I must agree with you here already.

Can any moderator being so kind to close the damn thread?! As the discussion here, is solely related to MLM!!! Please ban anyone that violated the rules of the forum accordingly(included me if applicable...).

Thank you very much.

I would say its a little bit of both, why its a MLM because in a way it works thru referrals and affiliates but there is also option if u dont want to do this ....and why I say its also a HYIP because it requires us to spend or a better word "invest" some money first .....u have to buy lot(s) which from it will u profit....

there is a lot of MLMs out there that is not actually legal and illegal, its just that this plan got some sort of backing from the government and ministers (if Im not wrong) , therefore its not actually considered illegal in full as compared to the others....

also, its not correct to say all other plans or programmes are scams, but the fact they are not registered with government depts/agencies makes them known as scam , yeah u might and will earn money from it, but wat happens if someday they run away with ur money before u earn ur capital back, will people say its not a scam then ?

to say the best, when people earn thru it, they say its a reliable plan or working plan, but when they got cheated they will say otherwise, its human nature I believe...

personally, I dont believe these programmes will last long, perhaps someday these plans will die or government agencies will interfere in their bisness because they are not paying any tax and banks are at loosing end here , wat if ppl started to dump all their money here instead of banks ...hehehe....

someone told me these are only hangat-hangat tahi ayam, but another person said then who ask to eat the taik ayam, eat the ayam laa....hahaha....

edit: grammar mistakes

This post has been edited by shocker: Mar 19 2007, 07:04 PM

Wrong again. MLM MUST HAVE PRODUCTs. It is not merely investing. No matter how useless the products as long as there is 1 it is legal. Without products it is classified as PYRAMID SCHEME. You can call up KPDN or whichever agency in charge of this to ask.

EM-Pay gives you a shopping card (as a product).

Close this thread instead of arguing about something most people don't know and are just blabbering.

OK if u say u are rite, MLMs must have products, then the product here is that those lots that people are selling to their downlines, MLMs works in a way of downlines and uplines, if there is no such thing such as these two things (upline/downline) then there is no MLMs...

so, if u say empay is not selling product, do u mean to categorise it as a pyramid scheme then ? looks like wat u are saying is that its illegal and legal at the same time...hehehe...

the IPC shopping card are one of the side benefits that we can use for if we join this programme, something like those loyalty cards like bonuslink, real rewards, mesra card and others, might also work like a debit card but not sure about this tho...its not a product IMHO for sure.....

Im not actually against or with this kinds of programmes, prefer to be neutral ...also, its not actually blabbering, most of the people are unaware of this stuffs, therefore its common to have things not correct at some point of discussion....

edit: extra infor...

This post has been edited by shocker: Mar 19 2007, 08:05 PM

www.em-pay.com

with a crappy website that has no functioning links (most of them don't), i have no respect or whatsoever to this HYIP / MLM scheme

and to add more salt, check se7en's finding. the webserver is in brickfields and 99% traffic comes from malaysia

and again, i have to reiterate, a crappy website that don't even have functioning links to anything (except adverts and misleading info) is very suspicious indeed

dis thread is not related wif mlm..is u all make it related to mlm ony..

I can sense that you're furious in your post, need not be overwhelmed by the different views (for critical thinking will be our own judge), and thank you for sharing with us of what you know.

It is true that "www.em-pay.net" and NOT "www.em-pay.com" was in the ipcshopping.com announcement, but that did not establish any fact that EM-PAY.COM is related to IPC Shopping Services.

If I may ask, can you enlighten us on how is it that IPC Shopping Services and EM-PAY.COM is related? Aside from the "IPC Shopping Privilege Card" having the word "em-pay", and not a link to "em-pay.com" can be found in ipcshopping.com nor "em-pay.com" being partners/affiliates of IPC Shopping Services.

This post has been edited by adres: Mar 19 2007, 10:58 PM

i don't know why, i can't go to www.em-pay.net but able to go www.em-pay.com, if u hv friend who joined this thing ask him to login u can see few noted form compony (ipcshopping services) regarding to buy e-pin for register new member

This post has been edited by arjuna_mfna: Mar 19 2007, 11:19 PM

Crap on, a simple phone call or any form of contact to IPC will tell you that.
The privilege card is the product for this MLM it contains a debit card that can be activated. Argue as you want, but this company managed to register with the correct agencies.

If anyone failed on MLM that is their fault, they are just not up to it. Stop blaming MLM. Dont join if you cant do it. No one is forcing you. You have the final say for your own finances.

HYIPs also aren't for noobs, if you can't take it, leave the game. Rm20000 profit aint much for me but it also aint little.

someone trying to "protect" his investment here

c'mon... everyone *knows* HYIP is a scam. it's just that they can't face reality and keep giving false hopes to their investments


edit: if anyone wanna say IPCshoppig and em-pay is not related, check this out

http://www.ipcshopping.com/OurServices/Service_Card.htm

check out the card

EM-Pay is a money laundering service cum MLM cum HYIP, using IPCShopping as it's "product"

it's the new trend now. dulu2 pakai minyak wangi. sekarang orag dah tau minyak wangi tu tipu. jadi guna la barang lain plak

This post has been edited by lucifah: Mar 19 2007, 11:44 PM

Protect their investment. Well, that's indeed the right phrase to use. 'cause the only income from such HYIP are from ppl joining and putting in money. Therefore, if the number of ppl who join drops, hence those who had invested will lose money.

