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Philosophy Do Human Need Religion?, some people say they can live without it

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ozak
post Mar 28 2010, 11:31 AM

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Something nice to read.

QUOTE
Philosopher: Why we should ditch religion

(CNN) -- For the world to tackle truly important problems, people have to stop looking to religion to guide their moral compasses, the philosopher Sam Harris told CNN.

"We should be talking about real problems, like nuclear proliferation and genocide and poverty and the crisis in education," Harris said in a recent interview at the TED Conference in Long Beach, California. TED is a nonprofit group dedicated to "ideas worth spreading."

"These are issues which tremendous swings in human well-being depend on. And it's not at the center of our moral concern."

Religion causes people to fixate on issues of less moral importance, said Harris, a well-known secularist, philosopher and neuroscientist who is the author of the books "The End of Faith" and "Letter to a Christian Nation."

"Religion has convinced us that there's something else entirely other than concerns about suffering. There's concerns about what God wants, there's concerns about what's going to happen in the afterlife," he said.

"And, therefore, we talk about things like gay marriage as if it's the greatest problem of the 21st century. We even have a liberal president who ostensibly is against gay marriage because his faith tells him it's an abomination.

"It's completely insane."

Watch Harris' talk at the TED Conference

Harris also said people should not be afraid to declare that certain acts are right and others are wrong. A person who would spill battery acid on a girl for trying to learn to read, for instance, he said, is objectively wrong by scientific standards.

"It's not our job to not judge it and say, 'Well, to each his own. Everyone has to work out their own strategy for human fulfillment.' That's just not true," he said.

"There's people who are wrong about human fulfillment."

Harris placed no faith in the idea that Muslims and Christians will be able to put their differences aside and cooperate on global issues.

"There's no way to reconcile Islam with Christianity," he said. "This difference of opinion admits of compromise as much as a coin toss does."
Ketchup Sauce
ozak
post Mar 29 2010, 01:03 PM

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What's wrong? somebody force you into believe? He.....


ozak
post Apr 26 2010, 10:29 AM

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QUOTE(fariddarif @ Apr 25 2010, 03:33 PM)
yes, human needs religion. that's my point of view... smile.gif
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Human need religion would depend how civilize they are. Third world/poor country or less civilize country definitely need religion. First world country, rich or civilize people don't need religion.
ozak
post Apr 27 2010, 01:08 PM

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QUOTE(azerroes @ Apr 27 2010, 08:18 AM)
wow, its just surprising! so then our objective of life is monetary?

as for us islam,money has nothing to do with our real objective of life. its just to support our life. human needs religion to serve the real purpose of life. religion distinguish between civilized and uncivilized human.
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Monetary?? What money??

What I mean is, if human civilize enough you don't need religion to govern your life. A good enviroment and education from civilize country will help you grow better from kid. And this will grow from your home to town. From town to state till the whole country. Which why some country above the others.

"human needs religion to serve the real purpose of life" - What human need to use religion? Hell and heaven? Next life?

"religion distinguish between civilized and uncivilized human." - Yes if you still live in dark age, hundred yrs ago or in third world country. So what is the use now for people if already civilized enough?

Maybe you can read this --> SOS


Added on April 27, 2010, 1:15 pm
QUOTE(slimey @ Apr 27 2010, 11:05 AM)
wow. people who have no religion are uncivilized?
one cannot be moral without religion?
where's the statistical data last time that showed country with most atheist have lower crime rate whistling.gif  whistling.gif  whistling.gif
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Actually many fail to see beyond their circle. The main problem is because of the religion. The mind is close, see one side and narrow minded.

And from what I see, the world situation is opposite where a country with less religion have lower problem compare a religion country.


Added on April 27, 2010, 1:33 pm
QUOTE(Bpdestiny @ Apr 27 2010, 11:39 AM)
1 question, do you need your parent spoon feeding you after you've grown? NO! We have to live independently. Don't expect GOD to help you if you're in trouble, you live on your own. I'm a buddhist and I don't believe in GOD but I do believe in GOD now after some life experience. =) I pray hard so that my life is better but still my life is bad, and I believe that everyone's life in this world are up and down. GOD gave us choice, either you choose the right path or wrong path, in the end it is what you've chosen and its your responsibility.

I believe that there is only 1 GOD in this world. We human in the past might have separated our beliefs. Hence, alot kind of religions appear. All religion teaches us to be a good person and that is the most important thing that every religions had.

Sorry for my lausy english =X
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Walau, what so life experience make you change your mind? You teh tarik with mr.buddha? tongue.gif

If I not mistaken, as a buddhist, you should not ask for a return or whatever. You only can give and never think of return. No?

What deserve you asking something from a god? Just to believe on him? You pay $1 and you want to get $10million?

