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 Studying in the UK V3

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bgeh
post Dec 3 2010, 10:26 AM

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QUOTE(corad @ Dec 2 2010, 10:49 PM)
Apologies for the delayed reply. A break down of my fees are 14k for my course (Engineering) and 5k for college fees.

However for the college fee, I'm getting a weekly room cleaning, college formals (weekend dinner + wine) and free access to sports facilities. I pass these off as being fair since it would probably cost the same amount at other universities.

The British Parliment hasn't tabled the fee motion yet, but it's the consensus here that any subject under the science fee will continued to be subsidized.
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It's been more or less confirmed that the science budget (math included) will be 'protected' from the cuts, i.e. nominal funding will remain constant, but in real terms funding will fall due to inflation

It's also very likely, if not already certain that science & math subjects will also see the 3x fees rise for British/EU students. However, nothing has been said about fees rising for international students, as the universities themselves have always had the power to set fees for international students [and are unlikely to do a 3x rise, that'll disadvantage them significantly in the higher education market], but it appears likely that international students are going to have to pay more to offset the pretty savage cuts proposed (especially in the teaching and arts/humanities budget).

The bill for the raising of the cap for tuition fees will probably be tabled before Christmas, hence the large amount of protests by students to pressure the Lib Dems to kill this off (actually it's set next week!)

This post has been edited by bgeh: Dec 3 2010, 10:32 AM
bgeh
post Dec 3 2010, 07:25 PM

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QUOTE(LightningFist @ Dec 3 2010, 04:19 AM)
As it is, some schools' international students' fees increase by ~1000 pounds per year already, going up 7.2% from this year to 2011/2012. Others do and can increase by more.

The government is referring to sciences, but is less sympathetic towards mathematics in social sciences. Mathematics is kind of a science wherever you put it, but mathematics for/with/in economics, statistics, econometrics, possibly computing, financial engineering etc suffer when it comes to budgets. Of course many schools have the "critical" science, health, engineering, medicine etc so they get funding anyway.

@Corad you're right, because if someone was in London, the catered room rates would be close to 5000-6000 a year before the extra stuff you mentioned. But these are optional, and it's less for non-catered, and even less for outside London.
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Hm, I'm not sure whether it'll happen the way you speak of it. What'll probably happen is that most of the UK Research Councils in the humanities side will find themselves having (a lot!) less funds, and people doing multidisciplinary stuff involving some other fields which include the humanities will be less likely to get funding from those research councils. They could still apply for the science research council funding anyway. The government isn't going to be picking and choosing whether it'll cut which branch of the more applied maths, but it'll occur through the framework of the independent research councils, and no one knows what they'll do. The end effect is probably similar, but the way it occurs is likely to be quite different. I strongly doubt they will have much leverage to raise fees by much more, given that they're on track to be on par with many US public uni tuition fees pretty soon, if they're not already.

BTW, that ~1000 pound increase used to happen even in the good times, during my undergrad days tongue.gif

This post has been edited by bgeh: Dec 3 2010, 07:31 PM
bgeh
post Dec 24 2010, 12:39 AM

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QUOTE(LightningFist @ Dec 23 2010, 04:04 PM)
6.2 Since the introduction of Tier 4, there
has been a requirement that prevents students
on courses below degree level from being able to
stay in the UK for longer than three years. There
is presently nothing to prevent those studying at
or above degree level from extending their stay
indefinitely.
We need to ensure that all students
understand that Tier 4 is a temporary route, with
the expectation that students should return home on
completion of their course
.

We have considered whether, as an
alternative, we should extend to degree level
courses the rule which prevents sub-degree level
students from staying for more than three years.

If I were registered, I certainly would have voted Labour or Lib Dem. Why did a Malaysian politician urge Malaysians to vote for the Conservatives?
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Which Malaysian politician?

(I voted Lib Dems but they've not done much good for students sadly)

p.s. voting the conservatives probably helps fix the brain drain problem we seem to be suffering from tongue.gif

This post has been edited by bgeh: Dec 24 2010, 12:43 AM
bgeh
post Dec 24 2010, 09:08 AM

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QUOTE(LightningFist @ Dec 23 2010, 04:51 PM)
Yes, it might seem so. But the brain drain, while intrinsically against the imperatives and objectives of the country, are in some cases wholly good for those individuals or persons who have chosen to relocate.

