The quote is half-truth quote. If you're getting only half of vertical resolution, that means you're only getting 510 pixels out of 1080; I assume the horizontal resolution is still 920. There's only ONE 3D technology that does that - XPOL. Xpol uses circular polarization to deliver 3D so you use passive glasses. The difference is the TV/LCD monitor is an Xpol monitor where 510 pixels is showing you left eye content while the other 510 is showing you the right eye content. So far Xpol are used in professional playback monitors (the Thriller scene in This Is It when Michael and crew are watching 3D footage they just shot) as well as 23" PC monitors (you need a special 3D driver which they provide to play game and movies in 3D).

The theory to make Xpol work as a Full HDTV is to double the vertical resolution so that the HDTV is now 1920 x 2160. The TV will take the 3D signal and convert it to 1920x1080 for each eye. 144Hz is the required minimum for the display, which is the same frequency as the RealD 3D in cinemas.

Meanwhile, we're still waiting for RealD to announce the products that will be using their Z-screen technology on flat screen LCDs/plasma/LEDs as well as projectors.


fuad

For consistency, passive glasses. Active shutters work but the drawback are the price of the glasses, and that I can still see the shuttering of the LCD.

You mean this Vizio TV? If you look at the tech specs it says:
Xpol tech working here since Full HD 3D is not supported, but circular polarized glasses are.

Free screening of select 3D movies at GSC Maxx Tuesday and Wednesday. Going to check out Legends of the Guardian and Avatar. Check out their website.


fuad

This post has been edited by writesimply: Nov 22 2010, 12:38 AM

Both tech uses circular polarized glasses to view content correctly. That's where the similarity ends.

XPOL uses micro-polarizors that polarizes light circularly. The polarizors are about one pixel height and they are on a piece of plastic film laid on top of a standard LCD screen. But the alignment must be exact because one line of polarizors polarizes light for the right eye while the other for the left eye. Since the LCD controls which vertical line gets the right and left eye video, the alignment must be precise. To clarify this further, think of a plastic film you want to stick to a wall. The wall has 1 inch black and white lines running horizontally, and so does the plastic film. If you stick the film to the wall without proper alignment, you end up getting a black wall, a white wall or half and half. Again, the micro-polarizors for XPOL are one pixel height but they do not require power at all.

For RealD 3D cinema application (no home version exist yet), the polarizor is an LCD screen placed in front of the lens of the projector. Called the Z-screen, it polarizes light for left and right eyes. The digital projector which must show the right eye info just as the Z-screen is polarizing light for the right eye. So the Z-screen and projector must be in sync. The Z-screen itself has only one pixel which is the entire panel, just like how in active glasses, the entire left eye panel is one pixel. The Z-screen obviously uses electricity.

For RealD tech to work at home, they need to make a plastic film that can polarizes light. It has to be a OTFT or OFET film because two LCD panels would make the 3D HDTV too heavy and consume too much electricity. These films are available now - in fact, Sony made a rollable 4.1" OLED display - but to make one that can achieve a minimum of 144Hz, that minimize color and brightness loss, as well as being relatively cheap are the barriers to be broken. Once this can be achieved, then 3D monitors and HDTVs are going to be everywhere. People will buy sunglasses and regular glasses with built-in 3D polarizers.


fuad

Yes. If you don't mind not getting Full HD 3D, then get the Vizio. Personally I'd wait until the second week of January 2011 to make any decision. That's when new electronics are announced. Still wish there's an affordable 1080p 3D projector using polarizing tech.


fuad

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Added on November 23, 2010, 11:36 pmFrom what I can tell, GSC Maxx is using linear polarization; if you rotate two of their glasses while looking at a light source, the glass will become dark at about 160-170 degrees. It's not circular polarization because my RealD glasses don't work.

According to a staff - even GSC is mum about the details - they are using two digital projectors to do 3D. This is similar to Imax 3d film approach; Imax digital 3D uses one 2K DLP projector. Perhaps Maxx is using 4K projectors since 2K won't hold up to scrutiny.

EDIT: I just saw pix of XpanD 3D glasses.

