Lowyat.NET > The ZERO DAC + Headamp (NO 56K)

yehlai

Jun 28 2008, 02:42 AM

QUOTE(abel @ Jun 28 2008, 02:17 AM)

previously i tested 3 speaker 9.1 , MS 902i and carnival 2 ,

Wharfedale 9.1 wut i know abit power hungry ,sound warm if u have enuf power to push this baby sound not bad really good for vocal no shh shh shh sound hahaha actually i really like this baby but my amp not enuf to push make vocal abit blur.

MS902i - sound dynamic and tweeter sound harsh , good resolution , nice detail and easy to push but vocal thin.

MS Carnival 2 what i using now - sound between of this 2 not bright not warm and easy to push

nothing impress hahaha
LS 3/5A i audit before it really nice ... this really power hungry bcoz running on 11ohm minimum some version with 15ohm and 16ohm also got if i not mistaken ....

http://www.stirlingbroadcast.net/

Thanks again for sharing

Power: 20-100W
Nominal Impedance: 6ohm
Sensitivity: 86dB

Many says Wharfy is hard to drive.. but why?

utellme

Jun 28 2008, 03:26 AM

QUOTE(yehlai @ Jun 28 2008, 02:42 AM)

Thanks again for sharing

Power: 20-100W
Nominal Impedance: 6ohm
Sensitivity: 86dB

Many says Wharfy is hard to drive.. but why?

no worry, take your old sony amp along when u test the spks. just trust your ear as simple as that.

abel

Jun 28 2008, 04:48 PM

QUOTE(yehlai @ Jun 28 2008, 02:42 AM)

Thanks again for sharing

Power: 20-100W
Nominal Impedance: 6ohm
Sensitivity: 86dB

Many says Wharfy is hard to drive.. but why?

bcoz the Sensitivity is low ... 86db is low at least u need 70-80w RMS to push my fren own 8.2 use Arcam Power amp to push and is 100w RMS per channel hehehe

my MS Carnival is 90db
88 db to 90db this range is the best and easy to push. they got calculation one but forget how to calculate hhehe

Added on June 28, 2008, 4:54 pmmy opamp collection
now testing on LT1358 it give music more alive .... it got more energy compare to LT1057 is say dynamic is not say warm also not hehehe very special ... let it running n see now abit bright.

i got 2 unit OPA2107ap who interested PM me

user posted image

RAV4

Jun 28 2008, 09:58 PM

Out of curiosity, have any of you Zero owners ever done a comparison with one of those branded DAC? My only experience with one was the Audio Alchemy and the Musical Fidelity CAN DAC. These are like "entry" level DACs coz others like Theta and Meridian cost a bomb but I'm sure they sound like one too. Thanks.

ccschua

Jun 29 2008, 12:12 AM

I think what u have mentioned is upper level, away from budget best value of money DAC. Again it depends on your tastes. They have been a lot of comparisons being made at the head fi thread comparing Paradisea, Citypulse, Keces, Lite. The european like Theta, meridian, benchmark, MBL, wadia, esoteric will cost a big bomb. So far, only ZERO DAC has got such following of ppl entry into DAC.

I have further did a A/B on the opamps like LM 4562, LT 1057, OPA 627 vs the DY2000.

What I notice on DY2000 is its smoothness at the mid range. The mid bass is control and not interfering into the vocal. Unlike LT 1057 and LM 4562, DY2000 gives good separation at the vocal and also more natural sounding. Very good tonality and relaxing to listen to.

I begin to suspect what is inside DY2000. I cant seem to find the specs of DY2000. can anyone share? I am not sure if JFET is used? But I like it.

DY2000 is like the partner for the tubeamp.

yehlai

Jun 29 2008, 12:23 AM

QUOTE(abel @ Jun 28 2008, 02:17 AM)

previously i tested 3 speaker 9.1 , MS 902i and carnival 2 ,

Wharfedale 9.1 wut i know abit power hungry ,sound warm if u have enuf power to push this baby sound not bad really good for vocal no shh shh shh sound hahaha actually i really like this baby but my amp not enuf to push make vocal abit blur.

