It's because of the audio recording and broadcasting standards. 2.0 audio signals do not have a wide dynamic range (dynamic range is the range between the quietest parts to the loudest parts of a signal). So they are recorded and played back at a louder volume. 5.1 audio signals have a wide dynamic range.

HD broadcast is in 5.1 regardless of the number of audio channels is there in the content. SD broadcast is in 2.0. So when you switch channels, you'll notice the audio fluctuations. You will notice this too when you switch between Astro SD and properly mastered 5.1/6.1 DVDs.

Hopefully when more people subscribe to B.yond, Astro won't attenuate the Dolby Digital signal to appease the masses who don't have surround sound. It'll defeat the purpose of having HBO-HD where the sound is crappy. For those with surround sound and HBO-HD who think the sound is crappy, complain to Astro right now. You are a beta tester after all.

---

Added on December 19, 2009, 5:54 pm Only if you have a BD player. The difference in cost between LED LCD and regular LCD is too big currently to justify the cost of watching 5 (if you have Movie/Learning/Sports) HD channels.

But if you're rich, splurge. But then, next year we're going to have 3D HDTVs...

The main difference between the two tech is black level. Plasma has the best black level BUT LCD is not that far behind. LED LCDs have the best black level for LCD tech but they are expensive.

Depends on the size of the screen. A 32" HDTV (most 32" HDTVs are not 1080p) won't reveal much extra detail. If you compare a 60" 1080i HDTV and a 60" 1080p HDTV, you'll notice SOME difference. For HDTVs, size matters.

Additionally, a 1080p HDTV will take a 1080i signal (B.yond) and de-interlace that to fit the 1080p resolution of its screen. Depending on how good the interlace chip on that HDTV, the result can be just "good" to "fantastic." On the other hand, a 1080i HDTV will take a 1080i signal and just make do with its native resolution.

I can't answer that but you can buy a HDMI signal splitter if you have two or more HDTVs in your house. The splitter MUST BE HDCP compliant.


fuad

This post has been edited by writesimply: Dec 19 2009, 05:57 PM

And that is a good thing for most people. If they don't repeat shows 50% of the time, you'd miss out on a lot of great programs that run concurrent to each other. Even if you have AstroMax or in the future B.yond recording, and Astro only shows that program once, you'd miss out.


fuad

If a HDMI cable is good, it simply works, meaning you get video and audio. If it doesn't work, it either will give you video SPARKLES or no video at all. A simple analogy is the Astro dish. If it gets a signal, it gives you audio and video. If it's not getting signal, you get nothing.

High quality HDMI cables are only needed when you need to cable up a very long distance - like 25 meters from the signal output. But for short distances, a regular RM24.00, Carrefour-brand, 3-meter HDMI is fine. How fine? I've used it on a PS3 at 1080p.

So Monster HDMI is a waste of money. If it makes you happy to know that only you know or care that you are using Monster cable, spend.

The B.yond comes with a standard HDMI cable, no? Just use that.

Try using the B.yond bundled HDMI cable with a BD player or a PS3 and see if you can get a sub-standard picture. I bet you can't.

Even a HDMI 1.0 cable is ready to carry 1080p video signal. Most likely the the HDMI port on the B.yond decoder is HDMI 1.2/1.3. A HDMI 1.3 port will automatically turn on your HDTV if the B.yond box is turned on, if the box is programmed that way. The Slim PS3 has a HDMI 1.3 port and does so.

Or ever. Monster Cable, the company, has some really vile lawyers. Monster Cable Sues.See how Monster Cable is suing other companies for using "monster" in their non-cable products. If you open Monster Nasi Kandar, be prepared...


fuad

Call Astro now and tell them that you're canceling your account starting January next year. Do it quickly!

I know BD is better but not all programming on NGC and History have been released on BD. And sports on BD? Well forget that.

Because expats and NFL fans want their game in HD too?

Not possible. This is due to the fact that the government never mandated that all TV programming be transmitted as anamorphic video. This is what Europe and Australia have done; by mandating it, it forced 4:3 SD TV manufacturers to include a mode to enable anamorphic conversion. The old decoder box actually have a widescreen mode but because there was no mandate, there was no need for Astro to enable it. It might actually cause more confusion. Even some SD channels like everything in the Kids channel are not shown in letterbox.

