You're guilty/innocent if the authorities say so.

The reason for this is ad populum.

People say they believe not because they have a good reason to, but since 100 great apes said so... then it must be real~

None. I get you.

Ad populum. There's a reason why most of those links have question marks in them. Cause they prove nothing.

Once it came on our local news, about this bomoh, who had captured a toyol into a jar. and we were shown this unidentified motionless black mass, inside the jar.

That was so darn distasteful. Is this a joke? Why is this shown on the news? If they were to say that scientist have dissect the creature and are baffled. Now that's news.

How can a claim be made news? If anything, that bomoh, should be gotten hold off, and investigated properly by the authorities.

We tend to simply accept everything that comes our way. This is why, there are many believers out there.

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Added on September 23, 2010, 2:43 pmOn one of the learning channels in astro, there has been a program on witch doctors in india. These people are feared and obeyed, just like bomoh's in Malaysia. They even showed how he teach his new disciples how to cast some death spell.

The guy was so serious... man who would dare question his power?

He claims that he can kill any thing with his curse, and he has done it many times before.

To demonstrate, he then did his mambo jambo on a tree, and claims it will die by the next day.


Unbeknown to him, the camera crew actually returned and found the tree as alive as it was before.

Funny right?

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Added on September 23, 2010, 2:43 pmThen there's another youtube that I came accross, it was a doco, on an indian man who challenged one of the witch doctors. To kill him on live TV. As usual, the witch doctor made some threats and tells the guy not to be little his powers. After that, he tried cursing the man.... and the subject just kept laughing. He was alive and well. The witch doctor was not satisfied and tried several times... up to the point of physically touching the man, and even applied pressure to the guys eyeballs to try and kill him.

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Added on September 23, 2010, 2:44 pm
The answer to this question is if such supernatural phenomena exist, as mention by Robert, why hasn't anyone claimed the price? The silence is deafening, there lies your answer.

As to, if I am not afraid why don't I approach one, and challenge them? Simple... what benefit do I gain from it? I might or might not die, and for what? For your amusement? If I don't die, you'd just say that bomoh isn't a "real" bomoh.

What if, we placed a bet, and if I confront one and don't die, you will free fall, off a 12 story building?
Sounds fair?

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Added on September 23, 2010, 2:56 pm
As to why, the non believers are unaffected, the excuses made up, I think are a little too convenient.

It should easily prove that it's a complete lie. A magician may be able to draw coins from behind your ear, but can he draw out a million bucks on the spot and live off that money? No!

Claims are just claims, when it comes down to actually applying them then they are no where to be seen.

Are you saying that the mat salleh's have greater vodoo power protecting them? Surely, if the natives are willing to kill themselves with black magic, why not the invading enemy?

Not having enough info? That's silly... all you have to do is ask the Guy and challenge him, he will tell it to you and laugh about it. Are those with powers that dumb, that they can use black magic to do anything, but aren't competent enough to get someones name?

If for example, there really were people with magic powers, first of all, they'd probably have set up an information gathering unit. Some guys who'd probably pretend to work for the mat salleh's and gain access to hair samples etc.

Heck, maybe they did do that... but failed to get any reaction from their magic.

This post has been edited by TheDoer: Sep 23 2010, 03:10 PM

Do you mind referencing? Extraordinary claims, require extraordinary evidence.

I tried searching online, but couldn't find the case to verify.

A search on the author, turned up with a concept he came up with such as:
Hundredth monkey effect

See the arguments against it at the bottom of the article.

He seems like a one man army. He had no peer reviews to verify his findings. Could it be that he fabricated or exaggerated his stories?

FYI Disclaimer: My use of 100 apes is coincidental and not related to his 100 monkeys

There's nothing wrong with 1 ape telling the others otherwise. It's more important that the other apes think for themselves, and not just follow the masses.

That one ape may or may not be right. It's up to the other 100 apes to consider, and not based on ad populum.

Wouldn't you agree?

Seems like I will have another bone to pick on ad populum. It's quite popularly used and if I may Generalize, it's like a golden logic rule for most people. It's a taboo to break this law. You are always questioned and shunned for thinking differently from others.

This post has been edited by TheDoer: Sep 24 2010, 12:10 PM

What?! a book that I have to buy to prove/disprove? You dig, and tell me where he gets his references from.

As mentioned, the author doesn't seem credible. (see my findings above.)

It doesn't matter whether he wrote a book or not. Lilian Too wrote a book, Joey Yap wrote a book. They contradict each other but that doesn't make them both right, or any of them right for that matter.

As mentioned, extraordinary claim, requires extraordinary evidence. If I were to tell you that I'm having chicken rice for lunch, would you doubt me? On the other hand, if I said, I'm having it with Barrack Obama, would you believe me?

Surely you will want proof!

You're proof, is from a standalone book, which no one can verify as being true or false. Isn't it convenient, that his is the only book with this story? Again please see my example above of his 100th monkey concept and comment, doesn't his source appear dubious? He did not even specify which scientist did that study.

He also failed to highlight that it takes many years for the monkey experiment to be observable. In which case, he failed to say whether any monkeys swam to the other islands, and whether there is a possibility that the other island's monkeys learned the trick themselves over the years of the experiment (just as the first island monkeys learned it themselves)? Also, did they actually count the number of monkeys that knew, then check out the monkeys on the other island, or is it just speculation?

I noted one portion of the book touches on snake charmers. Can you quote from the book on that? Science has already explained how snake charming works.

This post has been edited by TheDoer: Sep 24 2010, 12:40 PM

I don't think any amount of education or background will make someones findings acceptable.

Even Einsteins theory on special relativity, several people will have to verify his claim before it is accepted by the scientific community.

Now this guy makes a claim, and expects people to believe him? Is it more believable, if he claims that experiments were conducted by scientists without references to verify?

Just because someone is educated, doesn't mean he is without flaws. Doesn't mean he does not make false statements to sell a book or gain popularity.

We should always always! question, never accept things at face value, unless there is no other reason to doubt it. (Like I ate chicken rice for lunch)

This post has been edited by TheDoer: Sep 24 2010, 02:49 PM