to be honest.
if not for religion.
i wouldn't care about any human laws that governs us.
i would kill everyone i hate.
and i would steal for the sake of surviving.

i'm replying after i heard someone said religion is like electricity. something we can live without, but makes our lives easier.

you forget that today's world was built on religion.
every religion is basically the same, maybe except satanism.
all religion differentiates clearly between wrong and right.

if you think that the world is modern right now.
think again. you are rich, wealthy, can get internet, and post on lowyat.net
i'm sure you have a nice bedroom and a great toilet and dinner ready served on the table every night.
some things we take for granted. and we forget how lucky we are.
most religions tell you to be grateful, practice gratitude. give back to the poor.

let's say right now, i'm a poor fella. and you can imagine how many poor fellas there are out there.
and statistics have shown that in the poorer rural areas, religion is practiced more actively.
if not for religion, and if i was one of the poor fellas, to hell with human laws.
the first rich man i see, i'm gonna rob him, and i'm going to bring chaos. i'll make my other poor companions join me.
definitely will create war. perang saudara. die also die la, life also not worth living already. die also no afterlife what? so what to worry? better just die or steal.

most people forget that religion embraces gratitude. and when we are rich and wealthy, most men forget about religion.

i end this reply with a story of alexander the great (iskandar zulkarnain):
when king alexander was about to die, he asked for 3 wishes:
1. for his physicians to carry his coffin to the grave
2. for his treasures (gold and silver) to be the laid on the ground as his coffin is brought to the grave
3. for his hands to be dangling out of the coffin

his close companion told/asked him, "i shall fulfill all your requests my dear king but with all due respect, why all these strange requests?"

he answered:
1. to tell the world that no doctor can save your life. they are powerless and in the end you have to submit to death.
2. to tell the world that chasing wealth is a waste of time as these treasures cannot be brought along with me (though i understand that the chinese burn treasures to bring to the afterlife, i'm sorry if this statement has offended any)
3. to tell the world that i was born empty handed and i shall leave empty handed.

conclusion is, life is more than about chasing wealth. money helps being happy and comfortable. but chasing too much of it might just do the reverse.

Myth or no myth. I didn't say it was true. The morals of the story are there. You don't need something true to inspire someone or make them realize.

You have obviously forgotten that the westerners are all joyously living happily with their wealth and stable economy. That is what makes a country peaceful. Their economy. If you say being non-religious relates to less crime, have you seen the statistics on wealth disparity?

They have forgotten all about religion, and all wealthy men do. But they also forget that religion has been the very foundation of their country and history.

In the olden days, people went to war for ideologies and wealth. These days it's still the same. Whether it be a physical war between U.S. and Middle East stealing oil. Or mentally, by telling all the developing countries to cut back on green house emissions and not develop as rapidly. Ever read what happened in Copenhagen? Ever heard about whites plotting for the 1997/98 asian financial crisis? You think the greenhouse effect is a full proof theory? It's a bloody white man's theory. If you ask me, tell the west to destroy their buildings and build more trees.

Think about it in terms of human rights, everyone should deserve to live the best quality of living as you've already said. The west are obviously trying to control the world economy, sustaining the wealth that they already have.

If you want to look in terms of country, fine. Look at your dumb statistics. Only 10000 people died in NYC WTC. More than 1000x died in Afghan/Iraq, and they are STILL dying.
Think about it in terms of the whole world. You think the wealthy controlling the world isn't a crime? They are all sinners chasing wealth. They do it subliminally. Pure capitalism.

You will never ever see CNN showing the terrible scenes and what not in Iraq. Have you seen the new movie The Hurt Locker. Pure mind control that is. A self indulging movie where they portray 3 bomb disarmers in Iraq going through a "tough life". Winner of best picture for the academy awards. How controversial...

So back to your argument, 30 years without getting into a major war? Best quality of living? Just think of it in a broader picture. In China, they say they have the highest pollution. But when you see it in terms of per capita, or should I rather say, per HUMAN RIGHTS;  they're not even on the top 20 list. Australia's the highest followed by the U.S. So before you look for statistics within a country on religion, just remember that that's pure bullshit propaganda.

obviously you didn't read the part where i said "If you want to look in terms of country, fine. Look at your dumb statistics"

your statistics are country based.
and i'm saying here, that your peaceful non-religious european countries are all a single entity guilty for committing war crimes. you want to say the european countries are "peaceful" and relating it to them not being religious. pure deviation.
and ooo cnn cannot show gory, but can show people jumping off wtc in their last moments of desperation. yaya save me your lame argument on that please. and about china's polluted city, obviously you didn't read the "per capita" part. or maybe you just don't understand.

also on your cheap shot on me calling the west "whites". it's a metaphor. lol. you must be real grown up not to have realized that. you can call me racist but i'm sticking to my generalisation.