If Astro is serious about HD, then maybe later in the next year you will see a local channel shot in HD. There's only so much bandwidth the satellite can handle.


fuad

I meant what I said. I don't know what you remember/know or don't remember/know.

You never mentioned HBO-HD either. You "refer" to HBO-HD but you didn't "mention" it.

And you are comparing HBO-HD to BD for what purpose exactly? The simple fact is this: with the exception of HBO original programming, the movies on that channel are lower in quality by BD in terms of picture and sound quality, and supplemental features, and they also come out on BD earlier. Even DVDs of Chuck is better than what you get out of Astro's AXN.

So aside from pointing the obvious, why did you point that out?
You said that, not me. If you believe that expats are more important and given preferential treatment, then the chips are on your shoulder. And speaking about "the typical malaysian", last time I checked they have not migrated from VCD/DVD to BD in droves and Carrefour and Tesco don't stock RM300 BD players.

Back to the point, it's all about balancing the sports content to cover a wide range of sports. And since it's Supersport HD, it's about balancing sporting events that are shot in HD. If there's badminton or sepak takraw tournament coverage in HD, I'd like to see that on Supersport HD.


fuad

Even BD is not in 4:4:4 colorspace. Full bandwidth color space is only used for post pro and digital cinema projection.

Depend on your management and service agreement. A friend of mine have to wait for centralized wiring because his service agreement specifically says that he can't have anything installed on the exterior of his unit. (But if he is within the line of sight of Measat satellites, he can install the dish indoors and get the signal).

At my end, we changed management to owner's association and they changed the policy. So long as it's within/around the balcony area, it's fine by them.


fuad

How old are you? 9? Seriously. There are differences between "refer" and "mention".

On a more serious note, I'm beginning to think you don't know the intricacies of the point you made.

You mean "stating" your preferred choice. Here is where you state -> "still prefer to buy blu ray and keep rather than pay for this."

And here is where you compare -> "good thing it's free..cos i find it to be nothing impressive,"

And to refresh your memory, here's the original sentence: "good thing it's free..cos i find it to be nothing impressive,still prefer to buy blu ray and keep rather than pay for this."

You need to reread your post because evidently you don't know what you've said implicitly or explicitly.

Just remember to write clearly and remember what you said.

It's got everything to do with your post. You represented yourself as a typical Malaysian who prefers not to watch NFL, except that you're not a typical Malaysian since you subscribe to B.yond and have a BD player.

I'm not pissed off. However, I don't see the point of you threadcrapping about the quality of HBO-HD. Here's an analogy: good thing this rental Honda is free and paid for by the company..cos i find it to be nothing impressive,still prefer to drive my Porsche back home rather than pay for this.

Fact: BD is the highest quality home video media available. Fact: None of the HD satellite broadcaster can compete with BD in terms of audio and video quality. Point: Why compare HBO-HD against BD? Why threadcrap?

As far as NFL on Supersports is concerned, Astro via Supersports may do so to provide a more complete NFL coverage. In the US, some NFL games are broadcast by the local NBC affiliate, some by ESPN and some are not covered by either broadcasters at all because the broadcast rights are restricted. Therefore airing some NFL games on Supersport could be the way that Astro gives NFL fans a more complete coverage of the sports.


fuad

Yes, for now that's how Astro sets up the decoder box. Technically, the box should be able to bitstream DD via HDMI and coax simultaneously since the HD signals are H.264. Just like how a DVD player can output digital audio via coax and optical simultaneously. Maybe there will be updates in the future.

Right now if you want 5.1, HDMI for video and coax for audio. It's a pain for those who have newer HDMI receivers.


fuad

For those without a coaxial digital inputs on your receiver/HTiB but with optical instead, you'd need a coax-to-TOSLINK converter. I can't say I've found any at Jalan Pasar but then I haven't been needing to look for it anyway. I suppose in the next couple of months, they MAY carry it if B.yond takes off. If you've got friends in the US who can send it to you, the converter costs US$12 + shipping at Monoprice.com.

For those whose HTiB/receiver has only one coax input and you're using that with your DVD player, just build a simple mono-audio switcher; if the build is good and clean, it should not degrade the digital audio signal coming from B.yond and DVD player.