MS902i - sound dynamic and tweeter sound harsh , good resolution , nice detail and easy to push but vocal thin.

MS Carnival 2 what i using now - sound between of this 2 not bright not warm and easy to push

nothing impress hahaha
LS 3/5A i audit before it really nice ... this really power hungry bcoz running on 11ohm minimum some version with 15ohm and 16ohm also got if i not mistaken ....

the mid and tweeter is made by KEF and just the branding is different all the speaker they send back to BBC to inspection. currently KEF already stop production of this speaker and now the lastest version is STERLING and they ask scans speak to make the tweeter follow the original spec and the mid from SEAS ... and BBC say is get abt 95%
similar to the old LS 3/5A

http://www.stirlingbroadcast.net/

Thanks for sharing bro,
I found the Stirling today at City SQ AV Center. Sellng for Rm6k.
Looks modest, but really good in quality rite.. stop production summore.

Bro ccschua, you're using military op-amp

Quote from Head-Fi:

QUOTE

DY2000 - Supposedly an opamp AD made for the military, sounds like the AD823 but with bigger bass.

military op-amp need bigger bass lol.

abel

Jun 29 2008, 01:05 PM

military use that for their tube radio ghahahah

yehlai

Jun 30 2008, 01:38 AM

ZhaoLu 2.5A with OPA637, tempting or not?
http://forum.lowyat.net/topic/728522

Hows its performance compare with Zero?
I luv Zero and Zero community

waiting for my zero.. doing my countdown now.. (3, 2, 1.. ZERO!!)

ccschua

Jun 30 2008, 08:56 AM

ZhaoLu implementation is almost same as ZERO. So you wont get much differences and futhermore it is more $$$$ than ZERO. To improve the sound of ZERO, those mod also will improve the sound too.

RAV4

Jun 30 2008, 01:38 PM

QUOTE(ccschua @ Jun 29 2008, 12:12 AM)

What I notice on DY2000 is its smoothness at the mid range. The mid bass is control and not interfering into the vocal. Unlike LT 1057 and LM 4562, DY2000 gives good separation at the vocal and also more natural sounding. Very good tonality and relaxing to listen to.

Sounds really promising! Sure wanna get 1 if there's a bulk.

Thanks for sharing on the list of DACs. I think the Soundstage you're using is really good value for money. I would also pair it with a B&W like you. Perhaps I'll get to listen to it when we have a meet up after we got our Zero.

scy320

Jun 30 2008, 03:29 PM

QUOTE(ccschua @ Jun 30 2008, 08:56 AM)

ZhaoLu implementation is almost same as ZERO. So you wont get much differences and futhermore it is more $$$$ than ZERO. To improve the sound of ZERO, those mod also will improve the sound too.

Wow,then zero is worth.Zhaolu is much much expensive.mind sharing your mod?

ccschua

Jun 30 2008, 06:27 PM

I dont mod the unit because it is still new. I am quite happy with it. The tricks about modding is the quality and outcome. Perhaps Madman can share some light. One expert who is good at mod is in Australia. If you read the head-fi thread, u will see ppl mod the output stage decoupling capacity,with good results.

scy320

Jun 30 2008, 07:20 PM

QUOTE(ccschua @ Jun 30 2008, 06:27 PM)

I dont mod the unit because it is still new. I am quite happy with it. The tricks about modding is the quality and outcome. Perhaps Madman can share some light. One expert who is good at mod is in Australia. If you read the head-fi thread, u will see ppl mod the output stage decoupling capacity,with good results.

hehe,the expert you mentioned is it bro empire?

yehlai

Jun 30 2008, 08:12 PM

New opamp in town ~LM4562NA.
Not inferior, but cant use independently..

