There is no "best" way to connect your sub. It really depends on what you want and the type of speakers you are using. If you have a large full range speakers, then you can connect it via the AV LFE out, set your speaker to Large, & turning off the cross-over would be good because this will allow the signal to bypass the crossover. However that would leave your sub to produce everything from the LFE channel. But some prefer to use the crossover to set the crossover at a lower frequency which is just slightly above the lowest frequency that the main speakers can produce. This setting will have the sub produce those low freq that the main speakers cannot produce.

However if you want more bass from your system, you might want to set the crossover at a higher level to produce the bass that your main speaker already can produce.

If you have small speaker like satelites or bookshelf, then you will be required to play around the crossover to make the woofer blend int your speakers.

One thing that caught my attention about the REL subwoofers is the very unique set-up. In fact REL call it the Sub Bass system instead of subwoofers. Unlike most sub, you either connect with the LFE or you could connect via the High Level output(direct from AV speakers output). The REL that I tested 2 days ago requires a very different setup. REL recommended connecting with both the LFE input and the High Level input(it even include Nuetrik Speakon connector and cables for this). In fact it has a volume control for both the LFE input andthe High Level input.

Here are qome quotes from REL:

"RELs are not traditional subwoofers, but true sub-bass systems. A REL is designed to augment the performance of “full range” speaker systems, to provide linear response down to below 12 Hz (Studio III, -6 dB down at 9 Hz). Therefore, for the moment, set aside everything you’ve been taught about subwoofers and how they are integrated into a stereo or theater system. RELs set-up and position differently than other subwoofers. A REL will take advantage of physics and room acoustics to provide deep pressurization as no other sub-woofer can. It’s important that you bring to the set-up process a willingness to do things a little differently in order to obtain these superior results. The end result of your labors will be an utterly seamless integration of true deep bass to a sound system, regardless of the main speaker’s low bass capability."

Connection:
"It is helpful to know that you will almost always connect the REL to the input on the rear panel labeled “Hi Level.” This connection is made using the supplied 34’ 10” (10 meters) cable, the bare leads of which connect to the speaker output terminals of the power amplifier. The easy and foolproof connection at the REL is done with a Neutrik Speakon connector. The purpose of connecting to the speaker output terminals is one of the unique secrets of REL’s success. By connecting to the high level input on the REL from the amplifier, you build forward the sonic signature of your main system, including the tonal balance and timing cues of the entire electronics chain. In this way, the REL is fed the exact signal that is fed to the main speakers."

Theater and Film Applications:
For Dolby Digital AC-3® or other 5.1 theater systems, once the standard set-up for two-channel outlined above is complete, the LFE output from the processor or receiver should be connected to the low-level input and appropriate gain adjustments made. It may be necessary to take the crossover out of the low-level input using the “mode” switch if extra upper bass output is called for. Keep phase consistent with what was selected during high-level set-up by simply choosing the corresponding setting (1 = 2, 3 = 4). For this configuration, you must set the processor to the “large” or “full range” setting for the left and right speakers in order for the REL to receive the bass signal via the high-level cable. In this configuration, the REL provides support for both the left and right speakers for two-channel listening, and support for the LFE when movies are playing. Most processors will allow you to defeat the subwoofer output when listening in the two-channel mode. The effect of this set-up is one of greatly increased dynamics in the mid-bass range; no bass bloat; and a greater degree of space and timing from the Foley effects. For an even greater sense of space and impact, a second woofer connected in parallel to the center channel will prove to be a dramatic improvement as well. And if that is not enough fun, a rear sub, both to support the rear channel speakers as well as to evenly distribute LFE through the room, truly completes the full-range sonic picture for state-of-the-art film reproduction.

To read more about REL unique sub bass system you can go to REL website @ REL

hehehe

Want to read more?

Here is a quote from Sound & Vision review of the T1:

MUSIC PERFORMANCE

REL developed its reputation building what the company likes to call "sub-bass systems" for enhancing music playback, so it's no surprise that musical performance is a key strength of its designs. What is unexpected is that REL manages to maintain impressive tunefulness in a sub as compact as the T1. In my experience, small subs with high-excursion drivers can move plenty of air and create an impressive pants-leg-flapping rumble, but they run into trouble when attempting to reproduce specific notes and tunes.

"Anna Stesia" from Prince's Lovesexy might be a hard- and compressed-sounding mess of a recording, but it does include some seriously deep synth-bass. The T1 used in tandem with the diminutive Haydn Grand speakers demonstrated how well the REL could integrate with a smaller speaker, extending its reach into the lowest octaves. While I couldn't finger any part of the sound as coming directly from the T1, that synth-bass line all but disappeared when I switched off the sub.

With Venezuelan conductor Gustavo Dudamel's remarkable recording of Beethoven's 7th Symphony, the T1 clearly contributed texture and weight to the lower strings, as well as plenty of impact from the tympani. What was striking wasn't the quantity of bass but its quality and tunefulness. There was also a sense of fullness that came without making the sound muddy or thick.

MOVIE PERFORMANCE

While REL's emphasis with the T1 is on tunefulness and clarity, that's not to suggest that it doesn't go deep. With the right material, it produced plenty of bass that you could feel as well as hear. It's just not designed to bowl you over and make you say, "Wow, there's that sub kicking in again!"

