot believe that and need to rely on your obedience or good works to be deemed as a righteous Man, then the foundation of your doctrine is already lost. Your righteousness falls on your works which is of the flesh or self effort. I call that self glorification towards God which is not biblical because the rest of this world's religion work in the same manner.

And You cannot use the scripture in James where it says Faith without works is dead, because that scripture is use to justify for doing the work of God in the context of Love which of course need action and not just mere empty talks. That's why it says, Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by what I do. Faith and action works hand in hand. But the key point in all scripture of the New Covenant is that only our Faith is credited as righteousness.


QUOTE(Jedi @ Nov 19 2012, 03:02 PM)
"Since all the faithful form one body, the good of each is communicated to the others. . . . We must therefore believe that there exists a communion of goods in the Church. But the most important member is Christ, since he is the head. . . . Therefore, the riches of Christ are communicated to all the members, through the sacraments."480 "As this Church is governed by one and the same Spirit, all the goods she has received necessarily become a common fund'' Catechism of Catholic Church 947 - which sums up theologically since its not long-winded and precise to the point

Anyway, yeah, thats RCC and Orthodox practice though. You know, I discussed this with prophetjul and in the end, after all theological discussion he said something that u RCCs always try to justify yourselves with human reasoning of this biblical context, leaving the original context loose. Well, so much for all this. That is why it comes to a point where, I will try to answer your question if you have any though, but that is it, to avoid conflicts. Because I really love to share and to listen and to experience unity. and Believe me, I am very very young (21 yr old), trying my best to serve the Lord too. I am very grateful though, to have experienced and receive help from senior brothers, the Church etc and to experience love. Therefore brother, please forgive my ignorance in certain issues, particularly when it comes to theology, where here explains how the disagreement with Communio Sanctorum came about during the Reformation, and in which this maybe more of help: - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communion_of_Saints and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intercession_of_saints

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Prophetjul? Don't mind him, He's like the jihadist of our Christian Faith.

His ministry is very much towards a Ministry of Sin condemnation and Brimstone and Fire. tongue.gif

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Nov 19 2012, 10:48 PM
unknown warrior
post Nov 19 2012, 10:22 PM

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QUOTE(Jedi @ Nov 19 2012, 03:29 PM)
Yes, unfortunately I do not have the time to browse many pages for now (give me a few weekends). I really like your sharing on Faith.
However, for Christians, Faith must go hand-in-hand with works - I shall come back with this during the weekend okay? thank you!

Peace be with you all. Have a blessed weekend ahead.
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God Bless and shalom to you too. notworthy.gif

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Nov 19 2012, 10:48 PM
unknown warrior
post Nov 19 2012, 10:24 PM

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QUOTE(skydrake @ Nov 19 2012, 04:37 PM)
Be frank, I really going thru these process before. I despair so much until I could not think of anything and I started to blame "the world", and slowly I begin to realise that things will get better after I patiently moving to the right path & pray. In these process its proven that I make myself stronger not because of what I gain, its having faith from lord that makes me calm. Its hard for me to describe these feelings.. its just calm and joy that appear from inside.
And I totally agreed this quote below also. Life partner won't solve all our loneliness problem, I have this feeling of loneliness even I have my life partner or soul mates. Lucky me, this feelings does not haunt me any more after I truly surrendering myself to lord and give my trust for all.
Thank you UW for putting all my feelings that I going thru before into words so I can learn how to put my thought into words in future, I'm really bad at expressing my thought and feelings into words.  nod.gif
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John 15:5
"I am the vine; you are the branches. If a man remains in me and I in him, he will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing.

The Calm and joy in you is the Manifestation of the Holy Spirit in you.

It's very true, even Married couples at time can feel loneliness especially when one doesn't understand each other in fights and arguments.

And Even When you're married for many years, you can also feel like unfulfilled in emptiness because only God can fill that vacuum in our Heart.

To balance up, Great Marriages happen when you put Christ as the Centre.

The Bible says In Christ, All things are held together! Christ is our glue. biggrin.gif

When you look towards Jesus, automatically, the strength of God's Love is imparted into us to love each other even more.

The Key secret in marriage is to please Our Chief Shepard. And through Him, The strength of a family is held together.

Colossians 1:17
He is before all things, and in him all things hold together.

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Nov 19 2012, 11:24 PM
unknown warrior
post Nov 19 2012, 10:25 PM

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QUOTE(OlgaC4 @ Nov 19 2012, 05:30 PM)
Find God as your life partner.


