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RTS Starcraft 2 V3.0, Anticipated Launching Date July 27, 2010

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evofantasy
post Jun 2 2010, 07:18 PM

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QUOTE(Cheesenium @ Jun 2 2010, 07:13 PM)
It's subjective,but they are still RTS at the end of the day. CoH definitely have it's shortcomings but it's still the best RTS i ever played.

Those people always put in the way that others RTS are crap,compared to SC2. As if playing 2-3 years is bad.

If i manage to accumulate 100 hours in 1 game. Im happy. Really happy.
*
i feel that RTS gotta be huge (thus CnC4 = LOL)...
supp com really give me the epic war feeling (though my pc nt supp enuff to play it at optimum)
evofantasy
post Jun 2 2010, 10:31 PM

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QUOTE(XenoFr3ak @ Jun 2 2010, 10:07 PM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «
sssshhh...
the QQ-ers has already made assumptions!!!
evofantasy
post Jun 2 2010, 11:33 PM

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QUOTE(Moonflown @ Jun 2 2010, 11:15 PM)
Now they start to find another flaw to flame. gosh
*
its never ending...
and they dun learn to use the "i hate sc2" thread...

the price is not really that high if u are working...
even if u are not, u can save up that amount...
and its a 1 time payment...

i dun wanna make a game that i would be selling at a lost...
evofantasy
post Jun 2 2010, 11:35 PM

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QUOTE(yimingwuzere @ Jun 2 2010, 11:11 PM)
Thanks for the link. So at least there won't be Hellgate-style epic fail server updates like before.

Still doesn't answer for the price. I mean c'mon, the ridiculous price is encouraging piracy doesn't it?

Quoting a mod from gameaxis forums
*
or would u prefer they do its subscription based like WoW?


Added on June 2, 2010, 11:44 pmgood games justify their price nuff' said

This post has been edited by evofantasy: Jun 2 2010, 11:44 PM
evofantasy
post Jun 3 2010, 12:01 AM

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QUOTE(Moonflown @ Jun 3 2010, 12:00 AM)
First they complaint that SC2 requires subscription fees to play and rather one time payment. Now they whine about the one time payment price. Loop!
*
paradox!!!


Added on June 3, 2010, 12:03 am
QUOTE(yimingwuzere @ Jun 3 2010, 12:01 AM)
Expensive games encourage piracy, nuff said. What about the other guy who's itchy for SC2 and sees the price? He's gonna tell himself, 'ahh I'll just play the campaign then, screw MP' and pirate.
*
price is just an excuse for piracy...
spending $$$ on pirated copy that cant play on9 vs spending $$$ on a ori copy that can play online and well supported...

dun be penny wise pound foolish...
if u cant afford it, save up and buy ori...
not using price as an excuse for piracy...

This post has been edited by evofantasy: Jun 3 2010, 12:03 AM
evofantasy
post Jun 3 2010, 12:09 AM

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QUOTE(yimingwuzere @ Jun 3 2010, 12:06 AM)
Well try telling that to the vast majority of potential customers. I'm going to wait till they release a battlechest before I'd consider it. What about the rest?

And it's not like Blizzard will lose money by selling for less. Cheaper -> more people buy -> earn from quantity of sales not high margins
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1. have u thought of the development cost?
2. maintenance cost

or u rather they put the game cheap then
1. have subscription
2. DLC?

sorry i rather pay more to get a good game than pay less and get a crappy game...
there is no free lunch in this world...

if they cant afford this, save up and get it...
rather than spending on other means then QQ about the price...
1 night of clubbing could get u this game anyways...
evofantasy
post Jun 3 2010, 12:21 AM

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QUOTE(yimingwuzere @ Jun 3 2010, 12:15 AM)
Let me present you an example of such a game that doesn't overcharge: TeamFortress 2. If Valve can do it, why can't Blizzard? After all, ~10 years ago they released Brood War, which as an expansion is a steal considering the massive amounts of content in it. Ditto with D2: Lord of Destruction.
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is it the same game?
is it the same engine?
there's so many things to consider during the development...
to u its overcharged, to me its justified...

if u cant afford it, save $$$ and buy it...
evofantasy
post Jun 3 2010, 12:52 AM

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QUOTE(yimingwuzere @ Jun 3 2010, 12:42 AM)
TeamFortress 2 took 8+ years to make and was rebooted from scratch at least twice. Yet it still was $30 on launch.
Well go ahead and buy it, I'm not telling you not to.

