The row facing garden / playground was already at that price back in September.

I was a dummy to material quality / grading. After seeing and hearing, I did some research online and shopping... I think Kinrara Residence price tag "unmatching" material used is somewhat under-cutting buyers

I just checked some listing on iproperty: Waterville's real deal. I've been in the compound of Lake Edge, and the terrain and surrounding are very nice.
Besides giving good materials, Waterville even came with air-cond unit (not just piping). Comparing MS KR, similar open concept, modern facade, YTL Waterville are more generous (even to mention they are ready for move-in): YTL bigger land size (40 x 85), though MS bigger built-up by mere 1sqf (4118 vs 4117), YTL gives you a pool on top of better materials.

Both 3 storey Semi-D, even some argue KR location is preferred; but just can't deny... considering cost per sq ft weighting against finished product (concept - similar, layout - comparable, compound - yet to determine, materials - ohoh), reconsider KR?

---

Added on December 15, 2011, 6:14 pmOh yea, in case those who may ask and in fact I remember seeing someone asking people to survey and said SemiD without clubhouse is already at similar price... that's a no no. Reputable developer at RM 1.8M for 3-storey Semi D, YTL Waterville have got a club house: Bigger pool adjacent the lake (calm and easing view), gym, jogging track, playground, tennis court, futsal / basketball court. My goodness, we have water fountain in KR Clubhouse

This post has been edited by vevex: Dec 15 2011, 06:21 PM

Qaseh Superlink lower price , freehold, better quality materials, bigger build-up and land size - KR good facade + clubhouse (small / inadequate facility)... seems KR has got look only (from outside seems good but inside no substance)

Initially I thought MS was at the equal standard as other big name (ytl, sime darby) ... I think comparing Lake Edge was valid as they do have 2 phases of super link (24 x 85, 22 x 100)... not sure about other project, but just comparing Lake Edge with KR, MS seems out of the league (value for money / price, quality, clubhouse, you name it) Check http://forum.lowyat.net/topic/1883923/+260 and see what we get for paying a mil for a link house
Go to ytl lake edge site or iproperty and search for lake edge pavillion, their layout / floor plan, facade, concept, material ... Though asking price now is higher compare KR .... man regret man o man sux sux @#%$$& (if only i knew)

This post has been edited by vevex: Dec 16 2011, 02:42 PM

Spend here alr. Where got xtra

I think you're the missing the point here. Not mean to offense - just trying to clear up things. samuelazz was always referring to semi Ds. He quoted your earlier post particularly on the clause you mentioned "clear winner" (KR vs Qaseh). About the winner(s), we need to look at 2 main stakeholders (developer, include contractor / supplier, etc; and purchases). So the comparison :

Developer
MS KR - sell faster, much bigger margin (clear winner as you mentioned)
I&P Qaseh - sell slower but still will reach sold out, maybe lesser margin (maybe loser)

Purchaser
KR - lease hold, modern facade, clubhouse, low quality material (...mm)
I&P Qaseh - freehold, bigger build up, bigger land size, better quality materials (...mm)


on the purchaser end, there's no clear winner but lean towards I&P Qaseh in long run (freehold with substance) if KR material and club house is as-is(leasehold with out look only)... Purchaser is paying more for a lease hold property but getting less even in terms of material used. The comparison also apply to Semi D. As a KR purchaser myself, of course I want to hold firm and find all positive aspects in supporting my choice.... but as I said, I just can't deny...

This post has been edited by vevex: Dec 17 2011, 01:22 PM

Exactly the point, ms is the winner in kr ... Not the purchaser. I guess it is about expectations. If one pay a higher price for lease hold, for me I would expect better quality. But for some (maybe inc you as I interpret), would expect something less and ok with it. Then again I notice you start confusing yourself now by saying we can't compare kr with qaseh now. You were clear putting them under the same spot just few days ago and then stating something like apple vs orange while referring qaseh link vs kr link are of the same breed .... Pening
Being the winner like you noted, MS Kr sells well even at its high price while bandar kinrara fair price is not doing justice. While they r making so much extra now, purchaser is not benefited especially when the finished product completed. MS can boast about now, imagine after getting your house with those lousy materials and you try to sell. MS is no longer running the show. Anyone know crap when they see them. Have u seen the link I shared before? Crap man. And if u try to resell, your potential will go

---

Added on December 17, 2011, 9:37 pmThis post has been edited by vevex: Dec 17 2011, 09:57 PM

Same here, but as purchaser, I paid considerably low before for kinrara and now the value appreciated well. In the past, for the price, it met my expectations. But KR ... again maybe my expectation too high? More than a mil for lease hold link house (with low / missing substance)?

This post has been edited by vevex: Dec 17 2011, 10:27 PM

Error!! I&P quality houses are only seen in their recent projects. Even though their price tag compare to their older projects are more than double, their quality, build up and land size justified the price especially because they are free hold. Their facade may be thought out-dated by some (even myself). Mah Sing on the other hand, with it's modern facade and packaging, I thought they have it all (quality both inside out)... but crapped big time inside. Cheap materials, sub-standard finishing and accessories used on top of the leasehold land with smaller land size, but charging much higher price.... And yea the club house just look at some previous comments in this thread on that.

Some more, are you even aware of their selling price when you mentioned affordable?

