Guys im a playing Terran, JessieBoy nick here. im currrently keep getting pummeled/giving easy win to protoss players wif their 4 gates proxy pylon warp in timing push... i keep getting rushed at 6.45-7.00 mins mark....with like 7-9 stalker and 3-4 zealots.... at that time i can only churn out 5-6 marines wif 3-4 marauders, wht more wif increasing barrack built time rite now....its almost impossible to early harrass a protoss..... can any of you guys suggest a good buillt order, unit composition, replays? i have been training more than 1 week experimenting with differnt built but mostly not effective against this. Help neded

so far i've not figure out any specific win proof built vs protoss, so i usually 3 racks marine n marauder... i got 70-85% win rate TvT, 55%-70% wins against zerg... but i thnik less than 20% chances vs protoss players... protoss unit r quite high hp n shields.... they can warp instantly n by the time colossus went out wif their deathball arrmy they just roll over my units easily.. i try to early thor, repairing scvs with mass marine it seems barely just able to withold those rush....

may i know ur built order n main unit fighting against zerg? i also feel like u before against zerg... but now i don't have any prob fighting them... . i play a 4 blue flame hellion timing push against them wif careful micro, n tech to 2 starport n hit them wif cloak 2-4 banshee... while marine mostly juz stay in base as defense. if it doesn't work them usually i tech up to seeker missle raven as a 2nd spellcaster support group against my main army mostly consist of marine, BFH and medivac. seeker missle can destroy a group of mutas with good micro. But controllinga group of raven is quite difficult n needs lotsa practice. if ur good with raven, mutas, corruptor n broodlord ain't got nothing on u. But if they tch to ultralisk will be a bit of probs for me.

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Added on September 27, 2011, 3:02 amthank u for your guide, i been practicing it this past few days n its a very good stance against 4 gate proxy warp in protoss... . actually im nvr a fan of bunker before this as it gives a feeling of turtling and ultra defensive for me. jeffvip may i know ur counter against this 4gate once the enemy attack has subsided? do u tech up or hit them instantaneously? before stim research and mdivac is out, marin is gonna be hugely underpowered against protoss army, but once the have got all their update, the dps of stimmed mass marine can be frightening. .

Flampard, against zerg team game u need to wall in as soon as possible, repair damage building with a few hotkeyed auto repaired scv n try to tech up to BFH as soon as possible. if i team gam 4v4 wif my zerg frens, a combine army of ling and BFH early rush at 7.30 mins mark is very deadly n my favorite combo

This post has been edited by max_cavalera: Sep 27 2011, 03:02 AM

agree. this built requires good decent micro n nvr let ur 1st 4 BFH dies. usually zerg will b forced to tech to roach when they see BFH coming. kite around but don't commit all in/suicide ur unit. linger around n near his natural expansion. by doing this their roach will sit in their base defending their mineral line.Normal zerg players will see this n try to counter by overproducing roach dat cost gas, which means they will tech up to muta much slower since muta cost gas too... then hit them with minimum 2 banshee ready with cloak mode and follow up by another 2 producing banshee. straight to main. kill off the queens n drones, then move in ur 4 BFH on 2nd group control n fry the leftover drones in main n natural expansion. usually will caught many zerg players by suprise since its a unexpected rush. don't overproduce BFH, MAX 4-6. 2-4 cloak banshee wil be the ultimate gg for them. usually is insta gg for my zerg opponent less than 13 mins mark. but i lose once before to zerg when he tech straight to roach without producing a single unit of lings and rush my base with 8-12 roach at 6mins mark++. i guess the only way to defend this push is by double bunkering ur ramp wif repairing scv. to wait until my 2 banshee produce to counter those mass roach.

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Added on September 27, 2011, 7:50 pmMy APM for this built? usually a bit lousy avg 40-70 apm, but during enemy army encounter apm ranges between 120 - 330 apm(based on some my replay). usually those r spamming/queueing units army/scv when trying to micro a bit of ur army.

This post has been edited by max_cavalera: Sep 27 2011, 07:50 PM

111 wat so fearsome for dat built agains toss?

lol my 1-1-1 start typical marine tank banshee got owned by mass chargelot n immortals...gott improvized...

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Added on October 9, 2011, 12:51 ambtw was wondering any of u guys manage to pull off a mass marine+mass banshee +repairing scvs built against toss players? banshee is gas cheaper than siege tank by 25 gas, stalker does normal damage against them(10 to normal, 14 to armored unit), can't be hit by an immortal, zealots, colossus, quite easy to target fire colossus, immortal as they are air units and can move easier in range compared to marines that stuck behind their comrade and unable to shoot...and they have very high DPS(damage per second) at 19. so far i only make 1-1-1 built with fully upgraded bunker and siege tank containment on toss front natural expansion to pul off a win, if any other built seems impossible to own them...

This post has been edited by max_cavalera: Oct 9 2011, 12:51 AM

i think if all u ever make is marauder ur giving protoss dude quite an easy win...

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Added on November 1, 2011, 12:50 amchill jeff, apparently nerfing ghost emp radius wasn't enough. they want blizzard to remove marine and marauder as well. we'll just have to built only helion, tanks and banshee after this.

