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tsuyoshi
post Jan 21 2011, 05:24 PM

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QUOTE(shroom @ Jan 20 2011, 07:25 PM)
Dario, thank you for your reply.

Vendor's lawyer mentioned that there have been scenerios whereby consent took up to 9 months. Said he has to protect vendor's rights and insist on 1 year. (this is even with an additional 3 months extension) My lawyer agreed. Reason why I am concerned is that I get the impression that vendor thinks he can take his time through the paperwork. Because he's not living in Malaysia, he mentioned that he'll come back around end of Feb to sign the snp. And this is only snp stage....sigh...

Is there really no win win situation in this matter? Is there any clause I can add to protect myself. My lawyer is not being very helpful...
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I would think, if you are willing to wait out the 1year for the state consent... then the agreement that they will obtain state consent within that period should be a benefit to you.

Maybe get an undertaking from the Vendor to obtain the State Authority's Consent within that period of 1 year + a 3 month extension.

You may want to consult your lawyer on these, assuming that your lawyer has not already spoken to you about this nor inserted them into the Agreement -

(1) whether you can further enforce your rights in the manner speaking by asking for an undertaking from the Vendor to obtain the State Authority's Consent within the period and/or extended period.

(2) whether it is possible to include within the "termination by purchaser" clause, that by the failure, omission, neglect or refusal by the Vendor to comply with his undertakings and covenants under the Agreement, the Purchaser shall be given the option to terminate the Agreement. And, from the termination, the Vendor has to return to you, all monies he has received + pay an additional sum equivalent to 10% of the Purchase Price.

(3) whether it is possible to include in the agreement that the Vendor within 14 days from execution of the Agreement to make the application with all due diligence to the relevant state authority.

(4) who should appeal if consent is rejected, at whose cost.

Dariofoo, I would like to know what you think about inserting such clauses into the SPA agreement as well.... smile.gif
tsuyoshi
post Jan 22 2011, 11:03 PM

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QUOTE(dariofoo @ Jan 22 2011, 07:15 PM)
15 months is too long,brother!  smile.gif
Thanks for the input.

Bro, clause (1) is redundant is there is no need to ask for an undertaking by the vendor. If you don't mind me asking respectfully, do you understand the nature of an undertaking? It is a well-abused term which even lawyers use for no basis whatsoever. You'd be surprised!

For things like consent, it is the vendor's DUTY to do so within the stipulated period. If he fails and an extension is needed, the completion date would be automatically extended, to the benefit of the purchaser. The vendor doesn't need to UNDERTAKE to do it. He HAS to do it. It's compulsory.

Clause (2) must be there in every agreement. If consent is not granted the agreement is of no further effect and parties are restored to their previous position. Status quo, essentially.

Clause (3) would be of no effect as the vendor has a total of (for example) 6 months to obtain consent. It doesn't matter even if he undertakes to apply within 14 days.

Clause (4) - it is still the vendor. No changes there. Standard procedure.

Now, in an S&P, the underlying assumption and general rule is that the vendor would want to dispose off his property soonest possible and thus, you would notice that any delay by the vendor would result only in an extension of time to the purchaser, but any delay by the purchaser would entail a late penalty interest.

Some people might suggest that the vendor would want to 'delay' things and 'take his own sweet time to obtain state consent', but such arguments does not really hold water in reality because:

1) The purchase price is fixed. If during the period in which consent is pending, the market value increases, the vendor loses out. This is the BIGGEST risk that the vendor faces  sweat.gif ;
2) The vendor would still have to make his monthly instalment payments to his financier while consent is pending  sweat.gif ;
3) The reality of inflation and the depreciation in money - the longer it takes for the transaction to complete, the longer it would take for the vendor to obtain the balance purchase price to commit himself to a new purchase. There is a possibility that his intended new purchase would've increased in price as well during that period  doh.gif !

Hope the above clarifies things. What do you think?  nod.gif
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Very true, all of it... Now that I've come to think of it, 15 months is indeed too long smile.gif

Thanks for the clarification... I've learnt something new today. thumbup.gif

Just a few questions tho,

Is there anything that mentions that the Vendor has automatically (for example) 6 months to obtain consent? Or is it usually a period that is negotiated?

Can clarify about the nature of 'undertaking' further? ... I know it only as a formal guarantee, or promise or agreement to do something and it should be legally binding on the person who gave the undertaking.

tsuyoshi
post Jan 24 2011, 11:33 AM

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QUOTE(jalsrix @ Jan 24 2011, 11:16 AM)
My lawyer asked me to pay stamp duty for 5 copies of S&P, is it a normal practise for 5 copies ?

