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SUSDeadlocks
post Jul 27 2009, 10:04 AM

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Perhaps it's because all you've so mentioned so far are mere tangible properties? People are aware of that, but they are also unhappy because you forgot to include the intangibles as well.
TSezralimm
post Jul 27 2009, 10:06 AM

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QUOTE(Deadlocks @ Jul 27 2009, 10:04 AM)
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Perhaps it's because all you've so mentioned so far are mere tangible properties? People are aware of that, but they are also unhappy because you forgot to include the intangibles as well.
*
That is a good point. give me some time to think about it.

I appreciate you bringing it up. smile.gif


PS: tangible is not the word you're looking for, as it implies something concrete.... sweat.gif after all that debate about being subjective. lololol

This post has been edited by ezralimm: Jul 27 2009, 10:07 AM
SUSDeadlocks
post Jul 27 2009, 10:08 AM

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QUOTE(ezralimm @ Jul 27 2009, 10:06 AM)
That is a good point. give me some time to think about it.

I appreciate you bringing it up. smile.gif
PS: tangible is not the word you're looking for, as it implies something concrete.... sweat.gif after all that debate about being subjective. lololol
*
Your clinging to the norm is similar to the idea of "survival of the fittest", but you I think you didn't know that people are mostly atheistic against that.

Hence, the tension.

Tangibility is the opposite of abstract, conceptual, imperceptible, intangible, and the unreal.

It is the lack of intangibles that you are losing people's conviction.

This post has been edited by Deadlocks: Jul 27 2009, 10:15 AM
TSezralimm
post Jul 27 2009, 10:14 AM

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Totally.

I was thinking similarly to that.
I am a staunch realist. I believe in realism, not romanticism.
I also believe in "survival of the fittest".

^that said, I am human, and I do wish to fall in love with someone I find worthy one day. I strive towards that. it is my drive. I believe in love and monogamy...so i guess it's important to find someone truly worthy.

I've been getting the feeling that some people fell uncomfortable reading the article as it goes against the hope that they have in falling in love with their ideal partner.

I gotta admit, reality can be harsh... But waking up to that reality is the first step in making real changes in one's life. Changes for the better.

I write with a clear conscience...but sadly truth is not politically correct. There will be winners in the game of love, and there will be losers.

If you take comfort in knowing that there are EXCEPTIONS that derive from the intangible intricacies of life... such as the shy introverted, WOW addicted, obese loner who hooked up with a hot girl... Or the "old uncle" with bad physical/mental/emotional health who has a hot wife... then i guess this article is not for you.

I believe that my generalizations hold, and that exceptions will never be the norm.

This post has been edited by ezralimm: Jul 27 2009, 10:18 AM
SUSDeadlocks
post Jul 27 2009, 10:19 AM

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QUOTE(ezralimm @ Jul 27 2009, 10:14 AM)
Totally.

I was thinking similarly to that.
I am a staunch realist. I believe in realism, not romanticism.
I also believe in "survival of the fittest".

I've been getting the feeling that some people fell uncomfortable reading the article as it goes against the hope that they have in falling in love with their ideal partner.

I gotta admit, reality can be harsh... But waking up to that reality is the first step in making real changes in one's life. Changes for the better.

I write with a clear conscience...but sadly truth is not politically correct. There will be winners in the game of love, and there will be losers.

If you take comfort in knowing that there are EXCEPTIONS... such as the shy introverted, WOW addicted, obese loner who hooked up with a hot girl... Or the "old uncle" with bad physical/mental/emotional health who has a hot wife... then i guess this article is not for you.
*
If you're truly a realist Ezra, you'll transform your writing efforts into something more tangible, more concrete, something touchable, say, a girlfriend maybe, or your soul mate.

Your writings shows that you are probably like us, perceiving reality on our own terms, and perhaps manifesting our own realities.

This post has been edited by Deadlocks: Jul 27 2009, 10:21 AM
mumeichan
post Jul 27 2009, 10:31 AM

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QUOTE(Dickson Poon @ Jul 26 2009, 04:51 AM)
This put a LOT of things into perspective. For all my faults and flaws, no matter how "uncool" I was and all the horrible pratfalls I've made in life... I realised I had inherent worth because I stood up and took action where few people would or could, and the times I did so really did mean something.
*
You may think you are worth the heavens but that's is just your personal opinion about yourself. That opinion doesn't carry much weight when it comes to interpersonal relationships. When there is interaction between between people, each person wishes to derive something from that interaction. Whatever it may be, a person will present his self in a way he thinks would achieve the desired effect on the other party, thus getting him what he wants.