The shape matches the one Maxx uses. It's just the color is yellow and for some reason, on each side the logo is a cheap looking "3D tech". Hopefully GSC is using a legit 3D solution. XpanD 3D is an active shutter glasses 3D system.

3D on such a big screen is really a fantastic experience. But even 2D digital films would benefit from the screen size. Thankfully, YTL is no longer in charge. Otherwise they'll keep running 35mm films on a screen too large for it.


fuad

This post has been edited by writesimply: Nov 23 2010, 11:43 PM

It is.

QUOTE

GSC Maxx incorporates dual digital projectors to gain the most optimal brightness for a large screen of this size.
GSC Maxx incorporates active polarized 3D system with 3D Tech active glasses. The LCD lenses in the 3D glasses incorporate the latest LCD technology which gives 3D viewing experience with best brightness.
SC Maxx is the first digital hall to incorporate fully digital sound processes by Dolby CP750. The CP750 is designed to work within the new digital hall environment, integrating easily with pre-show servers, alternative contents, and digital cinema servers. Patrons will be able to enjoy the full spectrum of digital sound from its original source without any loss in audio quality.

That should be "processors".

Click here for the full statement.
My worry is that this tech is a pirated tech. The glasses are not from XpanD but the shape and make matches. If XpanD finds out, Maxx has to be closed down until GSC gets original XpanD glasses.

The reason why I believe it is a pirated tech is because of the vague statement in the press release. When GSC launched their first 3D hall, they mentioned Dolby 3D Digital specifically. They didn't do the same here. All they mentioned was "3D Tech" which, if you've seen the glasses yourself yourself, looks very cheap like a China-made OEM product trying to pass for a Sony. The silkscreen itself feels cheap.

4K upgradeable means it's not yet 4K. The first CE to offer 4K resolution was Sony with their SXRD tech.

EDIT: Then TI came in with their 4K DLP solution via Christie Digital, which makes the Christie Solaria CP4230, on November 10 2010 - yes, just this month. So basically, GSC and BIG have invested in the Sony.

I've never been to a BIG but hopefully they know that good sound is also key to a full cinema enjoyment.


fuad

This post has been edited by writesimply: Nov 28 2010, 01:47 PM

No, the glasses LOOK like they are XpanD cinema glasses. But it doesn't say XpanD or X as the photo above, but "3d tech".

The quality is very good. I did not see any flickering at all. However, there is ghosting. XpanD claims that no ghosting appears on their system. I have not seen any ghosting on Dolby 3D Digital or RealD 3D systems - or at least that I can remember.

Often the promoters at Juscos and the likes (not like or HNorman BDenki) are not in their job for the long run. They are temps until they find a field that they're really interested in. So expecting them to figure out what to do may be expecting too much. If you're looking to buy a 3D TV - or any electronics - educate yourself first.

Next month's biggest 3D movie is Narnia (conversion) and Tron (native).


fuad

Well it looked okay. Not bad. Haven't seen it yet though, only seen the trailers.

HP7s are also conversions. Part 1 could not have been finished at a high level of quality to make the release date. Part 2 is going to make it's release date for sure. I do believe that before Part 2 is shown, WB will re-release Part 1 in 3D to hype up the finale.

You could be right about the OEM part. The refresh rate is 120Hz though. The XpanD Universal glasses can go as high as 144Hz.

But if they wanted to OEM it, couldn't they just silkscreen "GSX Maxx" on the sides of the glasses? And pick a better color than yellow?


fuad

It's in the multiplication of images. 100Hz = 100 frames per second.

25fps = 1 frame of video will be on the screen for 4/100th of a second.
30fps = 1 frame of video will be on the screen for 3/100th of a second roughly.
24fps = 1 frame of video will be on the screen for 4/100th of a second roughly.

But that's for non-3D images. For 3D images, you have to divide that number to half as you have left and right images.

25fps = 1 frame of L/R video will be on the screen for 2/100th of a second.
30fps = 1 frame of L/R video will be on the screen for 1.5/100th of a second roughly.
24fps = 1 frame of L/R video will be on the screen for 2/100th of a second roughly.

