Well, the title says it all , yup i'm into phase cooling and hope to drag along a few of you guys with me .

I've done watercooling and watercooling + pelt but still i've got that craving for more extreme temps to toy with, it's either DI/LN or refrigeration/phase change.. since i'm into a more long term usage instead of benchies, then the choice is clear.. phase change here i come.

First and foremost thanks a lot to my sifu Bulkhy ( for a start i'm using his xillix till i diy my own multi phase) and our mod PCcrazy whose been nothing but help and guide me to come out with this thread. There are already some forumers who'd done phase cooling please share your experience here. TQ. Let's make this thread at par with those overseas thread (expecially those singaporean VR-Zone one.. even though we're far from it but we're workin on it).

O.K enough of this muchy and goey ghey crap lets get down to business.

PHASE CHANGE / REFRIGERATION
The Main Components and how duh it works (sorry I won't go into details till the "history of refrigeration")

Please refer to the "hand made" diagram below whilst i'll explain.


1. Capillary Tube/Line

(And you guys thought i'm gonna start with the compressor hehehehe.. ) The main purpose of the line is causing a pressure difference. A supply of liquid refrigerant enters the cap line ; this liquid is then forced to travel through a very thin piece of tubing (capillary tube/metering device). The liquid exits the line and boils off into a vapour as it does so it absorbs heat!
*Note: The phase of the refrigerant has changed, from liquid to gas, thus the name 'phase change'.

2. Evaporator

Car Evaporator

Chilly1 Evaporator (cause Xillix's evap using the same design)
The caps line now sprays tiny droplets of refrigerant into the evaporator. The evaporator is the component that removes the heat from the evap's head (that touches the proc).The Evaporator is the equivelent to the block on a H2O system. This is also where the Phase-Change occurs. Liquid refrigerant makes it's way to a larger volume of space and changes it's phase from a liquid to a vapor, or boils off.

This post has been edited by amok: Jul 1 2005, 03:01 PM

continues...

3. Compressor

Well as the names states it compresses. Compress what? It compresses the refrigerant from gaseous state to liquid state.. so gaseous state refrigerant from the evaporator is being compressed to vapour state (high pressure refrigerant) in this contraption. It does this by using a piston, slightly similar to the one in the car. The actual design and power of the compressor vary, just like you have different types of pumps in your normal water-cooling loop, as pic below:

Animated picture courtesy of refrigerationbasics.com
Thus, one can say that in time (when the compressor is ON) it will generate heat due to the friction of the piston against the cylinder.. (do take note cause this will help to get the idea of designing the casing of the phase cooling set).

4. Condensor

Yup it's bulkhy's condensor (looks almost the same as a car evaporator and w/cooling radiator but diffn in a way and design). This cools the refrigerant that is under pressure (vapour) allowing it to condense and turn into a liquid (as in my diagram in the first post). The condenser, looks similar to the evaporator, however in most cases is the larger of the two. The condensers main purpose is to dissipate the heat from the compressed vapour to the surrounding air or water. In another word this condenses the refrigerant gas to a liquid. The liquid heads off to the capillary tube (capline ), and then refrigeration process is carried out again. The Condensor can be either liquid cooled or air cooled (wif fans of course).

5. Filter/Drier

Drier used to hold moisture to keep it from reacting with the refrigerant. Which will produce harmful acids which will erode the line or damage the compressor. Also containing a filter/screen that keep small particles from blocking the capillary tubing or expansion valve.

continues..

This post has been edited by amok: Jul 1 2005, 03:59 PM

.. continues..

6. Refrigerant (gas... no not the one from your behind)
Here are the refrigerant table for refrences of names and boling points of each refrigerant.

The refrigerant is the working fluid in the system and provides the means by which heat is shuffled around in the system. There are many types of refrigerants, some run at lower temperatures, but require a lot of pressure and powerful compressors and vice versa. Refrigerants are basically different by the temperatures at which they boil at. And don't think you can just swap out one for another. Some you can and some you cant. Usually when DIY'ing a phase cooler, the refrigerant used determines the what/which compressor to choose.

Well that's basically explained how phase cooling works.. but i'm not done yet

Okay, now let's take a look at my sifu's xillix direct die (single phase) cooler..