Yeah, Lib Dems have let people down. But are people going to ever be satisfied with their governments? When Labour was in force, they were disliked. Obama was touted, and now the Americans have forgotten how enthralled they were by him initially? Do policies mean anything?

I cannot recall who, but a blogger noted his name. It is very recent (I believe Dec 2010), and can be found via Google.

The section goes on further, they are planning to scrap the post study work route after Jan 2011. I'm not even sure whether people will be allowed to stay 3/4 months or 2 years afterwards to look for work. The most deserving would have probably found employment prior to completing their education, I suppose.

The Lib Dems have gone into government and backtracked on most of their promises made prior to the election, using the cover of 'coalition' to put on conservative policy. It is this U-turn that's pissed most students off, not the satisfaction thing you're talking about above.

Policy does matter, else many here wouldn't be complaining about the closing about the PSW (which is a much more serious thing than the first passage you posted). tongue.gif

Ah well, it's the UK's loss
bgeh
post Dec 24 2010, 02:13 PM

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QUOTE(limeuu @ Dec 24 2010, 03:49 AM)
The feeling i get from this is that the current british gov is somewhat ambivalent about student immigration........

it is well know that students who immigrated into the country of their education benefit the recipient country.........the country gains a young worker, well educated and familiar with the country, likely of high intellect, and likely to contribute a lifetime of labour to the country, including taxes.........

on the other hand, it is well know that less qualified (and less desirable) students do get in as well, under the cover of such student migration pathway.........

it's this later bit they are trying to close......

the question is, how to close entry for 'low level' immigrants, while allowing 'high quality' immigrants to come in.....

perhaps the british gov could learn something from the aussies, who have a long history of taking in significant immigration, and usually selecting the best........they didn't get it right all the time, as is seen in the recent change in policy (they have the same issues with people coming in to study languages, diploma, trade certs etc, and staying on), but they have generally been successful in taking in young well trained immigrants in the skills based part of the programme (independent skill based and region/employer sponsored migration accounts for 70+% of all migration)...........

why anyone would want to actually migrate permanently to uk, however, is another question.......smile.gif
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They are very ambivalent about it. Prior to the election when challenged about their 100k net migration figure a year, and given the statistics about student immigration being one of the main contributors, they just kept avoiding the question. Well turns out it was in their minds all along.

Also, note that while the rhetoric they're using is that people doing sub-degree courses are staying back and working in the UK, which apparently isn't what they want etc, etc,... their proposals will affect those who do degree courses and above, and they could clearly fix that by stipulating a higher requirement for the PSW. But no mention of that is made altogether in the consultation documents, and this will affect the 'better' students along with everyone else. I think they're just playing to their galleries saying they're doing the right thing, while in reality to reach their very improbable target of 100k net migration a year, they've had to screw a lot of the non-EU students, talented or not. The rhetoric they're using is just merely to provide a convenient cover, which doesn't square with their proposals.
bgeh
post Apr 18 2011, 08:05 AM

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QUOTE(malayantiger @ Apr 17 2011, 07:39 AM)
Its not a bad thing what the current government is trying to do. During the last government (Labour), border checks were lax, resulting in mass immigration of peoples of the sub-continent into the UK.  This is done via 'backdoor' thru bogus marriage scams and private colleges. These colleges purportedly teach 'english'. They pay about £500 - £1000 to get a letter from the college to be used to obtain a student visa from the home office. They can simply renew their visas several times. I know of many indian co-workers here in UK using this route. Whilst some are genuine students, most just get a visa just to work. Duirng the boom times this was ok as jobs were plentiful. But nowadays joblessness is on the rise and the locals are up in arms and its become a national scandal. As a result the crackdown now affects the larger international student population.

However, I don't see how this affects Malaysian who are high quality, university students. For a bonafide student, the visa process is straight forward and painless, except the cost of applying for a visa has risen greatly. I paid nothing when I first came to UK. In fact, I did not even have to apply for a visa. You show your unconditional letter from your uni and some information regarding your finances, and get a stamp on arrival at Heathrow. I got three years straight away. If you are planning to come to UK and stay on AFTER your studies, i.e. get a job and hopefully gain PR, the rules have now been tighten. Again 'high quality' students are not directly affected, for eg. doctors and scientists which are sought after. Good luck to those planning to further their studies here. Any questions you can pm me.
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I wish that were true but there have been cases such as these:

http://www.varsity.co.uk/news/2498

and frankly, no postdoc on their first posting is going to come anywhere close to the 25k pound limit they set.

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