Those are not good numbers.


fuad

Have you watched an Imax 3D 70mm film?

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Added on December 7, 2010, 5:56 pm Told you, didn't I?


fuad

This post has been edited by writesimply: Dec 7 2010, 05:57 PM

That's because of the glasses has to be able to block light when they are not used. The important thing is that the color and contrast are spot on.


fuad

The trailer for Pirates of The Caribbean 4 in 3D looks good.


fuad

Well it's all in how you want often you want to shock your audience. The director can create the POP effect on camera then tweak it at post with the stereographer. Tron doesn't have that at all but it does have excellent depth detail. POTC naturally lends itself to the in-your-face kind of moments which works for it. Even then, I'm sure POTC would not have a lot of those moments, unlike Final Destination.

Looking forward to Transformers and Tin Tin this year. Will be watching those at Maxx.


fuad

This can work assuming your notebook will have the right video driver.

This won't work. The monitor can't handle frame packing video 3DBD because it's a PC monitor; the graphic card is supposed to send the frame packing video unpacked.

Either option, you may want to get the Optoma 3D-XL (which is hard to get in the US but apparently on sale in UK and HK) which can handle frame packing, side-by-side video.

PAL-to-NTSC converters have been available for a while so they will work. You just have to make sure that the device can handle Macrovision copy protection that Astro employs. Get one converter, send it to your family and see if they can make it work.

The US 3DTV you want must also handle 50Hz 1080i video. That's the video format that Astro B.yond handles.

Look into the Vizio/LG passive glasses 3DTV.

How big is the Big Cinema?


fuad

No. What you quoted is just the power requirements. That means the HDTV can handle 220/240v 50Hz; however, just to be safe go to a store that has one of these TVs and look at the back panel or ask the salesperson for the manual to check for the dual-voltage compatibility.

The US HD broadcast standards is 1080i 30 (1080i at 30 fields per second). When you double the frames, it becomes 60 hence 60 Hz, which matches their electricity frequency - 110v 60Hz. The Europe HD broadcast standard is 1080i 25 (25 fields per second) or 50Hz. Astro B.yond follows European standards. 1080p24/25/30 is the Blu-ray Disc standard since BD has more bandwidth than broadcast.

Most HDTVs that are sold here and in Europe can handle all SD/HD broadcast standard. Most HDTVs sold in the US (with the exception of projectors) can handle only the US SD/HD standards. Sometimes even the BD players are affected.

The ports are just ports. It doesn't come with decoding chips. Think of a port as a hose. You can pump any liquid on one end and the liquid will come out on the other end. However if you want to pump dirty water into the hose and expect clean water to come out the other end, you need a filtering device placed in the middle of that chain.

The Acer will work with a PC with the right 3D graphics card. It won't work with 3D BD player because the player will send frame-packed video. An illustration of frame-packed video is below.



The Acer can accept the frame packed video at 120Hz. But it won't know which images to display for the left and right eye, or what to do with the black blanking video. 3DHDTVs have the chips that can know how to decode a 3D signal and output it as such. That's why if you want to use the Acer with a BD player, you need the Optoma 3D-XL which costs US$500.


fuad

This post has been edited by writesimply: Jan 13 2011, 03:16 PM

That 24" monitor would work. Technically it's still a monitor because it needs a tuner to be a TV. But no word whether it can accept any other 3D signal besides frame packing. If it can, then you're set.

Supposedly Acer is also launching a passive 3D monitor as well.


fuad

Most probably as the current Frame Pattern Retarder (FPR) tech to do passive on LCD is meant for circular polarized glasses, not linear. The RDZ tech, taken from RealD's Z-screen that is co-developed with Samsung, is deemed too expensive for consumers.

Supposedly LG is going to stop releasing active 3D HDTVs this year and come out with FPR 3D HDTVs, both in 1080p and 4K2K (3840x2160p) formats. Based on attendees' reaction at CES, FPR 3D will win.


fuad

Not the latest news.

