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 Dog food, Discussion of dog food type/brand

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Divas
post Nov 12 2010, 04:13 PM

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QUOTE(PACIFICO @ Nov 12 2010, 02:52 PM)
i'm using acana puppy& junior for the the past week. my dog seems to give positive signs. loves to the food. turns out training is easier. haha

i was confused regarding the protein content for large breed puppies as well.  orijen puppy large breed has 70% meat which is really good but it also has 40% protein. i'm not about official research, a lot reviews seems to explain that to much protein is overkill the pup as excessive growth relates to joint and bones problem. on the other hand usually when it comes to joint and bones is the calcium is the one on topic is origen has 1.4% which i think is sustainable. and also it has 1400mg/kg of glucosomine which aids strengthening the joints. and high protein is good if the dog has a active lifestyle. if not could results in kidney problems

so ya , i'm really confused whether should i give orijen large breed puppy a try. and also my pup has to like it in the 1st place. or should i just stick to acana as it has also good ingredients which has 33% protein and so on
( sadly cant find acana large breed puppy so resorted to junior&puppy <-- kibbles to bit small )

all above just my opinion, so i could be wrong. need to decide quick orijen or maintain acana . CONFUSED !!!!
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If you have found a dog food which is considered a good food (which Acana is) and your dog likes it.. stick with it. It takes 6 months to fully determine how a dog is reacting to a specific food.
Also if you switch foods quite often your dog will most likely start to become picky and you will keep having to switch foods (this is a problem that a lot of people are facing).

My advice would be to stick where you are. Choosing a good food is great, but constantly switching foods can cause more problems than good.
Divas
post Nov 23 2010, 11:36 AM

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QUOTE(suann821 @ Nov 23 2010, 12:37 AM)
Jo (divas), how can i forget to grab Canidae off you last Saturday!!! urgh. silly silly silly!!! and you did not remind meeeee! tongue.gif

anyway, there was a pet shop near where i had lunch last sunday and i took a quick walk-through in there. the owner caught up with me and we talked a little about dog food. he mentioned something like since Bailey is about 6 years-old, i should NOT be looking at high protein dog kibbles as the older the dog gets, the lesser protein he/she needs. is it true??

he was telling me orijen should totally be out of my list of consideration if i'm ever looking to change because it's protein level is too high for a 6 year-old dog. any truth in the things he's saying? need advice here!

am currently feeding Bailey with Artemis Fresh Mix, but realised her poo has been the stinkiest pieces around!! not too sure if it's because of the food though? which, come to think of it, i should have grabbed a few packet of nutri-edge samples from your shop too Jo so i get to try and see if it's because of Artemis! urgh silly silly silllyyyyy!!!! sad.gif sad.gif sad.gif
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Ak I'm sorry, i meant to discuss food with you but totally forgot. One of the things i was going to mention was to stay away from grain free (high protein) stuff.
Because of Bailey's age as well as her medical history, her liver is probably quite worn out already. A high protein kibble makes the liver work harder as it has to filter out all the excess protein so wears down an older liver even faster.
Also as dog's get older they slow down and do less so need less energy so need less protein.

Hopefully the Artemis will last you until next month and then you can grab some samples to test, you should be able to tell if the poop smelliness is because of food in a couple of days.
Divas
post Dec 10 2010, 02:04 PM

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QUOTE(ming777 @ Dec 10 2010, 04:13 AM)
Hey peeps!

well I have a male Boxer , currently 14 months old. Im feeding him science plan adult large breed and usually ill mix with raw food such as cooked meat, cooked liver , chicken meat boiled in soup  and adding canned dog food like pedigrees' with his science plan dog food, what do u guys think?
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Hi.
I see a couple of problems with your chosen food plan.

Firstly, as Mecharojak said, COOKED food is not RAW diet. They are 2 totally separate things. What you are actually doing is mixing a "cooked food diet" with a "kibble diet" and a "wet food diet".
Also i agree that you shouldn't mix diets for the same reasons as already mentioned.

Secondly, if you had read even the first page of this thread you would see that most of us who have done our research don't recommend Pedigree for any situation and only suggest Science Plan for dogs with certain severe medical conditions (such as kidney failure).

To put it bluntly i'm sorry to say pretty much everything about your food choices is not what i would recommend. I think you would find it very useful to spend the time to read through (at least some of) this thread to get a better idea about what goes into dog food and what is actually good for your dog. After that, if you have any more questions or something you aren't sure about, feel free to ask.
Also have a look around at other diet options (im quite sure there are dedicated threads for both cooked diet and BARF on here with loads of info about those diet styles) and settle on one that you prefer. Mixing diets can be advantageous in some cases, however you have to be quite knowledgeable in nutrition to get it right so its generally best to stick to one diet style that suits your time-frame and budget as well as your dog's needs.

If you need help choosing the best diet plan for you (after you have researched a bit yourself) i would be happy to help you out smile.gif.
Don't be discouraged by anything written here, the world of dog food is tricky and filled with advertisements and clever packaging to sway your decision. You have started moving in the right direction just by asking about food, now carry on by doing the research and hopefully getting your dog on a better diet asap.

Don't be afraid to ask questions if you are unsure about anything you have read.
Divas
post Dec 12 2010, 06:36 PM

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QUOTE(Eelinkim @ Dec 12 2010, 05:26 PM)
hi, i have a 9 week old toy poodle,
i have been feeding her with addiction raw dehydrated food before her 2nd vaccination, and after having her injection she came home and started vomiting,
after taking her back to the vet, the vet said that the food i was feeding her is not good for her now, and asked me to feed her with some trade junior kibbles mixed with hill's pescription diet i/d for the next 2 days, after that jus feed her with the kibbles,
but then after feeding her with the kibbles, she started trying to gag herself to induce the vomit, but she would not vomit at all, n after a day , i took her to the vet, after doin all the tests all they said nothing wrong with her, n jus ask me feed her with the pescription diet for 1 week den change to science plan after that, but is it true that science plan on for puppies with medical needs?

do advice me on what to feed her after this, caz i initially thought of just staying on with science plan after this, and i dunno what other types of food is suitable for her.
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I personally don't like addiction raw. But that is personal opinion and not related to anything smile.gif.

