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Group LYN Buddhism Retreat - SERIOUS TALK, No trolling please

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eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 17 2010, 11:17 AM

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QUOTE(Joey-kun @ Aug 17 2010, 10:59 AM)
yes the bandits will get karma back, but Moganalla killed his parents in his previous life by beating them  to death, and not only in that last life of his that he died that way but in many previous lives as well.

That is the nature of Karma.

1. Karma is definite in that virtuous actions lead to happiness and non-virtuous to suffering.
2. Karmic imprints increase; the result is greater than the cause.
3. One will never experience a karmic result one did not create the cause for.
4. Karmic causes created are never lost.

So thats why we be very careful of the actions due to the nature of its reprecussion. It does not exhaust itself when it ripens.
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So if I get you correctly, good karmic seeds and bad ones (that one acquired throughout their lifetimes) will be in tact from since ages till now and will go on?
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 17 2010, 11:31 AM

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QUOTE(Joey-kun @ Aug 17 2010, 11:27 AM)
correct. They can only be removed using the 4 opponent powers. As long as they are not applied they will always be there. even when you have experienced the effects it will always be there. The 4 powers are:

1) The power of regret: One begins by reflecting on regret; the awareness that actions we have committed bring suffering to ourselves and others. This is not the same as guilt, which implies a negative and helpless state of mind and is not useful, but a sort of "intelligent regret," which is a very positive and creative mental state aimed at correcting the mistake so we won't repeat it.

2) The power of reliance: To correct our mistakes or negative actions directed toward either the Four Jewels or other sentient beings, we take refuge and generate bodhichitta. We rely on the Buddha who is our role model, the dharma that is the teachings of the Buddha, and the sangha.

3) The power of remedy (the antidote): These are positive actions of body, speech, and mind that we do to purify the negativity. This is "building the wall" of good karma. This can include kind deeds, chanting mantras, meditation, etc. and the dedication of the merit of what we have done to help anyone we may have harmed.

4) The power of resolve: This is our ongoing determination to never repeat the negative action and then not doing it again.
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But to me that does not sound like removing it. More like preventing bad seeds to be planted.

A Brother once told the students in my University in a Dharma Talk that good karmic seeds act as a hook to the door that is going to slam against you (bad karmic seeds), hence preventing one from being slammed by the door (effect). Also he said that it'll all be there until one reached enlightenment.

Well perhaps it can be from a different perspective, but both do does make sense.

This post has been edited by eXPeri3nc3: Aug 17 2010, 11:32 AM
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 17 2010, 12:01 PM

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QUOTE(soul2soul @ Aug 17 2010, 11:51 AM)
Some kamma are heavier, like committing matricide or patricide (killing parents), so the effect of this kamma may last a few lifetime like in the case of Ven Mahamoganalla.

Even good kamma that propels beings to the heavenly states (gods) will once day finish and they have to drop down to the human state or the evil destinies sooner or later.

Doing lots of good in this life will help us to be happy here and now, have a calm mind at death, and to reappear in good places after this life terminates.  It's like putting more good kamma in our pockets, so the probability of striking a good kamma is higher.
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Oh that's new to me. I never knew Gods that ran out of good karmic deeds / seeds will drop down from their state.

Hmm Karmic stuff so wide.

QUOTE(zstan @ Aug 17 2010, 11:55 AM)
technically, yes if they had not become 'fruits' & ripen.

however if the karmic seeds were to ripen, then its another story.

to make it simpler, good & bad things will not go on forever. all things will come to an end, just a matter of when.

this is why Buddhism is different from other religions who believe in eternal 'rewards and punishments'.

even if you have committed the 5 heavy evil karmas as what soul2soul said, and u get sent to hell for a few aeons. the punishment will still end, one day.

likewise for good things. easiest example will be rich kids. these people have done a lot great and good things and previous life and hence born into a rich family.

however if they just continue to spend the money and did not work hard for it, it will come to an end one day.

please correct me if i am wrong  laugh.gif
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What you said is in conjunction to the definition of impermanence I guess.

But personally the thought that the BAD karmic seeds will not disappear until reborn into Buddhahood kind of scares me to be honest laugh.gif
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 17 2010, 01:10 PM

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QUOTE(soul2soul @ Aug 17 2010, 12:08 PM)
The gods have lifeterm one, the higher ones live longer. Once their lifeterm finish (providing they are not killed or die prematurely), their aura recedes, their bodies start to sweat, they garments become dirty, and most of them panic at that stage.

Yea, once their good kamma finish, the gods will re-birth again, and will most likely drop down to the lower worlds if they haven't cultivate any merits there (spend their time partying and enjoy that is).
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In which teaching was this mentioned if I may ask?

QUOTE(zstan @ Aug 17 2010, 12:21 PM)
yes. that's the whole point of Buddhism. to obtain Nirvana and get out of the Samsara cycle and Karma system.

and no, even as a Buddha, u are still applicable to past bad karma.

one story that i know of was,

the Buddha once had a headache for 3 days continuously. Even the best medicine man in the town could not treat Him and were puzzled.

hence the Buddha told them it was due to his past karma.

