Hi all,

I want to install heat insulator and zinc sheet on the roof for security purpose.
I was quoted as below:

"The length of your house should be 50 feet because the standard set back is 20 feet.
I presumed the length of your 1st floor is about 47 feet.
Ceiling area is approximately 940FS
Therefore, roof area is 20'x51'x1.12 (extra 4 feet for roof eave and extra 12% for gradient length) = 1140FS
The thermal insulation (cellulose) system is RM3,208.00 and roof security system (using zinc sheet only) is RM3,734.00"

That would be RM2.81psf for the cellulose insulation and RM3.28psf for zinc sheet.
Would it be expensive?
Currently I was also offered RM2.60psf for rockwool insulation.

Would appreciate any feedback from you all on the:
1. pros & cons of rockwool vs cellulose,
2. the pricing on zinc sheet. <-- does it have different grade?

dreamKrusher, did u install them already? Mind to share ur experince?

Not yet install. But from my survey and feedback, it is quite effective to install them on the roof.
Pricewise, I'm comparing them. Price will definitely go up year by year. Rockwool was RM 2.60 psf on 2008, RM 2.80 psf on 2009, and next year...you decide.

As for cellulose insulator, not sure it is better as in long term and value for money than rockwool.
Cellulose is made from papers and chemical.
Rockwool is spun from melted rock.
Both of them are fire-retardent, which is good for prevent fire spreadout on your roof.

Any cellulose user here?

dont use the fire retardant issue on roof ...... sales gimmick ... by the time the fire goes up the roof .. there's go the whole house ...

the heat maybe unbearable to ppl on attic ... but the heat will not cause fire ... thermodynamics is always in motion ... the heat is dispersed by the atmosphere



i do not recommend Rockwool .... it's also used for hydroponics ... this maybe a joke ... but if your roof leaks .. and the water seeps in the rockwool ... some plant might grow on it .... since that's where organic vegies came from

use the Cellulose ... besides not growing plants ... it has the best fire retardant functionality (if you like fire retardant)


remember to have air duct + aluminium roof ventilation to help disperse the heat in rooms ... without air ducts ... the air take the easiest path from the small gaps in the roof ... and wont take up the heat from the rooms ... basically reducing it benefits from 100% to mere 10% (unless for fully sealed roof .. but there's no such roof except factories)

look at this..very impressive
http://www.tclmalaysia.com/

can confirm TCl is good with cellulose. used them. roof is closed. never reaches above 31°

Seems interesting - what is the average price psqf?

Only worry is what happens if this cellulose comes in contact with water? E.g. From a leaking roof, from a leaking tank, etc.
Most of this are unnoticed because the celllose is actually insulating the water from the ceiling, which will be hidden from you unless you go into the roof and check. Will it expand? Disintegrate, or grow mold (hazard ot health)?

my personal experience..
better to install treated woodplank below the roof tiles rather than zinc sheet coz it is useless in terms of security ( broken easily in many cases).. though its a bit pricey than zinc, but worthy in the long run.

http://www.monier.com.my/energy-efficient-...-coolroofR.html

so many products in the mkt

KeNNy,

this is why you dont seal the cellulose. any moisture that might come into contact can then evaporate again. however we have also installed an industrial grade reflecting roof foil made of woven fabric under the tiles - this keeps additional heat out and works as a protection from possible leaks.

i think the treated cellulose is not that hydrophylic - can try with a sample if you want to find out

@PJusa
That reflecting roof foil, is it termed as radiant barrier?

it would be something like that. i bought it from CSR last year - they have several grades and stability version. i bought the one for industrial application. wasnt much more expensive than the normal ones (factor 2 or so) and it seems to work very very well with the cellulose insulation we got. the roof has no ventilation (yet, i am intrigued by the monier solution and think i will ask for a quote to replace the roof tip only) yet the plaster ceiling doesnt exceed 31°. we have monitored it for a while last year with infrared readings. saves a bomb in aircon costs

@PJusa
I thought CSR only do coolbatts rockwool installation. How much they quote you at that time psf?

Can TCL cellulose help to reduce air cond. electricity cost? With installation of TCL cellulose, smaller air cond can be used to offset the cost of installation?

