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 REIT V2, Real Estate Investment Trust

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constant
post Jun 24 2010, 12:43 PM

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I see some REITs charge 0.3% for management fee and some charge 0.6%. They are allowed to charge up to 1% of NAV. I feel this might be quite a big drag on our returns. Hoping to hear some comments on this.

Thanks
constant
post Jul 4 2010, 09:57 AM

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QUOTE(yok70 @ Jul 4 2010, 02:24 AM)
I remember there is a rule that all m-reit MUST give their 90% or more of their rental profit as dividend to shareholders. Please correct me if I'm wrong. If so, how come Sunway REIT and the other upcoming Capita Malls REIT propose only around 6.7% dividend? Does that means their profit is not so good? But Sunway Piramid? Sungai Wang? Gurney Plaza? How come profit not good?  rclxub.gif
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That simply means paying out 90% or 100% will yield about 6.7% based on IPO price. Got to read the prospectus to give a clear answer.
constant
post Aug 28 2010, 10:00 AM

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I dun understand when forumers here seem to be very happy when their REITs are on acquisition trial investing more and growing bigger. I am very contented if the REITs I am investing in remains as it is forever and continue paying me my yield. Tell me what I am missing here pls.

With each acquisition comes the risk. Risk that they are overpaying, risk of mismanagement etc. I do not want that.
constant
post Aug 28 2010, 01:17 PM

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Hi cherroy,

Thanks for your views. Your argument is that if REITs do not acquire more assets, they will "stagnate" and also foreign funds dun want to buy. These are the exact reasons I want to own such reits. It is better for the foreign funds to even throw and reduce their holdings pushing price lower. The lower the better for me. As for stagnation, what is the worry of stagnation? Pls be more specific. What "stagnates"? If the management can keep acquiring "yield-accretive" properties, it is good as it can increase DPU, but chances of overpaying, undertable, figure-manipulation is high on every purchase. There is no need to acquire assets to "grow", REITs are not traditional companies looking for growth. There is natural growth in capital appreciation of existing assets.

All these acquisition are hypes. management must be seen to be doing something to 1) justify their pay. 2) they want to increase assets under management to increase their manegement fees and bonus. There is no need to. Just maintain existing props. as long as the reits have about 10 diverse properties, I argue that there is NO NEED whasoever to acquire UNLESS there is very good value buy.

It irks me when forumers make comments like "hooray, AXREIT to increase assets size". What the hell? Do they know what they are talking about?

prices r sky high now and "knowledgeable" parties are selling their assets to REITs. Dress them up with good figures and pay some undertable to valuer, and voila, you have an "yield accretive" props!

If inetrest rate spikes up, and properties go down, these REITs will DIE. But not those reits who sit tight and make no acquisitions!

Do not be caught up in the hype! Atend every AGM and tell the management to stop buying any properties.
constant
post Aug 28 2010, 05:23 PM

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QUOTE(cherroy @ Aug 28 2010, 03:26 PM)
As reit holder, people don't straight away cheer when the management propose acquisition.
I see little this kind of comment.
Some may be just mis-understand the acquisition issue, may be due to previous acquisition did improve the DPU.

We always need to look in to details of the acquisition, what is the yield, what is the lease, how to fund the acquisition.
Previously we did discuss before some acquisition yield is not something very good while some are indeed improve the overall earning.

Yes, the more asset being injected, the more management fee they can get. That's incentive for them. I don't deny this is a great incentive and potential excessive risk taking.
As said before there is definitely risk involved in new acquistion.
But it is same with banks as well, the more they lend, the more risk they have.
Everything come with risk.
If scare of risk, and don't want to do anything, also not a right mentality to start with.

For stagnation discussion,
Majority people always want some grow, it is nature for people. Just like you are doing business, you would like to have more sales, so that profit can go up.
Just like you buy a property and rent out, yield 8-9%, sound very good, but nature of people is, I want to have second properties to compound my return.
Little people will say, hey it is too much risk (price overpaid, difficult to collect rent) already, so I better stay with 1 properties and doing nothing.