Many lifetimes ago, the Buddha was a child in a village. Besides the village was a pond full of fish.

to cut a long story short, the child was being rather naughty and used a stick and whacked the head of one of the fishes when it surfaced. that action planted a bad karmic seed and hence why Buddha got the headache, even after a few lifetimes and yes, even after being a Buddha.
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Interesting story indeed. Hmmm animal cruelty reflected upon human being. Ouch.
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 17 2010, 01:56 PM

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QUOTE(soul2soul @ Aug 17 2010, 01:55 PM)
Theravada suttas (tipitaka). In the Sutta Pitaka it was mentioned that Sakka (king of the gods) paid buddha a visit when he got depressed knowing he was going to die soon as a deva.  There is also a story of a deva who panic after he saw his female playmates all disappear in front of him (apparently all took rebirth in Avici Hell after their kamma as gods finish).

The Abidhamma portion of the Tipitaka gave the lifespan of each gods, from a few million human years to a hundreds of thousands of Aeons (world cycles).

So the gods are not permanent, so warned by the Buddha.
*
Oh I see. I'm more to Mahayana teachings. Thanks for the heads up.
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 17 2010, 02:00 PM

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QUOTE(soul2soul @ Aug 17 2010, 01:59 PM)
I don't think the Mahayana buddhists believe the gods are permanent, do they?
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I haven't come across any that says that it is impermanent. Not implying anything btw.
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 17 2010, 02:08 PM

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QUOTE(soul2soul @ Aug 17 2010, 02:04 PM)
No la. I got quite a number of mahayana friends, they all tell me the gods are not permanent. Otherwise why would the Buddha teach the characteristic of existence is "Suffering, Non-self, Impermanent".

Just something to ponder, if existence of gods is permanent.. why strive for Nirvana? smile.gif
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Hmmmm. Food for thought eh. notworthy.gif

QUOTE(zstan @ Aug 17 2010, 02:04 PM)
the way devas die are quite different.

as a human, the process of natural dying needs to go through a few process.

i.e., birth -> growth->adult->grow old/fall sick then die. and since human age is short, u roughly know when you are about to die. (accidents aside)

for devas, since they are higher beings, they emit a sweet scent. however, when they are about to die, the scent will be replaced with a foul smell. every other devas will start to isolate you and you will be all alone. and add the extremely long life span, you don't really know when your time is up, hence you won't pay much attention to gathering more good merits, thus dropping into the lower realms.

technically, you won't be prepared psychologically that you are about to die. and devas dun die like humans, can tahan until the last breath. when they die, they just disappear.

correct me if i am wrong. biggrin.gif
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What? Wow. That's like damn sad. Just disappear. At least when humans die they'll rot away and left behind is their skeleton.
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 17 2010, 02:55 PM

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QUOTE(zstan @ Aug 17 2010, 02:47 PM)
hahaha..another question for u: is leaving anything behind(your remains) pose any importance at all?  rolleyes.gif
blink.gif  i tot this is basic knowledge?

yeah...that's why the Buddha said the human life is still the best..we can experience all 6 realms and have more time and attention for the Dhamma..

at heavenly realms..you enjoy too much and care less about enriching yourself spiritually..

at lower realms..u suffer too much to even bother..

that's why the Buddha chose to be reborn in the human realm.  biggrin.gif
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It does, to your family members at least. (those who chose not to burn the corpses that is)

QUOTE(kenmirzz @ Aug 17 2010, 02:53 PM)
The teaching of Buddha can be said to be the most tolerant and peace-loving as compared with other religions. The absence of eternal torture for unbelievers in Buddhism is a unique trait of this non-Abrahamic religion.
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One thing I like about Buddhism is that the preachers/teachers don't force you to join it unlike certain alternatives.
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 17 2010, 03:33 PM

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QUOTE(soul2soul @ Aug 17 2010, 03:29 PM)
Have you all ever pondered about death?  It seems more and more real as I get older.  sad.gif
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Yeah. Last friend to make in a lifetime. laugh.gif

Crap I forgot the quote I read from an article back then (Buddhism article), but I chose to embrace it.

I'll take it as it comes I guess.


Added on August 17, 2010, 3:33 pmWhat about you? Any interesting things you like to highlight?

This post has been edited by eXPeri3nc3: Aug 17 2010, 03:33 PM
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 17 2010, 04:15 PM

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soul you read a lot regarding Buddhism or you learned about it from schools?
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 19 2010, 12:40 PM

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6.) What is Kuan Yin? What does kuan yin has to do with buddhism? I see a lot ppl CANNOT eat beef coz they pray kuan yin. So should their religion be KUANYINISM ?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avalokite%C5%9Bvara
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 19 2010, 01:45 PM

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QUOTE(chezzball @ Aug 19 2010, 01:21 PM)
haha.. this just means buddhist have no answer.. meaning they themselves dunno what is buddhism. my Qs semua so simple u all cannot answer. fail la u buddhists... close this thread la..s aid wan solve our questions and doubts... now i ask a real serious Qs, cannot answer even 1. fail.. i demand this tered kolos !
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Your cup is full.
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 20 2010, 09:23 AM

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@Joey

Finally thread reopened.