I can afford it, but I cannot justify the price. Ah well, wait and see battlechest price then, hopefully Blizzard relents on pricing by the time Zerg EP comes out.
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do u realize the difference?

1. game engine
TF2 was reusing some old engine rebooted with source engine (which is already used for other valve games)
sc2 was build using a new engine (together with cutscenes etc)

2. single player
TF2 dun really have any single player or story...
there's cost for art direction, cutscene, models etc...

again, stop comparing apple and oranges...
evofantasy
post Jun 3 2010, 01:53 AM

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QUOTE(yimingwuzere @ Jun 3 2010, 01:07 AM)
1
TF2 was using a heavily modified HL1 engine with lots of source code replaced with some basic form of what graphics makers called tesselation initially.
SC2's engine had 4 years of development between when Blizz claimed they started work on the game till announcement. Sounds like a fair tradeoff to me.

2
TF2 has no SP/cutscenes/lack of models? Why else is it $30? Even if it had all those do you think it'll go over $50?
*
1.
lol...
it was modified out of the source engine from HL2, not HL1...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Source_engine
gosh u cant event get ur facts rite...

2.
do u know it cost to come up writters for plot, designer for single player campaign, unit design, cutscene rendering...

QUOTE(Cheesenium @ Jun 3 2010, 01:26 AM)
TF2 is using a brand new engine from 2004's Half Life 2. It is upgraded for TF2 and HL2 EP2. Then, upgrade again for L4D2.

FYI, TF2 was in development for 9 years,and there is a point where they just dump everything including codes and changed to the current art style. There is definitely way more iterations in TF2 than SC2,as most of the mechanism is very solid,even now with updates.

TF2 isnt just a couple of maps and shit. It was bundled in Orange Box at 2007. It wasnt actually a standalone game. There is still story, models,voices and so on in Portal and HL2:EP2. No matter what, Orange Box is the most value for money game one can ever buy. 5 games, that includes 3 brand new games and a very addictive MP game. No regrets buying this game.

The problem here is Activision,as they charge all their PC games for 60USD. And Kotick thinks that it's still too cheap for him. If you are happy to pay RM250 for SC2, Kotick will raise it even further to keep you happy.


Added on June 3, 2010, 1:30 am

As long as it's fun, does it matter it's esports material or not?

Even if SC2 released last year, it will still cost 60USD,as thats the standard price for an Activision game. I expect it to increase even more with later expansions.
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that 2004 engine is called source engine (its not brand new for TF2, its brand new for HL2)...
so did i mention anything wrong?
it was not develop from scratch (same as the previous engine it tried to use GoldSrc)...
don't tell me engine development doesn't cost $$$...
and do note, a game engine is inclusive of physics as well as AI...
thus a new engine is much more expansive then reusing a old engine...
u do know that the subsequent sc2 (expansions) is cheaper (announced before) because they dun have to develop everything from scratch...

wut valve did was just rebundle everything and sell it back...
it uses other games for what the game itself is lacking...
all u QQers happily mention TF2 over and over again (not orange box) till it gets stale...
dun compare apple with oranges as i've mentioned multiple times...

i just lol where u just have to whine about EVERYTHING
thank god the majority does not think like u...
else every company would have to be doing charity or reusing old engine to make cheaper games...
seriously, go stick to ur orange box and not QQ about every possible news about sc2...
if u are not sick of it, we are...
evofantasy
post Jun 3 2010, 12:13 PM