One copy for seller and one copy for buyer so why need 5 copies ?
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Wow, that's rather odd... Usually 4 copies would suffice... Maybe it's the normal practice for your lawyer's firm?
tsuyoshi
post Jan 24 2011, 12:00 PM

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QUOTE(jalsrix @ Jan 24 2011, 11:53 AM)
Why 4 copies when only 2 is enough ?
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Well, the other 2 is to be kept by the SPA lawyer as a 'Backup' of sorts... say for example, if by a miracle, both the seller and the purchaser 'misplaced' their copies, there is still 2 original duplicates kept with the lawyer.

I think there is actually another reason why the lawyers would keep extra... but i just can't seem to remember it sweat.gif
tsuyoshi
post Jan 25 2011, 10:30 AM

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QUOTE(Cannabis @ Jan 25 2011, 10:27 AM)
wow dario...very good legal advice....are you a lawyer in practice?
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Dario, that's the million dollar question, no? tongue.gif
tsuyoshi
post Jan 25 2011, 10:35 AM

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BTW Dario, is there any other situations that you need to obtain a blanket approval from the land office other than the Land being a Malay Reserve Land?
tsuyoshi
post Jan 25 2011, 11:45 AM

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QUOTE(dariofoo @ Jan 25 2011, 11:18 AM)
What do you mean by blanket approval,bro?
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Ok, let's put it into a situational context.

I understand from the fact that if someone, who is a Non-Malay, is buying a house on a Malay Reserve Land(MLR), that person would need approval from the state authority to be able to register his interest in the land, right?

In a different situation...

I would assume that if an empty land, being a MLR, is bought over by a Malay person (Let's call him "A") there is no problems to register A as the Proprietor of that MLR.

Let's say A is a Developer and has built a condominium on the land. Suddenly, A decides to broaden his market and decides to open the sale of the units to Non-Malays as well.

Since Master title then would need to be submitted for sub-division into individual titles...so, rather than waiting to see how many Non-Malay purchasers are willing to purchase the Condominium, A applies to the State Authority for a blanket consent on all the individual titles.

So, thus, the need for a blanket authority to be able to register a charge (by a Non-Malay Financier) or to register the new Proprietor (a Non-Malay) on all the individual titles...

Am I on the right track on this?



tsuyoshi
post Jan 26 2011, 07:45 AM

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QUOTE(vict @ Jan 25 2011, 11:29 PM)
Hi, need some advice on my Loan Documentation fees charge from the lawyer. My loan amount is RM400k and i manage to deal at RM6k, is it still expensive?
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Maybe you can provide a breakdown of your RM6k deal for the benefit of all?
tsuyoshi
post Jan 27 2011, 12:38 PM

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QUOTE(truth_seeker_09 @ Jan 26 2011, 11:15 PM)
I'm trying to purchase a shop lot.
can i know how is the s&p + stamp duty, loan legal fee +stamp duty, MOT will be calculated?
what else shall i aware of when signing s&p?

as from what i read here mostly are on resident property
Pls advise.


Added on January 26, 2011, 11:20 pmshop lot i meant is the shop lot in a shopping mall

Also, from my previous understand. the s&p for shop lot is non standard, can i know what shall i notice in s&p doc? as i'm lack of knowledge in law. Lots of agreement just sign with no so understand.
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Well, for the S&P part, you should wait till dario comes back from Gotham City for a full discussion...But, for my input, I'd say everything in the agreement should be looked at and are equally as important.

For stamp duty of the S&P, it is the same as when you purchase a residential property, and you have to pay the full amount for S&P.

Legal fee for loan and S&P is calculated as... 1% for the 1st 100,000 , 0.7% for the next 850,000 and 0.6% for the next 2,000,000.

MOT, for every RM100 or part thereof, is RM1 for the 1st 100,000. RM2 for the next 400,000 and RM3 for whatever after that.

My 2 cents however, is hire a lawyer to look at the agreement. Have him to explain to you over and over whatever you do not understand. That's why you are paying the lawyer. Don't sign blindly.
tsuyoshi
post Jan 28 2011, 08:07 AM

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QUOTE(truth_seeker_09 @ Jan 27 2011, 11:19 PM)
oic.. dario is professional in s&p? when he is coming back?

if for the property i put my wife name and i me is the borrower for the loan

is there any diff if i put property with mywife and my name? and also for the loan?

heard that it iwll be cheaper if put both name? is that right?
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Dario? well, you can read the earlier posts... he will be back this weekend.

No, I'm quite certain that even if you have 3 joint purchasers of the property, it won't be any cheaper...