As far as your puppy goes. If she threw up the day after the vaccination, it is possible she was having a reaction to the vaccination (nothing to worry about, most puppies will be slightly lethargic the day after a vaccination and some will throw up). I'm quite surprised your vet asked you to change food though. I'm assuming his thinking was that the Addication was a bit much for her stomach to handle, but i would never suggest switching food right after a vaccination (especially not such a big jump from BARF to kibble).

What are you feeding her right now? and What type of diet do you want to keep her on in the long run?


Added on December 12, 2010, 6:42 pmIn fact after thinking about it a couple more minutes and having a quick discussion with my business partner, i would say the most likely scenario was that she was having a stronger than normal reaction to the vaccination. Which would also explain why there is nothing showing up on any of the tests they have run.



This post has been edited by Divas: Dec 12 2010, 06:42 PM
Divas
post Dec 12 2010, 10:38 PM

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QUOTE(Eelinkim @ Dec 12 2010, 09:32 PM)
i think my vet asked me to changed because before this, after my puppy ate her meal, her stomach is usually bloated, so i was jus asking her wat could be the cause, n she asked me to bring to food to her n show her, den she said she didn like it n asked me to change it lo..

n i immediately changed it also caz my puppy after vaccination vomited more than 10 times all the food she just ate n also the water she drank. n when i brought her back there they put her under 20 drips n gave her a vomit injection, den after giving her the pescription diet she was like ok. but her induced gagging started only after i finish the i/d n jus feed her with the kibbles.  the vet told me that the cause of the vomiting after the vaccination could be due to the deworming,caz might be too much worms.. but i checked her poop no worms at all..

so if she could realli be having a stronger reaction to the vacination, does that mean now she would be ok ady? im worried the next round of vaccination would be the same prob!! was already so worried for the during the past week, with the doctor doind tests for parvo n canal cough all.. aiikks
but so far 3 days after only taking the i/d she is doin ok, only thing is that her poop is kinda softish...

currently, i brought her to another vet and they jus asked me to feed her with i/d now for a week and then change to science plan for puppies till adult...
i dun think i have any type of particular diet in mind, i just want her to be healthy, so any recommendation? =)
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Firstly advice: I would stick with the i/d for a few days. Then very very slowly start adding kibble adding slightly more each meal. If she seems to start feeling sick again, take a step back and slow down your kibble adding even more. I wouldn't use Science Plan for Puppy personally, choose a good quality food to make sure your puppy has enough good stuff to grow properly. Also make sure your dog is drinking filtered water in case she is picking up a lot of worms. Make sure she is de-wormed once a month until she is 6months old, then step it back to once every 3 months. Once she is a year old you can de-worm every 6months (i'm talking only about intestinal worms here, you need to de-worm with an intestinal dewormer on top of whatever heartworm prevention you choose).
You can also pick up a supplement paste (puppy-paste, nutri-cal, nutri-gel anything similar). If she has problems keeping her meals down (or even if she isn't) you can give her one pea-sized blob a day to make sure she is getting plenty of protein, vitamins and minerals.
I would recommend staying away from BARF type foods (like the addiction raw) as it obviously has been causing her some problems. For some dogs (especially puppies), BARF can be hard to digest and wears out the digestive system, in cases like these any potential benefits of feeding BARF (although i am not convinced that these are valid for commercially produced BARF as of yet) are outweighed by the negative side effects).

Secondly reasoning: Its obvious that something had a major effect on your pup (i didn't realize how serious her condition had become after the vaccination), it could have been the vaccination, worms, a bad batch of BARF, tummy bug, eaten something weird or any combination of these. As much as i detest Science Diet, i do find i/d is very easy for dogs to keep down when they are having severe vomiting so if that is working for her, it is better for her to eat some i/d while she recovers than having nothing at all or continuing to vomit. As long as you take your time switching back to kibble (it could take anything from 2 weeks to 1month to fully ween her off the i/d, let it take as long as it will take to prevent upsetting her stomach again).
As i said, i don't like Science Diet for healthy dogs (hence not suggesting switching to their puppy formula). Its protein content and ingredients list leave much to be desired in my opinion. I agree it has its uses, but i don't believe a healthy puppy (which it seems your pup is) is one of them.
Chances are, the initial problem will have been very minor, however with issues that affect the stomach (especially for puppies) they can spiral out of control as the intestinal tract becomes overworked and irritated causing more vomiting which irritates the intestines more (and so it continues). This is especially true if it happens around the same time as puppy vaccinations as they keep the immune system busy (this is why you shouldn't board, bathe or stress your puppy after vaccinations).


As far as her next vaccination goes. I would suggest de-worming her a few days to a week before the vaccination is due (either do it yourself or pop into the vet to have it done) to make sure her system isn't overwhelmed. Keep a close eye on her after her vaccination to make sure she doesn't have a reaction and see how it goes.
You can also ask your breeder if she had any kind of reaction to her first vaccination as well as if she had any problems with her initial weening (from milk to food).

I hope that helps. If anything isn't clear or you need more clarification just let me know and i'll try to explain it further.

Divas
post Dec 13 2010, 08:58 PM

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I have never heard of trade junior kibble, nor can i find it online. If it is a decent food then stick with that, if you aren't sure post up the ingredients and protein/moisture/fat content and i'll see how good it is.

Don't worry about high protein, Science Plan in very low protein. Remember that the protein content shown on the i/d can is for a wet food so will look very different to if you are considering dry weight. Also she is probably drinking less because of the high water content of the wet food (i don't remember what i/d is specifically, but can foods can be as much as 70% water).