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QUOTE(XenoFr3ak @ Jun 3 2010, 10:01 AM)
Im more concern on the where about of Samir Duran
*
not sure...
but i doubt its the xel' naga...
since i doubt the xel' naga would be making hybrids...

and from what i'm expecting, the xel' naga are here to destroy the hybrids (thus all the races along the way)


Added on June 3, 2010, 12:16 pm
QUOTE(MYNAMEISJASON @ Jun 3 2010, 11:41 AM)
Dude, don't be retarded, the orange box came out with 3 new games at the same time along with 2 old games.
New: TF2, Portal and Episode 2
Old:HL2, Episode 1

Even SC1 didn't cost that much during launch, I'm still disappointed they raised the price just like MW2 when sales on PC is already bad enough and had to split it into 2 expansions just to milk more money out of it.

Anybody watched the entire altitude SC2 competition?
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

Here what the top player in SC1 says
*
new games based on the same engine...
making a game reusing an existing engine with all of its API is so much easier (if u are in the comp area u would understand this first hand)...

when was sc1 out?
did u take into account inflation?
not to mention blizz are pushing sc2 more to live up the hype due to the success of sc1...

as long as the content is there, i think the splitting is justified...
u can have 60 hours of content for SP into a single game selling for the price of a single game...

This post has been edited by evofantasy: Jun 3 2010, 12:16 PM
evofantasy
post Jun 3 2010, 12:20 PM

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QUOTE(yimingwuzere @ Jun 3 2010, 12:06 PM)
You quoted cheesinium's post that clearly states that Valve dumped the code and rebuilt from scratch, which is why I said 'was' not 'is', the old engine WAS an heavily modified HL1 engine. Stop selectively quoting just to suit your argument.

Anyway regarding this debate I'll reply to it on the other SC2 thread, I'll not bother you guys about the price issues since some of you are willing customers or blind fans or whatever.

Back on current topic,
@set: You can say he's very likely one of the Xel'Naga, as they created both protoss and zerg.
I think they won't resolve this storyline till the Protoss expansion tbh.
*
the release of the game is based on the source engine, not goldsrc...
nuff' said...
whatever u said contradicts the fact...

think of this...
i wanna make a car, i reuse the old engines/ parts (some 1998?) then it failed...
i remake the car with more recent engine/ parts (not new though as those were made in 2004)
then i charge u for both despite my failures...
when u buy the car, u pay for the development (reusing the old and using the new)...
how would u feel?


Added on June 3, 2010, 12:21 pm
QUOTE(yimingwuzere @ Jun 3 2010, 12:17 PM)
Samir Duran's vast knowledge of both Protoss and Zerg, and his attempts at creating hybrids suggests he's one of them. After all the Xel'Naga created both Protoss and Zerg themselves.
*
i doubt the xel' naga would be making hybrids that is such a blasphemy to their plans of perfect beings

This post has been edited by evofantasy: Jun 3 2010, 12:21 PM
evofantasy
post Jun 3 2010, 12:42 PM

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QUOTE(yimingwuzere @ Jun 3 2010, 12:31 PM)
Your argument was about Blizzard recouping R&D cost as well as the game's value. The effort spent into the original GoldSrc version still counts in the R&D.

Anyway regarding Duran, the reason why I think he's still Xel'Naga is that Protoss/Zerg hybrids would adopt both what the Overmind wanted: purity of form (toss) and purity of essence (zerg), both things which were important to xel'naga research on creating intelligent species.
*
the difference was blizz have their own game engine that is working great as a results...
TF2 used source engine and only did improvement on some area like facial expression...
the other aspect of the engine remained the same...

more like the hybrid as the next generation of xel'naga since the xel'naga are not immortals...
evofantasy
post Jun 3 2010, 01:55 PM

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QUOTE(MYNAMEISJASON @ Jun 3 2010, 01:19 PM)
I sincerely do not find starcraft 2's engine on release very impressive, its very modifiable but still lacks behind in terms of visual quality and technical stability as in demanding slightly higher requirements compared to what it can deliver (lets say when compared to dawn of war 2 which looks better and runs better). There is no doubt though blizzard will improve it in oncoming patches though.
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a game engine is not only on the graphical side...
the sc2 engine allows cutscene to be rendered from within the engine itself, superb physics engine via the havoc, map editor (with tonnes of flexibility) and definitely a very very polished AI compared to many RTS i've played...
for the requirements of the engine, i think its visually pleasing...