This post has been edited by max_cavalera: Nov 1 2011, 12:50 AM

itts been sometime since i win a macro game wif a zerg opponent, it seems mech+marines is the best way to deal in a late game wif zerg rite now. anyone got a good youtube video to share this kind of built order?

THANKS jEFF FOR YOUR REPLY. For your info i just discovered a new tactics to punish a fast expanding zeerg, evento a fast expanding toss thats more effective. I play standard blcokinh at my ramp 2 supply depot n 1 barrack. as soon as i discovered enemy position , my scout scv will go to an area that opponent will unlikely scout and unvisible to the xelnaga towers, and i send additional 1 or 2 more scv to built proxy 5 barracks thr. save al OC energy for mule only and do not scan, this will boost of your income and you be able to add supply and marine count massively so fast early game. no need gas as well. just a mass, unupgraded marine..at 7-7.30 push out with reinforcering marine enroute to ur army. so far i have played 4 games 2 zerg and 2 toss all won. thrs only 1 time whr base trade scenario occur when toss opponent 4 gate proxy pylon rush me. but then again i still have advantage bcos all his structures at main will be wiped out and eventhou my main base is wiped out i still got 2,3 scv in my assault army and i still have 5 barracks sturcture that i can choose to fly them away to all different location and finish those toss offthe only weakness to this is aoe units such as colossus or even baneling. thats why i rush at 7-7.30 mins mark.

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Added on November 7, 2011, 3:09 pmTHANKS jEFF FOR YOUR REPLY. For your info i just discovered a new tactics to punish a fast expanding zeerg, evento a fast expanding toss thats more effective. I play standard blcokinh at my ramp 2 supply depot n 1 barrack. as soon as i discovered enemy position , my scout scv will go to an area that opponent will unlikely scout and unvisible to the xelnaga towers, and i send additional 1 or 2 more scv to built proxy 5 barracks thr. save al OC energy for mule only and do not scan, this will boost of your income and you be able to add supply and marine count massively so fast early game. no need gas as well. just a mass, unupgraded marine..at 7-7.30 push out with reinforcering marine enroute to ur army. so far i have played 4 games 2 zerg and 2 toss all won. thrs only 1 time whr base trade scenario occur when toss opponent 4 gate proxy pylon rush me. but then again i still have advantage bcos all his structures at main will be wiped out and eventhou my main base is wiped out i still got 2,3 scv in my assault army and i still have 5 barracks sturcture that i can choose to fly them away to all different location and finish those toss offthe only weakness to this is aoe units such as colossus or even baneling. thats why i rush at 7-7.30 mins mark.

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Added on November 7, 2011, 3:30 pmoh yeah btw against zerg u need to quickly snipe off any overlord dat u come across in those close distance proxy rushing, main aim is to let zerg get supply block or limit5 their production capability when they 1st spot ur army.

This post has been edited by max_cavalera: Nov 7 2011, 03:30 PM

hahaha, dat is call cheesing bro. a commited all in early game go for the kill. if it doesnt bring victory. of course gg on the spot.

this kinda tactics all my game is decided less than 10-11 mins time. its tiring to play macro game and spent 20-30-40-50 mins every single game. the longest game time record i have is against zerg opponent and we played 1 hour and 50 minutes rite until all based are full mined out and he cant remake any more army dat time he already gg.

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Added on November 8, 2011, 2:08 amcounter all 3 protoss units? not really mara only deal 20 damage per shot on armored units(stalkers). against zealot and sentries they do only 10 damage per shot. and its only 1.5second per shot. main damager is still thos marine to me aka the glass cannon.

much of the time when mara kite zealot and stalker were given free shots to the marauder its not an efficient thing for a terran. thats y i dont really like mara i only built them like 2,3 or 4 in my mass marine army just as a tanker as their hp is quite hi at 125.

This post has been edited by max_cavalera: Nov 8 2011, 02:08 AM

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7 roach rush can be defended with a good bunker placement behind barrack and 2 supply depot wall off. along with 5-6 repairing scvs, it could be better if u manage to throw down 2 bunkers. a good number of marines still counter roach.

MLG: Providence just ended and its a final between Zerg and Protoss players.... so much with all those terran QQ stuff... lol

used to have raven seeker missle spam tactics with 8-10 missle at clumps of my enemy before my main force stimming in and clear off the remaining forces....but rarely now as its only viable vs bronze level players. Ravens IMHO, all their 3 active skills cost is quite expensive. 50 energy for turret, 100 for PDD and 125 for seeker missle. and they move quite slow as well. They are nvr going to be as good as infestor.. to fully utilized raven do you know u need to upgrade Corvid reactor, increase duration of PDD/turret and research seeker missle. not to mention u need to get upgrade at Engineering Bay for hi sect auto turret for +1 range for turret and +2 armor for building to make mass turret harrass more viable....

wow. thorzain getting thumped by Liquidret zerg.... ;o ... outside korea it seem terran pro are pretty shitty nowadays....