Stick with the i/d for now until we settle on which kibble to start introducing. If you have sample packs of Science Plan you can always add a little in to keep her used to eating some kibble if you want.

The most important thing to remember is not to give her extra attention or 'baby' her. If you treat her very differently when she is sick, she will react to your feelings and possibly make her feel worse (or not get better as quickly). Stay in a good mood around her and avoid feeling sad/sorry for her/worried/nervous... any negative emotion really.
If your dog throws up, a simply (but happy) "oops, oh dear" or something similar is enough to let them know you have seen the accident and it isn't a big deal. Just relax, obviously keep a close eye on her, but treat her normally...
Basically what i am trying to say is, don't make a big deal about it... if you do, they will. biggrin.gif
Divas
post Dec 14 2010, 12:07 PM

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Her poop will be more soft from the wet food. Nothing to worry about, just a bit of a pain to clean up.

If you want to use all 3 foods, i would mix them all in one meal rather than switching every day (to avoid her getting picky and choosing one over the other (so eating some days and not others). Once she has been eating the mix for a while, you can adjust it slightly and feed her 2 of them a day (so giving some variety).
I generally prefer to use treats for variety and keep their kibble the same (i mix 2 different ones together, but they get the same amount of each every day, then i rotate their favorite treats so we have a different flavor treat every week or 2). They know that they have to eat their meal before they get any treats for anything, so like a kid waiting for dessert as a reward for finishing their vegetables, the dogs will have their treat for finishing their food.

As for her sleeping a lot. A healthy 9week old dog will sleep a lot of the day so that is pretty normal. They will usually wake up for a while (sometimes as little as 15minutes) to play then fall back asleep again. As she grows older, you will see her play for longer and sleep less during the day but for now, it is good for her to sleep a lot of the day as she preserves all her energy for growing (a hyper puppy who sleeps little will often end up much smaller than one who sleeps more in the first few months as they waste all their energy they are supposed to be using for growing).

I'm not sure where you can pick up those foods from, most pet shops carry all 3 though i think (especially the big ones like Petsmore etc.).
Hope your girl continues to improve and that this is the end of her tummy troubles. I'm sure she will be fine and carry on being a happy and healthy puppy smile.gif.


Divas
post Dec 15 2010, 10:22 PM

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QUOTE(broga_night @ Dec 15 2010, 02.36 PM)
any 1 heard about super k9 dog food.....today i went to pet shop ,i saw super k9 brand dog food which from USA,the price is so cheap to me...only rm108 for a pack of 25kg...pls giv me any opinion becoz i plan to change to this brand,my 2 dogs cost me a bomb in the monthly dog food
Sorry, never heard of it (nor can i find the ingredients or nutritional analysis online). At a guess from the name, size and price i would say it isn't going to be a good food. If you can get an ingredients list at least, i can confirm or correct that statement. It sounds like what is commonly called a "breeders pack", very large amount of food for very cheap, in general terms "breeders packs" are not good foods and not usually used by responsible breeders despite the nickname.

QUOTE(RayX @ Dec 15 2010, 09:34 PM)
I heard chicken isn't a good ingredient for dog food, why?
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Chicken isn't a bad ingredient for dog food. The stigma a lot of people have over chicken is based on the fact that all dog foods used to be chicken based. After a while, some dogs started to build up an intolerance to chicken. This lead to a lot of people thinking chicken was bad and favoring alternatives (such as lamb, kangaroo, salmon etc.). The truth is that chicken is actually as good as any other meat (as long as it is chicken or chicken meal, not by-products) and usually isn't the source of any problems at all.
Saying that, a lot of people do seem to find that their dogs seem to do better on a non-chicken based food (although i can't say if this is an actually fact or if people are so worried about chicken that they see problems that aren't there/don't see them when chicken isn't being fed).
Hope that helps smile.gif.
Divas
post Jan 17 2011, 09:43 PM

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QUOTE(paranoid_tw @ Jan 14 2011, 11:56 PM)
Hi Divas or other nice ppl out thr...i have a min schnauzer 5months old.currently feeding wif go! salmon..bt i stil found out sum small part of dry skin at sum of his body part..y tat???i mean da dog food is subject for skin sensitive prone dog like schnauzer..y i stil found out tat still gt dis prob occured?if nt for min schnauzer which dog food brand i shud go for???
thanks so much!!!
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Sometimes skin issues cannot be fully controlled with diet alone (although a good diet will go a long way to controlling skin issues). Schnauzers (especially ones that aren't bred so carefully) are especially prone to a number of skin issues and are notorious for sensitive skin and allergies.
The food may not be 100% effective because there is still an underlying issue that needs to be resolved (fungus, environmental allergy, hot spots etc). Also it sometimes takes a long time (up to 6months in some cases) for the negative impacts of a not so great food to fully filter out of the system (and so stop affecting the body). It could just be that the initial change in food gave the skin a boost, but the lingering dry skin is just caused by the old food still working its way out of the system.

Some useful things to know to better assess the system include:
What shampoo you use and how often you bath him.
How long you have been feeding the new food.
What the dry skin looks like (is it flaky, red, oily, itchy, broken skin, bumpy).
Where the dogs stays (is it dusty, type of flooring, what the floor is cleaned with, possible access to other animals).
When the dry skin started (and if anything changed at that time, when you brought him home, changed bed, changed shampoo anything new that could cause stress or allergies).

