Hi...

With regards to the question on investment deposits - deposit-taking is regulated under BAFIA. Check out Bank Negara for a listing of deposit-taking institutions.

What the SC regulates, is on the basis of the Capital Markets & Services Act (which covers various items like prospectus registration, corporate finance activities, etc.)

MLM not equal to deposit taking.

There will be some genuine MLM (usually the type where it's established, you need to slog hard e.g. Amway)... but what you are technically worried about are Ponzi schemes which are masquerading as MLM.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponzi_scheme

With regards to the Island Red Cafe affair, the issue may not be fraud in terms of them promising abnormal returns paid out of new incoming shareholders. What happens is that the shareholders (apparently) own shares in each of the operations. The issue with regards to the Island Red Cafe is that their form of marketing the shares is effectively illegal (under the CMSA) if they are offering shares to the public. On a separate note, it's only fraud if they are inflating the returns from the cafe by utilising the capital investment to generate spurious dividend payments back to the investors and misrepresenting it.

This may be useful to everyone.

How to go about reporting Investment Scams.

You can lodge a complaint by completing the following form below and faxing or sending to the address below

Investor Affairs & Complaints Department
Securities Commission
No 3 Persiaran Bukit Kiara
Bukit Kiara
50490 Kuala Lumpur

Tel: 603 6204 8999
Fax: 603 6204 8991
E-mail: aduan@seccom.com.my

Fill it out best you can, and draw attention to the issue.

The more people report it, the higher up the priority chain it goes to for investigation.

SC has set up a specific target time period to respond to all queries, so take advantage of this...

Attached File(s)
 complaintsform.pdf ( 135.44k ) Number of downloads: 65

when it sounds so good to be true...
then you might inside the trap.

please tell me what company can get back capital in 20months?
I rather put the money into mutual funds , than risking the 100% with this Red Island thing.

Thanks for all the infos as 1 of my fren wan to join..but i don't hv confidence with the IRC...but now i'm with other project that get me similar returns and yet better offers too...great to hv expert like u guys here!

what other business gives similar returns like IRC... 5% fixed...

does anyone here involved in this MLM and successfully gained the 5%?

Again like I asked before, is this considered MLM for starters?
I'm not sure.
IRC wants investors. Say Investor A joined. So when investor A introduce investor B and investor B joined, what will investor A gain?
When investor B introduce and recruited investor C, what does investor A and B gain?!....
As the way I see it like my previous post, it's only 2 level as MLM is multi level.

In some sense, it looks more like direct sales and yet not direct sales.
It's more like what Playbook had mentioned.
The only thing uncertain here is whether or not it's legal to "collect" funds or capitals from the general public. But than again IRC can always defend themselves by saying that it's a relation between them an the potential capitalist, depending on their defense on their stance.

It's rather a simple idea.
EG:
I want to open a shop selling computers. And I do not have enough capital or I don't want to coup up so much.
I would invite my friends to join in it as sleeping partner. Than when it's profitable or gaining momentum and I'm hungering for more, I would ask more friends and maybe my initial friends would ask their friends thus gathering capital for another shop. And it goes on as expansion as business grows.

Concept is similar, just that this IRC put up a rather strong stance in paying back 5% of the investment whereby if it's my method, it's profit sharing according to "share portions". It's a great business idea but if I'm the owner, I'm more worried on paying back the 5% if my business drops. This eventually led to the discussion and debates we're having here now.

That's the problem now, ppl have too much of money and refuse to put into FD because the interest is so low. Therefore, these people is now coming out with so many creative idea to indirectly getting funds from public to funds their own business. Anything happened, they're neither the employee/creditor/ shareholder of a shell company with RM1/2 paidup capital. In the end of the day, they get nothing. That's the worst scenario anyway...

I guess people needs more thinking here.

say you(sleeping investor) have invested money inside and the active investor make sure you get back 5% a month and that means you get back your capital in 20months (1.75 years) - doubling your money in less than 3 years. In this case, think that you are the active investor, you need to make sure the business gets more than 5% ( or about 7-10%) every month, to make sure you get the money and some saving money for your company, isnt it?
I really need some proving from TS's approacher to convince me about it. RM6000 isnt a big sum afterall. I'll ask if they wants RM200k from me and each month i take RM10k, so i no need to work anymore. Why people bother to buy shares, forex, funds and even property to make themselves rich if there's 5% a month. I re-mortgages all my properties and pay them.

There's a topic saying "how much you need to retire?" I think RM200k, in this case.

cheers guys

hey your at the retirement state now? great man...i'm going to make the rm200k then for rm10k per mth hahaha no need work liew

Hi all, I'm one of the investor in this Island Red Cafe.
First time i heard this, I feel that the concept is awesome. Anyway, I still spent more than 1 month period to do some survey before decided to invest it. I even seek opinion from a lawyer about the legalize & the S&P lawyer letter provided by IRC for the benefit guarantees.
Let me summarize the information i have about this investment concept.