china was stuck in Copenhagen. again obviously you didn't read any post mortem on that. sure they're gonna adopt green tech. but hopefully not by means of buying tech from the west and cooperating with google. haha.

p/s: it's "rambling" not "rumbling". this ain't wwe.

wow so now the europeans are in peace because they seek retribution from the aftermath of the holocaust? hmmm. okay you can have your say but seriously, wars are still going on till today between countries. remember russia and georgia? last last year only. and they're barely religious countries. ideologists/communists. georgia was a country struggling with it's economy and their US-educated president moved forward with military development. note that russia and georgia are considered developing countries (not first world) still not as wealthy and developed as west europe.

nazi's were also ideologists, not religious people. if you think they are christians going against jews, that's inaccurate. every religion teaches peace. nazis conspired that jews would one day take over the world, even till today that is still an on-going conspiracy. so you blame religion? or ideologists?

did i mention anything about bomb-blowing? lol. a simple show of how they are being treated in iraq is good enough. but guess what they show? haitians being rescued by the oh-so-loving americans. of course they look good. got money give la. in the end look good, but still got enough cash to be prosperous and wealthy. you really don't believe in media control do you?

lol and your wikipedia data is outdated. that's 2006 data when the middle east were developing massively. please get your 2009 data and then talk. and duh, of course countries with a larger pop will cause higher pollution. but isn't that fair? i breath the same air you breath. if i pollute 1mg of CO2, you should too. and you say that since australia got bigger land? so what. per capita doesn't include land. if i have 22mil people. the amount of CO2 emissions should be linear. why do the australians get to have more factories, more development and what not? and you forget that 1/3 of australia is covered with desert. and in true fact china has a bigger land size than australia + it's islands combined anyway.

china doesn't have the technology capabilities. they have the limitless number of cheap labour. their green tech is immature. why do you think obama had to resort in a green economy? nothing else to go for what. end tail of development already. seriously they should just pay american citizens to plant trees. if you say china can "profit" with single moms working 2 shifts at factories, that's just sad. in the end, who holds the wealth? who's living a better life? soon they will come up with a new idea, just watch.

and in all of this you conclude due to them being non-religious hence they are more peaceful.
here's mine:
human equality (not in terms of communism) = world peace
everyone knows asians are more hardworking than the west.
religion = a way of life and the very base and foundation of today's world
if killing wasn't a sin, i'd get on a plane and shoot george bush for committing war crimes. why tony blair kena charge but he never kena? think about it. it's a clear cut of who's controlling the world today. and it's controlled without human equality.

law is created by man. morals are created by man. which man is superior enough to tell me what i can and cannot do? the world was in chaos before religion (dark ages). incest, rape, murder, killings of babies etc. did you ever think it was human morals that stopped all these doings rather than religion being the very base of determining wrong doings. let's say we were still in the dark ages, would incest be a trend? a normality? perhaps after science discovers that it was cause inbreeding, then would humans stop. but wait. let's talk about homosexuality. obviously everyone has their own right, but everyone isn't stupid enough to know that being homosexuals will not sustain the human race. look at america, a world torn down without religion, and homosexuals are in the uprising. now being homo is becoming a normality having others lose the sanctity of marriage. kids now have a reason to "not like" the opposite sex, an easy answer for them is to resort being gay/lesbian. so which human law is going to stop that? they're slowly growing, now if i'm not mistaken states of florida and san fran have made it legal for same sex marriage. let's just say one day all these homos come up with a new virus even deadlier than HIV. ever thought about the consequences?

so you say middle east is bounded by war and crime. who came into iraq/afghan? americans, british, french, germans etc you name it. to find weapons of mass destruction? to find al qaeda? to seek revenge on 10000 americans that died in 911 and kill millions? which human law stopped that? which human law charged george w bush when tony blair was easily charged for war crimes? you talk about moral? f*** that. enforcement my ass. let's look at dubai. richhhhhhhhhhh. ever see anything there? chaos? nope. don't think so right? wow. how come? human laws? morals? the great prince is the ever so giving and kind? it all comes down to the wealthy and the powerful.

you talk about czech being non religious. alright. in terms of political stability and wealth they're fine. they rank top on the global peace index. similar to new zealand. would they be ever so different if they were religious? do you really think that if they were religious that chaos would come upon them? especially new zealand??? their country is at peace. stability. like i've said earlier, every wealthy man will in the end forget about religion. the need for gratitude is no longer there. there was one day when new zealand was religious. but all that faded away when they had everything. loss of gratitude leads to loss of religion. i've mentioned to you before on your country statistics, especially the global peace index, is a subliminal attack and propaganda against religion. and someone such as you has fallen for it very convincingly. it's just so funny how they put peace beside religiousness statistics instead of other comparable factors and data.