So even if you think you have some inherant worth for doing something when others don't, it would not mean much if the person you're dealing with thinks you're a complete idiot for making such an action.

QUOTE(Jamien @ Jul 26 2009, 02:25 PM)
Oh, so he's one of the men still trying to figure women out? Lol it'll never work. Reason being that women and men are different. You don't have to understand women to please women and attract women.
*
+1 This is so true

QUOTE(happy4ever @ Jul 27 2009, 09:26 AM)
when you were growing up with your high school friends, do you two check each other out when your pubes start to grow? "Hey, i got few strands!!! come see!! come see!!!"  did you?  hmm.gif
*
In all honesty, I have seen and hear about my friends doing such weird stuff.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Btw @Ezra's original post,

Love isn't that simple, so is any other type of human interaction. If it was, people wouldn't have so much problems.


Added on July 27, 2009, 10:39 am
QUOTE(Deadlocks @ Jul 27 2009, 10:19 AM)
If you're truly a realist Ezra, you'll transform your writing efforts into something more tangible, more concrete, something touchable, say, a girlfriend maybe, or your soul mate.

Your writings shows that you are probably like us, perceiving reality on our own terms, and perhaps manifesting our own realities.
*
I agree. Do you know why business promote products and services by doing demonstrations and publishing success stories? Do you know why companies prefer experienced workers? People need to see the results to be convinced something really works. Talk alone is cheap. If you show the results, people will be willing to listen and follow you even if you talk crap. Why do people buy Donald Trump's books? Because he's known to be a good writer? Because the contents are good? Definitely not, he's not a writer and people know shit about what's in his book. But because he proved to be a successful businessman, people are willing to give it a look.

This post has been edited by mumeichan: Jul 27 2009, 10:39 AM
TSezralimm
post Jul 27 2009, 10:41 AM

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QUOTE(mumeichan @ Jul 27 2009, 10:31 AM)
Btw @Ezra's original post,
Love isn't that simple, so is any other type of human interaction. If it was, people wouldn't have so much problems.
*
Thanks for the feedback!
Just a simple clarification: this article is not about Love per se.

Love blossoms when it blossoms. Fate? Destiny?

This article is about how to make girls want to interact with you....giving you more OPPORTUNITIES to fall in love. It guarantees nothing, and is simply a rough guide to getting more of the right type of interaction with girls.

This post has been edited by ezralimm: Jul 27 2009, 10:46 AM
SUSDeadlocks
post Jul 27 2009, 11:04 AM

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QUOTE(ezralimm @ Jul 27 2009, 10:41 AM)
Thanks for the feedback!
Just a simple clarification: this article is not about Love per se.

Love blossoms when it blossoms. Fate? Destiny?

This article is about how to make girls want to interact with you....giving you more OPPORTUNITIES to fall in love. It guarantees nothing, and is simply a rough guide to getting more of the right type of interaction with girls.
*
You may be forgetting one thing though.

Girls are reading it too lol.
mofonyx
post Jul 27 2009, 11:30 AM

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QUOTE(happy4ever @ Jul 27 2009, 09:26 AM)
when you were growing up with your high school friends, do you two check each other out when your pubes start to grow? "Hey, i got few strands!!! come see!! come see!!!"  did you?  hmm.gif
*
All things, all things. Girls not allowed.
silverhawk
post Jul 27 2009, 02:08 PM

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QUOTE(ezralimm @ Jul 27 2009, 09:49 AM)
In my opinion, there is nothing wrong with making generalizations if they are true. Do note that generalizations, by definition, will have exceptions (which is why they are not called "absolute truths" but rather "generalizations" in the first place.)

There is the problem of something being so generalised it doesn't have any value.

QUOTE
But it is not the general truth. In reality, the guys with those issues are very likely to have their choice selection of partners (ie. The girls they are interested in are not interested in them). Im not saying that they are doomed to be single all their life...Most people will adjust their standards (the hot girls with options were out of their league) and date/ask-out girls who are willing to go out with them.