This baybeh is handmade (except for the compressor) and below is the fully insullated evap head with the mounting bracket.


Next is prepareration of installation (for those whose seen the pelt insullation guide it is almost simillar except that this time i had to use loads of them dielectric grease).

This post has been edited by amok: Jul 1 2005, 04:01 PM

for my first attempt in phase cooling, the victim will be my ABIT NF7-S Rev 2 mobo.. (O.T. :at first i was thinking of selling it to hmspower... but naaah he'd got a mobo ledy summore he want to break the Mobile Xp record which i'm eyeing for oso watch out dinster) Okay ere's the pic of the mobo:


And I'll be using the Brush-On Electrical Tape.. again.. (thanks arj ),


Here's what my mobo looks like after being brush with the electrical tape twice (two layers).. noticed that i didn't fix any electrical tape around the socket and centre slug of the socket this time.. why? cause this time i'll be using the dielectric grease around it and in the centre.. cause bulkhy sent me plenty of those grease (thank you sifu).

And brush-on the back side... Okay i'll add more pics as progression goes.. now waiting for the liquid to dry.

EDIT: currently i'm stuck with some technical glitch hope can sort it out by today cause i wanna wrap this thing as soon as possible. Neway i'll finished the insullation part:

okay here is the backside pics fully covered with elect tape.


Since the cooler comes with a back plate, i highly recommend that we sort out the backside first before it started to give me a pain in the a$$ later on.

Get a 3/8" thick neoprene sheet and cut it to cover enough of the back side socket area and give about 1/2" more just to be safe. Here's how to poke a hole in neoprene.

Tadaaa..


continues...

This post has been edited by amok: Jul 2 2005, 04:39 PM

... continues...

okay, come let's do the center slut/slug area.. just squeeze the dielectric grease to cover the whole center slug.
The dielectric grease supplied by bulkhy.


till it looks like this

Next is the socket pin hole.. use finger to press in teh grease into the hole till you'd see a pool of grease inside every hole (several time of spreading and pushing)

Wokey.. next up as usual, an 1/8" neoprene sheet cut to size enough to cover the center socket slut./slug.

next is the neoprene around the socket..
]
tada.. socket done.


Well the mobo is done insullated.. fix back the nb fan, and remount on the mobo.. affix gfcard blah,blah blah, hd, fron panel switches etc.


...continues...

This post has been edited by amok: Jul 2 2005, 04:58 PM

... continues..

awright.. this is how my look like..

b4 mounting the evap head, i've decided to fire up the cooler.. this is where the technical glitch occurs.. i'll get back to post as soon as it's sorted.

EDIT: wokay.. glitch sorted, so this is the temp reading seconds after the cooler is switch ON,

.. suddenly another problem occurs, my temperature probe broke!! , the thermocouple sensor, I think was broken to sudden movement/bent on very-very cold temp.. so sorry no more probe temp reading.

And now, i'd to wait for at least an hour before mounting the evap head to the socket mobo.. so i'll update again later.

EDIT: ergh.. ... don't you just hate it when there is one of those days everything goes wrong?.. well it happens today, i've got my replacement temp probe... was all jolly excited, but then this happens:


it was the fan that suppose to keep my condensor cool!!!.. ergh. All'n'gap, hurry up get back to M'sia will ya.

as a consolation here a pic of the evap's head when fully operational at -27C (justttt before the blade broke)

ais kacang anyone?

EDIT: 07/07/2005; still got some minor glitch with the phase cooler.. am trying to sort it out with bulkhy. sorry.
EDIT: 14/07/2005 AM; found out that the filter/drier was "rosak=blocked" so had to change em..


This post has been edited by amok: Jul 14 2005, 11:28 PM

cool mod dude...cant wait to see the result...btw..u using a mobile barton isit???

Cool mod cooler from amok.

woot....u r the man...
but barton-m can boot up at -'c ??

nice thread

This post has been edited by babyelf: Oct 9 2005, 06:31 PM

Great info there amok. Just a question, why didn't you use a rotary based compressor since it's lower in maintenance and size?

u just need da elephant super glue to fix dat fan...