This post has been edited by vevex: Jan 1 2012, 07:41 PM

Hi, just to lay things clear. You are right-on: it's about expectation. So, with it's higher price tag: having it's nice outlook, my impression (expectation) is that I would not even compare it with I&P houses as I thought it would not be fair since KR is more expensive even though leasehold as oppose free (so, I thought KR materials, workmanship would all be top notch). Why I expect that? Cause I was comparing it with other reputable developers that charge similar prices (even slightly lower) for lease hold and similar concept: YTL LakeEdge and Sime Darby projects around Subang area.

Then.... All I can say is My expectation on MS is too high... Then again, the gap is too much (not even close). I guess I didn't expect they would go to this extend in terms of "cost control" and "high margin".

Really? And a lot? Care to name a few? Or maybe one? Thanks.

The club house is just too small for 800 occupants. Rough calculation 100 x 800 (monthly) for maintenance, clubhouse 50 x 800 (monthly)... Can't they do better than that?
Where I'm staying now (G&G Apartment), roughly 500 occupants RM12+ monthly. It's a 7 year old property to-date and last June, the building management account reported surplus of more than RM3 millions. Since the management taken over by resident 2 plus years ago, the body put in many improvements on surroundings and common areas (building repainted, "tiled-up" some area, refurbish playground, new barbeque area, new astro byond centralized dish and booster, etc).... Yet 3mil cash rich

This post has been edited by vevex: Jan 3 2012, 03:26 PM

Those are kalsa (not cement sand brick). Technically far more superior than sand brick. Price may sometime be even higher than clay depending on grade.

This post has been edited by vevex: Jan 3 2012, 05:28 PM

You are saying it's a lot... And i don't believe it's a lot, and from far when you mentioned driving past elite (not on brochures), I don't see sand bricks and ioi project, they are not sand, man. I think even the KR brochures, they are only stating brick (not specific).

Thanks to your advise I saw the brochures. So from 1 of their 4 Sime launches in usj height use mixed of sand / clay. And in fact IOI, all of their Bandar Puteri project are sand brick (all under RM1 mil first buyer price). So with this fact, I still don't believe it's a lot using sand brick when the price tag is > 1 mil like mentioned. Maybe, developer starts moving there, but I think a lot of prop > 1 mil is not using sand.

---

Added on January 3, 2012, 6:42 pmSo, did I interpret the fact right, or did you?

This post has been edited by vevex: Jan 3 2012, 06:42 PM

The subject is about the clubhouse big enough / good enough to cope 800 household. What does it have anything to do with selling after VP??

Then about the reported account.

I'm no account guy... but 3.1 mil it is. And it's actually dated Feb 2011 (mistakenly thought it was June since I got the report then).

yea the 2 mil I&P. are u referring chantek. I don't see any foreign brick besides clay on site.

This post has been edited by vevex: Jan 3 2012, 11:27 PM

I guess I'm the dummy there. So, it is that fact that more and more developers doing that. Sorry Spidermind. I was wrong and you're right.

---

Added on January 3, 2012, 11:46 pmSo, your calculation on that? Any thought? Since you know, then you should know things are pretty well maintained here. I don't remember if the entire building was repainted but the lobby on each floor common access area like stair well and railing, even the fire extinguisher and other stuffs.. and the building does look pretty new and very clean indeed.

This post has been edited by vevex: Jan 3 2012, 11:58 PM

I see, so that's how it's read. The developer is still around. And I think they are owing the management and even the previous management company is owing some. Nevertheless, as I said they are managing it really well. So, now that I know the actual financial situation, they are really doing fantastic job.

Since you are kind enough to clear the first part. Would it be ok if you can share some more thoughts on these (think they are income statement following the earlier balance sheet)

I think the debts has been there for years now and can be considered bad debt since. If I read these correctly (pls correct if otherwise), I don't see any problem to call those all bad debt - it's not like they need the money to survive. Since, they made 400k just last year alone, right? or do they? I'm really not sure here but that's how I read. And if that's the case, there's no need for luck... to reach the budget for major redo, we would be right on schedule 10-15 yrs irregardless of the bad debt? right? (though don't think I'd still be staying there anymore) . Of course I understand the subject is still if people pay as they did - and that, I believe there are always people who don't pay (happens all the time where I stayed previously).

Something didn't add up though: (I was merely plucking figure when I use 500 house hold for rough estimation... after looking at the figures I think that's well be out). Here's the thing I know, we have 3 blocks, all 20 storeys with 12 units per floor from 1st to 10th floor; then higher floors are bigger size so lesser unit (not sure actual count). the thing I don't know is the took-up rate... carpark is pretty pack for the last 2 years but not crazy (no double park even outside compound) that's why I just took 500 as the count.

Anyway, back to the subject here, we are discussing to see if the collection is sufficient for well-maintained community (not debating if people don't pay and management is being owed - cause if that's the case, there's not much of a discussion to begin with). And as I said earlier, I do hope MS can do better which I believe it's not asking too much.
Better still, I think I see the point clearer looking at the account. It's on paper only and it is 3.1 mil surplus on paper (if everyone do pay back). Then we can see the point falls back to our earlier argument: for what we pay and in this case we do pay, MS can do much better in return while still making money . Another thing: imagine if they do lousy job like previous Desaminium and suck up the money ...

This post has been edited by vevex: Jan 4 2012, 02:55 AM

I think what Kinraraboy meant was instead of bricks, MS used concrete... I have no idea

The concrete... Could it have anything to do with the change of layout (2stry SD balcony position) noted before. So, may be the concrete is used as better support structure instead of bricks? Any thought? Anyone?