Added on November 19, 2012, 5:34 pmwhat ever church you are. Unity in Christ does not needs uniformity.
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Agreed.
unknown warrior
post Nov 19 2012, 10:26 PM

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QUOTE(pehkay @ Nov 19 2012, 06:03 PM)
biggrin.gif ... quite active today
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Well, you're missing in action too. hmm.gif

unknown warrior
post Nov 20 2012, 09:39 AM

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QUOTE(Alvin330000421 @ Nov 20 2012, 09:00 AM)
Bro/fren,

I know one guy who is very pious. Yes he did the same as you say. Now he is 45 years old and still single !

You get the whole meaning wrong. You still have to go and find. Not say "Duh, I submit to god's will but I am going to continue to sit down here and do nothign about it". If you are a gold prospector, you don't go prospecting gold in your toilet. If you are an insurance salesman, you don't go and sell to people who already have policies, you will go and target the graduates who just came out to work.

If you have a gun, you have to aim it so the bullet reach the destination, not shoot up the sky.

I am not empty ok. I am just figuring out how to do this.
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One Question, asked twice.

Do you think God is not able to bring the right life partner to meet you?

Do you think He lacks this power?
unknown warrior
post Nov 20 2012, 09:40 AM

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QUOTE(Deadlocks @ Nov 20 2012, 09:27 AM)
LOL. You speak of battles between your desires, and enlightenment. It's hard to be human, and serve God at the same time, ain't it?

Here's a short answer: Seek wisdom.
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honestly, I'm kinda impressed.
unknown warrior
post Nov 20 2012, 10:43 AM

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QUOTE(skydrake @ Nov 20 2012, 09:44 AM)
good day alvin,

uw did not say that u can sit down n let god spoon feed u, u r right that if u sit down n wait for god to give u a wife is wrong.

he means to tell u that you r empty in your soul, you are not empty from your daily knowledge. you are still not connected with god, u need to understand whay uw told u was from bible and it will helps u to create a connection with god. then god will leads u the way.

from all u had mentioned, i can see that u r counting
on your own knowledge to deal with this matter. In other word to say, you are walking alone without letting god to assist u.

my friend, having own knowledge is very limited, u need to understand and do what the bible told, u can say what i told was wrong. the way u understand bible nor gods word are with your own point of view.. not the real understanding of bible.

i m not trying to proof myself right, i just wants to help u. i hope u can be patient, i had meet ppl that reading the bible for 10 years or 20 years, they may not understand bible if they not willing have the gift "faith" thats cames from god.
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Everybody have different needs Skydrake,

For Alvin, It's a life partner, For some to have children, others Finance, For some Healing from body sickness, etc.

All these fall under this verse of God's promise

Matthew 6:25
"Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life........

Somehow the devil knows the things that worry us through our actions and words spoken in confession and will not hesitate to use it against us to disrupt your peace of mind.

The Holy Spirit already said this in

John 14:27
Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid.

Philippians 4:6
Do not be anxious about anything, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God.

and in

Matthew 6:8
for your Father knows what you need before you ask him.

I believe, the reasons why our prayers can be hindered:

1. We don't trust God enough. Lack of Faith.
2. We worry.
3. We let our hearts be troubled and fearful.

These symptoms, I believe will allow the devil to operate anxiety and slow down or hinder the answers.

It's not that the Devil has powers against God. No for sure not, but here's the secret as to why and how.

The devil know he can't touch God. But he can affect the believer to doubt God and hence that's why, things doesn't flow.

The problem is our worrying.

For Alvin, he worries he'll grow old without a partner and perhaps due to age is catching up.

That kind of fear can grip a believer's life to the point of doing things outside the will of God, like looking for unbelievers as life partners.

I hope this sharing helps you in your journey with God.










unknown warrior
post Nov 20 2012, 10:46 AM

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QUOTE(OlgaC4 @ Nov 20 2012, 10:22 AM)
I am just saying not comparing my bro.
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Keep on growing Olga, I encourage you brother.

I can see you have sincere heart for God.

God Bless.


unknown warrior
post Nov 20 2012, 12:23 PM

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Aiyo it's okay lah guise.

We all learn and strive to improve from our mistakes.


unknown warrior
post Nov 20 2012, 12:25 PM

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QUOTE(OlgaC4 @ Nov 20 2012, 12:04 PM)
Arrogant and confident are 2 different thing.
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Just be careful to put confidence in the Lord rather than self confidence.

because self confidence was what happened to Peter that caused him to deny Jesus 3 times.


unknown warrior
post Nov 20 2012, 12:31 PM

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QUOTE(OlgaC4 @ Nov 20 2012, 12:29 PM)
With holy spirit only the Pondan disciple became brave.  rclxms.gif  rclxms.gif  rclxms.gif
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hahaha laugh.gif
unknown warrior
post Nov 20 2012, 12:33 PM

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QUOTE(skydrake @ Nov 20 2012, 12:30 PM)

thats why i wants to point it out.. hope next time when my turn to make mistake, i wants to all to point my mistakes too  nod.gif
without mistakes I makes, I will never grow up.. I don't wants to be babies  cry.gif

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God honours this type of attitude.

no self-confidence but God-confidence.