It is supposed to prevent direct heat into your house, so that you will require lesser air-conditioning in cooling down the room to your desired level. You still need the right air-cond to cool down the room in respect to your room size. Else the cold air won't reach the other end of the room. These heat insulators are costly, but for long term...I think it worths the penny. Just that now I not certain rockwool or cellulose better in long term. Cellulose might be dusty after the chemical tears up due to the fact it is made from papers. Rockwool is made from melted rock and spun into fine thread.

dreamKrusher,

this one i bought in long rolls dunno ... like 100m long and 1,50 wide or something like that. the double relective woven foil some builder-stores also sell. CSR sold me their factory grade (most durable and thickest one) i think i paid around 380 or so per roll. this foil is really tough not like the flimsy one you can buy in the builder store (there got for less than 200 bucks)

Calmman,

since less heat from the roof you can reduce aircon a lot. i now only use 28 degree setting and its nice and comfy. i even could reduce the number of aircon. just create an airflow with fans. we have a huge hall (450 sqft or something like this and i can cool the whole thing with just one 2HP inverter aircon at one end and two fans moving the air through the hall. aircon hardly has to work.

also our other rooms all run on 1HP even though aircon ppl say according to their formula must take more than one unit and /or larger units. no need... can easily cool down the whole house without any problem. also the house wont heat up quickly. i am quite content.

from my experience just cellulose wont be enough. better also create a second roof under the tiles with a reflective foil (also means protection from leaking). then make sure you get good closing windows. for us we could cut electricity consumption will all this + changing to inverter aircon when old one fails (no only two old ones left) to approx. 1/3 of the previous level. that is a lot of money you save every month - basically pays for all the costly insulation jobs.

the problem with rockwool is that it is not seamless. hard to reach corners also cannot cover properly. thus inconsitant. cellulose is blown into the place and creates a completely sealed insulation. it settles and there you are. i have not heard that cellulose is having problem in the long run. the insulation properties are superior as to my research. now in europe the insulation is changing all to cellulose due to it providing better features than rockwool.

i hope the info helps.

Did you have wall insulations as well?

Does anyone know of a good reliable company that does roof insulation in Penang?

Like to get quotation and further advice.

KeNNy,

so. my place is built in the 50s and the wall is pretty good. the wall usually is not really a problem. paint it white and you're good to go. the windows are however an issue. if you have the bugget, get good insulation windows, double laminated glass + good tint (raybarrier or something like that). that will work wonders. the normal alluminium frame windows dont close and leak too much heat/cold.

I have studied the cellulose application and feel that the aluminium foil does not help much in thermal insulation despite of good quality. Of course it is better to have it than none. Most developers installed poor quality foil and due to its vertical laps sometimes caused leakage positions unspotable and makes repair works difficult. These foils are easily torn and just for show only at the end of the days unless the owners re do at their own cost.

Are you in the cellulose insulation business? May be can help to install for my house.

Calmman,

i am not in the business. i used TCL and they did a good job - not the cheapest insulation but its very well done and fast. i would recommend them.

with respect to the foil: if you ask your contractor to seal the foil properly you wont have any overlapping-flapping issue. in fact my contractor overlapped then joined the endings (kind of folding whatever) and then stapled the whole thing to a tight set of wooden trusses. this way you effective create a second roof just a little under the tiles. if you allow for ventilation, the heat will heat up the air between the tiles and the foil and gets disspated from there. you keep your roof cooler to begin with. the alluminium foil wont help if you place it loosely or worse on top of the cellulose. i think under the tiles it does make a difference. and since its not too costly it's a good extra

Can you advise where are the areas to install with this TCL cellulose ?

You mean the whole house never reaches 31 deg. celcius?

i installed it in the entire roof. the ceiling temperature does not exceed 31° since we installed it along with the relective foil to form a second roof under the tiles. i am not sure how the effect will look like if you only do the cellulose. in other words, we dont get any heating effect from the ceiling anymore. my neighbour who has no insulation (but the roof ventilators installed) has had 38° while our ceiling stood at 31° - we did a comparison test once.

How about the performance of using Turbine Ventilator? This is much more cheaper to install.

One of the installer website:
http://www.taika.enetmyne.com/

dont think its that great HappyGuy - my neighbour has two in his roof. his roof is 38° when mine is 31°. go figure

might be good as an added benefit though. i dont have one installed.