What the T1 does have is a chameleon-like ability to disappear sonically into a system and blend impeccably with the rest of the speakers. The effect is more as if you replaced your main speakers with a much larger and more full-range model from the same company, rather than adding something that's designed to impress on its own.

The scene from the animated movie Over the Hedge where the turtle Verne first explores the new housing development is a good source of subtle low-frequency detail. With the REL, sounds like the statue falling over onto the grass and the SUV that drives over Verne were especially clear and unmuddied.

The Haunting has plenty of over-the-top bass effects, and using the T1 for the "Creaking Pipes" chapter demonstrated just how tight and extended the T1's response could be — as long as levels were kept to within its limits. When pushed too hard, the bass radiator would start to make strange noises as it reached the limits of its excursion — although it took truly silly volume levels to get to that point.

A scene from Master and Commander where enemy cannonballs rip through the timbers of the ship demonstrated the T1's impressive impact. The sound of the British vessel crashing over the ocean waves was crisp and taut, with plenty of low-bass extension. And I didn't get any sense of bass energy overload, which can be a problem with less well-behaved subs.

BOTTOM LINE

If your idea of a great subwoofer is one that can inflict the maximum amount of structural damage to your home for the lowest price, then the T1 is clearly not for you. REL's design approach is far more subtle, going back to the original thinking behind the subwoofer concept, which was to extend the low-frequency reach of an existing system coherently and discreetly. But that's not to suggest that the T1 is in any way effete or wimpy. Using its separate LFE level control, you can set up the T1 to let loose its subtle prowess on music while delivering a real kick for movies. That level of flexibility, in my opinion, is the sign of a great sub.

I went to try out the REL T1 and the Velodyne CHT-12R again this afternoon. This time the setup was in a different room with carpet floor.

First I try out the T1 and on the carpet floor it still produce the "blat" noise at higher level so I suppose the sound is from the driver instead of the wooden flooring 2 days ago.

But what really surprise me this time is the sound of the CHT-12R. I play around with the crossover and set it at the 12 position and somehow it sound great this time. Although the T1 still sound better, the CHT12R can still stand on its own against the T1. What really disappoint me about the T1 is that it seem to go out of breath at higher volume producing blatting sound which is very irritating. The CHT-12R still sound a tad slower than the T1, but it still sounds damn good and more than make up for the loss with its mighty power. I can really fell the CHT-12R producing much powerful bass and can surely go lower than the T1. In fact I brought a friend with me this time and he actually prefer the CHT-12R because we can feel and hear the bass much more than the T1. I try higher volume and the 12R seems to handle it without much problem. I am defintely reconsidering the CHT-12Q again after this audition!

What really surprise me is how a different room with different acoustic could affect the sound so much.

So my problem now is which sub so i buy. They T1 sound sweet but the blatting noise make me feel very uneasy paying Rm3000 for it. The CHT-12R definite impress me this time round with its good quality bass and shear power. Then the seller ask me to take the Velodyne CHT-12R for RM1500 which is a second hand one. At half the price of the T1, do you guys think its worth it? In other words, is a second hand 12R worth Rm1500? Or should I go for a new 12Q at Rm2800?

Need some expert advice advice!

This post has been edited by lightning69: May 21 2009, 06:37 PM

He is offering me 6 months personal warranty. If I buy the CHT-12Q, it will cost me RM2800 which is RM1300 more. Is the 12Q very much better than the 12R?

Btw, how much is a new CHt-12R?

This post has been edited by lightning69: May 21 2009, 07:22 PM

I really like the REL T1 but just that it have blatting sound when i try it at moderately high volume. I'm not too sure the unit i try is faulty or what.

That leads to to listen more to the 12R which is not bad too and yet much more powerful.

So is the second hand 12R for RM1500 worth it?

The used Cht-12R is more than 1 year old and no more remote. I try to add the remote to mt Harmony remote but it is not in logitech database.

So how much you selling your CHT-12R?

I bought the second hand Velo CHT-12R for RM1300 without warranty. I decided to go without the personal warranty from the seller as its only RM1300.

I try it out in my room with Transformer....so far so good. I have the remote map to the Logitech Harmony but it doesn't work. Where is the infra red receiver located? or maybe the remote function is not working anymore?

I'm in Miri and bought it from King's Audio.

The lR on the right got light or not? I try the pointing the Harmony on the right on still no response. Btw, the Harmony code I use is from the Logitech website which I just use the "add device"....not program thru "learn".

I think that is why i can get for Rm1300. There is a blue light on the left though. Anyway, it still works fine without the remote.

If anyone can lend me his 12R remote for me to try out, I would really appreciate it.

Wah, everybody upgrade. Poor me just got my 12R...somemore used one.

One thing I hate about our country is that we don't have much choice and if it ever comes to our shore, its damn expensive.

PB12NSD dooor to dooor RM3150! I want one!

Ok...just let me know when things materialize.

CAn point me to any pro review of the NDS before I fully commit?



This post has been edited by lightning69: May 28 2009, 05:01 PM

The L.Y.N. SVS Subwoofer MO club (if Jadi)

PC12Plus

1)
2)
3)

PB12Plus

1) geforce1999
2) jwyj
3)

PB12NDS

1) lightning69
2) lexonline
3)

AS-EQ1??

1) Jack28HT?
2)

PC-13 PLUS

1)
2)
3)

PB-13 ULTRA

1)
2)

All I want to know is when can I receive my SVS PB12-NSD.