Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

Outline · [ Standard ] · Linear+

 HDMI Cable Quality?, Really make a diffrent?

views
     
fun_feng
post Nov 5 2009, 02:29 PM

One Cat to Rule Them ALL
*******
Senior Member
2,289 posts

Joined: Jan 2003
From: Stairway to Heaven
QUOTE(moomoos @ Nov 5 2009, 09:00 AM)
this topic.... very nice debating indeed....

my fren, a sony technician and me did confirm there is a change,

one HDMI seem to display clearer PQ than the other, and also for AQ the ambience is different

As for me i believe there is a difference,
but at the end of the day... The Decision is Yours biggrin.gif
*
Ok let me see if i can convince you.

Do you know how binary (0, 1) system works?

A LCD tv is made of millions of pixels (or dots). 1920x1080(2 million pixels) for a FullHD tv
Each pixel is encoded by binaries. If you see your GC properties, there is an option to choose 32-bit color or 16-bit color, this is what represents a pixel.
32 bit means 32 (0 or 1) to represent the color that a pixel can display.

So take an example that you are displaying a fat straight line with some blur around the edges (which means grey pixels around it)
These grey pixels can never becomes black pixels which will make the line looked clearer. WHY?? Because the cable can never know what encoding to make it display a black pixel. It doesn't have a chip/DSP for such algorithm.

Similarly, if the picture is a well defined straight line with no grey pixels around it, a capalang cable can never make the pixels grey in color. At most (if the build quality is lousy), the encoding for that particular pixel got lost during the transmission and the TV will just display a weird color for pixel (white i think).

Similarly is for audio. Do you know how analog signal is encoded into digital form?
fun_feng
post Nov 5 2009, 02:50 PM

One Cat to Rule Them ALL
*******
Senior Member
2,289 posts

Joined: Jan 2003
From: Stairway to Heaven
QUOTE(Dark NT @ Nov 5 2009, 02:35 PM)
I am even more confused after hearing your opinion  rclxub.gif
*
Try to understand how pixel works http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pixel

Understand how pixel is represented by 0,1(binary). THen u will know why a cable cannot affect the colors it is showing.

Only the TV/GC/etc... can make the picture "better" using Digital Signal Processor (DSP)/software/etc.... A chipless HDMI cable can do nothing


By "better", i mean the picture is not original but is "modded" to be more comfortable for human eyes
fun_feng
post Nov 5 2009, 03:40 PM

One Cat to Rule Them ALL
*******
Senior Member
2,289 posts

Joined: Jan 2003
From: Stairway to Heaven
QUOTE(moomoos @ Nov 5 2009, 03:13 PM)
lets say a HD 1080p of 1920×1080 native resolution

means to say i would have 2,073,600 pixels correct  !!

so it will have est 2.7million dots of either a binary 1 or a binary 0

like ppl say digital is either a 1 or 0, means you get or dont get correct

so if a LCD depends on only one digital signal of 0 or 1 to turn "ON" or "OFF" i truly understand

but now so many million pixels meaning to form a picture,

so its common maybe few thousands pixels cant decide whether is a 0 or 1, so it just passes out what it think it is or dont pass out at all,,
meaning you still get a few thousands of "unstable correct" 0 or 1 signals...

during this state of malfunction unstableness, what will happen??? you still get a picture right, but not getting the FULL picture.

Am i correct to say???
*
Firstly each pixel has 32 bits (0,1), so a FULL HD 1080p is 2 million x 32 bits = 64mil bits.
Assume a 60Hz refresh rate which means 60x64 mil bits = 3.84Gbps + additional bits for CRC, audio and god knows what... is well within the range of HDMI 1.3 (10.2 Gbps)

YOu must understand 0 or 1 is not ON or OFF this simple in this case. These 32 bits represent a coding that the TV understand so that it will project a color to the pixel.

Then you must also understand something call CRC (Cyclic Redundancy Check). These bits transmit throught the cable in "packets". Any corrupted bits in the packets gets detected by the CRC algorithm which the TV calculates. Now the TV know that the packet for this particular pixel is spoilt, the TV will most probably display a default color for it, white if i am not wrong.

You are correct you will still get a picture, but not getting the FULL picture. But if a few thousands pixels are corrupted, most probably your picture will have white patches on it. You will not get clearer picture, red is redder, sky is bluer etcc....


Anyway, the probabllity of getting corrupted bits is probably 0.0001%.


fun_feng
post Nov 5 2009, 03:51 PM

One Cat to Rule Them ALL
*******
Senior Member
2,289 posts

Joined: Jan 2003
From: Stairway to Heaven
QUOTE(moomoos @ Nov 5 2009, 03:13 PM)


Added on November 5, 2009, 3:28 pmDecision time

10101010101010110101010010110010101010100100100101010011010101010101001010101010101001010100101101001010 eg 1

10101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010 eg 2

looks identical correct, if yoo really count the pixel you compare you can see correct eg 2 is original signal and eg1 is the receiving signal

so what if the HDMI cable cant decide and just alters the signal... ?

cant imagine if you have 2.7million pixels

gracias
*
Ok, i see you don't quite understand coding means. These coding is industry standard. like this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SRGB
These bits is a language that only processors understand.

10101010101010110101010010110010101010100100100101010011010101010101001010101010101001010100101101001010 eg 1 might represent red

10101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010 eg 2 might represent blue..

So if the bits get screwed up, your red apple might be blue in color.

But of course, we have come a long way in visual display, these things doesn't happened. The TV will detect the error and attempts to correct it. If it fails, then it display a white color.

Again let me assure you, these corruptions is vy rare, otherwise it will not be an industry standard
fun_feng
post Nov 6 2009, 09:30 AM

One Cat to Rule Them ALL
*******
Senior Member
2,289 posts

Joined: Jan 2003
From: Stairway to Heaven
QUOTE(Scud_eSpade @ Nov 5 2009, 09:24 PM)
Well, seems a lot of you is very good in theory. but you guys are missing something. Its true a digital signal is either ON or OFF. But in real life, the signal is more like analog (sine wave) due to resistance or others

*
Since the analog signal only carries the interpration of 0 or 1, the error margin is big, you don't need a super quality cable to do the job.
Any decent cable will do the job.


fun_feng
post Nov 6 2009, 10:03 AM

One Cat to Rule Them ALL
*******
Senior Member
2,289 posts

Joined: Jan 2003
From: Stairway to Heaven
QUOTE(anfieldude @ Nov 6 2009, 09:39 AM)
I admire your patience in educating people.

BTW: Do PM me what the importance of Nov10 is...
*
thumbup.gif Engineers are socially responsible to educate the public.. lol



p/s: Nov 10 is to mark the BERSIH rally 2 years ago

 

Change to:
| Lo-Fi Version
0.0312sec    0.62    7 queries    GZIP Disabled
Time is now: 4th December 2025 - 01:18 AM