The problem is you perpetrate this generalisation as though its something people should do/must do to succeed/thrive. There is truth to it, but as mentioned to you time and time again, you're putting the cart before the horse. Almost everyone knows that being healthy, being better groomed etc. will be better, but the problem is that such advice although true, is shallow, and it requires a much deeper understanding of core values before you truly understand what it means.

I'm going to make an assumption, but correct me if I'm wrong. You're still a student, and you haven't gone out in the working world to meet people at various levels of power. You're still stuck within the perspective of young students/young adults, the image of successful people are normally those on magazines; healthy, good looking and rich. Put that together with the social engagements around you and its easy to come to the misguided conclusion of what would qualities thriving person has.

Once you get out and start meeting people from all walks of life, you'll see how some really "attractive" people aren't "thriving" and how some people who just look so plain/average/below-average are actually doing damn well in life in almost all aspects. In your case, what you think is general truth may apply due to your personal experience, my personal experience however has a different generalisation.

QUOTE
It's not to say that you subjective feedback on writing isnt valued. Believe it or not, it actually is. I have been trying very hard to make the message as politically correct / non-offensive / non-belittling as possible. But there is a limit that I will reach sooner or later.

I do believe that you trying to make it "nice" for people undermines the entire message. If you have something to say, something to share, something of value. SAY IT and STAND BY IT don't give a shit about what other people think of it, if they can't bloody accept what you say, boo hoo, go cry to mommy.

You can't help people who do not want help, but you can help those who actively seek for help. If you want to take up writing, you have to be very strong on your points, people will criticise your writing from all angles, and if you always try to pander to the myriad criticism, your message in itself starts to lose direction and value.

QUOTE
I agree. The delivery style is not perfect

I don't think its even good to begin with.

QUOTE
ANyway, I was not "defining it for people" I was just expressing my opinion. Note I even added "IN MY PERSONAL OPINION" in caps to the sentence. FREEDOM OF EXPRESSION IS A HUMAN RIGHT. If you want to use that kind of an argument, then almost opinion on this forum is wrong.

I have the right to express myself. You have the right not to listen. You have the right to disagree if it means something else to you.

Yes, which I am disagreeing with you now no? The crux of the issue lies within how you define "self worth". Like religious believes, you have to realise that its entirely personal. You can't tell another person what their self worth is, or even how to judge their own self worthiness. Its something that have to come to by themselves.

You can teach them how to find it, but you can't tell them what it should be or what it is.

QUOTE
Also, I did not say that physical/mental/emotional health = self worth. I DID NOT SAY THAT. I said that self worth builds as a natural consequence of being in good physical/mental/emotional health.

I DID NOT MENTION ANYTHING ABOUT having self worth WITHOUT good physical/mental/emotional health.

I DID NOT MENTION ANYTHING ABOUT some people having self worth WITHOUT good physical/mental/emotional health.
(yes, i agree some people do have high self worth even though they are in poor physical/mental/emotional health)

Really?

Lets see what you said here:
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

Don't try to back paddle on the issue. This is exactly what you said and it does mean physical/mental/emotional health = self worth. This is further evidenced by the amount of topics you made on the same issue. If its not what you meant then perhaps you need to work on your communication skills.

QUOTE
Your logic is non-sequirtur!

laugh.gif You think using words like this makes you smarter or intimidates others? If you want to point out logical fallacies, please use the right ones. The misrepresentation of an opponent's arguments is the strawman fallacy. Non-sequitur is when the conclusion does not follow the premise.

QUOTE
Dont put words in my mouth laa... If this thread makes you bitter, then dont read it...but ffs stop putting words in my mouth.
You put your own words in your mouth mate. Not me.
TSezralimm
post Jul 27 2009, 02:29 PM

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QUOTE(silverhawk @ Jul 27 2009, 02:08 PM)
snip
*
yawn.gif whateverlaa...

You're right. I shouldnt really give a shit what ppl say about my writings.

Regarding the self worth thingy, yeah, I made a slip on that one occasion...but i still stand by what i say: self worth naturally develops when a person is thriving physically/mentally and emotionally.

I really meant that you were non-sequitur. Especially with the quotes you gave. I replied every single one. Anyway getting lazy to argue lah.

cya on fb ;-)




To other readers:

Define "self worth" whatever damn way it makes you happy. It doesnt matter. I dont care.

To me, a young man, self worth develops naturally from physical, emotional and mental health. And that is the context I am using the term.