For those asking for 5.1 "sound systems" to go with B.yond, that depends on your budget and upgrade path. There are already DVD HTiBs that have coax input that are below RM1000. The Logitech Z680 can be had for under RM1000 while the newer Z5500 is at RM1500; neither of these old HTiBs have HDMI audio/video inputs. If B.yond and DVD are all you are going to use (not migrating to BD), then RM1500 and below should be your budget. Any more is a waste of money because you can get HD audio beyond that price.

For those looking for 5.1 HTiBs, Sony has the HT-SF360 HTiB that has 1 coax input and 3 HDMI inputs (audio and video) that provides a good upgrade path to BD/PS3. Pioneer has a HTiB that comes with fugly full-standing front speakers larger than the Sony (Sony's are slim satellite stuff) with a full HDMI receiver (3 HDMI input) that also provide a good upgrade path to BD/PS3. Both sets are RM1999 and both cannot decode Dolby TrueHD and DTS HDMA. Decide with your ears first.

For those who already have decent 5.1 speakers and want to upgrade to BD, there are many receivers now that can do Dolby TrueHD and DTS HDMA. Starting price is RM1999 and go up, up, up. But remember to get those cheap 3 meter HDMI cables from Tesco and Carrefour for under RM30.

Finally for those who've got none of the above yet somehow have a sizable bank balance, don't splurge on the top end audio/video products just yet. 3D HD and 3D BD are coming at the 2nd quarter next year (first appearances at CES 2010 in January) which means 3D HDTVs and HDMI 1.4 receivers and cables are coming.

---------
For those who say that 5.1 sucks, complain right away and constantly. Explain to them that you can tell the difference. E-mail them too and perhaps CC a copy to MCMC.

As far as I know, some channels are completely live up-links where delays are for the occasional minor censorship. For the Movie, Learning and Entertainment packages, the objectionable programs are censored FIRST and then up-linked. Our HBO content is for Malaysia (and perhaps Brunei) only, even though HBO Asia is also available Thailand, Indonesia and Singapore. This means that HBO-HD movies come in pre-censored, pre-encoded Dolby Digital BetaHD tapes (the H.264 video encoding can be variable but DD is fixed at 384/448/640 kbps). If the audio is echo-ey, the DD signal is not being streamed correctly at Astro's end.


fuad

Do you have the latest firmware for that card? It may improve on your recording quality. Don't have any HD tuner card here myself so I can't tell you if it'll work.

As far as recognizing 720p only, the reason may be that the B.yond decoder encodes 1080i with HDCP but not with the 720p signal. I assume you're recording the HD channels in MPEG-2 since that is what the card is capable of doing. 720p MPEG-2 on the fly may be too much for the card.


fuad

You could always ask for their contact number and verify it with Astro. That way you know if it's on the up and up.

Who knows? Astro may want to enroll you in B.yond max as a Beta tester.


fuad

Yes, because it has only one tuner. A three-tuner would be ideal. Since I doubt there would be a decoder with a BD recorder, three tuners is the best that you could hope for B.yond max.


fuad

Good work. Keep them up-to-date on this issue. They need to perfect the DD transmission before they can call it "cinematic surround sound". Of course, the criticism should be constructive.

On a different note, for those with HBO-HD, let them know that you want movies to be screened in OAR - Original Aspect Ratio. Based on the pix of it so far, it's been mixed. Speed Racer is cropped to 1.78 (OAR is 2.40) while City Of Angels is OAR at 2.40. HBO has done this in the US but we're dealing with HBO Asia. Because potentially all the movie channels would be in HD eventually, the OAR movement would affect them as well.


fuad

Since you're using HDMI to view HD and SD channels, it's safe to assume that the built-in upconverter in the B.yond decoder is not as good as the upconverter in your TV. The SD signal coming from the satellite is the same as before.

Depends on the box, the upconverter can be hardware or software. If it's software, Astro can upload a better software to improve the quality.
This could be true but it's a complicated way of handling it. In the future, there could be only two decoder boxes: B.yond and B.yond Max (with two tuners). But the way the can handle HD channels is the same way as they handle all the various packages - HD channels must be enabled from their side. So having a B.yond box doesn't mean you can have access to HD channels. Conversely, having HD channels without HDMI output enabled is equally stupid.