Remember the first day the reit being launched, if it started with 10 properties, then those 10 properties also can be priced overly one. Not limited to the newer acquistion afterwards.
The newer acquistion risk is same as pricing of reit what start time.

Who know current properties price is high or low, nobody knows (although there is some bubbles currently), but it may be higher further in long term future.
Just like last 1 year ago, (a real life experience), everyone said a particular properties at Rm500k is overpriced, insane, but now there is great demand at 700k.
Main reason is our money value is depreciating, not the properties price appreaciting factor. So if there is such acquisition taking place, then it is good acquisition. 

Sometimes we need to be fair as well, if the management is doing a good job, and reit holder benefit are looking after, then there is little wrong in doing this.
Some properties are yielding 8-9% with long tenure of lease which is considered as good acquisition.

Some reit are more offensive, some are more conservative, it is allowable within the guideline as long as the management is sincerely looking after reit holders benefit.

To say all reit acquisition is bad, is something too harsh already.

Yes, I agree reit is not the same as natural growth company, but turn back the issue, if you work a company, and the company said to you, the company is not a growth company, and resulted your paid cannot be raised or raised too much, don't you feel demotivated? if you look from the property management company.

As reit holder, you vote or reject the acquistion resolution if the price paid is too much, yield not good, or company take too much leverage on it.
You approve the resolution, if the properties acquisition is fair, yield is attractive, and there is little funding issue.

Reit holders are deciding the acquistion can go through or not, not the property managers, so all reit holders decide.
So cast your vote and right, if not opt to and feel uncomfortable with acquisition, as simple as that.  smile.gif

Cheers.
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Hi Cherroy,

Your points sound reasonable.

When you say "Reit holders are deciding the acquistion can go through or not, not the property managers, so all reit holders decide.", how is the process? Is it the acquisition must go through some kind of resolution? The managers cannot decide at all? Thanks for explanation.

I agree with what you say. I just dun agree with many of the other posts here regarding expansion being surely good for the reits. But seriously, managers shouldn't be pressured to 'do something". It can be counter productive. Warren Buffett says," when there is nothing to do, do nothing."

constant
post Aug 28 2010, 11:11 PM

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Hi Jordy,

Thanks for explanation.

And, what is RPTs?
constant
post Sep 3 2010, 12:08 AM

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This ARREIT purchase is exactly what I talked about earlier regarding REITs simply purchasing properties. It is now a vehicle for big giants like PKNS to dump their stupid assets into ARREIT. The yield is going to get pulled down. So does the NAV. We do not need this type of purchase. It is a "yield dilutive" purchase. As I say, I prefer REITs to STAY AS THEY ARE! STOP MAKING STUPID PURCHASES TO FATTEN YOUR OWN WALLETS!
constant
post Sep 4 2010, 12:15 AM

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QUOTE(Jordy @ Sep 3 2010, 11:56 PM)
sharesa,

The current yield of ARREIT is 8.5%, while the yield for the new acquisitions is 7.25% for the first 3 years. This automatically drags down the yield.
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Hi Jordy,

What about the leverage used? I think leverage increased to 40+% meaning they part finance through loans. This might make the new acquisition yield higher than 7.25%?


Added on September 4, 2010, 12:24 amWhat I don't like is they issue new units to PKNS at MARKET price of rm0.88, not rm0.95. rm0.95 was the price they bought a smaller additional investment from ARB. should have issue at 0.95 also at least. Signs of incompetent management or something fishy?

This post has been edited by constant: Sep 4 2010, 12:24 AM
constant
post Sep 11 2010, 12:28 AM

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Bonus issue has no effect on NTA. It definitely does not increase nor decrease company capital. It is an accounting entry capitalising some reserve account into issued capital. Shareholders equity remain unchanged.

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