Sorry, I don't believe in god. And I hate to see people using religion and demand something from god. Where he/she never contribute anything out at all. sad.gif

This post has been edited by ozak: Apr 27 2010, 01:33 PM
ozak
post Apr 27 2010, 03:43 PM

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QUOTE(Bpdestiny @ Apr 27 2010, 02:56 PM)
Hmm, that is what you believe . . . and this is what I believe =D no offense .. er..I pray so that my family is safe, nothing bad happen to them? never ask for $$ from GOD.  Yea, I agree with you, mostly people like to ask something from their GOD during prayer especially chinese eg. wealth, knowledge, safety(like me) and etc. About that, I believe GOD wont help us on that, we have to work it out by ourself. =D nothing in this world belongs to you, if you're not hardworking enough to get it.

A man can claims that he's a buddhist, islam, christian or etc, doesn't mean he's a religious man, kind-hearted person, good man that doesn't do bad things.
Nowadays, monks, bomoh and etc uses religion to con people end up girls getting rape by those idiot monks or bomohs. This is not religion's fault. Is WE as a HUMANS's fault. So, don't blame religion, start blaming ourself. = )
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Asking for family safe is already asking god for help. Not just $. Can you never asking/demand anything from god and sincerely follow the religion rule? I bet you can't.

God only help you, if you help the world, the people and be more civilize. Cause you help the god lighten up his job. tongue.gif
ozak
post Apr 27 2010, 04:35 PM

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QUOTE(Bpdestiny @ Apr 27 2010, 03:52 PM)
Yup, agree with you, GOD will only help you if you help others.

Ya i'm asking from god,my mum always teach me to do good things and I will always help others but not good enough =X. Hinduism said what you do, never hope for any return. =D and I admit, our way of praying is wrong . . . its like a culture already HAHA so its not the religion's fault.. again... We as a human's fault =x

Anyway,bro .. have you read the history of religion?
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In buddhist believe, the more you help the more merit/point you get. So keep collect the point. When you have higher point, the god start to notice you and will ask you " what you want from me?" biggrin.gif

Since I don't believe in god, I don't read much religion history. But it was 1 of my favorite subject in school. I only believe in science.
ozak
post Apr 27 2010, 04:39 PM

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QUOTE(Bpdestiny @ Apr 27 2010, 04:25 PM)
Yea . . . so guys and girls..stop blaming at religon =( . Is human's fault not following the rule.
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I do blame religion. Cause it add and write by people over a hundred century.
ozak
post Apr 27 2010, 09:08 PM

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QUOTE(Bpdestiny @ Apr 27 2010, 05:41 PM)
LOL, buddhist belief is, the more you help, the higher positive karma you have. So, next life you will have better life. Its not like what you said god start to notice you and ask what you want from god..if like that, I also want..
One of the religion problem is, always think after life. And never think the life now. What the heck you care after life when you won't going to remember? What you care after life when people destroying the world and life now? Would you have after life if there is no life tommorow?

" Its not like what you said god start to notice you and ask what you want from god..if like that, I also want. " - Bro, it is call karma lah. What you do now will result what you get later. I always have this result.

QUOTE(Bpdestiny @ Apr 27 2010, 05:41 PM)
LOL, I don't see any bad thing about buddhist or hinduism's religon, mind listing any if have? I wanna know too >.<". Islam and christian ,I might not know la ..but I believe that all religion are good. So, I blame humans instead of religion =D
I said religion. Not specific religion. Religion rule is write by the earlier guy who is the founder (god). And it keep adding and rewriting over hundred of century. And who keep write and add it? What are their qualify? Do they consult the world? Cause I see many not logic and crazy rule in religion.
ozak
post Apr 28 2010, 01:01 AM

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QUOTE(Bpdestiny @ Apr 27 2010, 11:47 PM)
Current life I do good thing for next life.. feedback= still I do good thing in current life ????

You should say it specifically instead generally , its unfair to other religion la =_= and you don't seem understand what I said, its not religion's fault, is we the human's fault, religion never tell us to do bad thing , ..OMG, I've been repeating this for like 2-3 time?>.<

Mind telling which religion keep adding their rules? so far I know only one, mind share it with me? tongue.gif

and what kind of crazy rules??

okay... wanna stop debating le .. like I said everyone got their own way of thinking tongue.gif
Human got brain, knowing what is right or wrong. If its good, we follow it. If its bad, we still follow it? then too bad like you said, brainless sweat.gif and there's a limit of believing .. biggrin.gif
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I don't believe in god and religion. That open my mind and I see religion as a whole. The bad and the good.

You believe in religion and your religion. That make you narrow minded and see 1 side. That why you keep defend your religion and dislike others.

