A good paradox I enjoy asking believers of God is the question, "Then what did God do before he created the Universe?"
And I've gotten all sorts of answers. One was that "God was busy battling Satan with the angels." 

The most important thing in a mankind's life is to believe the existence of 'the creator'. Doesn't matter if the religion is Islam, Christian or Buddhism.

Believe in the holy energy..

Well, the most important thing is what do we believe?
Do we believe that the whole life thingy is created by chance?
The big bang created by chance?
Or there's a holy power that created all of these..?

Cool it dude, just cool it. Your strong words are seriously not helpful. If he said so, let's interrogate him to the core. He'll give concrete reasons if he's researched thoroughly on what he said.

Can we not lose sight on the topic at hand. It whether humans can or cannot live without religion. This isn't a believers vs non believers debate. Or maybe I'm just too wishful to hope that such a thread won't degenerate into a does god exist debate. No offense.

Believing in god from what I understand does not necessarily mean believing or belonging to any particular religion. Right so anyone can believe in god yet reject religion. I believe the answer tends to lie more towards human sociology than faith of any kind really.

PS : I believe there is a strong tendency to flock towards what we find similar to us(a sort of herd mentality). Hence people of a certain region believing in particular religion or whatever mystical believe. Of course there is also the political reasons for certain religions to pop up(such as injustice of a tyrannical empire, out comes a sense of hope). Also religion can and has been used as a way to control society(imparts some form of governance for the state to take advantage of)

I may disappoint some by saying this, but I believe there will always be some form of religion even in the future. There will always be someone trying to gather people into their group for whatever reason. Hard times will always seem to encourage more of these sort of people.

Hey if you look at the bright side of things, at least you can say humans are quite creative creatures.

Just let go of it dude, it's off topic anyway, no use for rebuttal if he can't see the fact of what you're trying to say.

Well, no one can give an accurate answer there...It's all a matter of belief cause as you've said there's no conclusive proof of even an "us-after-death".

Correct me if i'm wrong:
Christian view: Heaven or Hell based on whether we've truly repented/ committed suicide etc... One question though, do we wait for the day of judgement before going to heaven/hell?

Buddhist view: There are several levels of heaven just as there are several levels of hell. And in between there's reincarnation(this branches out to human,animal,insect etc based on karma) and being sent back into the world as a Hungry ghost. Only humans can go to heaven, but hey if you're reborn as an insect, try again next life. Or the next few hundred. Eventually though, everyone will become Buddhas which we all once were.

Atheist view: We disappear? Though this is a generalization...

I don't agree with this, but I respect your opinion. I would like to add something - religion does not necessarily to be labeled flawed, it's just BLURRY, not clear and direct. Most religions talk philosophically, not all human can comprehend that. That's how you see flaws and inefficiencies in religion.

sauce?

AFAIK it's the chinese.

The concept of Zen is from Shaolin leh. He is not talking about the word origin?

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Added on December 13, 2009, 10:01 pm

no, it isnt.
The story of zen goes:

Monk A(to Monk B): Hey what are you doing these days?

Monk B: I eat, shower and sleep.
It's not doing it "ASAP", it's doing it and being 100% aware of each and every inch of your actions. Even a tiny bit of paying attention to the irrelevant = fail. Like the scenario above, eat when you eat, shower when you shower, and sleep when you sleep.
It's a very hard and almost impossible training if you live in the modern day world.

"Believing God gives human the motivation and creativity to create/invent/evolve into something that no other species in earth are capable to be"

Let me give you some example. Where's all the great film come from? Van Hellsing, Exorcist, Journey to the West, andDa vinci code ...etc... hehehe..all motivate/creativity/idea.

Ok, more serious note. Human marked time/create cloak to pray their GOD. All Pyramid was build due to religion purposes, mayan egyptian etc. This creativity help the foundation of modern building.

Chinese read the stars to understand the universe (religious way). Galileo build telescope to proof the church that earth is not the center of universe. islam was formed to united the arabs (althought not long) and many many more....

Religion can be a good thing when proper education is given to the follower, however most churches in Malaysia nowadays are just screwed up.

Sure if you want it to be your pillar for dependency it's all good I have no objections. Only and if only that person is sensible enough to think for himself what is wrong and what is right.

And yes it doesn't matter whether you believe in God or not. Being a proper decent person does not count on being religious. One just has to be sensible.

But when you see things like people fight over the use of a particular word, it just irks me a whole lot. Just because of religion you people start fighting amongst yourselves. It's already enough that we have racism, but we have to have to fight religion against religion as well?

Oh and then I find it funny that even Christians can fight amongst their own kind when it comes to their own belief.

To me, religion in the past hasn't been a dependable way to be a decent person no matter how many people turn out to be good following it and it isn't a dependable method now even more so because each one has their own perception at interpreting it.

I rather be a sensible person rather than a religious person.

And to people who don't wish to depend on their brains and wants to depend on some texts. Try Code of Ethics , that'll work better for sure.

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind.

the question of if religion is necessary to human is only something an atheist need to concern with.

if you are a believer, that question does not arise, as to you it is real and obviously important.

if you are atheist, the question becomes does religion have its merits despite being something not true. thats when opinions about guidelines, moral code, control, etc comes into play.

so believers are advised to stay clear of this topic, unless you are willing to discuss based on merits despite not being true. this is a fine line to prevent the discussion devolving to "its true, it not, its true, its not..."