You can try changing food again, but if you found something that made an obvious improvement i would stick with it for at least 4 months to see if there is more improvement to come before switching again.
Divas
post Jan 17 2011, 11:04 PM

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QUOTE(paranoid_tw @ Jan 17 2011, 10:01 PM)
currently im using PET ESTHE for bathin my schnauzer...erm once per week and bout 15min each time...da food i chnge for bout 2months n i jx bought go! duck formula which is higher grade recommend by da pet shop ppl.....hopefully it works!
da dry skin is sum part flaky and oso gt tiny red spot..nt oily or bumpy...erm i guess nt reali itchy coz seldom saw my dog gatal..
my dog gt his own dog bed n oso slip inside my room which is tiles floor and wil mop once per week..shud b very clean environment..
da dry skin laztime while using eukanuba by da breeder is started ady..bt after i chnge it act gt bit better la..bt stil gt i tot wil b gone...
bsides is it bcoz i was using frontline spray everyweek for ticks prevention???

and divas,cn i ask hw much shud i feed my dog???he is 5months old..currently feed twice per day and 2 and half teaspoon each time...

THANKS SO MUCH!!!
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Ok in order:
Pet Esthe should be fine. Consider changing if nothing else works just as a test, but i would highly doubt it would cause the problems.
Once per week is fine. Make sure you dry him off really well (you can use a hairdryer but make sure the hot wind doesn't blow too close to the skin as it can burn/irritate.
I would definitely stick with the same food for another 2 months to see if the skin heals fully. If you want to switch after that, you can but at least you know 1 brand which fully clears up his skin in case the problem comes back.
The small red spots sound like hot spots (are they quite spread out like bug bites or more clumped together like a rash?), and the dry flaky skin could just be dandruff or where the skin is healing. Sounds like quite a minor thing at the moment but still best to get it fully cleared up.
The area sounds fine, if you use strong chemical floor cleaners/detergent to clean his bed it could be causing him some irritation but you would most likely see localized irritation from that, usually on the belly, feet and underside of the legs, with very little or none on the back and head (basically only on areas that come in a lot of contact with whatever is causing the irritation).

Random question: why would you buy a puppy who already has skin problems? it is something i come across quite often (well more often that i ever expected when i started out in the pet world), people who would never (for example) buy a car leaky gas tank or a washing machine that only works on one of its settings will happily shell out money for a dog with health issues...

Using the Frontline every week could definitely be adding to the problem. Fontline used very often can irritate and dry out the skin which could be keeping the initial skin problem from fully healing. It is usually only necessary to use once a month (make sure you apply it at least 2 days after AND before bathing). If you find that ticks are still sticking to your dog, try using one of the Spot-on products (Frontline-combo, Advantix, Revolution) for a while (they are easier to apply than the spray) to see if the skin clears up fully (again once a month is usually enough and make sure it is at least 2 days after a bath and 2days before the next one.

As far as amount of food is concerned. Every dog is slightly different. A page or so back (on this thread) is a chart/diagram showing the ideal 'look' for a dog (not too thin and not too fat), in line with that, i always say if you can feel the individual rib bones easily and see the pelvic/hip bones (sticking out above the hips) the dog should eat more, if you can't feel the ribs and your dog has no 'tuck up' (where the body slopes upwards towards the back legs) and has a belly hanging down or a stomach that constantly feels hard and bloated the dog should eat less (or be dewormed or checked for cushings disease). A dog that is the right weight will look heathy, you can feel their ribs but also feel that there is a layer of fat between the ribs and the skin. A healthy (and well fed dog) will have bright/shiny eyes (but not glazed which is a sign of illness) and pink gums.
You can also use your dog's reaction to food as a sign of how much to feed them (although some dogs will act starving no matter how much you give and others will appear disinterested/ full no matter how little they eat). In general, if your dog still begs for more and licks the bowl clean, he might do well with a little more food, if he leaves a few pieces in the bowl or plays with his food towards the end of his meal he could eat less.
What you are feeding sounds about right for your dog, but it can vary greatly from his size (as with a lot of breeds here some dogs are very small and some are very over-sized) and activity level.
Divas
post Jan 20 2011, 09:48 PM

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QUOTE(hryeunice @ Jan 20 2011, 02:00 PM)
Hello all!

I am distressed. sad.gif My doggy has allergy and I brought her to the clinic for a check-up. The vet did a swab test on her allergy area and confirmed 3 kinds of infection - fungal, bacterial and normal allergy.

The vet said the allergy could be caused by dog food. This is the second time it has happened and I really don't know what food to put her on. The last time she had an allergy, it was on Canidae.

When I adopted her, I put her on Eukanuba, then I changed to Orijen 6 Fish and she was doing well on Orijen. Then I changed her food to Canidae because a closed friend recommended it. But after eating Canidae, she started having swollen bumps between her nails on her paws. So I stopped giving her Canidae and gave her Orijen Adult. She was ok, but we felt that it didn't keep her coat well like how Orijen 6 Fish did. So when Orijen Adult finished, we bought Orijen 6 Fish.

And now she has this allergy and the vet said it's most probably the food she takes. I am not sure if it's the dog food, because Orijen is corn-free and it's one of the best dog food we have in the market.

My only concern is this: My boyfriend's mom has been giving my dog bread from time to time in the past two weeks. Gardenia bread... And I need to know if this will caused her to have allergy? Since bread has wheat flour and all.

Can someone enlighten me? I wanted to stop my bf's mom from giving my dog bread, but I didn't know how to tell her without hurting her feelings. I don't know if it is the bread that is causing the allergy and I don't know if bread is bad for dogs. Hope someone can help.

Thanks!
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Firstly, i have to ask exactly how your vet made a diagnosis of food allergy from a simple skin swab? As far as i am aware the ONLY way to confirm a food allergy is to use an elimination diet for at least 3 months. A food allergy can be suspected from seeing certain symptoms in a dog (although all of these can be seen without a swab). The only way i can think of that a swab would help lead to a diagnosis of food allergies is if it found no cause for the symptoms that were present (both a fungal or bacterial infection could explain any symptoms that would possibly indicate a food allergy).
Also, most veterinarians and researchers agree that less that 10% of dogs actually have food allergies. Symptoms suggesting allergies are more often caused by external allergens (dust, pollen, chemicals etc) rather than ingested food allergens. However switching to a very high quality, usually fish based food (as most people do when they suspect food allergies) would help relieve skin symptoms of any allergy by boosting both the skin and immune system which would make it seem like the dog had had a food allergy and switching the food had stopped the allergy.