* if u doubt bout it, come & check all of my broken blade fans are saved by da glue... includin my table fan... & its cheap tho than buyin new fan... ( dun use the RM2 one coz da material is sux - use rm4 one wit brand somethin like elleyes - i hardly remember the exact brand but it spell like dat... just make sure its really dry...

*if u want la... u can borrow my DMM wit temp probe (-40C lowest)... but not now since my fren usin it for his project or maybe u can PM me & we can discus... just dun spoil it la...

phase change mean change the phase of the cooling? like liquid to solid ?

yes but in this case its from liquid to vapour...from what i researched this is what i understand..but i`ll start from the compressor hihi..somehow i prefer it that way...here goes..correct me if im wrong..

It starts with the compressor. As the name states this is what compresses the refrigerant. At this point it is a gas and that's what it is designed to pump.

From here it pumps to the condensor. The top side of the condensor to be exact. By cooling the gas and compressing it, it will turn into the liquid needed to create the Phase-change. Out of the bottom of the condensor and into a filter is where the flow goes next.

Out of the filter there is a small diameter copper line called the
capillary tube or capline.
This is where the tunning of the system is done. The lenght and diameter is critical for the temperature of the evaporator.

The Evaporator is the equivelent to the block on a H2O system. It is what is mounted to the CPU or GPU. There are many different designs and I just happen to be working on one myself. It is simular to H20, in the fact that as much surface area that can be exposed to the refrigerant the better.
This is also where the Phase-Change occurs. Liquid refrigerant makes it's way to a larger volume of space and changes it's phase from a liquid to a vapor, or boils off. Refrigerant boils at a very low temp and that is the main difference between the dozens of types.
During this change it sucks up the heat and releases it's cold.

The return line, or suction line as it is reffered to has negative pressure in it. It is caused by the compressor pressurizing the high side, creating a low side in the return line, because the system is sealed. The refrigerant is now back in a gas form and is cycled again through the system.

hope it will help in the understanding of phase change cooling to those who are new.

Well, i'll try to edit my last post but kenot.. exceed the max allowable pics per post thinggy.. neway here's an update.

UPDATE: 14/07/2005 PM: now i'm back in business.. here's what i've been doing with the cooler today.

1. replace the capilary tube..(ori was 1/16" tube, replaced with a 2mm tube)

2. replace the filter/drier (replaced with a torino/italian interdryers filter)

3. replace the low side + high side nipple valve...
finished product.

closed up of low side valve and cap tube

4. vacumed the cooler

and... 5. charged the cooler


and the result after those modifications

-32C within 50 seconds!!!

EDIT 15/07/2005: Today after reinsulating the suction line with another layer of 3/8" of neoprene i've got this.

But unfortunately, the evaps head insulation was sweating with condensation (at -37C!!).. now must find a way to reinsulate the evaps head.

EDIT 18/07/2005: After a quiet weekend wif family now back in action, the evaps insulated ledy (haven't tested it yet cause lack of time).. and just oni now ordered the 135cfm fan from Alln'gap

EDIT 25/07/2005: Finally this afternoon recieved those 135cfm fans from all'n'gap , i'm in a roll again.. watch this space for results from the cooler

EDIT 26/07/2005: heheh, so today i curi tulang and try to mount the evap's head to the mobo under my boss's nose ( please do not imitate/replicate what i did today, it's a bad example set by me and am not responsible for any legal nor diciplinary action taken to those of you who curi tulang like i did today). Wokay, first and formost is the thermal interface compound or TIC.. here i used Arctic Ceramic (hoping it doesn't crystalize like AS5 at -35C)... and dabbing a generous amount of dielectric grease around the core and inner walls of neoprene.

then, come the hectic part which is mounting the evap's head on the mobo, it took me three tries b4 finally get it right (must ensure that the head make a clean and thorough contact with the core)

and now time to fire it up.. oops forget to mention and take pics of a thermal probe that i've fixed near the core nvm you've got the idea..
Okay result time... naaah .. make y'all wait a lil bit cause kasi suspense sikit.