LT1057 + LM4562 DAC=good, phone=good
LT1361 + LM4562 DAC=good, phone=good
LT1364 + LM4562 DAC=great, phone=great

This guy have 5 units.
http://forum.lowyat.net/topic/695685

scy320

Jun 30 2008, 08:49 PM

QUOTE(yehlai @ Jun 30 2008, 08:12 PM)

New opamp in town ~LM4562NA.
Not inferior, but cant use independently..

LT1057 + LM4562 DAC=good, phone=good
LT1361 + LM4562 DAC=good, phone=good
LT1364 + LM4562 DAC=great, phone=great

This guy have 5 units.
http://forum.lowyat.net/topic/695685

it is a good opamp.bro,the LT1057+Lm4562 mean what?does it mean 1 opamp on the DAC section in Zero and another in headphone amp section?

abel

Jun 30 2008, 10:54 PM

QUOTE(scy320 @ Jun 30 2008, 08:49 PM)

it is a good opamp.bro,the LT1057+Lm4562 mean what?does it mean 1 opamp on the DAC section in Zero and another in headphone amp section?

yeah ... is true 1 for DAC and got 2 for headphone section

LT1057 not bad LM4562 also not bad but i prefer LT1057 ... now i testing DY2000 found this opamp very special sound, calm n relax really no attack more slow than LT1057 but mid is really smooth like tube feel ... dunno how to explain

LT1361 ermm ok
LT1364 sound better than LT1361 for my taste

wut i found i prefer DY2000 , LT1057 , LT1364 and last but not list LM4562 other not really suite my taste at first found LT1358 not bad but after sometime i feel bored and frustrated maybe the vocal too forward fell the singer saliva spit to my face

for those who like dynamic n fast go for OPA627 bass are fast n tight opa2107 also not bad.

scy320

Jun 30 2008, 11:41 PM

QUOTE(abel @ Jun 30 2008, 10:54 PM)

yeah ... is true 1 for DAC and got 2 for headphone section

LT1057 not bad LM4562 also not bad but i prefer LT1057 ... now i testing DY2000 found this opamp give very special sound ... dunno how to explain

LT1361 ermm ok
LT1364 sound better than LT1361 for my taste

LT1057+LM4562 mean we put 1 LT1057 in DAC and 2 LM4562 in headphone section?

abel

Jul 1 2008, 01:11 AM

QUOTE(scy320 @ Jun 30 2008, 11:41 PM)

LT1057+LM4562 mean we put 1 LT1057 in DAC and 2 LM4562 in headphone section?

yup u are right

scy320

Jul 1 2008, 01:21 AM

QUOTE(abel @ Jul 1 2008, 01:11 AM)

yup u are right

opamp in the headphone amp is it for listening headphone only?will it have effect on speaker listening?

abel

Jul 1 2008, 01:22 AM

QUOTE(scy320 @ Jul 1 2008, 01:21 AM)

opamp in the headphone amp is it for listening headphone only?will it have effect on speaker listening?

no is separate section except u use Preamp to connect to power amp if u headphone kaki i think u need to change all the opamp
bcoz i also got headphone test found speaker sound n headphone different sound wut i found when like let say LT1057 for DAC is slow n relax when go to headphone (i use opa2107) feel the sound thin n sharp i think better use opamp for all section than u will get the rights sound for combination not say not bad but u need alot of time to tweak n test

scy320

Jul 1 2008, 01:30 AM

QUOTE(abel @ Jul 1 2008, 01:22 AM)

no is separate section except u use Preamp to connect to power amp if u headphone kaki i think u need to change all the opamp

so i can just change the opamp in DAC section only to get the effect of that opamp?

abel

Jul 1 2008, 01:35 AM

QUOTE(scy320 @ Jul 1 2008, 01:30 AM)

so i can just change the opamp in DAC section only to get the effect of that opamp?

change DAC section also got different ....

u change any opamp also got sound different see u use for headphone or direct to amp

if u got use headphone than better change all .... u try to change the DAC section than compare with change other see which one u like

scy320

Jul 1 2008, 01:08 PM

QUOTE(abel @ Jul 1 2008, 01:35 AM)

change DAC section also got different ....

u change any opamp also got sound different see u use for headphone or direct to amp

if u got use headphone than better change all .... u try to change the DAC section than compare with change other see which one u like

ok,thanks for your info.any review on your DY2000?