The fungal and bacterial infections must be fully healed before there is any chance of getting any hint about allergies. I'm assuming your vet has prescribed you some combination of Antibiotics, Anti-fungals possibly Anti-inflammatories and probably some form of medicated wash as well. After the courses of medication have been completed, see if the symptoms have subsided (although they may just be temporarily hidden by the medicated wash/Anti-inflammatories).
Depending on which area is affected, even if the symptoms reoccur, it could be due to a reoccurring fungal or bacterial infection (with the other being an opportunistic infection). Keep a very close eye on the affected area and go for another skin swab/scraping as soon as any redness, itchiness or abnormal skin is seen, if there is already a fungal or bacterial infection, it is most likely something in the environment passing on the infection rather than an allergy. If no fungal or bacterial infection is found, then you should move on to look for potential allergens.

As it is extremely difficult (as well as long and time consuming) process to determine exactly what is causing the allergy symptoms, learning to manage the allergies though food and supplements is usually the best course of action.
There is some evidence that environmental allergies respond well to steroid treatment (whereas food allergies are not improved at all) so you could try a short round to rule out (or prove) that environmental factors are to blame for the allergies.

If the symptoms respond to the steroid treatment and you have time (and discipline), you can try to eliminate all potential allergens until the symptoms subsided and then slowly introducing them one at a time until the symptoms reoccur (then you know that whatever was last reintroduced is the cause of the allergies). This process of elimination can take many months to years as you would need to introduce only one potential allergen per month and ensure that no new potential allergens are introduced at any time during the trial to keep the results accurate.

If there is no response to the steroids, then you would need to move on to a novel food trial. During a novel food trial you must find a brand of food that is as different as possible to anything the dog has eaten before (usually finding a food with a novel protein (meat) and carbohydrate (rice etc, or now you can choose a grain free variety) is considered enough, but sometimes it is a more obscure ingredient causing the allergies, so finding a food as different as possible saves time and stress). The dog must eat this food and ONLY this food (no treats, no snacks, no nothing) for at least 3 months. If the symptoms are seen to subside during this time, the dog should then be put back on the original food for 2 weeks, if the symptoms come back the elimination food is used again to see if the symptoms again subside. If they do it is confirmed that something in the original food is the allergen (causing the symptoms).
At this stage you can choose to stick with the food that reduced or eliminated the symptoms or you can slowly try foods with different ingredients to try and pinpoint the exact allergen (although this is a very very complicated, time consuming and often frivolous endeavor).


Finally to answer your question, yes your boyfriends mother should definitely stop feeding your dog bread, it is not good for dogs at all. A healthy dog may be able to take a small corner of your sandwich as a snack on occasion however if your dog is already experiencing skin issues, many of the ingredients in bread (especially commercial breads such as gardenia) will definitely not help the situation.
Perhaps try buying her a pack of treats and ask her to feed those. Try to find natural, 'healthy' treats, there are a lot of them around at the moment. Salmon based would be good as it could help reduce, and probably won't worsen your dog's skin problems. You can tell her that you are very happy she likes your dog and wants to give her treats, but that she is suffering from some skin issues that could be made worse by the bread.

Sorry it turned out very long, hope you find it useful. If you need anything explained in more detail let me know smile.gif.
Divas
post Jan 29 2011, 08:01 PM

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QUOTE(purple115 @ Jan 29 2011, 12:08 PM)
hi all pet papa and mama here,
I have 2 miniature schnauzer teddy and piggy wub.gif which is 9 months and 4 months..i supposely have 3 dogs but (X'mas) kena stolen on september 2009..haiz.. sad.gif

For x'mas -I feed him Regas turkey puppy bites, then lamb and rice. in his 8-10 months age, i found out he got skin problem and vets recommend me to change his dog food. and i 've change to blackwood 3000 lamb and rice, result is so so..then he kena stolen edi=(

For teddy- a white male schnauzer, i feed him blackwood and NB from young, until i found out he had abit skin irration..and im lucky the petshop recommend me a super good dog food golden eagle, previously known as eagle pack! (Holistic Salmon and oatmeal)..after i feed my teddy 1 month, very good result i see..no more skin problem,and the poopoo and weewee not smelly already..and his body odor not so strong..im happy with this product and will continue all the time =) and also, now for my little princess piggy, she is now too young to have it so i put her on addiction salmon puppy=) she is now got serious skin problem, need all sifu's help also! what shampoo should i bath her?  blink.gif

check out this website for more info: http://www.goldeneaglepetfoods.com/index.html

u can pm me, i let u know which petshop can get it.
I wish all the doggys always healthy ya=) icon_rolleyes.gif
*
I hate blackwood, hate hate hate.
The Golden Eagle looks decent, although i would prefer to see 1 or 2 more meats in the first 5 ingredients, nothing majorly bad in there (except the chicken digest stuff, yuck).

Where do you get your dogs from? you seem to have bad luck with the skin problems. Alternatively, do you use any hard cleaning products at home or some weird shampoo on them?
What skin problems do they have? (or at least what are the symptoms?)

If Golden Eagle is working for one, you can always use it for your puppy as well. Most decent foods can be used for all life stages as they should be balanced enough to provide decent nutrition for a puppy. However if she is already eating a decent (addiction) salmon based food and her skin is still having issues i would say it isn't the food, or she has an allergy to a specific ingredient (depending on her symptoms).