Kinda like encouraging ppl to get screwed over, maybe not for the early birds, but eventually it'll happen

Edit: Furthermore, let's not forget the very first golden rule of anything to do with finance. REPUTATION.

When you get a company that does not does not even provide a proper physical contact address on its website, and furthermore goes to the length of hiding their contact data on their domain name information, what does that say for their reputation?

---

Added on March 19, 2007, 11:57 pm

Nup, what you say is incorrect. MLM does not necessarily need to have a product. All the term MLM means is that the business is conducted in a multiple tiered manner. MLM with products r often MLM combined with the concept of direct-sales.

Such sites as em-pay tends to be the worse of such MLM types, more towards pyramid schemes actually.

This post has been edited by fyire: Mar 19 2007, 11:57 PM

EM-PAY is just a system for the IPCSHOPPING members.
It would be much nicer if u can read chinese, i will show u the link.

I bought 3 units, my friend keep on kacau-ing me. According to him, i will get my money back in 6months time(which i invested 168x3).

IPCSHOPING is going to do something like Bonuslink, loyalty programme. U can get discount and gain point using their card(correct me if i am wrong). In the same time, u are playing with Pyramid scheme.

There is actually 3 Plans. er....i forgot already. i will explain later when i go back for cheng beng on april. cos i will need him to explain to me again.

P/S: according to one of the plan, u might get around 60++k when u reach certain level.

C'mon, I've been experiencing a lots of scam like this. Don't because other people claim that they from the company or they earn lots of money because of investing money to that company gives you hope that you can do it also.

Never ever believe in fast money making sytem.

THE ONLY SYSTEM THAT WORKS OUT WHEN YOU INVEST MONEY IS EITHER STOCKS OR FOREX. Eventually, you will also lose money because of trading and forex also but at least this is not scam.

bro, it take rougly 1 year ++ to get the amount of money, not join today at the end of month u get the rm130k++ lo..., if play with stock ya, u can nake 20k in 1 day, this 1 year not 1 day or 1 month

The big question to ask here is, will this scam be still around in a year's time, keeping in mind that the more successful it is, the quicker it is to close shop and run.

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Added on March 20, 2007, 12:09 pm

Please show the link anyways. there's those here who can read chinese, and those who cannot can make use of one of the translation tools.

But my main question has not been answered. Why is there no physical contact address at all, and why is it that the domain name is held by an annonymous holding party? Basically, why is it that the operators of empay wishes to hide their identity if they r truely legit?

And final question is, is the EM-PAY used by IPC the same as the EM-PAY as described by em-pay.com?

This post has been edited by fyire: Mar 20 2007, 12:40 PM

maybe this can help a little bit..

IPC ataupun International Platinum Club beroperasi di Syarikat IPC SHOPPING SERVICES (M) SDN BHD (M-549293), telah diasaskan oleh Mr. Steven Leow, Syarikat ini telah beroperasi sejak tahun 2001 di No 77-1, JALAN 3/93, Taman Miharja, Batu 2 /2, 5000 Cheras, Kuala Lumpur.

IPC Shopping Services Sdn Bhd, telah dianugerahkan Asia Pacific Entreprenuer Excellence Award 2006 pada 30 Jul 2006 di Palace of Golden Horses di Kuala Lumpur kerana telah mengeluarkan produk-produk yang innovatif dan berdaya maju serta mendapat sambutan yang begitu menggalakkan dari pelanggan dan mendapat pengiktirafan dan dianugerahkan sebagai syarikat Superbrands pada 8 Sep 2006.

yes yes, we all know that IPC has got a contact address and so on. But the question remains of if em-pay.com is linked to IPC or not.

If em-pay.com is part of IPC, then why the difference in the domain name registrant information? Why the need to hide the contact details for em-pay.com?

Similarily, I can go and register a domain via an annonymous party, and call it something like maybankpersonal2u.com, but does that mean that my website is linked to Maybank?

Refer to your statement, why does it need to close shop if it's successful?
Does it make sense?

Check on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Yield_Investment_Program to see what such scams r actually all about.

End of day, the fact is such scams r unable to sustain in the long run due to the very nature of how they obtain their revenue, where their only source of revenue are from the investments. Check on Ponzi schemes here for more info (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponzi)

So thus, such scams depends on numbers. Such scammers r pretty smart ppl, who set a target on how much they've accumulated before they run. Hence, the more successful it is, the faster they'll reach their target as well. Not to mention, the more successful it is, the more difficult it will be to pay back everybody what they advertise what will be received. Such is the one factor common to all pyramid schemes.

So well, once the target's been reached, pack up and run lor...

a whole lot of ppl who I know joined this so called scheme told me that they are not putting up much hope for them to get hundreds of thousands of ringgits , but merely they will get their capital back in 5-6 mth time for sure , after that what ever they manage to get is out of their luck ...if they dont, well atleast they did try and see if it worked...

I have a friend who bought 63 lots (calculate RM168/per lot X 63 lots= and u know its whole lot of money )...he told me he put it as a way of gambling, even if he did make RM1K from each lot, its really worth for him already ....also, take note his is not that confident he will get RM131K++ from each lot, a little bit is better than nothing as he said ....I wonder if I feel the same way like he did....hahaha...

do take note along the 2 year grace period, u will get some money along at every month or level, not the end of the 2 year period, its just that end of the 2 year time, u will have a whole lot of it....

edit: grammar mistakes...

This post has been edited by shocker: Mar 20 2007, 12:56 PM