What is the typical cost of doing this Insulator for a standard Double Storey Terrace... say around 1500 Sqft.

Any idea?



www.shchoy.com

paid around 3.30/sqft, so 5k

since need to take out all the roof tiles, and install...will it affect the original
tiles position...and cause possible water seaping... ???

no need to take out ALL roof tiles. they come with a long vaccum-like-tube to blow the stuff in. for my place 4 openings were needed (large single story house). smaller roof might need less.

1500 Sqft refer to your roof area or ceiling area?

I was told the material are installed on top of the ceiling, so you should measure the ceiling area of your 1st floor if yours is a double storey house.

@Calmman
You can always ask them to come over and measure your ceiling then quote you the pricing.

Hi to all,

I was trying to search for a authenticate and long run solution of pest, as my home got many Roaches & white ants,
On internet search I found this “Cellulose Material”

http://forum.setiaalam.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=3621&start=0
http://www.usj.com.my/bulletin/upload/show...43&page=3&pp=15
http://www.tclmalaysia.com

I found its quite effective product for thermal and acoustic insulation… and your ppl’s testimonies are more insisting me to apply this cellulose in my home….
Now I’m just trying to get any testimony regarding pest control…. Any experience by cellulose user? Please share your idea, becoz I’m almost ready to apply now…

This post has been edited by Super_Lutein: Aug 8 2009, 11:00 AM

never had any problems with ants or roaches but i am not sure if i can generalise from my place to others. its an old renovated house (50s) but we took great care to close the thing up. so over the last 18 months we had two (2) roaches who both came through the tub since the blasted installer didnt bother to put the U-tube in place. did that myself after i found out and havent seen any roaches at all so far.

i read that cellulose is helping with termites and all. roaches dont usually come through the roof so probably different combat needed there. we have no ants in the house if you exclude the super tiny ones that like to eat spill-overs.

if the cellulose insulation helps to control termites and roaches, then it is an added advantage.

for my case, i am very much concern if the west wall is not insulated, the cost spent on roof insulation would help to reduce the heat or not?

@easyperson
Roof insulation will definitely help, every single item that will help in reducing heat. This include installing a ventilator turbine combined with insulator to dissipate heat faster in the roof. As for wall, you might want to consider those sunlight reflective coating paint. I'm not certain on the effectiveness though as time passes due to the fact that rain and dust will reduce the reflective surface. No?

Yes, I also found this material” pest control material”
So I studied their website and personally met them, so they told that defiantly its Pest control Material, its imported from US, and proven 99.7% killing roaches, ants, termites and other insects, they mentioned many insects, but I forgot their names now… yes millipedes & silverfish also…
So basically this material is for thermal & acoustic insulation, pest control and fire resistance is the additional features of this material.
Cost wise its not bad, if we evaluate and count this material in long run, as they mentioned that this product is for life time, and energy saving material, safe, healthy, natural, green product blah blah blah ….. donno what what what else they mentioned many advantage of this material.

SO NOW I think I’m going to insulate my whole house with this Cellulose insulation, (Roof & Walls) in next week, and if they are professional and committed to their statements will be very appreciative

Any experience, any idea, any advice, any suggestion….. share it pls….

There question I'm seeking here is:
Cellulose insulation better or Rockwool insulation better in long run?

(As in my first post, but I'm glad that many people start to have interest in such product.)

Super_Lutein,

how much they quote for the walls? can you share how this is done. i am planning to do this with TCL probably next year. when we did the roof it was too much hassle to also do walls but for the bedroom side of the house i feel i might gain a bit (also make the house more silent... the sound insulation from the roof is great). did they give you a price already for the wall?

when do we normally do this house insulation? after all other renovation works have been completed?

i'm also interested in this product

Quoted 3.60/ per Sq,ft, but depend on size or location, im not so far from TCL so they quoted me this price, (For Roof only) for others location i donno well,
and for walls; let me finish my Roof first in next week, and thn i will try to do my walls, maybe in next month... coz it’s so hard to start everything at once... better do step by step.. isnt? Whats your advice PJ?