Island Red Cafe (IRC) Global Partnership Franchise Business:

1. Whenever the region accumulated 50 slots investment, an IRC will be opened. 1 slot = RM6000. The investor will be the shareholder of the company & the royal customer and definitely will brings up more customers to the cafe. In short, win win situation for the shareholders and the company.

2. Shareholder's benefits:
i. Fix return RM300/slot (5% of the investment) for 1st and 2nd year = RM7200
Fix return RM150/slot (2.5% of the investment) for 3rd, 4th & 5th year = RM 5400
ii. RM100/slot food voucher given every month & will be give for total 5 years = RM6000
iii. VIP member discount 15%
iv. Birthday discount 30%

Total up the fix return & food voucher, the return is equal to RM18600, which is around 3x return of ur investment.
Imagine if u invest RM2 millions, ur return are RM6 millions after 5 years,

After 5 years, no more fix return but company will distribute 49% of the net profit to share among all the shareholders.

3. IRC's strengths:
i. Delicious food with vary choices.
ii. Reasonable price, with 6 star expenses but 3 star fees
iii. Good strategy and business plan, whereby the shareholders can share the company's profit
iv. All the shareholder's benefits are black & white guarantee with S/P & stamping from the lawyer, clarify the shareholder's benefits and protect the shareholder's rights.

4. Currently there are 3 IRC outlets already officially opened & operating.

i. IRC Cheras:
15G, Pandan Indah 1/23 B,
Pandan Indah,
55100 Kuala Lumpur

ii. IRC Puchong:
68, Jalan Puteri 5/1, Puteri Avenue,
Puchong 47100,
Selangor Darul Ehsan

iii. IRC Malacca:
G30,
Plaza Malacca Raya,
75000 Malacca

Feel free to ask me more questions & i'll answer it genuine,

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Added on May 1, 2008, 5:38 pm


Yes, ur name will be listed inside the company license.
U can check it at the Register Of Company...

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Added on May 1, 2008, 5:48 pm

em, the cafe will only be opened if there is 50 slots or more than that...
so no matter how, the cafe will hv a group of royal customers...
take me as example, i hv RM100 voucher...definitely i will go there to eat frequenctly....
when i go there to eat, i will always ask my family or friends....

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Added on May 1, 2008, 5:54 pm

did u try all the food there? different people will hv different taste.
what i can say is the food there is the food i eat every day in other place.
so it give me an idea that, since eat the same thing, y not go bek to the cafe i invested?

drink u may try the island red cafe (hot) or ice blended laici....i prefered this 2...
food u may try the penang prawn mee, red sate, island nasi lemak, chicken wings...

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Added on May 1, 2008, 6:03 pm

we need to compare the cash generator btw sunshine empire & island red cafe...
the cash generator i mean is the business & method of how the company generator profit...
wat i can see that is the cash generator in sunshine empire haven't completely setup but they need to pay out more return to the investor...

island red cafe already hv 3 branches operating and generating profit...
in the coming may, johor skudai IRC will be opening soon....it will the the largest cafe in malaysia....



This post has been edited by cappuccino: May 1 2008, 06:03 PM

Then can you tell me what would be the case when the company wound up? Bankrupt?

I've seen and touch too much of these shits, basically i believe no one except myself....

Still remember my father last time went to court a few times just because some shits left in a private limited company...

From the Deed of Mutual Agreement:

7. Further, should the Business be wound-up either voluntarily or upon a Court Order, the proceeds from the sale and/or disposal of the Licensor and the Licensee’s assets, upon being realized, shall be distributed to Shareholders who have not received their first twenty (20) monthly payments, and thence to be followed by the other Shareholders, again in the proportion to the lots held, and shall be treated as if the Shareholders were secured creditors.

It is ok if u dun believe it nw.
Perhaps u can wait until IRC become famous and opened more than 10 outlets in Malaysia and only invest on it.
Everyone must measure the risk & return & if ok with it then only invest.

Since this is another type of investment, I wouldn't say this business will 100% success, what I can help to make IRC work is make sure i recommend more friends to hv their meal there, .

Q1: Does all this in written some sort of agreement or guarantee that this is not only verbal but are stamped black n whites?

Q2: What is the company registration no.? and the AJL license no.? as if not mistaken your using binary scheme,correct me if i'm wrong!

Q3: What is the paid out capital of the co.?

Q4: What are the current sales turn over for each or all IRC's?

Q5: Which bank is the Financial Support behind this IRC?


Just hope that all this is true to be the preferred investment program of the year! I'm interested to view what's current /latest investment such as IRC and perhaps there are more similar n might be better deal than this? thanks.