what built ur doing? i play only 2 category and thats 1v1 and 4v4. If ur playing terran, thrs a few strat that can pull you off strongly and with 1 or 2 understanding teammate you can go from bronze to gold league less than a month. My strat is mostly 5 rax mass unupgraded marine with all your OC energy spam on mule early game , push at 6.00 mins mark or less and rush with your teammate. Once the battle occured micro ur marine as best as you could. Once 1 or 2 opponent of ur army is setback, quickly tech up at ur base by immediately taking 2 gas, built the 2nd CC, EBay, factory and transistion from there....

usually won me 7-8 out of 10 games when on a roll. thanks to de biru man as well for being my teammate..

based on my experience with 4v4 its all about rush rush rush fest , whoever rushes 1st have a very big advantage and very high percentage win. Unless the opponent have plan clearly early game that they wanna turtle and being ultra defensive with lots of bunker repairing scv, siege tank, cannonc, spore crawler and tech up.

This post has been edited by max_cavalera: Nov 28 2011, 01:00 PM

u stress play random 4v4 , i stress play solo 1v1. even bronze dude, terran, zerg or protoss can be scary....they r so damn good. probably gonna try until reach at least silver 1v1 then im gonna semi retired dat category already. n4v4 random thou is always a fun game to me no matter win or lose, i get adrenaline rush from it hahah. tonite juzt got rank 1st in gold 4v4 dude .

not to break ur strat...but im only bronze lvl terran 1v1 player(top 8?), i will fully block the ramp even thou u 6 pool me either its 2 supply depot-1 rax or 1 depot 2 rax. early game i willusually select all 6 of my scv and regroup them to hotkeyed no 3 and set them to auto repair. when zerg rush come even i dont have any marine i just simply press 3 and click at the supply depot ur attacking, i even separate them to 2 group to repair either side of the depot ur attacking. while the rest of ungrouped scv mine as usual and by doing this u can even succesfully defend early pool without ur single marine out. if u wana learn early rush strat as zerg i recommend the next upgrade is early baneling bust.this one not many bronze or i think silver lvl terran player learn how to deal with it yet.but i experiment it and the best for me is to wall off ur ramp 1st and immediately throw down a bunker just below ur ramp to create choike point and all ur training marine route to the bunker area at the front.

btw since thiis is a terran strategy discussion thread, i wana ask my issue on ZvT. lately i try to harrass a little with FE zeg, by building a bunker near his expo and route 3 marines. after that i concerntrate on macroing at my base. what puzzles me greatly is when i only get 2 base mining and trying to push out at 16-20 mins mark, i encountered a zerg player on bronze league already having 5 bases and an Ultralisk!! ;o....the abilit of their macro really baffles me.... i have done some thinking and for a terran like me if i decide to get fast 2nd cc, and get it running, my best bet for a push will be at least by 15 mins mark...i played 2 or 3 games against zerg opponent few days back(their bronze and silver lvl if im not mistaken) i dont even bother to play a macro game anymore, usually i just harrass as usual with bunker and after that 1 base all in with stimmed marines, 1 or 2 marauder and 4 medivac drop by his main at 10-11 mins mark. i won this2 games, but it hink if a zerg player have banes then i simply be gg....i dont think a lower league player would have an insane micro to beat those banes..when a zerg player get banes early on, a terran usually need more time push out sas they need to get a few tanks and slowly siegeing themto the zerg base. i thought by this minute mark a good zerg player already have like, 4 or 5 base? and a terran player barely 2 or 3 base....marines and incredibly fragile when they on their foot and race to the zrg base.... but their threat increase significantly by dropping straight at a zerg main if it goes unscouted early on...onmce my marine landed and they get themselves in a tight choke spot(between minerals, hatchery or spawning pool whr a zerglings is impossible to get a surround and roach most of them struggle to hit me, then its an auto win situation, unless they have banes....i personally think a zerg that is good with bane composition, micro can easily get to very high league.....what u guys think? hellions to me just isnt that viable anymore as it is very easy to defned against them. u creat choke point between main and natural with evo chamber, guarded with 1 or 2 spine crawler and a queen, and all youtr rescources, time committed to those blue flame hellion get immediately neutralized....

Latest TvP stats in November shows that P win rate has increase to 55% and terran only 45%. any of u guys experience facing a toss become much tougher recently or u guys juz refuse to qq and adapt to survive wif new built?

currently i have given up to even get natural expansion against zerg.i just 1 base all in with MMM and timing before 9.30 mins mark must load up n drop to his main edi. got very good win rate against Z wif this....marine few marauder n medivac is really sick wif 4 medivac can keep on stimming non stop n micro like hell. only weakness is bane but by 9 mins mark u wont face speed upgrade bane if ur hand fast enuf u can lift off wif medivac and abuse their base ledges. just drop only 2,3 marine at their main n wait bane kill it off until hes no more bane pickup again n drop to his main.... constant pressure spells the death for zerg opponent... huhu

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Added on December 11, 2011, 3:02 amgood good. i was thinking the same thing. if u fast get at least 2 viking edi u only need like 2 turret 1 at mineral line another 1 around ur building area just to get detection... that already nullify cloak banshee threat.

This post has been edited by max_cavalera: Dec 11 2011, 03:02 AM