@ kian
xel'naga created toss, but they left toss during the civil war as they find that toss are not pure anymore...
so they created zerg with a single overmind (avoiding any possible civil war)...
but zerg managed to detect the xel'naga ship near it and destroyed it...
from there, the zerg spread like plague hoping to integrate everything around them...
xel'naga was not really wiped out, just that they lost the ship that was overlooking the zergs...
evofantasy
post Jun 3 2010, 02:02 PM

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QUOTE(kianweic @ Jun 3 2010, 02:00 PM)
Good stuff. Probably a good idea to get Fujkenasai to put some information on the story at first post.

Backstory was really well written for Starcraft.
*
or u can read from http://starcraft.wikia.com/wiki/StarCraft_Wiki
since it covers the games, side missions as well as novels...
evofantasy
post Jun 3 2010, 02:30 PM

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QUOTE(yimingwuzere @ Jun 3 2010, 02:22 PM)
SC2's engine is designed such that it can run on DX9.0b cards (Radeon 9000 series/Geforce 6). No big deal here for me.
*
well blizz games are known to have lower requirements (though cant say the same about WoW lol)
evofantasy
post Jun 3 2010, 02:43 PM

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QUOTE(yimingwuzere @ Jun 3 2010, 02:32 PM)
WoW is a DX8.1 engine, also low requirements.
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not really when u go into raid/ BGs...
the amount of spam can kill ur fps >.<
evofantasy
post Jun 3 2010, 03:30 PM

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QUOTE(yimingwuzere @ Jun 3 2010, 03:02 PM)
Well that means the engine is poorly coded, which of course adds to the reasons why I said earlier that WoW won't last forever.
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not badly coded...
just that its already dated (and cata have some improvement over it)...
and with the amount of things going on at the same time, its no surprise...
after all it gotta be massive to be MMO...

even wotlk back then when its out it as RM 160 (free goliathus if u pre-order)...
so i dun see how expensive can sc2 be...
evofantasy
post Jun 3 2010, 03:52 PM

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QUOTE(Moonflown @ Jun 3 2010, 03:48 PM)
That is why I suggest they charge different prices for gamers who only want to play campaign and dedicated b.net players
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if i'm nt mistaken that's wut blizz is doing to russia...
the game comes with an option of 3 months on bnet free before subscription services...
but of course, the QQ-ers whine about subscription lol (quite a number of pages ago)...
evofantasy
post Jun 3 2010, 04:26 PM

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QUOTE(yimingwuzere @ Jun 3 2010, 04:06 PM)
In those countries, it's the hardcore who are QQing not casuals, as to gain unlimited access to bnet it costs almost the same here.
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they have 2 choices: -
- full version at the same price as other countries
- limited version at a cheaper price

majority of the gamers around the world are casuals, not hardcore...
that's the pattern which made blizz changed WoW to casual-friendly...

blizz's games dun come cheap always...
their games are usually known for quality and gamers are happy to pay for it...
they are not some developers that release half baked games and patch it later on...

i do admit i'm annoyed by blizz's fanboys at forums but for their impressive track record, its justified...
evofantasy
post Jun 3 2010, 06:36 PM

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QUOTE(Instant_noodle @ Jun 3 2010, 06:27 PM)
alliance? FOR THE KING OF STORMW...

*mod furiously b!tch slapped noodlez's attempt to divert SC2 thread into WoW thread*

ok srsly, there are some odd manner i noticed about  sc2

why in most PvP match the expansion usually starting late?
*
cause of the amount of pressure u can provide via warpgate units...

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