But, if anyone has any knowledge on this, please do inform smile.gif
tsuyoshi
post Feb 7 2011, 12:37 PM

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QUOTE(dariofoo @ Feb 4 2011, 03:02 PM)
Tsuyoshi, the delay in replying to your query is because I can't seem to get my hands on a copy of the Malay Reservations Enactment of any State, for that matter.  sweat.gif

Generally, the requirements around disposal of a Malay Reservation Land (MRL) is very very strict.

The developer must be a 'Malay holding' within the definition of the respective Enactment. The chargee bank must also be within the similar definition.

When it comes to purchasers, it must be strictly only those who fall under the definition of Malay. From what I remember reading ages ago, the Selangor Enactment does not give any right to dispose a MRL to a non-Malay. The Kelantan Enactment, in contrast, has a provision for disposal to a non-Malay, subject to the consent of the Ruler-in-Council. Not too sure as to the actual wording of the provision, though.

As such, the issue of blanket authority/blanket consent in such developments does not arise as it will contradict the strict requirement of the Enactment, rendering it redundant and academic.

I'm not sure if there are many developments on MRL. As far as I know, it is mostly individual lots given to individuals. A lot of MRL are in rural areas. I doubt if there are MRL in hotspots or developing areas. Correct me if I'm wrong though.

In reality, you do find certain developments with a bumi quota, probably around 30%, of a high-rise development, for example. What happens if the quota is unsold and you want to open it to non-bumis? Then that particular purchaser has to apply for consent from the state authority. You can look at the 30% as somewhat of a MRL as well, but this time, the requirement is not stringent. It can be transferred to a non-bumi as long as state authority's consent has been given.  nod.gif
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Thanks for the info smile.gif

BTW, Happy CNY!
tsuyoshi
post Jun 7 2011, 06:36 PM

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QUOTE(dariofoo @ Jun 7 2011, 11:21 AM)
First thing which you must understand is that the terms of a contract is based on the understanding and mutual agreement of both parties. So, there's nothing the law can do to 'remove' that paragraph if it is merely unfair or unjust to you. If parties have executed it, then parties would be bound by it.

There are exceptions, of course - if there was undue influence, duress, mistake, or if the contract itself is based on something illegal.

Coming back to the issue at hand - what you have now is a Condition Precedent. It means that the contract will only kick off when you have obtained a loan within the time frame stipulated. If you can't obtain a loan an extension of time may be granted subject to the agreement of both parties.

Unless this condition is fulfilled, the contract would not kick off. The Ringgit XXXX sum would most probably be the balance 7% or 8% deposit.

So, unless you get a loan within the time period, the balance deposit would not be given to the vendor.

However, this clause is poorly drafted as it doesn't state the consequences if you fail to obtain a loan OR if the vendor does not want to grant you an extension of time after the 21 days have lapsed.

Unless there is another clause somewhere, or if there's a clause 3.3 which you have not inserted here.

What happens if you fail to obtain a loan? Would the 2% or 3% earnest deposit be refunded? Would the vendor be entitled to forfeit it? Perhaps you can check with the lawyer if it is not covered elsewhere in the contract.

On a final note - If you think that you need more than 21 days to obtain a loan - tell your lawyer to amend the draft and see if the vendor agrees to it.  icon_rolleyes.gif
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Hi, what Dario said is all true and all correct. I am assuming that this is a sub-sale/sub-purchase of a property.

You may want to start shopping for a financier to finance your purchase in the meantime.

But just to add on my 2 cents, if the Condition Precedent is not fulfilled, the consequences generally would be that the Vendor can (without sounding too legal)... "terminate" the agreement and return all parties to their "original position" as if the agreement has not been entered into. Well, quite unlikely that will happen unless the Vendor has obtained a higher price from someone else.

You can also turn towards the termination or default clause in your SPA to see what the Vendor can do if the Condition Precedents are unfulfilled.




tsuyoshi
post Jun 14 2011, 07:25 PM

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QUOTE(dariofoo @ Jun 14 2011, 10:17 AM)
1. Your 10% would be forfeited, unless there is a clause which provides for a refund in the event you fail to obtain a loan for the 90%. Check your SPA. You must note that the vendor has the option to go for specific performance against you, i.e. to compel you to proceed to purchase the property at the price of RM550K as agreed in the SPA.
Dario, just for discussion's sake, is it not that specific performance is usually aimed at the defaulting Vendor and not the Purchaser?

It's true that if the Purchaser defaults in his/her obligation, the 10% Deposit will be forfeited. But, if there is a clause of specific performance against the Purchaser, what happens in a scenario whereby the Purchaser cannot be compelled to proceed with the purchase for some reason like the Purchaser has been adjudicated bankrupt, etc?

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