It's supposed to work like a BD player. You get SD when you put a DVD and HD when you put a BD, all while connected with a HDMI cable.

===========
Any volunteers that can take off the cover and take pix of the internals of the B.yond box?


fuad

You can have 2 decoders on one account. But you'd waste money since if you have 2 decoders on one account, you shave 50% off the subscription on the second account and get the same packages.

From what I can tell, the composite video out and HDMI out are active active simultaneously. So you can link it like before, if you want. You just can't be tuned to the HD channels when you are watching in bedroom.

How are you connecting your B.yond to your HDTV? If you're connecting via HDMI but your HDTV does not have Dolby Digital 5.1 downconversion to 2.0, you get no audio. Check the manual of your HDTV.

This can be fixed via firmware update, I think. Complain to Astro about it.

Some channels are just stuck at SD. It's not just local OTAs but foreign channels. Even in the HD channels, some of the programs are SD upconverts.

SD channels won't go away but they'll reduce in numbers in the future.


fuad

---

Added on December 27, 2009, 11:17 pm Others have stated before. The SD channels are on Measat 3 while HD is on Measat 3a.

In the future once all the old decoders have been recycled, Astro can keep broadcasting the same number of SD channels but using H.24 instead of MPEG-2, thus improving picture quality.


fuad

This post has been edited by writesimply: Dec 27 2009, 11:17 PM

You are right.

Correct. Satellite transmission can cover a lot of area. Thailand, Singapore and Indonesia could receive Astro if they are permitted to be a provider there. Brunei already is.

The entire Learning Package should be in HD, in my opinion. But the last I heard, Mythbusters Seasons 1-5 were not shot in HD.

You can split the composite signal to get SD video. You can split the HD signal as well but you'd need a HDMI splitter that is HDCP capable as well as an IR repeater for the remote.

Indeed. Usually when there's such delay, they are waiting to open a telephone node in the area; they don't put a RM100,000 node in an area where there's no people. Sometimes the wait is not long as nodes get approved quickly.


fuad

This post has been edited by writesimply: Dec 28 2009, 11:23 PM

By normal you mean CRT, that is correct.

Most of the HDTVs out there do not downconvert the DD5.1 signal to 2.0. If you have one of these and your HDMI cable goes straight to your HDTV, change your audio to 2.0.

HD is defined as a TV that can display AT LEAST 720p video. Most HDTVs out there are 720p/1080i. These are fine to use with B.yond as the video will be at 1080i at most.

"HD Ready" is a marketing term. It was invented so that people would know that their HDTV is "HD ready" even if the local broadcaster is not transmitting in HD. It assures people that their investment is future proof. HOWEVER, Astro may get some headaches from people with these HDTVs since not all of these HDTVs, especially the older models, are HDCP capable. Since B.yond HD can only be enjoyed through HDMI, these people will get no picture. They have to have a stern talk with Astro.

1080p is the best of HD but B.yond is not going to achieve that so whichever HDTV that can give good picture is fine. If you have a BD player or a PS3, 1080p at a minimum of 37" is an option you should not overlook.

This is not necessary. It's for frame interpolation, meaning if you have the 100Hz mode on, it will try to intelligently figure out what to fill up between frame 1 and frame 2. The older the HDTV model, the less successful the attempt is since it's all mathematical. The newer models are better but it gives movies shot on film a fake look.

Full HD refers to video not audio. See above.

Correct. And for the last time: Not all HDTVs can handle the downconversion from Dolby Digital 5.1 to 2.0.

5.1 via coax
Video: B.yond decoder -> HDMI cable -> HDTV/PC monitor/ HD projector
Audio: B.yond decoder -> coax cable -> Dolby Digital receiver/HTiB
If your receiver have only TOSLINK/optical input, you need to get a coax-to-TOSLINK converter.

5.1 via HDMI
Audio and Video: B.yond decoder -> HDMI cable -> HDMI Receiver -> HDMI cable -> HDTV/PC monitor/ HD projector


I understand. Too bad Discovery didn't have the foresight to shoot everything in HD from Season 1. Yes, Dirty Jobs in HD would be very nice.

They do. Some have optical cables for HDMI with optical repeaters. This is pro stuff and expensive.


fuad