Super_Lutein,

i did the same thing. the roof is done a year ago already. rest of the house is pretty finished also so this lead me to remember i wanted to explore the walls. the house is cool so no hurry. actually hoping to get some info from someone who did it already. so i wait till ur done

The cellulose is one type of material put on top of ceiling to prevent heat from coming into the house and make home cooler.

I am making a research which is the best material although some of them recommended TCL cellulose.

please do share your research

is it recommended to do it before the warranty of the house expires? what if there is leaking due to rain. having this would make the repair more difficult?

sorry if my questions sound stupid

i'm going to renovate my new house soon and this is the first time i'm doing it and there are a lot of things that i don't know

The supplier may give you better advice. Or you can find out from their website.

My research just started. Worry advise wrongly.

If the new hse is ady with insulator sheet,is there any other thing that we could do to cool the hse? Is there special paint that can be painted on the roofing to reduce heat further plus prevent roof leak?

nippon weatherbond solareflect or nippon solaroof

huuuuuuu roof Insulation :

This post has been edited by HSHome: Aug 12 2009, 04:21 PM

Oh you mean only Roof Insulation with Cellulose Insulation is Enough ?
What is your home temperature right now bro?
Is it below 28c ? or what? Can you share your experience with me?
Since how long you insulate your home, did you use “TCL RESOURCES SDN BHD” for Insulation?
Yes for now I’m going to insulate my Roof by “TCL RESOURCES”
Kindly share your experience here with me after insulation.

This post has been edited by Super_Lutein: Aug 12 2009, 04:27 PM

Super_Lutein,

ceiling never exceeds 30°. the house got good windows and thick walls (old UK-standard building). inside i cool the house to 28° with aircon. doesnt set me back by much. but it also means i can not really say how big the factor of the roof insulation is as standalone measure. did all at the same time. but since it 30° you can be sure your house will be a lot cooler than before (my neighbours ceiling is whopping 38° at the time we compare to my 30°).

i used TCl. i recommend them. the product is the good celllulose not the cheap version from china. no need to save there.

How much is the savings in air cond. cost after you insulated your house?

Your house can be voted the model "GREEN' house.

how muchi for normal terrace house ? tq.

Calmman,

if i compare with my previous place i am using about 1/4-1/3 of the electricity per sq/ft that i used before with same aircon usage and same appliances running (pc, laptop, lamps, fans, oven and whatnot). and that house had normal alluminium frame windows, the old leaky doors that i sealed with doorseals only and a layer of rockwool on top of the thin aspestos ceiling. i even added an additonal big side by side fridge.

---

Added on August 14, 2009, 8:50 pmsorry: forgot one important additional fact: we replaced half the older aircons by inverter aircons. that also reduced electricity consumption. but i guess roof insulation has 20% effect or so. afterall around 80% of the heat comes through the ceiling into the house.

This post has been edited by PJusa: Aug 14 2009, 08:50 PM

Hi,

Anyone can advise me on the below:-

I wish to do my kitchen extension with roofing. Awning type will be more save for me. Developer already given 5' wall, I wish to extend it to 7' and put grill for another 2'. For the roof, some people advise not to use the Ajiya Awning because it will be hot and noisy during raining day. Alternative to reduce noise some contractor suggest using polycarbonate skyline (compact type). Anyhow, it will be hot too.

Another contractor told me to use industrial zinc roofing with added fiber glass & reduce heating layer. Where can I find this product? Any suggestion for contractor that doing this?

Appreciate your kind advice.

Thanks a lot.

I think you don't need insulation for your roof in this case since your area is not fully enclosed by brickwall. The heat still comes in through the 2'grill which is an open area. Don't waste your monies for insulation in this area.

May be noise is your concern during rainny days.

I think you're looking for this - Residential roofing with fiberglass.

http://www.unitedseasons.com/acco.html

Sound and heat insulation. Roof tilting can be minimal which is normally suitable for single story extensions (e.g. Kitchen).
In comparison to using roof tiles you need quite a high angle tilt to prevent rain water leakage.

how they count the area? is it roof surface area or ceiling surface area? is this cost for tcl cellulose only? how about the csr thingie, how much is the cost, per ft. sq?

tq

yeapsc73,

since the stuff resides on the ceiling - the ceiling area is the one you pay for. 3.3 is for the cellulose only. the CSR foil was around 400 bucks+ per roll - which was - if i remember correctly - 1,50 wide and 20 or 30 metres long. if my memory is right (i dont have the data with me) then its around a buck per sqft.