As far as shampoo goes, your best bet is to use a mild, natural shampoo with little/no chemicals and definitely no fragrance (as in they haven't added anything to make the smell strong). A dog shouldn't still smell like their shampoo a couple of days after a shower (if you want your dog to have a fragrance, use dog perfumes instead as you only apply them lightly to a small area they don't dry out the skin and coat as much as a heavily scented shampoo). I prefer natural shampoos that can be diluted (usually 8:1 or 10:1) as they are often more economical than cheaper shampoos (if you count how much you get after dilution) and are much milder on the skin. You have to put a bit more effort into the bath and massage slightly longer to get very clean but it is worth it (and the extra massaging time is great for your dogs skin and shower enjoyment smile.gif ).

@Calvin - I prefer to use kibble instead of canned food for normal meals (this also fits with your only wanting to stock up on food once a monthish). Kibble helps clean a dog's teeth as they eat it and is also more often than not (if you choose a decent food like the ones you are considering) more nutritious than canned food.
You can go with a puppy formula or all life stage formula depending on your preferences. As far as treats go, look at the ingredients and choose healthy ones. I like to use treats that have unique meats in them, or at least ones that aren't in his regular kibble (for a bit of novelty) this is really usefull especially for motivation during training.
If you are feeding treats, make sure he doesn't start leaving some of his meals for treats. Also don't over do it, give him one or two treats for a few days when introducing new treats as new treats often cause diarrhea like new food does).

@derking96 - Depends on your budget, diet preference and if the puppy is actually 1month or 5months old (there is a HUGE difference). smile.gif an undetailed question deserves an undetailed reply.
Divas
post Jan 30 2011, 08:07 PM

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QUOTE(purple115 @ Jan 30 2011, 06:05 PM)
thanks for ur comment divas, ya all my schnauzer got skin problems..my fren recomment me to bath them with MCLEE's medicated shampoo..but currenty im bathing them with YU'S bubble bath..
any good comments?
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I have yet to try Yu myself (although i have some samples waiting in my shop), but i have not been at all impressed with the comments i have heard on it so far. I don't think i have heard a single positive review of any of the Yu products which leads me to be pretty uninterested in testing it. From the comments i have heard, it would definitely be worth switching shampoo to see if it makes a difference.

A lot of people seem to like McLee's although i am not that impressed myself. Its definitely not a bad brand so might be a good place to start. I personally would switch to a very natural (again preferably dilutable) non-medicated shampoo to see if it was the shampoo itself causing the irritation (something with oatmeal, aloe etc would be fine, just avoid any of the real medicated washes with sulfur or anything stronger (pretty much anything with a chemical name) to begin with and see what happens.

If there is still no improvement after switching shampoo then we can look at other options like food and environment, but a shampoo switch is a pretty simple and easy place to start.

@derking96- Ok that is a little clearer smile.gif. It really is up to you what food you feed. within your price range there should be a number of very decent options. A 5-6lb bag of food (most small bags are around that weight) would last you more than a month and often cost between 50-80RM per bag (which falls nicely within your budget). If you want to start with a puppy formula, you can (that will start narrowing down your choices as not all brands have individual life stage formulas) but often puppy formulas are slightly more expensive than adult/all life stage ones. If you want to go with an All Life Stage plan (the same food can be fed to a dog of any age) this will also help narrow down your choices.
Your next step in choosing a food would be to go down to a pet shop that is convenient for you and see what they have in stock (only look at brands that the packaging looks new and the shelf is fully stocked, if there is only 1-2bags of the food and they looked pretty bashed up it is most likely that that food doesn't move in the area and they will stop stocking it soon). Keep in mind the list of good and bad ingredients (explained on the first page of this thread as well as in a number of links scattered throughout, if memory serves) and start looking at the back of the packages. Also keep in mind that the money a company has spent on the package (with shiny logos and fancy packaging) is money they haven't been spending on RnD or the actual ingredients that go into the food. Some times lesser known brands that have simple packaging and do little advertising are much more value for money than one that goes all out and obviously has a huge advertising budget (where do you think all that advertising money comes from?).

Don't feel shy to take along a camera or note pad and list down the pro's and cons of each food as well as the price (or snap a picture of the name and ingredients list). If the shop people give you a funny look or ask you what you are doing, let them know you want to compare foods and decide on which one you would prefer to buy your dog, if they are good 'animal people' who understand how important choosing the right food is, they won't have any problems with this.
if you get stuck deciding between a few brands, post them up and we can give you some more detailed advice. smile.gif
Divas
post Jan 31 2011, 12:08 AM

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QUOTE(muffdiver @ Jan 30 2011, 11:05 PM)
Hi Everyone,

I just started reading this thread. I've been feeding my GF's 5 year old poodle with Blackwoods for a few months now. Starting with Lamb and now Salmon. Previously, it was some generic brand I didn't quite remember. Anyway, he seems to like the food better and his poo is not soft & smelly anymore (which is good since I had to clean his room everytime). So is Blackwood really that bad? I would definitely change it since it cost me RM 60 for the Salmon.

For shampoo, I've been using something called Ferbes. It's made in Korea and does come highly recommended by some relatives of mine. It keep him nice smelling for a few days. I've heard that Yu is better in scent though but quite expensive.

Would really appreciate some guidance. Don't want to be blamed by my GF for mistreating her poodle. Sigh...
*
I didn't know Blackwood had a Salmon? the Lamb i know, but i thought their only fish based food was 'Catfish' (and even then it contains chicken.
Blackwood isn't the WORST food you can feed and technically the majority of its ingredients are fine. What i dislike about them is how they have a lot of fillers in and their 'hypoallergenic' formulas/sensitive formulas contain chicken products (in my opinion, if it is a lamb based food it should have only lamb, and a fish based food only fish, if there is a mix of meats it should be clearly stated not hidden in the ingredients which most companies assume most people won't read). Also from clearing out anal glads during grooming sessions, the expression from a dog eating Blackwood is typically similar to that or much much lower grade foods (the only 2 times i have wrongly guessed that a dog was eating Pedigree or Alpo from anal glad expression, they were both on Blackwood). Although anal glads don't always give you a lot of information about how decent a food is, when a secretion is supposed to be quite watery and light in color with a foul but tolerable smell, comes out almost tar black and stinking of old metal and really really old trash, i would say there is something wrong.
If your dog is doing well on Blackwood i would not ask you to change. I am extra picky with the company as (like a number of other dog food producers) they have never really shown any indication of anything other than money motivation (IMHO) which i don't like from someone i am trusting with such a necessary part of my dog's life and health.
Also i find that there are plenty of much better brands out there for a similar price. You could have a look around at your local pet store and see what else is available.