This post has been edited by amok: Jul 26 2005, 05:04 PM

-32'c
can borrow arr let me test my proc for 1 week
emm, wen u wanna install in ur proc n let us to know the result after using XTREME COOLING

hehe.....ppl now all get into phasechange de...good thing....make a gathering ...u guys buy all ur stuff....den do a gathering where me and amok can teach u guys how 2 braze...and how 2 build 1....so make malaysians more extreme....we r abit slow de....lol..so stop watercooling now!!...lol..jkjk

yeeehaaa...!!!!malaysia boleh!!! -37 man verry nice temp...whats ur oc target??

my rig lastime
now HSF


Attached thumbnail(s)

yeah...build phase change...i'm now in process..my sifu is bulkhy

I would definitely join........ lets make one.

.. SIFU BULKHY is in the house, yeah , lets rock this joint , c'mon people lets join the sub zero's cooling clan .. now the Grand Master is back... sigh.. i wish aleck could be back oso.. (hint, hint)

FYI, i'm using a custom made Bulkhy's xillix cooler, for those whose interested in getting one of em can pm Bulkhy to custom made one suit for your needs, no two cooler is the same neither is the user .. .. it's a good training ground for those who're gonna DIY one yerself letter let it be Direct Die (single Phase) or Cascade (double or triple phase).

This post has been edited by amok: Jul 26 2005, 05:10 PM

huh....me ???

sorry guys...been out of da scene lately..

wish could join u guys like the old days....



well maybe when i get my own mill and lathe i can start back on track making evaps...blocks.....containers....


at the meantime.... keep up the good work amok

question, i wana ask bout the BUDGET to build a phase change cooler? rougly how much will it be? AND, i see dat u all use phase change ONLY for procs...how bout graphics card?

Mowgli@ Budget wise: the parts are not as expensive as a good watercooling set. Its the tools and skills required for assembling the parts that are a bit pricey. If you're interested, i'd suggest you pm bulkhy to custom made one for you.. cause currently he has all the tools needed to build one, just tell him your budget. All I can say is that it cost less than a good watercooling set... less a lot!!. Sorry can't discuss price in the forum, just pm him
As for graphic cards: Just wait for it

aleck@ woi bang... balik la sini... I'll need some evaps head for the upcoming project.

O.T.: sorry couldn't be around as much as b4, cause doing a lot of travelling.. mebbe during "puasa" month will less travel. And sad to say i'd to reformat my hard disk due to netsky virus... all my pics and logs of this project had to be deleted. . and you all know the forum rules, no claims without proof.. I'll start over this project during the "puasa" month and show it again (btw, you guys won't believe the temps, and clock i've got with this babey.. )

evap head.....
hhhmmm

Ill give you a hint...
get one of those zalman blocks from din..

youll be surprised at how easy to mod it into an evap

OCZ Phase Change cooler

http://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?showtopic=236957

Well, I'm reviving my phase project after a loooongggg delay, just watch this space..

Neway, here's Chilly1's store link for those who wanna short cut of DIY'ing the evaps head + mount.

Chill1 Evap Kit

Complete for installation just add water.... no lar add compressor + Condensor and off you go.

EDIT :JAN 19, 2006

Capn's log stardate 19... erh.. mr worf I want you to take No. 1 for No. 2 in the loo....

Just recharge with R22 for my chiller and this is what we got...



unfortunately i'm doing a StormG4 on presc'hot' test right now, just about to finish. after this i'll continue with the chiller project.. just wait for it.

EDIT 20 JAN 2006..

GULP



I've left the evap in a cup of water and went out for a smoke... when come back and got that cup of ice!!!! Now i'm having 2nd thought about doing it on my beloved MobileXP

This post has been edited by amok: Jan 20 2006, 05:35 PM

i also got delayed..b'cause of compressor....huhuhu...can't start
want credit to amok..b'coz he alwayz help me solve the problem thanks bro...sedozen kotak rokok hahahaha

Impressive...nice work there...go go go!

i got delayed my phase project because of this...my compressor can't start..i have change overload n ic relay to new one..i'm using flex cord wire and clip to join it..test overload and ic relay with multimeter no problem at all and 3 pin on the compressor also no problem



anyone has idea... thank you

bro, you're connection seemed alright... , and i'd recon you'd changed both the o/l and relay...

must diagonose the mechanical part of compressor then,

1. Is there any oil inside compressor?
2. If yes, is the color, viscosity, transparency still ok?

Cause i suspecting the compressing piston stuck with the cylinder.. How long was the compressor left unused?