My house is done on Saturday by TCL Resources, (Roof Only)
After Cellulose Insulation my home temperature never exceed 27°c yet
We are monitoring our home temperature, so I would like to share my experience here as Cellulose User
And of course the TCL’s Team is very good & professional, done everything with in 4, 5 hours

guys,

when you apply the Cellulose Insulation, did you add more wooden beam to the existing truss to close the gap for security purpose since people can gain entry from the roof top?

or it's not necessary to add the addition wooden beam?

May I know what type of house you have. How does TCL charge? I'm quite interested in insulating my new home and in due time help save the environment.

there are few options for insulation...

1) wool or fibreglass wool...
2) aluminium foil to reflect heat radiant( this range from Rm 60.00 per roll to Rm 500.00per roll, depends on its efficiency highest is > 96% reflectivity)
3) or Astino PU insulated metal roofing
http://www.astino.com.my/html/pro-div/insulated.html



1) in long run, the wool might wall down as it is supported by hex chicken netting which will rust and deterioate in time....

2) this type is metal roofing or metaldec
it is know as Gauge thickness
G 32 (which is the thinnest.. for wall application)
G 30 (typical application)
G28 ( higher standard)
G27 ( normally rich people and use)
G 26 ( thickest... bloody rich people, government and factory use)

NB price differs again for step roofing.. which is about Rm0.50 more exp compared to long run

price is dependents on Foot Run basis... typical G30 would cost about RM 3.50 per FR while G26 would cost about Rm 5.50 per FR

say your house is 20' long and 30' wide

so its (20ft x Rm 3.50 x 12pcs) = RM 840.00 for metal roofing only

but the corrugated is the cheapest of all.... abotu Rm 1.90 per FR which can easily rust in a year time

---

Added on December 17, 2009, 11:41 amto be frank, any metal roofing will be noisy if rain falls....

refer to my previous post...

Ajiya is one of the top most selling metal roofing company in msia

regards....


This post has been edited by keemajujaya: Dec 17 2009, 11:41 AM

I've got a question about cellulose insulation. After the thing has been blown in the loft, what happens when I need to get up there to fix the wiring or to do what ever? Will I get cellulose fibres pouring down on me when I remove the ceiling hatch to get up? Will I have fibres sticking all over my clothes, my hair etc etc?

96% reflex. for rm500 per roll is cheap.
i got PARSEC termo B III for my parent's house, rm 1700/ per roll of 96M

I engaged the service of TCl Resources too last Friday for my small apartment. I'm happy to say that it does bring down temperature, and the people from TCl are very professional like you said.

for others, don't expect your house temperature to go down until very cold la. that is NOT the purpose of roof insulation.

---

Added on March 8, 2010, 5:30 pmi was told they would create a removable "pillow", so u can open the ceiling hatch without problem. the wiring... they explained to me but i no contractor so i can't answer. the best is ask them directlyask them directly. no harm ma.

This post has been edited by sblsbl: Mar 8 2010, 05:30 PM

oh TCL done my house liao. Not bad the result.

i see. yes, if not expect cool like refrigerator, the result is quite good. what i dun understand is why there's a research by local university saying roof insulation does not work in Malaysia. Really rubbish work. Somemore publish on Internet. Those who think roof insulation work for them should go share their experience there ---> http://www.scribd.com/doc/13455204/THERMAL...ROPICAL-CLIMATE

. It's environmentally friend thingy. Don't let these irresponsible, cincai study ruin these green efforts. Kajian tempatan.... *sigh*

Aiya, no need to waste time with these people. The first named author is from MARA. Celup punya.

Memang celup .... sigh...

i read it just now. i really wonder what they measured. i have before and after readings (TCL cellulose) and my results match the ones of you guys. using them is free cause you save so much on a/c charges you break even after a short while and then you have the savings in your pocket personally i would assume that insulating the ceiling alone will shave off approx. 20-30% of the bill based on my previous experience ina single story link house.

May be someone should advise them to carry out the test again to houses installed with TCL cellulose.

The report will be a laughing stock if present in international conference.

Maybe they were funded by some company with a rival technology lah.