As far as shampoo goes, i never ever recommend anything that leaves an unnatural fragrance. A shampoo is supposed to clean your dog's coat and skin not perfume it. Natural is always better. If you want your dog to have a fragrance, there are hundreds of perfumes with many different fragrances out there that are very reasonably priced. I already commented on Yu today, hopefully someone who has tried it will notice this thread and be able to comment further. If not i will find a suitable candidate and take the plunge myself :S.
Hope that helps smile.gif.
Divas
post Jan 31 2011, 10:03 AM

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QUOTE(Calvin871989 @ Jan 31 2011, 12:26 AM)
thanks divas.

im current feeding my 2 month plus beagle eukanuba. for now, no problems at all when i feed him eukanuba for breakfast, lunch and dinner.

but yesterday i only fed him during breakfast and dinner. i made him skipped his lunch. reason so is because i was testing to see how hungry he will be for dinner.

i usually scoop up the food 8 tablespoon. some may think its too little or maybe a lot but i find it just nice enough.

only big major problem im having now is, he pees and poo everywhere in my room. i really dont know how to toilet train him. is there anything selling at the pet store that can really help me with the pee and poo ?

sorry for the off topic.

thanks
*
The best way to toilet train a dog is with consistency and patience. There are many products that claim to stop dogs pooing/peeing in the wrong place or encourage them to pee/poo in the right place but i don't think they work and definitely not as well as just doing really good training.
There are many many many websites all over the internet that take you step by step though toilet training but the basic steps are

1. Confine him to an area where he can't eliminate in the wrong place (eg a bathroom/pen) while you aren't in the same room.
2. When he is roaming free, watch him (keep one eye out) for signs that he is about to do something (usually a dog will become very animated, start sniffing the floor, but each dog is different so you have to figure out what your dog's 'tell' is).
3. Quickly move him to the correct pee/poo spot before he has a chance to do his business. The first few times you do this he will probably hold his pee/poo in. Keep a close eye on him for a while and move him back again as soon as he shows any signs.
4. Praise him lightly for being in the right place, if he pees/poos in the right place, throw a party, lots of love and attention.
5. If you don't catch him in the act don't scold him. In some cases it helps to scold the poo/pee as they then realize that you don't like the poo/pee in that place. Clean up the mess and take the poo/pee soaked tissue to the right pee place and praise the poo/pee.
6. Clean any areas where he has an accident with vinegar or a pet odor remover so he isn't encouraged to 're-offend' due to the lingering scent.

The most important thing is to be consistent, the more you can watch him and the more often you can relocate him before an accident (and therefore the less accidents he has in the wrong place) the faster he will figure it out. Remember also that at 2months old he will have quite low bladder/bowel control so quite often when he has to go he has to go. As he grows older and bigger he will have more control and won't pee/poo so much (although when he does, it will be bigger biggrin.gif).

Hope that helps.



Divas
post Jan 31 2011, 10:16 PM

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[quote=muffdiver,Jan 31 2011, 03:49 PM]
Thanks, Divas! You really are knowledgeable in ingredients. I think I will upgrade to something else after this. I was recommended by the groomers of the brand, Royal Canin. They claim it is the 'caviar' of all dog foods and even have something called Poodle Diet specifically for my dog http://products.royalcanin.us/products/dog...aspx?Animal=Dog . The price is about RM80/kg. If it is really good then I wouldn't mind considering it. Hope to have this dog to live longer and healthier for as long as possible.

Also, I agree with you on the scent of shampoos but unfortunately my GF is always complaining about natural doggy smell. Either way, Ferbes seems to be working well for me so far with the scent lasting for at least 5 days.
Hi Calvin,

Royal Canin is a decent food, but IMHO very overpriced for what it is. It certainly isn't the best food out there and its 'breed specific' diets are pretty much identical (if you look at the ingredients list) with a different picture on the front. You can get just a good if not much better foods for less. As it has a high protein level you would be better off with Arcana, Orijen or anything similar. Or go for a lower protein food such as Canidae (sorry i can't think of any other brands with protein around the 24% mark right now, been a long day and most popular brands at the moment are grain free high protein ones).
Royal Canin spends a LOT of money on advertising and writing long pretty descriptions about why there food is good and bla bla bla bla bla...
...If i am going to be impressed with a food i want a picture of the packet (not even that is so necessary), a clear and full ingredients list and nutritional guarantee and a name, simple, precise, no mess, no fuss smile.gif. I don't need to spend hours clicking buttons and looking at pretty pictures of dogs you have hired to snap pictures of (that probably don't eat your food), scanning through marketing junk telling me what you think i want to hear and finally reaching an ingredients list and nutritional guarantee that not only is unimpressive after all the hype but also is STILL surrounded by more junk and garbage to cloud your mind and sway your opinion...

Excuse my random rant but i find it really frustrating when it looks like a company has spent more money constructing their website than creating their food (of you have that much money spend it researching what dogs actually need and create a fantastic food as a result, don't wait until people start shouting about how bad corn is and then take corn out of your ingredients and scream about how 'corn free' your food is vmad.gif .

To make it simple, Royal Canin is not as impressive as they want you to believe. Maybe 5 years ago is was a pretty decent choice but now there are many many other better brands. It isn't the worst food in the world, but it is not worth anywhere near what they charge for it!!