Woooo bro.... i never visit the oc thread for so long. Your plan for phase change finally has been realize So when 2nd stage phase change??

This post has been edited by WhitE LighteR: Jun 28 2006, 08:50 AM

hehei taikor... long time no see, currently trying to fix a leak between the condensor and filter/dryer.. but got no time. 2nd stage in due time. mebbe on conroe perhaps

wow.....1st water cooling, then pelting now bulding 'iceland' for your beloved proc? (oh, for the record i jz read all 3 cooling threads today...so my knowledge of cooling is only so limited....so outdated nobody can imagine )

u really one dedicated lover of the OC..........<<salute>>

jz add one more.....if only i got some skillful fingers like urs instead of butter fingers

really kau tau to you all... it looks interesting in making one... but jus dun have the time.... and no place to put such big stuff around my com... hehe... however would like to know how much it would be to get it... bulkhy?? PM PM PM PM PM...

Where's the end product heh amok?

Hows the result?

i'll b bck

My vapo LS (modded) will be arriving in one months time...

be prepared for sub -50 temps...

you guys aren't the only two whose making a come back...

bro post sum result here dude
we all want to see liue

tok only....MIA for 6 months and mau ajak yum cha/DIY session like wan to die only. Bro sponsor zip ties can? And apa betik phase on Brisbane?

aiyoh.. no result lagi ka? is it trying to reach 5GHz by using AMD? but lately, tomshardware already reach 5GHz using this method also.. if im not mistaken.. but i guess, tomshardware story still new.. ur already 2years ago.. hehe.. u rox. sometimes i see malaysian modders more pro than outsiders..

This post has been edited by hafiez: Jun 23 2007, 10:50 AM

comeon guys....time to build a cascade cooler....temps around -70c easily. depends onwat refrigerants u use...i am using r22 on the 1st stage and r410a on the second....i get -75c in windows. I am trying to find r744a (nitrious oxide) as the boiling point is around -88c.....

---

Added on July 21, 2007, 2:43 pmhere's a pic of my cascade:



Still changing here and there...trying to get the best temps possible...but i doubt i can achieve much using r410a. Need at least r744a to reach -80C or r1150 to reach -100C

This post has been edited by extremeocer: Jul 21 2007, 02:43 PM

looks gd....
wanna planned to make one but still got no idea yet...lol
extremeocer mind teaching me? hehe

no prob....waddaya need to know?

wats the cost like, to build one?
cheaper than getting a vapochill LS?

First, tell me how much does a Vapo LS or Prommy Mach 2 GT cost. IIRC, its around RM3000?

Vapo Ls & Mach2Gt cost about RM3000 i think..

This post has been edited by kerryking: Jul 26 2007, 01:37 AM

nice cooling setup Extremeocer.... R744 is good, but you will found wall with dice problems, it sublimes @ -78c, so you wont achieve near to it when loaded. some where near -55c @ 185w would be realistic... anyway, why dont you use R410 on your 1st stage? its much colder than R22...
making cascade isnt that expensieve, the tools/refrigerant that makes it expensive.

it's around USD$700...so estimated almost RM3000. Building a phase change system can be real fun not to mention challenging.

Vapo LS and mach2 GT cools at around -30c on full load. Well, a selfmade one could cool at -40c and cost much cheaper. Now, the problem is that the tools cost quite a lot. Once you have the tools, then building a phase change cooling system will be very cheap. It's only a one time start up money that you hafte invest on.

still pinned?

is there no other people can continue this project?interested

This post has been edited by alive88: Feb 15 2008, 04:00 AM

Affordable phase-change on the way?

How about compact affordable phase-change cooling? See here : http://www.tomshardware.com/2008/03/14/the...change_cooling/

got no ppl want to play with it.. summore sure cost a lot to electricity..am i right??

Its like running a small fridge right? correct me if i am wrong

wrong... it doesn't consume that much electricity as its not always on... its much more efficient than TEC coolers.. no people play with it because its risky unless you have a temperature controller which shuts off the compressor as it reaches target temperature and turns on when its above...

This post has been edited by IcEMoCHa: Apr 10 2008, 09:01 AM

>>anyway, why dont you use R410 on your 1st stage? its much colder than R22>>>

you can't use R410 on the 1st comp. very high pressure, you can use R134a and R23 if you like to hit -70, but have to change the comp. oil.