If we debate specifically, more and more people defend their religion. And fail to see the bad and the good. You say your religion is good I say my religion is the best.

Religion directly is intend to be teaching good. But indirectly create bad thing too. Religion war, killling for the name of religion and etc.

All religion keep adding the rule by people. You don't tell me all are 100% pure rule from the founder (god). Even buddhism original place is not pure rule anymore. The purest is sri lanka. Christian have 1 god but few rule. Methodist and christian. Islam have 1 god but many intrepreter. (sorry, I not good in religion language, Correct me if I m wrong with those word) Why is there so many branch and believing? Do the founder (god) write this?


ozak
post Apr 28 2010, 10:55 PM

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QUOTE(anti-informatic @ Apr 28 2010, 02:13 AM)
If u are as what u mention, and able to stand out from the border and look at it as a whole
u should able to realize it is very logical that this happen because there some human out thr directly or indirectly add their own rules into it regardless what their intentions are.

We can go ahead and think something like: Actually, those are god's arrangement, everything is god's plan, god know what best..... bla bla bla
Well yeah, regardless the possibility of such a thing, we would not consider of such thing unless it is proven god exist at the first place
So as a conclusion i stick to the point saying that some human add their own rules, furthermore since the partially diff believe and branches are not only one, so i would say there are more than one people try to make their religion go (maybe a little bit) to the path that they want
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Yeah. Realize it long ago. When I train myself to think out from religion and think in science way, it getting clearer to me about this human write rule.

Actually this rule did bring people out from dark age and gorvern good the people hundred and hundred yrs ago. Thing start to bad when it get adding more the rule, branching, fighting own belief, killing for dominate, jealously etc.

World change and people getting civilize and have another religion call science to choose. biggrin.gif So it getting cleary to some that religion is not important anymore and oudated. The world still have many problem and religion is not helping here.
ozak
post Apr 30 2010, 12:26 AM

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"For the world to tackle truly important problems, people have to stop looking to religion to guide their moral compasses"

"These are issues which tremendous swings in human well-being depend on. And it's not at the center of our moral concern."

"Religion causes people to fixate on issues of less moral importance"

"Religion has convinced us that there's something else entirely other than concerns about suffering. There's concerns about what God wants, there's concerns about what's going to happen in the afterlife,"

-philosopher Sam Harris.
ozak
post Apr 30 2010, 11:38 AM

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QUOTE(Turnip @ Apr 30 2010, 09:19 AM)
I have one argument on IF the holy Quran is made by a man(An atheist once told me),how could the big bang theory appeared already in the holy Quran already?Thousands of years where there is no such rocket ship and super telescopes?

I wanted to know the answer from an Atheist not from a religion people. nod.gif Need to clarify this one as its been 'whirring' in my head. nod.gif
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I don't see you read and understand the quran here too. You get the question from somebody told you. hmm.gif

Every decade/century or yrs, outstanding people, geniue people, professor, sciencetist etc, will or like to predict, talking, write about future. Base on anything they research, observe, etc. After hundred yrs or so, some theory prediction will come true and some are bullshit. Than they become legend, highly respect people or what you call now as god. This thing will go on and on for every yrs, decade and century. So it is not a big deal. Check back the history what genius did document down their theory and come true now. There is a lot. And why you never pray them as god?

And remember one, the quran you read now is not 100% the founder write. How am I know you the one add in some this theory. tongue.gif

You also can bullshit hundred of theory now. And after thousand yrs, if one of your bullshit theory come true, people will pray you as god too. But makesure is bigger than big bang theory. tongue.gif
ozak
post May 2 2010, 10:43 AM

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QUOTE(slimey @ May 1 2010, 08:23 PM)
you are too narrow to only focus your attention at the arabs....
as for the arab love to war and kill.... where's the source? can the source be trusted?

the study of ethics begin long before islam
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethics
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It is normal for religion people to focus on their religion side to give opinion and view. Specially when everything you live till you death is religion matter.

That is why the world is still facing problem with this individual only know their religion and don't care about others matter.

That is why the world is still fighting with religion war with narrow minded people.


ozak
post Oct 15 2010, 10:07 AM

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QUOTE(Potatojii @ Oct 14 2010, 09:32 AM)
Try to think religion as a road with signboard and u are the driver in your car.

Without road, how far can u go and where will your destination be ?

It is necessary to have guidance for us to move on in life.
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I cannot understand what you trying to say? hmm.gif

Do non religion consider as one of the signboard too? Cause we have a one more choice nowaday.
ozak
post Oct 15 2010, 03:18 PM

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QUOTE(Potatojii @ Oct 15 2010, 11:35 AM)
non-religion are like desert without road. u have non to follow.
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You are using religion mind to think/judge? hmm.gif

 

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