Most 3D PJs sub US$15,000 uses active glasses tech. The LG CF3D costs US$15,000. The Runco D-73D costs US$50,000. The SIM2 C3X costs US$59,000. The Dolby 3D module alone costs a lot of money.


At AVSF, somebody has built a passive system using 2 JVC DLA-RS40s and 2 Optoma 3D-XLs, which comes up to around US$11,000 - not inclusive of silver screen, polarizers and circular/linear glasses. You could potentially use the cheapest polarized 1080p projectors out there to build your own 3D projectors. If the Epson 8350 has polarized light output, you could have a 3D projector system for $3,600 - not inclusive of silver screen, polarizers and circular/linear glasses.

As far as drawbacks with silver screens, there are drawbacks with non-polarized projection too.


fuad

This post has been edited by writesimply: Mar 9 2011, 11:51 PM

I don't think that ghosting is tech specific in terms of projectors. It's how the implementation of the ghosting-reducing tech inside a 3D projector.

Dolby 3D doesn't use active glasses but it does use DLP projectors - as do a lot of commercial digital 3D theaters. RealD doesn't use it either. And there are no ghosting for both systems in my experience.

The GSC Maxx uses active glasses and 2 projectors. It could be a 4K SXRD or it could still be a 2K DLP. But it does exhibit ghosting.

I still don't like single-chip DLP projectors because of RBE. I would think that using a 3D single-chip DLP projector that's below $1000 would make RBE worse.

I'd go with the dual-Panny AE4000 projector route to get 3D projection at home. The Frame Interpolation would be useful for 3D movies and games. Then there's the 2.40 lens memory function.


fuad

Not quite new. It's been announced at CES 2011 back in January. Samsung is reportedly working on passive 3D as well. So far, the only ones in the market with passive 3D are LG and Vizio. Since Vizio doesn't sell their TVs in Malaysia (wonder why, considering that they can corner the market better than Haier), LG's announcement means for at least 12 months, they will dominate passive 3D HDTVs. And from what I read from AVSF, LG's quality is much better than Vizio.

http://www.lg.com/my/tv-audio-video/televi...tv-47LW5700.jsp

You can buy an active LCD glasses for about US$80. You can buy one of these polarized glasses for under US$5.

Not quite. You pay RM5 to RENT the Dolby 3D glasses (GSC Maxx glasses are active LCD glasses which costs about US$80). If you lose it or damage it, you'd have to pay RM200. It used to cost US$50 per Dolby 3D glasses. Now Dolby has discovered new manufacturing techniques to sell it at US$20. Unless you're mysophobic, you don't need to buy the Dolby 3D glasses because so far, Infitec tech is not being developed for HDTVs.

The reason why LG call it Cinema 3D is because the polarized glasses here are circularly polarized, which is the same technique used by RealD 3D. RealD is the most popular 3D installation system in the world. We just don't have it here. If we did, then LG's passive 3D HDTVs will get a massive boost because those glasses are cheap.

If LG can sell it for under RM9000 for a 55" and give 8 pairs of glasses, then they can.

Autostereoscopic HDTVs are expensive, lacking detail and so far very small. So far the tech involved includes head tracking, which is great if you're all alone in your house.

If you're talking about the above passive 3D HDTV tech, you can use the FPR laminate on LCD or plasma panel and apply the right algorithm to make the image splitting work.



LG is also launching D41P (21") and D42P (25") 3D computer monitors. These 1080p monitors also uses FPR which means you can use the same passive glasses from your monitor to your passive 3D TV and vice versa. The monitors can also convert 2D to 3D.


fuad

This post has been edited by writesimply: May 7 2011, 03:37 AM

Neither is the active LCD glasses with its ghosting and flickering issues.

For a typical setting where the sitting area is about 6 feet away from the TV, passive 3D users do not see the resolution loss. Because the left eye and right eye image are combined in the brain, the brain fill in the details that is lost.

pierreye was talking about FPR, not 3D SBS transmission on Astro.

FPR is just one component of a 3DTV. You still need GPUs to render all the 3D types to the screen; this is true for all 3DTVs.


fuad