As long you're always to open to learn and admit mistakes, God can fill you up fast.


unknown warrior
post Nov 20 2012, 06:19 PM

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QUOTE(pehkay @ Nov 20 2012, 05:12 PM)
The Problem of Spiritual Knowledge without Experience

All spiritual experiences begin with a certain amount of knowledge, but once we have the knowledge of spiritual experiences, it is easy to consider that we have the experiences themselves. This is especially true for young believers. To have knowledge is one thing, but to have the experiences of life is another. If we hear a person testify with spiritual knowledge, we may think that he has the experiences of the Christian life, the church life, and the Spirit. In the first stage of the Christian life, however, what we mainly have is knowledge. Our knowledge needs to be tested by failures, trials, temptations, and many troubles. The more knowledge the Lord affords us, the more He will put us on the test.

In just one year, a believer can gain much spiritual knowledge. Then he may think that he has everything. He may believe himself to be the most wonderful, advanced, and spiritual believer. What he has, however, may be ninety-five percent knowledge in his intelligence, not experience. According to knowledge, he may seem to have been in the Lord for many years, but in actuality he has little real experience. When the Lord puts such a one on the test, he finds that what he has is nearly all knowledge.

There are many different ways the Lord puts us on the test. One is that at a certain point He withholds His hand from us and lets us fail. After we are saved, the Lord’s hand sustains us, but at a certain point He will withdraw His hand. He will leave us to ourselves, and we will be sure to have a failure. That seems terrible, but in actuality it is not. The Lord is very wise. In this way we see that what we thought we had was not real.

Another way the Lord puts us on the test is to give us trials. The number of ways that the Lord has to give us trials is inexhaustible, including physical matters, family matters, and many others. Moreover, trials often do not come by themselves; one trial follows another. The Lord gives us many trials to test us. Then we are in the “fire” to be “burned,” and in this burning we come to know how much of what we have is merely knowledge in our mentality, and how much is real experience. Then we discover that we have little real experience, perhaps only five percent or even one percent of what we thought we had. Little by little we find that the greater part of what we have is merely knowledge in our mind.

We should be advised and warned to be in fear and trembling and to have no trust in ourselves. If we have any trust in ourselves, it is easy to be tempted. This temptation is another kind of test. Temptation comes to us when we have some trust in ourselves. Because our heart is deceitful, the trust we have in ourselves is often in secret. Sometimes we do not even admit it to ourselves. The only way for the Lord to prove that we have a secret trust in ourselves is to allow temptation to test us. When we are tempted, we realize that we have self-trust and self-confidence. These temptations prove to us that we are not competent, that we are not good enough to trust ourselves, and that we are not good enough to meet the situations. Whenever this kind of temptation comes, we always fail. Even if we try our best, we simply cannot make it because the Lord’s hand is withheld from us in order to allow us to meet the situation alone and prove that we are not competent for anything.

By all these tests we will realize how little we have and that what we mostly have is knowledge in the mind. Then something real will come out of this burning, and we will begin another stage. We will be equipped and further nourished with spiritual knowledge. We will know things in a deeper, fuller way. Then even though we have learned the lesson of the first stage that knowledge is not real experience, we will once again consider that we have much and have become rich. We will once again enter into a dream that we are spiritual and have acquired much. Then in the same principle, the Lord will put us on the test again. This is the process of the Christian experience.

The process of Christian experience can be compared to a potter with his clay. First, the potter paints a design on the clay, making it look beautiful. After being painted, however, the clay must be put into the fire to be burned. The Lord as the Potter always paints us first and then puts us through the fire to be burned. Day after day He operates according to the same principle in order to work something of Himself into us, first by spiritual knowledge and revelation and second by testing. This is the reason that many of the Lord’s children, after hearing a message and gaining some knowledge and revelation, are put into testing. The more we are clear about this process, the more we will be saved from troubles. This will humble us.
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yup, the end result is complete trust and reliance on God.

that's is the rest, the Holy Spirit talks about in Hebrews 4:1.

It took awhile for me to wrestle away from the trust of man to be pinned to God.

was a painful journey.




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