Added on July 1, 2008, 1:08 pm

QUOTE(abel @ Jul 1 2008, 01:35 AM)

change DAC section also got different ....

u change any opamp also got sound different see u use for headphone or direct to amp

if u got use headphone than better change all .... u try to change the DAC section than compare with change other see which one u like

ok,thanks for your info.any review on your DY2000?

abel

Jul 1 2008, 04:05 PM

not fully tested yet

wut i found DY2000 sound very smooth sounding , bass more refine not soo punch , feel the bass very transparent , vocal more forward and found the high smooth no sshhh shhhh bright sound already but some ppl say abit dark ... depends ur own taste.

scy320

Jul 1 2008, 04:59 PM

QUOTE(abel @ Jul 1 2008, 04:05 PM)

not fully tested yet

wut i found DY2000 sound very smooth sounding , bass more refine not soo punch , feel the bass very transparent , vocal more forward and found the high smooth no sshhh shhhh bright sound already but some ppl say abit dark ... depends ur own taste.

how much you get for he DY2000?

yehlai

Jul 1 2008, 10:02 PM

Hi guys,
OPA627AP, OPA2107, DY2000:
How is the performance different between this three opamp?
How much is DY2000?

OPA627AP is not cheap, but hope can reach MOQ soon.

ccschua

Jul 1 2008, 10:11 PM

DY2000 is about RM 55. I think Abel has given some riview. Basically OPA627 is the undisputed bare it all opamp with good dynamics. DY2000 is more tubelike with solidstate feel, can help to tame the metal tweeters a bit. Dont use DY2000 if you have full tube amp.

scy320

Jul 1 2008, 10:12 PM

Added on July 1, 2008, 10:12 pmAll Zero DAC owner,anyone want to sell your Zero DAC?im looking for a used one.

kwekeugene

Jul 1 2008, 10:23 PM

QUOTE(ccschua @ Jul 1 2008, 10:11 PM)

DY2000 is about RM 55. I think Abel has given some riview. Basically OPA627 is the undisputed bare it all opamp with good dynamics. DY2000 is more tubelike with solidstate feel, can help to tame the metal tweeters a bit. Dont use DY2000 if you have full tube amp.

Do you think OPA627 in DAC and DY2000 in the headamp is a good combination? That would probably help to tame the OPA627.

yehlai

Jul 1 2008, 10:26 PM

QUOTE(scy320 @ Jul 1 2008, 10:12 PM)

All Zero DAC owner,anyone want to sell your Zero DAC?im looking for a used one.

You should find abel..

ccschua

Jul 1 2008, 10:42 PM

QUOTE(kwekeugene @ Jul 1 2008, 10:23 PM)

Do you think OPA627 in DAC and DY2000 in the headamp is a good combination? That would probably help to tame the OPA627.

Sorry I am no headphiler. I believe there shoud be 1 source giving the buffer, either DAC or the head amp. In my case, I have soundstage 1.5 with mullard tube (good for vocal and warm) plus KEF Cresta 10/B&W/AAD. The ZERO DAC, being oversampling type dac, gives quite a wide spectrum of musics. While I prefer the mid spectrum, without sacrificing the high and low, I find good use of dy2000. Sometimes musics goes this way. When u done putting in dy2000, u just find the musics clicks, like doc and patient. Music is the doc, and I am the patient.

It comes back to matching again.

GodLuvSxS

Jul 1 2008, 10:51 PM

QUOTE(scy320 @ Jul 1 2008, 10:12 PM)

Added on July 1, 2008, 10:12 pmAll Zero DAC owner,anyone want to sell your Zero DAC?im looking for a used one.