Please note that even if someone can get back their capital in 20 months or shorter don't mean that anyone or you should believe in it. Don't be surprise that when they last that long, someone or those who joined early are sure to get back their money but at the expense of the newcomers. Those who join last will be caught and lost. Thats how these scams worked.

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Added on May 1, 2008, 10:50 pm


Why would I want my name to be involved in a Company or ROC knowing very well the scheme is a scam ? When the Company wind up, there will be nothing left, maybe LIABILITIES. You think the master-mind founder/s will leave any much money there ?

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Added on May 1, 2008, 10:58 pm

Some gave even higher than 5%. Yes, many have received their money successfully BUT you don't want to harm others. These monies are taken from the newcomers. When there is less newcomers and more money to be paid out, the founders will make a report to the police of authorities to go after them so that they can give an excuse for closing shop and run away.

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Added on May 1, 2008, 11:06 pmcappuccino,

Why don't you let us know the full marketing and commissions scheme for recruiting new investors ?





This post has been edited by stopscams007: May 1 2008, 11:06 PM

Answer:

1. Yes, company will sign a contract "Deed of Mutual Agreement" between you and company once u decided to invest in IRC.
We even can do until lawyer to lawyer, meaning that u can bring ur own lawyer to meet IRC lawyer，nothing hide &　ｓｅｅｋ，

The rest question will refer back to u later. Or do u want to meet the boss to ask further?

In the mean time, u may go to check their business by visit to any of the branch, no pass needed,
Ask me along if u want to try the food there, i still hv voucher in hand,

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Added on May 1, 2008, 11:48 pm

Firstly, there is no reason for any boss to wound up their business if the business is earning money, so does IRC.
Secondly, IRC is doing a solid cafe business, u can c the cafe is existing and know how's the business going time by time.

Feel free to understand the cash generator of IRC. IRC's profit is not from the new shareholder investment money.
The investment of new shareholder are use to open more outlets, eventually this outlets will bring more profits to the company.

With the concept "investment created expenses, expenses created investment", the business will only growing bigger. I can foreseen that IRC will become another successful franchise business in Malaysia or even better in International.

We can choose to be a pure investor or run the MLM business at the same time.
I would just think that this is a natural recommendation to friend when i found a nice cafe to eat. Only after that they can choose to become the shareholder or just be a normal customer in IRC.

Lowyat forum not allow to post any MLM business plan, . Will send to everyone who wan to know it provided they give me their email address.



This post has been edited by cappuccino: May 1 2008, 11:48 PM

you can send details to me at creditcardepp@gmail.com . thkx....Even a boss will run away with the money if big as running will let him keep all than rather divided to all investor... My biggest concern is your pay plan...MLM or not i don't bother as i don't hv a problem with MLM as it is a very effective marketing strategies...So back to my question is. Can email me how your pay plan goes as since your sharing here that money are not coming from new comers and are paid by profit from actual business, right. So i need to know whether the plan are a scam or really can pay all investor monthly as i did visit few time to IRC..the business is so so only..sorry to say that as i really when there few times...frankly my taste bud are a bit particular as the food rating if you as me, is only 4/10 (10 is best).
If i'm goin to invest something that the pay plan promised secure returns but can't be paid eventually than this is a scam.... if it can pay off well from the actual business...than i'll 100% support you....anyhow, to all investor or person incharge of IRC in this forum, can pls reply all my previous question pertaining this IRC issue? really appreciated it. Thanks!

This post has been edited by siliconwiper.com: May 2 2008, 04:01 AM

I will get back to u asap.
My upline will be in KL this saturday, if u dun mind, i can arrange a time for u to meet him. I believed he can answer all ur doubts other than this issue that u raised.
Tqs for ur comment on the food, i will comment back to IRC management.

Cappu,
Thks for the pay plan...but remmebr i still need the answer for my questions above....Please arrange ur UPline to meet up.as i hv a group of business ppl are interest to see this IRC..PM when OK...thks......to all forumers who are interest can JOIN our meet up if wanna check it out...Scam or No Scam!! Hope you don't mind for this meet up

You are welcome,
I'll post out the date & time once fix it so that who interested can join the meeting.
Everyone feel free to go IRC to hv their meal & give comment to everything u feel not good.
I believe that IRC will still improving on the foods & drinks.

I treat this as my own business since I'm not afford to buy Franchise from McDonald, KFC or OldTown,

Air Asia taglines is 'Now everyone can fly' then IRC taglines will be "Now everyone can do franchise" . IRC's philosophy allow free choices for investors with different capital scales based on one’s financial condition and provide franchisees an interactive franchising support system for them to enter the international branded coffee franchising market comfortably.

Cheers!

This doesn't answer his question. His question was whether or not the returns are guaranteed. It's not.

Stay away from IRC. This is a clear case of a get-poor-quick scheme

This post has been edited by Playbook: May 3 2008, 04:50 AM