Was about to ask you on the *crap what I want to ask ady*

Any idea on which mantra the 'Da Bei Zhou' was derived from?
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 20 2010, 09:41 AM

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QUOTE(Joey-kun @ Aug 20 2010, 09:39 AM)
the mantra is a transliteration of sanskrit to mandrin.

mantras cannot be translated as they produce certain vibrations in the body when chanted. These are the vibrations that heal and produce various effects.
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I mean, erm, the name of the mantra in sanskrit. tongue.gif
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 20 2010, 09:45 AM

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QUOTE(Joey-kun @ Aug 20 2010, 09:43 AM)
i am not sure because there is no tibetan sources for that mantra. perhaps the lineage of that mantra only made it to china but not tibet.
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Hmm interesting as I'd been looking around and too many so-called 'explanation' that I don't even know what that mantra means.

Wanted to know what is it that the mantra actually trying to convey.


Added on August 20, 2010, 9:49 amI hope the wiki entry about it is accurate though, just found it

This post has been edited by eXPeri3nc3: Aug 20 2010, 09:49 AM
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 20 2010, 09:53 AM

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QUOTE(Joey-kun @ Aug 20 2010, 09:49 AM)
master hsuan hua has written a commentary and explanation of the mantra. Apparently it invokes all 84 different forms of Avalokiteshvara according to some sources, but i feel it is meant to invoke his energy through the mantra.
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The invocation of the 84 different types of protectors is what I'd heard.

That's why I wanna make sure the true thing behind it. Commentary eh... I'll try to look around. Got source for it?
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 20 2010, 10:34 AM

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QUOTE(soul2soul @ Aug 20 2010, 10:17 AM)
THere is no Mantra in Theravada Buddhism, but there are chants called Parittas which are basically the quotes of the words of the Buddha recorded in the sutta.  The monks will sometimes chant these Parittas to offer protection, but the actual working of paritas are the reflection in the mind of the person who recite or hear it.  Arahant Nagasena noted that certain parittas recited at the shrine of the great arahants (where the relics are located) , if accompanied by Saddha (faith) , certain miracles may happen. 

For example, in times where a person encountered a lot of hatred in daily life, he may visit a monk to seek advice. The monk may recite the Loving Kindness sutta (metta) , which is actually the words of the Buddha himself . Normally, in temples, the translation of the Paritta (recited in Pali) will be given to the devotee so that he will understand what the monks is reciting.
Hope this helps
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I see. Thanks.

BTW, from the article I'm reading, it is mentioned that:

Recite this mantra 5 times

Recite the Dharani 21 times

What is the difference with the above 2?

QUOTE(Joey-kun @ Aug 20 2010, 10:18 AM)
Will read thanks.

Am reading this actually: http://www.fodian.net/world/dabei_sutra.htm

QUOTE(soul2soul @ Aug 20 2010, 10:29 AM)
Yep, do you know that the hindu mantra also start with "ohm" ?
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Ohm sathi?
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 20 2010, 10:46 AM

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QUOTE(soul2soul @ Aug 20 2010, 10:35 AM)
Tsk. You  should ask those who are well versed in the Mantras.. hehe not me.
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Lol okayyy

Anyone of you actually recite any mantras?

I used to recite Heart Sutra when I'm having exams tongue.gif, Great Compassion Mantra in NS.
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 20 2010, 10:48 AM

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QUOTE(Joey-kun @ Aug 20 2010, 10:46 AM)
Om is just a sanskrit syllable but it can also be used to represent other things like in this case, the Buddha's body. makes sense since words are used to represent things, why cant they represent a Buddha's body?
A mantra that is longer than 10 lines is known as Dharani. Mantras are supposed to be short and to be recited in 1 breath.
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Oh, then:

Then Avalokitesvara Bodhisattva told the Brahmas: "Recite this Mantra 5 times, use threads of 5 colors to tie knots, then recite the Dharani 21 times, tie 21 knots, wear it on neck. This Mantra has been spoken by previous 9.9 billions Ganges-river-sands Buddhas.

Means...?
eXPeri3nc3
post Aug 20 2010, 10:53 AM

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QUOTE(Joey-kun @ Aug 20 2010, 10:51 AM)
Instructions on how to reap the maximum benefit from the mantra recitation. however in reality altruistic intentions as well as sincerity would be more than enough.

I recite a few mantras: basically my Guru His Eminence Tsem Tulku Rinpoche's mantra, Manjushri's mantra and the food offering mantra.
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I should be more specific:

Since the article is in regards to explaining the Great Compassion Mantra, how does it differ when it comes to reciting mantra 5 times and dharani 21 times? That is the part that I don't get it.

Oh Manjushri. Hard to memorise for me, or rather haven't really remembered it.

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