If you are looking for a used one, perhaps you try to PM Abel

scy320

Jul 1 2008, 11:00 PM

QUOTE(GodLuvSxS @ Jul 1 2008, 10:51 PM)

If you are looking for a used one, perhaps you try to PM Abel

hehe,Abel change his mind after getting DY2000.

yehlai

Jul 1 2008, 11:03 PM

OPA627 cant reach MOQ yet

, where can i get DY2000?
Thanks!

Who want to order a set of OPA627 kit (consist of 2 pcs OPA627AP + 1 pc Browndog adapter):
Kindly order with bro Mikelanding.
LINK
Thanks!

GodLuvSxS

Jul 1 2008, 11:13 PM

QUOTE(yehlai @ Jul 1 2008, 11:03 PM)

OPA627 cant reach MOQ yet

, where can i get DY2000?
Thanks!

Hi yehlai, you could get DY2000 from Eddie Wu of Diykits. Maybe you can conduct a bulk to get the quantity to nego and share shipping

http://www.diykits.com.hk/

scy320

Jul 1 2008, 11:17 PM

QUOTE(yehlai @ Jul 1 2008, 11:03 PM)

OPA627 cant reach MOQ yet

, where can i get DY2000?
Thanks!

hehe,yehlai,i think you kena Zero opamp poison quite deep,lolz.

ccschua

Jul 1 2008, 11:34 PM

Yeah Yehlai.

Take it slow. When u get your ZERO, I can lend you the DY2000 for test. I always go to hifi shop in Puchong, and I learn the hifi stuff from the sifu in there. That place got all kinds of amp, solid state, int amp, ptube pre amp, tube full , harbeth, etc. sorry another poision.

If you know Lawrence, you should know Eddie Wu. Eddie is very knowledgeable in HIFI, but at the same time, a marketing guy.

yehlai

Jul 2 2008, 12:04 AM

QUOTE(ccschua @ Jul 1 2008, 11:34 PM)

Yeah Yehlai.

Take it slow. When u get your ZERO, I can lend you the DY2000 for test. I always go to hifi shop in Puchong, and I learn the hifi stuff from the sifu in there. That place got all kinds of amp, solid state, int amp, ptube pre amp, tube full , harbeth, etc. sorry another poision.

If you know Lawrence, you should know Eddie Wu. Eddie is very knowledgeable in HIFI, but at the same time, a marketing guy.

Wao, really thanks bro!

Maybe i should test before decided to buy it (reduce a bit poison

).
I found another shop in Puchong too. Its the same shop?

Speakers: http://www.smarthomesolution.net/buy-Sell/Loudspeaker.htm
Cables: http://www.smarthomesolution.net/buy-Sell/...er%20Cables.htm

Epos ES 14, Rogers LS5/9, B&W DM603 S3, Harbeth HL Compact 7, Jamo X510.. so poisonous!! (poison myself again lol ).

Cable Talk Talk 3 bi-wire. 1m for RM39.
This one is good?

Thanks!

ccschua

Jul 2 2008, 12:08 AM

Bring your cable there and test.

I miss his Marantz 63KI, Orpheus, Exposure, rogers, Monitor audio studio 2, harbeth HL-P3. The owner now got menthor with Telefunken tube (not for sale) .... so many.

thats the shop.

scy320

Jul 2 2008, 12:08 AM

QUOTE(ccschua @ Jul 1 2008, 11:34 PM)

Yeah Yehlai.

Take it slow. When u get your ZERO, I can lend you the DY2000 for test. I always go to hifi shop in Puchong, and I learn the hifi stuff from the sifu in there. That place got all kinds of amp, solid state, int amp, ptube pre amp, tube full , harbeth, etc. sorry another poision.