The article stands. You can say what you like about how it hurts your fragile egos and go to whatever lengths to try and discredit it and feel better about yourself. I dont give a shit anymore. I've tried my best to make it as POSITIVE and a least insulting/belittling/negative as possible. I dont think i can do that any further.



The game of love is cruel. THere will be winners. There will be losers.


What I wrote is basically what I feel the winners have.


You may think differently, and you may use whatever rare examples (eg. the shy obese, lonely, isolated nerd who has a hot gf) to give you hope and to feel good about yourself. It will not change reality as I PERSONALLY perceive it. If you perceive reality to be different, then you are entitled to your views. Do start another thread or something.

This post has been edited by ezralimm: Jul 27 2009, 02:40 PM
SUSDickson Poon
post Jul 27 2009, 02:40 PM

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QUOTE(mumeichan @ Jul 27 2009, 10:31 AM)
You may think you are worth the heavens but that's is just your personal opinion about yourself. That opinion doesn't carry much weight when it comes to interpersonal relationships. When there is interaction between between people, each person wishes to derive something from that interaction. Whatever it may be, a person will present his self in a way he thinks would achieve the desired effect on the other party, thus getting him what he wants.

So even if you think you have some inherant worth for doing something  when others don't, it would not mean much if the person you're dealing with thinks you're a complete idiot for making such an action.
You are absolutely correct. This is my personal opinion about myself. Meaning that other people's judgements have stopped influencing my perception of self.

Wooo, so somebody thinks that I'm an idiot. So what? Plenty of other people think that I'm alright, and I have friends. This is the key. So what? There are other judgements of worth apart from what other people think and what I intend to derive from an interaction, because I CHOOSE my interactions and the people I interact with. So in the end I really don't care. biggrin.gif

This post has been edited by Dickson Poon: Jul 27 2009, 02:42 PM
TSezralimm
post Jul 27 2009, 02:42 PM

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QUOTE(Dickson Poon @ Jul 27 2009, 02:40 PM)
You are absolutely correct. This is my personal opinion about myself. Meaning that other people's judgements have stopped influencing my perception of myself.

Wooo, so somebody thinks that I'm an idiot. So what? Plenty of other people think that I'm alright, and I have friends. So I really don't care.  biggrin.gif
*
same here dude. At the end of the day, with a good social life and emotional wellbeing, you dont really care about what people say in forums such as this about you.
Iambored
post Jul 27 2009, 02:43 PM

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if you are like the idols in taiwanese drama, i will want to know you smile.gif
SUSspanker
post Jul 27 2009, 02:55 PM

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QUOTE(debbieyss @ Jul 25 2009, 10:19 AM)
There's no theory in love, alright?

Both can ignite the spark or break up for any reasons.
*
Or, one can try to spark some flames and then the other person is constantly putting it out.
emefbiemef
post Jul 27 2009, 03:07 PM

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You're arrogant. And childish. And thinks you know it all. And have no gf.

So there.
SUSspanker
post Jul 27 2009, 03:20 PM

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QUOTE(Dickson Poon @ Jul 27 2009, 02:40 PM)
You are absolutely correct. This is my personal opinion about myself. Meaning that other people's judgements have stopped influencing my perception of self.

Wooo, so somebody thinks that I'm an idiot. So what? Plenty of other people think that I'm alright, and I have friends. This is the key. So what? There are other judgements of worth apart from what other people think and what I intend to derive from an interaction, because I CHOOSE my interactions and the people I interact with. So in the end I really don't care.  biggrin.gif
*
I have plenty of friends whom are idiots. Sometimes it's fun to act like an idiot, being a genius is a huge drain on my emotional well being. Dickson Poon Tang, will you be my fwen?
Duke Red
post Jul 27 2009, 03:33 PM

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Darn missed out on this debate...

Can't be arsed reading everything so I'll keep my opinion short. Just be interesting.
SUSDickson Poon
post Jul 27 2009, 03:34 PM

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QUOTE(spanker @ Jul 27 2009, 03:20 PM)
I have plenty of friends whom are idiots. Sometimes it's fun to act like an idiot, being a genius is a huge drain on my emotional well being. Dickson Poon Tang, will you be my fwen?
*
I think I certainly qualify. rclxub.gif
silverhawk
post Jul 27 2009, 03:42 PM

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QUOTE(Duke Red @ Jul 27 2009, 03:33 PM)
Just be interesting.
*
+1 biggrin.gif

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