Anyone knows the latest price below?

this type is metal roofing or metaldec
it is know as Gauge thickness
G 32 (which is the thinnest.. for wall application)
G 30 (typical application)
G28 ( higher standard)
G27 ( normally rich people and use)
G 26 ( thickest... bloody rich people, government and factory use)

can i do both insulation (cellulose) and the roof security system, which one comes first? also, i want to change the whole roof tiles as i just owned an old house, i would like to know what comes first?

i'm sorry, my first time, no experience in this kinda thing..

appreciate also if anyone can help me on new roofing..price per sq.ft

TCL did the cellulose thingy and added metal battens to my rafters (the security thingy). Two days worth of work. I suppose they can change the tiles for you as well.

Hi PangurBan
thanks!

How much does it costs you for both?

RM4900. I think it was RM3000 for the cellulose and RM1900 for the battens. It depends on the area. Mine's a 20x70 extended fully to the back alley.

Will it grow fungus inside?

well any price increase latest issue?heard material building increase 20%!!!

Wah! goodlah if can. I can have my very own mushroom farm up in my loft!

dopp,

you mean the cellulose? nope - cellulose actively regulates the moisture and channels it out so unlike with other insulation products that might create a dewpoint and corresponding moisture issues this will not be the case with open cellulose. no need to put anything on top either just blow and the cellulose does its thing. in comparison to the stone-fibre wool we had placed in the previous house, the cellulose wins hand-down.

Anyone here tried Radiant Barrier ? Is it works?

Radiant Barrier Tyler

i use similar sheets + cellulose. works well but i think just the foil wont be good enough for our climate. the foil can used to create a second roof and channel away some heat but by all means not all. under my roof and on top of the cellulose its pretty hot. ceiling under cellulose is cool. so go figure.

I've been told that bubble radiant barriers work better than normal ones. Any truth in that? They are more expensive though.

possible since the air sort of works like an insulation. i personally would not just rely on a reflective sheet. you need to ask yourself where does it reflect the heat to? to the tiles which in turn beam the heat back and so forth so what you can do is create a second roof under the roof with those sheets and allow for airflow between sheet and tiles. that way the semi-trapped heat can be moved out. but i think there is still a lot of heat getting into the roof. that is why you should employ several methods of insulation / heat combating to get best results. its often the case that a combination of several things works best. we want to try to add a third option: coating the roof with a (partially) relective paint i.e. grey or whitish to reflect some heat BEFORE it gets into the roof. of course you could also cover the outside of the roof with reflective sheets but i am not sure if this i legal. pretty sure it would look real bad though .

If the entire neighbourhood's houses have their roofs painted white, I would do the same.. but not if I'm the only one

"Branded" reflective sheets like Parsec Thermo-Brite III actually costs more than foil wrapped bubble sheets. I guess you must always have air space in between the sheets and the tiles, and have ventilation tiles to allow the heat to escape.

I was quoted RM 1.20 per sq feet for bubble sheets(without installation), anybody could share their cost for their sheet insulation?

HOW MUCH??

RM300PER ROLL??

and the precentage of reflectivity of heat>?

Cover the whole roof with solar panel lah. Kill two birds with one stone. The heat all absorbed by the panel instead of into the loft and then radiate into the house below, and convert to electricity pulak.

Nice idea. How much is the solar panel cost?

I am lookin at the roof of this old hse I jus bought and was advised to get it fixed – coz the weaving seems ‘out’

I have a couple of choices
1) change the rooftiles completely – gonna cost a BOMB
2) treat the current rooftiles & rearrange them back
3) just rearrange them back

with that three options, I guess I should also install insulator and all. I heard of vry good comments of TSL.

Anyone can advise me on what I should do? and since im renovatin the whole house, I guess I should start with the roof 1st? A latest cost list would also be helpful. Thanks in advance.

Need a roof security system, my house size is 24 x 70

---

Added on November 20, 2010, 11:43 amPlease quote me for the roof security.

This post has been edited by epalbee3: Nov 20 2010, 11:43 AM

you can contact this company - Aikim Insulation & Engineering 04-3901 493 or 012-488 8807 Elvis Tan

This company have provided the roofing insulation or Home thermal & sound insulation,using Cellulose insulation , is TCL at northern malaysia distributor.