If you know Lawrence, you should know Eddie Wu. Eddie is very knowledgeable in HIFI, but at the same time, a marketing guy.

yeahlai,maybe you should get your DAC and try familier with the stock opamp,then only upgrade to other opamp,then you can hear the different.

mikelanding

Jul 2 2008, 09:03 PM

QUOTE(yehlai @ Jul 1 2008, 11:03 PM)

OPA627 cant reach MOQ yet

, where can i get DY2000?
Thanks!

Who want to order a set of OPA627 kit (consist of 2 pcs OPA627AP + 1 pc Browndog adapter):
Kindly order with bro Mikelanding.
LINK
Thanks!

Dun worry, got another forumer interested for the OPA627Ap kit. If include U, ngam ngam 3 persons..

Current list:
1) tan01 - 1 set (confirmed)
2) sakuragi01 - 1 set (confirmed)
3) yehlai - 1 set

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

scy320

Jul 2 2008, 10:27 PM

QUOTE(mikelanding @ Jul 2 2008, 09:03 PM)

Dun worry, got another forumer interested for the OPA627Ap kit. If include U, ngam ngam 3 persons..

Current list:
1) tan01 - 1 set (confirmed)
2) sakuragi01 - 1 set (confirmed)
3) yehlai - 1 set

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

finally yehlai can sleep well already,reach MOQ d.

ccschua

Jul 2 2008, 10:39 PM

So is it going to have mini meet to pk the opamp during dac collection? good to try out the gear. may be we can invite others to bring their DAC for shoot out.

scy320

Jul 2 2008, 10:52 PM

Still waiting for people to let go their Zero DAC.

ccschua

Jul 2 2008, 11:18 PM

Why dont you minta tolong godluv, may be special deal loh. he got a lot of lobang.

scy320

Jul 2 2008, 11:51 PM

QUOTE(ccschua @ Jul 2 2008, 11:18 PM)

Why dont you minta tolong godluv, may be special deal loh. he got a lot of lobang.

ok,try minta tolong from him.

RAV4

Jul 3 2008, 09:56 AM

QUOTE(mikelanding @ Jul 2 2008, 09:03 PM)

Dun worry, got another forumer interested for the OPA627Ap kit. If include U, ngam ngam 3 persons..

Current list:
1) tan01 - 1 set (confirmed)
2) sakuragi01 - 1 set (confirmed)
3) yehlai - 1 set

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

Hey Mike, what happened to my name? If there's enough to make your order now, let me have your account details so I can make the payment. Thanks.

yehlai

Jul 3 2008, 10:09 AM

QUOTE(RAV4 @ Jul 3 2008, 09:56 AM)

Hey Mike, what happened to my name? If there's enough to make your order now, let me have your account details so I can make the payment. Thanks.

Sigh.. i tot cancel order alrdy.

Anyone like to order extra 2 more OPA627AP chips so we can conclude now?

mikelanding

Jul 3 2008, 11:32 AM

QUOTE(RAV4 @ Jul 3 2008, 09:56 AM)

Hey Mike, what happened to my name? If there's enough to make your order now, let me have your account details so I can make the payment. Thanks.

Sorry..though U not interested anymore..

QUOTE(yehlai @ Jul 3 2008, 10:09 AM)

Sigh.. i tot cancel order alrdy.

Anyone like to order extra 2 more OPA627AP chips so we can conclude now?

No need anymore order, with RAV4 and U confirm..it already got 4 peoples. So are u confirm??

MOQ reached! Updated list:
1) RAV4 - 1 set (Paid RM106

)
2) sakuragi01 - 1 set (Paid RM106

)
3) yehlai - 1 set (confirmed)
4) tan01 - 1 set (Paid RM110, Balance to refund

)
5) mADmAN - 1 set (Paid RM106

)

I will start send out my bank in detail soon. Once all bank in, I will proceed to order..

mADmAN

Jul 3 2008, 11:34 AM

yo mike... add 1 more set for me oso pls...

and of course as usual...PM me banking details

thanks