i won't defy the fact that the world is changing and becoming modern and this is the time that religion needless. but one day, when humans don't have anyone to turn to, they will eventually come back and lean on an idea/concept that shaped the world as we know today. religion.

since when america became the most religious country in the world? since when Bush worships God? since when Bush wasn't belong to skull n bones group that worship Satan instead (or u might call it...particle being/'alien'...LOL)?

since when lowyat forummer become dumber, mind numbness, succumb and enslave ya soul to benediction order?....I should start with thread...'dumber evolution @ lowyat'.....

since when they do not and your diligence turns blunt? 

click to enlarge...

as typical forummers might say:

just a picture?
where are others?
how's it true?
i can photoshop one la?
bullshit where got such thing!
i've seen many, these satanic, paganism, shamanistic, khazarians, yada yada, these are craps
,etc
my comment....it's up to u to seek more further. i'm just nobody who happened to drop by and gave the keyword.

as expected.....no need to start inductive/deductive interrogation and try to postulate something to discredit the given picture later, typical isn't it? u are so attached to the system, and become one of it, its like a movie matrix, once u plug out, u just a dead man, plug out from the capitalist system (ur new religion), as dictated by the illuminatis, ur hopes on illuminatis idealism i.e. capitalist/communist/etc are all crash and wipe out from existence entirely. No wonder when the capitalist system was shattered back in 1997, many ppl suicides aka plug out from their own created religion namely capitalist. It's going to be repeated when another wave of economic turmoil paralyze the system again, the time is ticking   .....btw u don't make a cut through even a novice level in that organization, not even in freemasonary (i guess)....unless you are equally at par to subversive Taksin a South East Asian drug dealer, than it's another story. 

-i'll be on hiatus again-
happy searching and preaching the truth   

ooo contradictions. 60% of heteros have anal sex. how many % of that are religious? lol.
unprotected/promiscuous sex... hmmm, which human law controls these acts if not the good practice of religion?
back to the birth of the universe, we have no answers. i've already said they're theories. all we have is something, but without an explanation. when will science provide full-proof evidence of it?
i am merely a scholar whom relates science, religion and politics. it's a fact that people are leaning more towards science instead of religion. more and more think religion isn't something required anymore. but i theorised that people will fall back on it in the end eventually.
the belief in a supreme being is also theory. just  like science, theories are ready to cross over to being facts. but such a far-fetched theory is impossible to be a fact. and just like many theories, it is only logical to believe that it took more than just pure coincidence of how the universe was born.
i also believe in newton's third law. balance. for every extremist out there, there are the peaceful and humble. but all we see on tv are violence coz peace is just so boring to watch.

i doubt it, i believe the book "lord of the flies" is a rather honest interpretation on a very possible outcome of a group of individual in the absence of guidance. note, i say "very possible" not "inevitable". while certain group of people may be civilized enough to do "good" (or as i like to label it, act selflessly in the grander view of society) most are still guided by their more reptilian instinct to do "bad" (or as i like to label it, act selfishly to benefit the individual regardless of the losses faced by others)

while you conveniently divided into religious/non-religious minds, you have to realize that there is no such demarcation available in society. "do not steal" "do not kill" - is that a product of civilization or of religion, it is impossible to separate which part of our society values is due to religion and which part is not. to you, not killing may be as obvious as day, but in ancient times before such "kind" religion are practiced, it is not so obvious.

when you so boldly say that religion offer nothing to society, you are doing it a great injustice, when it did offer much and still have a role to play. i would say that the role of religion is diminished, but not unneeded.

6)and saved from the New Worldly Order....

The NWO is dead, non existent, no more.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_World_Ord...ling)#Formation
Hulk Hogan and Kevin Nash are not in the WWE anymore. Sorry to burst your bubble.

I would say it is human's fault = ). Quran said no smoking, no drinking liquor but still there's some malays doing that. Buddhist, no eating beef but still some chinese eat beef. Why is that so? human's fault or religion? Other example, rules, I believe that everyone in this world disobey rules before. Whose fault? WE or the one who set the RULES?

I do believe that humans need religion. Let's take moral values for example:

You could say that morality can be constructed solely from rational arguments or empathy a.k.a. the Golden Rule.

But I believe the problem for this is that arguments and empathy can be subjective.

Let's say self-beatings. This practice can be considered as an act of bravery, or self-redemption, according to some cultures. However, other cultures may view this practice simply as harming one's own body, inviting diseases to wounds, etc. Differing values.

Same as empathy, in which we would treat others as we would like to be treated. However, can a South African 20 year old know what a 70 year old Russian feels? Can a minister of a country empathize with the common man selling t-shirts at the night market?

Only religion provides the reason to break through all these subjectivities, by an objectivity, which is God, the creator of everything, which stands above everything.

Without religion, moral values would be as stable as fashion sense. Ever evolving, ever changing.