I am worried in a way... Now i use remote access from my laptops to my htpc for what ever pc stuff/ thingy.
Only use tv to watch hd content now. I am just hoping that it would get better after break in (say after 200 hours).
Hopefully...I'm just hoping....

That is the major problem with plasma tv especially LG and Samsung. I think panasonic plasma don't have this problem.

No such issue on S10. Just blur image during early panel hours which have improved a lot after break in.
Not sure how would this B650 flare... Now tho i got htpc, i cant use it on this B650
Got to bear it. Rather than having retention on it

Actually panny plasma's also have this, its just not as bad. LG and Sammys are slightly worse. Panny's recover faster, sammy and lg takes a little longer. Phospor residue....Some people do not like to hear this, but Pioneer does fare very well in this regard.

Sorry, but what is image retention? It only happens with HTPC? Why?

Pioneer fr Japan. Samsung is considered 'second grade'.

---

Added on August 5, 2009, 12:01 amWhen i use TV with HTPC. Like downloading and go online surfing
It tends to have still image like sidebar, task bars, windows etc...
After a while, when i switched watching movie and concert or dark scenes, I see slight retention...

This post has been edited by ronaldjoe: Aug 5 2009, 12:01 AM

Free ke Samsung ni .....

In terms of durability and reliability, I'm still prefer brands like Sony & Panasonic

This post has been edited by WereWolf84: Aug 5 2009, 07:46 AM

Cons on this unit...

- BUZZING freaking annoys me. If you have a small apartment like mine, the buzzing is really bad.

- Not as bright as LCDs. Somehow brightness during daylight looks faded. Especially fullscreen whites looks like grey.

- Screen flicker on bright spots/areas. Worst when PC mode.

- Hot.

- Astro PQ looks blurred. No problems with DVD or HD but Astro on 50' 1080p is too much. Better to stick to 720p plasmas where the upscaling do not need to stretch so much.

All the above problems I believe are inherit in Plasma technologies in general.

Now the good:
- Black levels
- Color accuracy

Both I can never tune it to match the Plasma compared to LCD. Typical LCD color accuracy and black levels are off.

I actually turn off all artificial processing to get the best results. No Dark enhancements, dynamic contrast, no sharpness, etc.

Avoid this if you watch Astro most of the time. This plasma only make justice on higher resolution feeds (DVD and above)...

1) Buzzing - so far no, hopefully not
2) I find LCD too bright for me.
3) Flicker - I find sometimes but S10 is worse
4) Hot - S10 is much hotter than B650
5) Astro - later of the year Astro would have HD channel (stage by stage tho), I watch HD content mostly of the time

Features that I like (add on):
1) Much better GUI compared to S10
2) Networking (wireless/ LAN)

Much like a pros and cons situation. Strongly suggest V series for those with fat wallet like our TS.

No worry as for image retension,i did once in 2~3mths and the logo will goes off.

Is this your 1st plasma? How many hours has it been running?

Plasma phospours take time to mature. It will become less blurred as time goes. Typically after the 100hr mark. Astro shd be better defined than LCD.

Fullscreen whites should never look grey. I believe it is some setting that you have not optimized. Fullscreen white will not be as bright as a LCD due to the nature of plasmas APL but it shd never look grey.

Screen flicker will reduce as the phospors age.

I have seen Astro on Full HD plasmas and they look very good. Give it time. On fast moving objects, it shd be much better than LCDs due to its refresh rates. There shd also be less macroblocking.

What are you trying to tune? LCD accuracy in terms of which parameter?

Samsung is supposed to be pretty good with SD broadcasts, better than Panny in this regard.

For Astro you might want to turn on some of the NR as the broadcasts is pretty crappy.

Pls let me know what you are looking for and maybe I can help.

@ronaldjoe

You seem to be happy with the Samsung B650, but why do you say the Panny V will be better? Any experience with it?

From what I read, the V should be no different than the G except for the THX Mode. But that would be useless anyway as the G in asia has more adjustable pro options for calibration.

THX mode gets the primary colours spot on. Even the secondaries are almost accurate. I believe only magenta is off. The Z series fixes that.

Even though Panny sets have greyscale calibration options they do not have a CMS. No amount of tweaking can fix the problems with the colours on the Panny. THX mode is the best bet.

Better colour accuracy vs G + reliability from Panasonic + design + after sales service
And of coz bigger screen, V is 65" and more $$$

Yes it is. It's fine during low lighting situations (after 6pm). Daylight watching seems dimmer.

Fullscreen whites should never look grey. I believe it is some setting that you have not optimized. Fullscreen white will not be as bright as a LCD due to the nature of plasmas APL but it shd never look grey.

I would say dim. Somehow i suspect it's dynamic contrast. Here's how i test. I use PC HDMI as source so i can control.
> 1st test picture, 100% white. Screen dims, whites becomes greyish.
> 2nd test picture, 50% white, 50%. The whites becomes whiter.
> 3rd test picture, 10% white, 90% mix color. perfect whites.

No changes in TV settings. Just different type of picture. Even easier to see the effect of dimming when i drag a white window around the screen. When it fills up 100% of the screen, the white becomes grey. Can see the dynamic contrast ratio (or dimming) adjusting itself.

I have turn off all enhancements. May try to put on Game mode and let you guys know the result.



Hope it does!



No complains on fast moving pictures at all. No ghosting whatsoever. Again, easiest to test by dragging window. However, horizontal bleeding seems to be a major problem. Eg, scrolling text / credits will exhibit image bleeding. That annoying as well.



The disappointments i have with this set is below:
- Scrolling bleed
- Buzzing
- Astro PQ
- 100Hz only works for 50Hz input. It will not optimize HTPC movies channeled via HDMI. The signal must be in 50Hz or 1080p/24Hz to take advantage of the cinema smooth function.

The likes i have:
- DLNA (even plays MKVs)
- Price / size ratio
- Color accuracy and black levels
- Thin (surprising for a plasma)

However, i don't think i can get a 50' LCD within the same price range with the blacks and color accuracy

I have curtain down which effectively can block sun light.
PC HDMI input to "HDMI 2" - mode set to "PC". I don't see bleeding. It's much clearer than S10 on 1:1 pixel mapping.

hi tewwyble,

maybe u should post some picture of your mention issue so other might able to help u out lor..just my 2 cents

oohh.. image retention is burn in.. hhehehe.. how stupid of me.

But I heard Samsung got some anti burn in technology, something with moving pixels for static images... this don't work?

May be this would happen during early panel hours.
Btw after all this 'debate', I prefer B650 over S10.