PM me if you need small digital temp. controller.

Uh, I think I will pokai trying out one of this...budget only 200ringgit...but I still favor air or water(liquid) cooling.........Just so cool. This type makes your rig look like a science experiment. xD Much rather stay with water/

lol
where are the results?

can some1 share with me how to build an air cooler using phase change... like air-cond.... not wanna build a CPU cooler but a system cooler... to cool all the components and everything... like a small fridge

go out and buy a mini fridge the cheapest one is around RM500-600...

if you wanna make it simple and easy, just buy a mini fridge, rip off the back components, slap on to the side of your CPU door with one vent from the fridge. dont know what's the humidity of the fridge air tho, might wanna consider dehumidifying the air beforehand, or insulating your CPU innards.

---

Added on October 3, 2008, 6:56 pmactually if you buy 2nd hand no-brand old fridge... mayb can get rm50-rm100

This post has been edited by tajukagebunshin: Oct 3 2008, 06:56 PM

is it ok if i just mod the whole small fridge into a casing? sounds much easier i think. but i dunno if the lil fridge's lid is too durable to be broken easily. never done it before.
nevermind.
after done some googling, it seems that the fridge compressor is not capable of dealing with the constant heat output of cpu components

This post has been edited by xelrix: Feb 18 2009, 04:16 AM

result ?! where the result ???

Can't wait to get the result...

It depends on the compressor but those from small fridges would definitely be insufficient. CPU these days produces quite a number of "watts" The graphics card is even worse.

guys...i have some phase cooling stuff to sell....
so for those who r interested...pm me on which item u want...

-evaps made in msia
-evaps imported from USA ..made by chilly
-insulations
-dieletric grease
-customize phasechange casing...full alu...designed by me
-screw and hold downs



Attached thumbnail(s)

where the result bro....

All please sabar la.... I'm curious too but give him some time

any updateS?

OMG!
This thread is 4 Years Old
and still
dont hav any result -.-

can some1 share with me how to build an air cooler using phase change... like air-cond.... not wanna build a CPU cooler but a system cooler... to cool all the components and everything... like a small fridge

---

Added on October 4, 2009, 3:41 pmto make small cooling system, it possible, but i need to know your budget,
let me know the total WATT you need, i find the compressor capacity for you.




This post has been edited by ultralow: Oct 4 2009, 03:41 PM

Thread necro alert!
its 2010 and are there any ppl still using it?
I used to be an aircraft air conditioning technician-my basics about refrigeration are quite good hehehe..now I'm interested in building one, but looks kinda dangerous+pressurized gas and long term power consumption worries me..
when looking at ppl who used single stage/phase change- I think I'm done with WC'ing and its time to move on..

project abandoned... lol

yeah..looks like it
but in next few months time-looks like I have a new cooling project, but not necessarily involves highly compressed refrigerant lol..

lol..maybe kaboom liao

??

Anyone watched a video on youtube cpu cooling using liquid nitrogen

why is there nobody posting wnymore.. wud love to hear new things from this thread.

no need to this all la..just take ur cpu to the icy cool southpole-no need to pay electric bills and buy the parts..ahahaah

i think this project failed :/ im so keen on the updates too..

haihz these efforts are more like R&D rather than conventional cooling lol..

But i wonder does it make sense getting the cpu to below -30 degrees? i think you have reached the hardware limitations already.

great past time to play with

They use LN2 also can make it -198 Degree la... XD

Well you need to keep buying LN2 to do overclock
Phase change you can pretty much buy it and forget it unless need to retune for newer CPU
And phase change temperature is more stable so one less thing to think about when oc

Erm...1 tong of LN2 how much price edi a?



This post has been edited by LBYuan: Apr 28 2011, 06:37 PM

refer here
http://forum.lowyat.net/topic/873078

is this page dead ?? lol
its coming back with a kick !

Eh...if not mistaken, you were the one who made phase change ages ago?

hi david , yup i did bring in some WC brand as well as building a phase change unit back then .
Feel like coming back again .

It has been a long time bro!

hahaha its time its time , Watercoolers be ready

is it time yet?