Get perfume and your dog won't smell "like a dog" (although i have never personally found a dog's natural smell offensive unless they have some kind of skin/health problem giving them an abnormal odor). Perfume lasts longer than any shampoo and can be topped up as often as you want really.
Divas
post Feb 2 2011, 11:10 PM

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QUOTE(derking96 @ Jan 31 2011, 06:38 PM)
Divas, may i know which brand of food you suggest to give my shih tzu eat,avoderm,royal canin,natural balance,nutriedge,orijen,acana or??tq
*
Sorry forgot to reply

Avoderm is a decent food but a lot of dogs don't like it because of the Avocardo. It doesn't give amazing results but is healthy.
Royal Canin is overpriced, but an ok food.
Natural Balance and Nutriedge are both fine ingredients wise but i don't have any practical experience with either.
Orijen and Acana are both good, but high protein (if memory serves) so i would always recommend mixing with a lower protein (but equally good quality) brand.

Hope that helps. I would definitely not suggest Royal Canin, Avoderm is worth a try if your dog will take it, Orijen or Acana would be a good choice and Natural Balance or Nutriedge would do fine.
Divas
post Feb 8 2011, 06:06 PM

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QUOTE(xDingx @ Feb 8 2011, 04:15 PM)
Hi All,

I'm currently feeding my 1 year old schnauzr BARF, and planning to switch her diet to kibble as her poo is kinda dry when she is on BARF, and i believe that this is not a healthy sign....

However, I searched around and couldnt make decision which kibble to go for. Am looking for a kibble that is excellent for a dog's health and its skin and coat, and also, prefer if the dog wont produce a VERY smelly poo after eating the kibble. My dog cant eat fish based kibble as she will produce soft poo...i tried to feed Acana Pacifica before....
Is Acana Grasslands good? anyone tried?

In addition, I know that i have to brush my dog's teeth more often if compare to feeding BARF.....any brand of tooth paste recommended? and where can i get it....? (sorry, a bit out of topic  tongue.gif )
Thanks  blush.gif
*
I would have thought just adding more moisture to your BARF would solve the problem.

However kibble is much less hassle. Ingredients wise Acana Grasslands is a great food, as long as you don't mind the high protein (which you would be getting from a BARF diet anyway so makes a lot of sense in your situation). I don't have any practical experience with it, but with an ingredients list like that, you should expect only good things. However a word of caution - it is often the healthier, more natural and less grain foods that can cause smellier poop, however in my opinion if you pick the poop up as soon as it is done and flush it... no more smell, no problem smile.gif. Sadly though, as far as food is concerned, when trying to avoid smelly poop, it is a case of trial and error as each dog reacts differently to every food so it really depends what works for you and your dog.

If you feed your dog the kibble dry and give rawhide (or raw bones seeing as you are already doing so, i assume) there is no need to brush your dogs teeth any more regularly than you would feeding BARF (it is the bone chewing that cleans the teeth which you can continue to give even after switching to kibble). I prefer to let my dogs chew things and clean their teeth very rarely (only if i see areas where their chewing isn't doing enough), not only does it keep their teeth clean but it keeps them quiet for a while and by constantly using interesting shaped and different textured chew things it helps keeps their mind active as well.
If you choose to feed wet/canned food (which i highly don't recommend) you have to clean your dog's teeth a lot more often (even if they chew things) as wet food really really builds up the gunk and causes rotting/black/dead/decayed teeth way way way to early in life otherwise.
Divas
post Feb 12 2011, 10:18 AM

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QUOTE(-Aktan- @ Feb 11 2011, 09:09 PM)
people please help me, my dog last time been eating those chicken bones from the chicken rice stall... then its fur keep dropping and sometimes we  feed with pedigree dry dog food, i know its better for him because she doesnt drop much fur if eat pedigree biscuit, so last week i bought again, but 2 days before till now she didnt not eat anything , either rice one or the biscuit 1 she is very weak now, anyone know what happened? could it be the firecracker sound that affect her mood? she really afraid of it.. someone please help
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I suggest you actually read through some of this thread. I think if you even went through the first couple of pages you would be able to answer some of your question yourself.

Some quick notes anyway:

1. Chicken bones are extremely dangerous for dogs as they splinter and can tear the intestinal lining (as well as any other cooked bones for that matter).
2. Pedigree is a very very very low quality food, if this is the only food in your budget, chicken (without the bones) and rice is actually more nutritious.

3. She could be not eating because a chicken bone has caused her some intestinal damage. If your dog EVER appears weak you should go immediately to the vet for a checkup as a dog will usually show little/no signs of illness unless it is something quite painful/severe.
If the vet doesn't find anything wrong then she is just being picky and you need to stop switching around her food. The best thing to do is choose one decent food brand (not pedigree or alpo) and stick with it.

@AntonioKane - Feeding wet food to a picky dog is not a solution. You are allowing your dog to get away with the behavior rather than teaching them that they must eat what you decide to feed them (as pack leader/surrogate parent/owner). Also wet food is generally not as nutritious as kibble (unless you are talking pedigree/alpo) and also contributes to accelerated tooth decay.
Divas
post Feb 12 2011, 07:18 PM

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QUOTE(derking96 @ Feb 12 2011, 12:39 PM)
may i know a english springer spaniel should eat wat a????1 months plu only, should eat barf or dry food,what brand??
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Do your research:
BARF and Kibble are 2 different diet choices, just like people can choose to be Vegetarian, Vegan or a whole range of other diets. You can't say one is better than another, it is simply personal preference.

I hope by 1month plus you mean 2 months. Never take a puppy from a breeder before 2months. It is a very bad habit of a lot of breeders in this country to try and get puppies out of the house before 2 months old and it is only by owners insisting on not taking the puppy until the safe age of 2months that this will stop.

If you are interested in BARF (or even Home cooked diet) and think you have the time to balance meals and prepare them properly for your dog then i suggest looking up and reading through the appropriate threads. If you want to stick with a kibble diet then read through this thread to get some ideas about what are good foods...



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